There is a great circular argument the "birthers" use to maintain their indignation. It goes a little something like this.
Birther: Please show us proof that Obama was born in the US.
Clerk: Here is the legal form of his birth certificate available to public inquiry.
Birther: Obviously that is a fake. Show us proof that Obama was born in the US.
Clerk: That is the only legal document available... same for every citizen of this state.
Birther: Obviously you are on the take. Show us proof that Obama was born in the US.
Clerk: Here is a certified declaration by the state at our highest levels that this birth certificate is authentic.
Birther: Obviously you are all on the take. Show us proof that Obama was born in the US.
Clerk: There is nothing more I can do for you. Our legal obligation to provide documentation in this matter has been met.
Birther: See! Obama has no proof that he was born in the US. If he did, he could show us a valid document listing where he was born! Show us proof that Obama was born in the US.
It is a simple matter that has already been resolved. It was easy to resolve and it has been. The problem that continues to swirl these accusations is the fact that Birthers ignore all of this. It is like asking a blind person to tell you the color of the sky. He can firmly tell you any color he thinks because he is incapable of determining the truth.
Birthers will not and in some cases do not have the capability (mentally) to see the facts that have been legally certified.
flhu
· 5 months ago
You forgot:
Birther: Show us proof that Obama was born in the US.
Researcher: Here's a birth announcement from the Honolulu Newspaper in 1961.
Birther: You have a time-machine and drink the kool-aid.
Navigator7
· 5 months ago
Here is an idea:
Birther: Show US THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE OBAMA and not obvious two fakes posted on your website.
Obama: OK...Here it is!
End of story
But....The story is not over. Hence the mega bucks spent to assure this is THE most OPAQUE Administration TO DATE!
Insert Jaws background music.
hyperbolefreaks
· 5 months ago
Amazing how 20 percent of the country that gets their "NEWS" from hyperbole mongers Hannity, Rush, and Oreilly, only embarrass themselves and this country more and more everyday. You people are serious losers with chips on your shoulders that are quite unpatriotic at that. Wake up!! It isn't enough to have the same losers still believe Iraq bombed the world trade center, or that there are weapons of mass destruction in Iraq....they just go on and on and on.....you people will even diss your own president as hes trying to mend foreign relations while he is overseas.....you tune into one news channel and play the constant victim card. Your idols in the media are nothing more then self promoters that sell themselves to you as a commodity that you swallow like lost little sheep....and to the detriment of this country at that. These are "conservatives" who turned a blind eye the last 12 years while the republicans have doubled the national debt and haven't said "boo" about it. I mean i can understand a difference of political opinion but base it in fact....I know far too many people that speak out of some implanted unreasonable fear (by Beck , Hannity) that are seriously demented..instead of issues they talk birth certificates, and lapel bins.....but thats great considering you losers are now a regional party who sadly (but truthfully) put party before country and base your future on our country's continued misery or worsening. These are the same folks who state the best thing for America would be for Osama Bin Laden to attack us again. There is so much hatred, inclusiveness, and fear in you people...its beyond comprehension.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Here's what you need to take away from this article and these comments:
President Obama is black.
He will continue to be black.
And he will continue to be President.
Your money will still be good in our stores.
You can still fight and die in our wars.
You still have the freedom to say anything you want, subject to the limitations on free speech like not shouting "fire" in a crowded theater.
But if you say something stupid, a liberal will catch you, and call you on it. And depending on how stupid what you say is, you might get called a name.
But only if you say something stupid and you say it in bad faith or you say it in an insulting way.
So unless you're a sore-loser racist who is just here to bitch about the President being black, you should have nothing to fear.
Allah Akbar. Oh sorry, thought I was talking to Obama. God is great.
FTW
chimsect
· 5 months ago
Hi, Stephen!
Glad to see you're still going strong. In fact, I think you may well may be closing in on a new world record in the whack-a-troll marathon. You know this is like the original Dawn of the Dead, though - there are legions of contemptible bigots out there with shit for brains, and you can be damn sure they're never going to stop surfacing no matter how many rounds you pump into them. But please do keep on smoking them out and picking them off - many of us are reading your posts and understand that you're performing an outstanding service on behalf of sane, rational people everywhere. Incidentally, I see that for the time being you're dug in pretty deep and you've got plenty of ammo, but if you ever need some artillery or air support, or even to be airlifted out of there, just give us your coordinates and we'll see what we can do for you, man.
In the meantime, keep on keeping on, man, and just keep in mind that, unlike the vile conspiracy freaks, you're a stable, educated, well adjusted adult with normal friends and (presumably) a peaceful life and and a satisfying career. And you're not alone out there.
Peace,
Chimsect
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Hey Chimsect! Thanks for the support in this and other posts. I'm just paying my dues, man.
I still sometimes have to pinch myself to remind myself that the black guy won the election. For a long time I didn't believe it possible. That's the main reason I supported Hillary in the primaries; I just didn't think the black guy would be able to overcome all the nonsense he would face. When Rev. Wright hit the airwaves I said "oh shit that's their excuse. Now they won't vote for him because he's black but they will say it's because his pastor scares them."
So I dug in deeper and prepared for life to get worse.
And then, miracle of miracles, God blessed us with Sarah Palin. All was once again joy. Hilarious, nonsensical-bailout-explanation-providing, Russia-sighting, interview-avoiding joy.
So I figure we got off lucky. And as a result I feel like we all owe a debt of gratitude. I pay mine off by being sarcastic to racists who pretend they have a legitimate uncertainty about the President's eligibility.
But I haven't been here in some marathon session, no matter what the birthers think. I just show up often enough to make them believe I'm omnipotent.
One of the highlights was when one of them, d2i I think, posted a link to some nonsensical rambling bullshit "abstract" compiled by some loser right wing hack named Tonshen or something. I looked at the abstract twice before cutting and pasting a sentence that said the controversy would "definitely not" be resolved even if Obama's original birth certificate conclusively states he was born in Hawaii. I posted that sentence along with an explanation that you don't need to read the rest of the abstract to know the guy's a kook.
So of course, d2i immediately protests, including by saying that I couldn't possibly have read that whole abstract once in 7 minutes. Of course, I didn't. I read it twice. (I just don't trace the line I'm reading with my finger, like Frank Ricci did in the Sotomayor hearing. Anytime you use a test for the first time and a finger-reader gets one of the top scores, you got a shitty test on your hands. But I digress.)
But d2i did not believe that I could have read it. There and then the legend was born. He (claims to be a Democratic she but I'll believe that when I see a voter roll and a birth certificate) from that moment on was convinced that I'm a paid Obama blogger. Hence all the posts saying "please please please do not respond to him" and "he's making a killing today" and all that. That alone made up for all the tortured logic and circular reasoning I've had to endure. I've never been regarded as a supervillain before. The pay sucks but the fringe benefits (scaring racists away from their preferred targets of opportunity) are great.
Plus I got to meet comrades-in-arms like you, phxgwen, JL, gopfail, wayoutwest, and a host of other REAL patriotic Americans. And I got to read a lot of insightful analysis and humorous commentary. None of it by birthers.
Good to know we're not alone. With that, I pass the torch to you. But if kwiley should post here ever again, please be sure to ask about her mythical black husband. She claims she is his "slave." Issues. Some people have issues they should be embarrassed to tell their therapist about.
I'm off to spend my nickels earned from birther responses to my posts.
Cheers, comrade! (What's the word socialists use for each other? I don't have my notes from Re-Education Camp right in front of me.)
There's just something about sticking it to people who try to deceive you that is...cathartic.
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
"whack-a-troll"
great label, plus cudos, AND 2nd the 'you're not alone', stephenperry (not 'THE' stephenperry, or, is he...?)
kennethetucker card carrying ACLU & NRA member (not mutually exclusives these) Vietnam (volunteered) Veteran NOT a chickensh*t Chickenhawk like 99% of reich-wing rethugs PROUD Progressive/liberal
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
One thing that ticks me off about this is that the birther thing distracts from national unity in a time of war by dividing us AGAINST our Commander in Chief.
Look at recent history. When Bush was put in power in 2000, people on my side were mad. They (and I) blamed a partisan Supreme Court and partisans in Florida for the outcome. But they, and I, put all that stuff aside whole-heartedly in the days after 9/11. It isn't just other countries around the world that supported America in the days and weeks after 9/11; Americans supported America. We rallied around the flag and we rallied around our leader.
Bush was our President and he had our full support to get the bad guys. Notice I said the bad guys. But anyway, we gave him our votes when he said he needed them for national security purposes. We let him manage the War on Terror in his Constitutional role as The Decider. Liberals and Republicans and everyone in between. Because we were at war.
Which brings me to my point. We're still at war. 2 of them. AND, unlike in the days after 9/11, our economy is shot to pieces and we need help. America needs help from Americans. Think about it. We still have every problem we had on Sept. 12, 2001 plus a whole host of new ones.
And, now that it's their turn, the fringe element of the other party won't rally around the flag as we did. The WHOLE element of the other party, won't for that matter.
And it's just un-American. So even if you guys weren't racist, which you are, you still suck.
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
That ticks me off too. I surely don't mind lively debate, but this birther thing stinketh.
In a normal context, liberals more often believe that they are competing in different schools of morals, patriotism and reason. While conservatives tend to believe they are the only ones who are moral, patriotic and reasonable. Obviously if you disagree with them you worship Ba'al, you're unpatriotic etc. You're following false cults of personality, because you're not voting as you ought. There must be some systemic reason for not being like me!
But this little mutiny in the military transcends my normal mode, and I feel it needs be quashed. I'm not willing to go this far or entertain some 'service to country' is behind it. There is something really bad here.
Did you ever notice some so often accuse others of the exact same things that they do? Usurp, divide or my favorite: class war?
gopfail
· 5 months ago
Well said. It would seem far better for them and for the country to get their house in order instead of burning it down in fits of hysteria. I guess it will get worse before it gets better.
MilliJoolz
· 5 months ago
And that is exactly drilling down into the very core of the whole disgraceful situation. It's so sick, dishonorable, disgusting and mindboggeling [sp?]. And quite frankly, those qualifications don't even come close. I just can't find any other description.
I guess it's better to steel an election than to win with a landslide... Not. Just SUCK IT UP.
kb345
· 5 months ago
Millijoolz, these single-minded, blabbering idiots don't even have a clue what you are referring to! The fact that they continue to ignore the facts, what the Constitution says about being a natural born citizen, making any kind of birth certificate showing unnecessary, proves that they don't read anything but right-wing propaganda. Therefore, they would never be willing to believe the FACTS about the illegal, Republican actions carried out in both the 2000 or 2004 elections.
Nothing will make them happy, because they wouldn't believe this so-called "long-form" was real even if it was shown to them. They will always look for a reason to disqualify Obama even though he is probably the most brilliant man we've ever had as president. At this point in time, we need someone with a calm temperament, able to make logical decisions by consulting a team of experts, not "his God" or his "good old boys" that he has given jobs to in order to raise their income brackets.
These people have been raised in a different way, they don't understand common sense. The more you try, the harder they defy you. This story is coming up on almost 2500 posts and they still want to see "the birth certificate" for a man who clearly knows that there is no need to go through this crap, his worst critics know there is no need to go through this crap, yet mental midgets think that because a case goes to court, it makes it true. Every other case prior to it has been thrown out and they JUST DON'T GET IT. Why wouldn't a lawyer take a case? Money in her pocket and her name in the news? It is hard to stay away from this site, though, isn't it? It's like driving past a car wreck, you don't want to look, but....
JimPA
· 5 months ago
I have many Republican friends and they hate the birthers. They feel that it takes attention away from our President's decisions on the economy. They disagree with him. They also hate the teleprompter, Hitler and socialist nonsense.
I don’t agree with all of President Obama’s decisions. If I did I would be happy for about 30 seconds till I realized if he is making all the decisions I would then he isn’t any smarter than I am. I’ll give our President the benefit of the doubt. Heck who long has he been in office, 6 months?
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Yeah, 6 months.
I agree lots of Republicans think this stinks. I can appreciate the frustration there too, it wasn't so long ago I felt it in reverse. But we had Howard Dean that just went out and built a 50 state network, they have Showboat Steele. They are being disserved, but a small portion are chanelling it the wrong way.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
Years back I read a lot about President Lincoln. He signed the Pacific Railroad Act during the Civil War. Most were against it. The Country was in a brutal/dividing war. The government was broke because of the war. I thought when I read this, man I would have waited till after the war. I'm a conservative person. But history shows it was the right decision. Opened the west up at the right time. So I’m OK with our President not doing what I would do. I’m extremely happy when Rush disagrees with our President. ;)
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
I'll have to look up the the Pacific Railroad Act, that does seem gutsy.
My writings here aren't against conservatives, just a small band of thugs that are easy to provoke with a little prodding. When the mask comes off the birtha, we see it was never about a birth certificate.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Same here - I know some Republicans who are good and decent. It's just that they're not the ones I hear from about politics. They tend to go about their business, because just about everything that Republican politicians are in the news for these days is not something they want to defend.
My writings here aren't against conservatives, for sure. I see conservative as quite distinct from Republican. Republicans have perverted and violated conservative values. You need look no further than Bush's bloated budgets, new government departments, spying on citizens, and needless war to see that.
Wayoutwest
· 5 months ago
You are correct that this has nothing to do with conservatives and liberals Stephen. This is about pure hate for the Other. I think you know better than most of us about that. I understand why you doggedly pursued these birthers until they finally showed their true self. When navKKK talked with joy about burning flesh it became very clear. Strange Fruit. I don't know if i'll hear from you again, if not good luck and keep your head down. Pete
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Hey Pete - thanks for keeping company through this whole thing.
I figured that if I just brushed aside the pretexts, eventually the real reason for all this hostility and stubbornness would come out. And it always did. Like when Navigator7 finally explained his theory about why Obama was propped up by whites and how blacks need to explain to whites their collective failure to launch.
It's sad, really, that with all the problems facing us collectively, some people choose to try to throw a wrench into the whole process... cutting off their noses to spite their faces.
And to be honest, at first I just found it all kind of amusing because they can't argue. But then it sort of sunk in how un-American they are. And when I wrote that post about how we rallied around the flag for Bush but they won't rally around the flag for Obama, it kind of left me with an empty feeling. I think your post on that subject hit the nail on the head. And so now that every birther argument has been debunked, I don't feel like talking to them. But I'd still be interested in exchanging ideas with folks like you.
Good luck and keep your head UP! I'm sure I'll see you around. By the way, I always enjoyed the sight of the Manzanos growing up. I grew up looking at the Sandias, of course. But I traveled throughout NM and will always miss the purple mountains.
Cheers.
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
Oft mentioned in most any/all of President Obama's speeches/new conferences where he's asked (again and again) about 'having too much on his plate'.
Lincoln's 'palte': Civil War + Railroad Act + Land Grant Colleges* +oversaw the 3X of US telegraph system among other 'things' on a VERY full plate.
"The story of Abraham Lincoln and the telegraph is perhaps the greatest untold story about this great man. Through these messages it is possible to watch Lincoln’s confidence grow and in turn to observe his growth as a leader. What is most remarkable, however, is that Abraham Lincoln applied the new telegraph technology in an absence of precedent. Without the guidance of text, tutor, or training Lincoln instinctively discerned the transformational nature of the new technology and applied its dots and dashes as an essential tool for winning the Civil War."
* "Morrill first introduced a land-grant bill in Congress in 1857, which after much struggle was passed in 1859 only to be vetoed by President James Buchanan. In 1861 Morrill introduced another land-grant bill that increased to 30,000 acres the grant for each senator and representative and added a requirement that recipient institutions teach military tactics. The newly felt need for trained military officers to fight in the Civil War, along with the absence of Southern legislators who had opposed the earlier bill, helped the Morrill Act through Congress in just six months. President Abraham Lincoln signed it into law on July 2, 1862."
Pacific Railroad Act - Today this seems like nothing. The Industrial Revolution hadn't taken place. The land out west had Native Americans who seen the railroad as an end to their way of life so they weren't too happy about it. Building bridges, tunneling thru rocks, going thru wilderness. We didn't know what caused the bends. You needed a good supply of water. Many big obstacles to overcome. It was hard to know how much this would cost. I think this was a reason many opposed it. If you want to read an excellent book that would put this in context, The Great Bridge: The Epic Story of the Building of the Brooklyn Bridge. It was built in the 1870s. To build a bridge you had to get to bedrock. The transcontinental railroad was a great feat.
jilly82
· 5 months ago
Give me a break. Get over it.. Obama was born in Hawaii, and when I went to law school there were part of the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA....
Susan Sherman
· 5 months ago
This is just the craziest thing I have ever heard of. Don't these people have anything better to do. Go out and do something useful. I am so sick of this b---s---. Get behind a project that could help someone in need. What a bunch of immature grownups. What is going on in this country that we can't get behind our president whether we voted for him or not. Do something for the betterment of this country and stop the damn whinning. Grow the f--- up already.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Well said.
Name
· 5 months ago
If you're a 4th grader.
kkdalloway
· 5 months ago
Okay, let's apply a very elegant principle of Logics known as Occam's Razor to this problem. Occam's Razor says: Of two acceptable explanations for a phenomenon, the simplest one is the correct one. The two conflicting explanations here are as follows:
1. Barack Obama's birth certificate which was created, validated, and released by the governance of the state of Hawaii is valid and in proper order and therefore confirms that he is a natural born citizen of the United States of America.
2 Barack Obama's birth certificate which was created, validated, and released by the governance of the state of Hawaii is a fake because a. the governance of the state of Hawaii and all of the people who work in the Department of Health and in the Vital Records Department are lying and they made up a fake birth certificate and then lied and said it was valid because b. he was actually born in another country and c. his mother is not an actual citizen of the United States of American.either, and d.Obama knows he is not a natural born citizen and decided to run for President knowing he wasn't and he is lying to all of the 306,935,543 people in the United States and all of the 6,771,696,605 people on Earth.
If you chose #1, then good for you! You are correct and this is the proper explanation for solving this problem.
If you chose #2, then DING thanks for playing, but you are a total idiot. Explanation #2 is not only illogical and ridiculous, it is downright amusing and so are you.
rks1232
· 5 months ago
This whole thing kills me. Those that beleive the President is not a "legitimate Citizen" need to ask themselves one question. Don't you think our FBI, CIA, and any other alphabet soup agency in our governement would have figured it out by now that he isn't a citizen? Seriously stop for a moment and use the brain you were given. Normal Joes who have no access to anything solved the President is faking it and our own intellegence agencies are just being duped. For goodness sakes the Clintons would have used every angle of this, if it were true, to win the nomination. Like him or not he is our President show some respect.
I can't plant trees fast enough to replace the amount of oxygen these people are wasting.
2bill
· 5 months ago
Now that you mention it, don't all canidates get a background investigation check before getting secret service protection (start of campaign), on the intelligence committee in congress as senator(top secret clearance), has a u.s. passport, been state senator for 10 years.....WTF?
oan
· 5 months ago
For those who are new to American history and politics, being Black has always been seen as alien and suspect. As long as Barack Obama is a Black man, with a Black wife, there will be some scheme or another by people who are incensed that he is in power. These people are unable or unwilling to express the true reason for their hatred and disdain, so they resort to nonsense.
Name
· 5 months ago
Obama is half black and was raised by white people after his black father abandoned him. You can look it up.
oan
· 5 months ago
What is your point?
nellpost
· 5 months ago
yep.
politiliedetector
· 5 months ago
Bi-Racial White and African, but I get your point
jdbryce
· 5 months ago
Place of birth ("jus soli") is not the only deterimant of natural-born-citizenship. President Obama's mother was an American citizen, even if his father was not. Let us suppose that Obama had been born in France. He might be considered a French citizen by the French, but he would also be a natural-born American citizen on the basis of "jus sanguinis;" which is to say his citizenship derived from that fact that his mother was an American. So, it really doesn't matter where he was born, although all the evidence points to Hawaii as his birth place.
Assuming he was born in Hawaii, he gets his citizenship on the basis of "jus soli." Someone should look up the case of US v Wong Kim Ark. Wong was born in the US while his parent, who were Chinese citizen, were resident in the US conducting business. The Supreme Court ruled on the basis f "jus soli" that Wong was a native born American citien, because as stated in the 14th Amendment, "All persons born or naturalized in the United States, subject to the jusisdiction of the United States, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside."
Thus Obama's citizenship is determined by place of birth(jus soli) and by virtue that his mother was American(jus sanguinis).
I doubt that this will end this stupid controversy, but there it is.
jeninoh
· 5 months ago
you have got some kind of nerve bringing FACTS into this! Citing case law and all... sheesh. Way to wreck a good conspiracy theory... NOW what will we do? Play D&D?
student2
· 5 months ago
Hello, I just read your post. I take no sides on the issue of eligibility. I am interested in the legal aspects of this heated debate. I looked up "jus sanguinis" on google. I can't seem to find any cases where this has been applied to grant United States citizenship. I found a site that explains citizenship. http://www.statemaster.com/encyclopedia/United-.... It doesn't address the "jus sanguinis" issue either. Can you please write a link down relating to a court case that has a person born in a foreign country who was granted US citizenship on the basis of "jus sanguinis"? Please do not include any cases involving US sovereign soil. I am only a student wishing to understand more about this debate for an impartial paper I am writing. Thank you for your time.
jdbryce
· 5 months ago
I don't like to use Wikipedia as a source, but it has a comprehensive article on Wong Kim Ark v US in which the principle of jus sanguinis is discussed. The United States uses both jus soli and jus sanguinis as determinants of citizenship. As I mentioned in my conspiracy post, if your mother was traveling in Spain, France or any country, and gave birth to you, the US would consider you a natural born citizen via jus sanguinis. It would not matter to the US that France or Spain might consider you a native French or Spanish citizen also. Dual citizenship does not negate American citizenship.
If you check the Wikipedia article and click on jus sanguinis, it takes you to a discussion of jus sanguinis as a principle in multiple countries.
I should mention that in 1964 a faction argued that, since Barry Goldwater was born in Arizona BEFORE became a state, he was not a natural born citizen and thus ineligible to run for the presidency. This argument was as specious, albeit for different reasons, as the current debate on President Obama's citizenship.
J. D. Bryce
student2
· 5 months ago
Hello. Thank you for your reply! I looked up The Wong Kim Ark v US case yesterday. I thought that was more of a "jus soli" case. Wong was born in California. I may not understand the difference in the two terms. I do not understand Latin. Is "jus soli" related to citizenship when you are born in the US, and "jus sanguinis" when you are born to US parents outside of the US? I also don't understand the two cases against Goldwater and Romney. The only thing I can figure on their cases is that because they lost the elections, it was never tried in court. Did Goldwater ever apply for US citizenship? Was he ever officially a US citizen? Same with Romney. Was he ever awarded citizenship? I can't find these facts either. This paper is getting very long. I may not be able to use this topic because it might take too many pages to write. Back to my original question. Has there ever been a case where a person, born to US citizen parents, in a foreign country, not on US soverign soil, was granted US citizenship? Again, this is for research only. I have no stake or opinion for the current debate. I just want to get a good grade in school. Thank you.
jdbryce
· 5 months ago
1. Jus soli is Latin of "right of soil." It means that those born in a the US, subject to the laws of the US (non-diplomats) are citizens of the US. Jus sanguinis means "right of blood," and refers to people born out of a the US whose parent(s) are citizens of the US are citizens of the US. Jus sanguinis has its roots in English Common Law. There has never been a case of an person born overseas of American parents being denied natural born citizenship status. The jus sanguinis principle is totally established and would never be challenged.
2. Barry Goldwater was born in Arizona when it was a "territory" as opposed to a state. People born in US territories (Puerto Rico, Guam and Arizona before 1912) are natural born American Citrizens. The Goldwater case was never litigated because it was a preposterous claim. Goldwater never had to apply for citizenship. Was was native born!
3. The Romney case involved his "residency" in Massachussetts, not his birth. Romney's opponents opposed his candidacy for Governor on the basis that he supposedly had not sufficiently established is legal residency in the state. It had nothing to do with his national citizenship.
I cannot imagine where you are getting your information from.
4. You need to take courses in Constitutional Law to intelligently write about these issues. As regards your paper, narrow the scope. You're developing "scope creep," which means you're expanding the subject of the papaer as you research it. The central issues of President Obama's natural born citizenship controversy involves his birth in Hawaii and the supposed inauthenticity of his birth certificate. The birth certificate debate is irrevevant because even if he wasn't born in Hawaii, his mother was an American citizen and thus he is a natural born citizen by virtue of jus soli. Research jus soli as the focus of your paper.
student2
· 5 months ago
Hello again. I don't understand why you are getting upset with my questions. I maybe naive, but that doesn't mean you have to tell me what I need and don't need to do. When I refered to Romney I ment George Romney, not Mitt. Did you ever hit the link I provided? It has alot of information about citizenship. So the awnser to my question is that no case has ever been tried with regards to that subject. Ok. I do not see any laws made that state persons born in US Territories are granted Natural Born citizen status. So, again I'm still not sure Goldwater was eligible to hold office. There have been no decisions made about Constitutional eligibility to run for the Office of President, only who can and cannot hold said office. Only a few of the US territorie have US citizenship laws. "jus sanguinis" does not cover persons born to only one US citizen parent. I am writing an impartial paper. If I focus on "jus soli" that is not impartial. Also please slow down when you type. I see alot of typo's.
jdbryce
· 5 months ago
I'll make this very plain. Persons born in Puerto Rico or any territory of the United States are natural born citizens. You might want to research US territorial policy beginning in 1898, when we acquired The Philippines, Guam, and Puerto Rico as territories.
George Romney was born in Mexico of parents with were living in Mexico conducting business. He also was a natural born American citizen by virtue of jus sanguinis.
Jus sanguinis, as a determinant of citizenship, is a principle so old that no one until recently has opted to challenge it. The Wong kim Ark established jus soli as an additional determinant of natural born citizenship. Since the 1890s, Jus soli and jus sanguinis have been the dual principles on which native-born American citizenship is determined. Period. That's the answer!
My irritation with your questions is that I answered them, but you simply ignored what I wrote and asked the same questions again.
student2
· 5 months ago
I never ignored what you wrote, and I'm sorry, but you are wrong. The Phillipines have never been accorded any Citizenship rights. Look up cathy's post. She was born of American citizen parents overseas and she had to apply for citizenship. She is a nationalized citizen. I'm sure she'd choose to be natural born if she had that right available to her. You seem to me to be an angy person, just like everyone else on this site. I cannot believe how much this issue makes people angry. Who cares. I'm going to give up on the idea of writing this paper. I'll write about how much the US spends on lawn care versus how much is needed to feed the homeless. That issue won't piss off any angry people. Irritated, huh. I'll let you have the last word on this post if it makes you feel like more of a man. I would say I appreciate your time, but you haven't help me decide anything other than to not write papers about current events.
jdbryce
· 5 months ago
As of today, virtually all children born of American parents in the Philippines or anywhere in the world are natural born American citizens by virtue of jus sanguinis. There is no question or debate on this issue. In addition, children born in any US territory (except Samoa) are natural born American citizens. That is the law!
You seem upset. This is supposed to be an intellectual debate, if indeed debating "conspiracies" like can be called intellectual. Fro myself, I believe that emotions are like underwear: They are necessary, but it is tacky when they're shown. Emotions are to be controlled, not displayed.
J. D. Bryce
jdbryce
· 5 months ago
I have been considering what you wrote about the "Cathy" who was born the child of an American military officer while he was stationed in Peru. This person, in order to establish citizenship would have had to apply to the Department of State and furnish proof of her birth situation. The State Department would then issue proof of citizenship. This person is simply asking the State Department to confirm her status as a citizen. That is not the same as a resident alien applying for citizenship.
In addition, the affirmation by the State Department would not make her a naturalized citizen, but a natural born citizen based upon her father's citizenship, or on the basis of jus sanguinis. I should add that Peru, might consider her a Peruvian citizen, but that it irrelevant to her status as a natural born American citizen.
MS
· 5 months ago
Racism...Racism......how low with the Republicans go before they bottom out! FOX is a joke and now considered the new Comedy Channel. Who cares about this crap...he is our President and I voted for him and will again in 2012!!!
I hope Obama never shows you people anything! He has nothing to prove!!!
Rock on Mr. President!!!
chimsect
· 5 months ago
This thread's really got some legs, thanks to the patriots who've decided that it's time to get serious about confronting the bigoted birther whack-jobs.
May I humbly remind all concerned that the birther freakazoids are nothing more than a bunch of sick, demented bigots who cannot hold a candle to President Barack Hussein Obama when it comes to both personal achievement and true concern for the future of our country. That's what kills them, really. They've been duped into trumpeting "personal responsibility" as a cause for all societal ills (only when it applies to "others", of course), but now the dire economic circumstances that they helped to create through their complicity in murder and war profiteering have given them a visceral understanding that they have been broken down shotgun-style and plugged from behind with their own dumbed-down ideology. And yet they can't bring themselves to admit that it's their own fault - they brought it on themseleves.
May they rot.
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
GOP R.I.P. 1854 - 2014 [est]
good-bye party of Lincoln and abolition - and - hello parties of (after)'birther' wack jobsplinter factions, primarily regional fly over 'pockets' of ignorance and (still treasonous after all these years) johnny rebs.
and, good riddance. the trashman cometh in 2014 to haul away the remainder of the GOP
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
This birther crap is an attack on a specific president requiring ad-hoc things that neither exists, nor are required.
Hawaii's officials, including the Republican Governor, declared that Obama was born in the United States. If you can't deal with America and her states having established institutions, then neither Cook nor you understand this country very well.
If you were trying to perfect these institutions, I might even believe that any of you are actually sincere.
Obama is an American. Obama Won. If you don't like it get active and perfect the message that you have for the voters.
Navigator7
· 5 months ago
Nope
He is a USURPER IN CHIEF
This sordid affair should have ended when Obama posted his birth certificate on his website. Instead....it was a fake. Actually it was two fakes.
And is anybody following the story about the two hospitals Obama was born in?
So here we are.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Bravo.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
"That Sow-With-Lipstick will one day butter your bread." - Navigator7
Wait. Sarah Palin quit her job as Governor to become my housekeeper? Weird. Well, I guess Sonia Sotomayor is about to get promoted, so I DO need a new housekeeper.
But I'm not willing to pay employment taxes for Sarah, so she'll have to work under the table. Won't be the first time, I'm sure. Don't you wonder just what Sarah said or did to old man McCain when they had their ONE and ONLY ten-minute meeting prior to his selection of her as VP candidate? They were on his Sedona, Arizona ranch, which is in the middle of butt fuck Egypt and private as any multi-millionaire white couple would need to be... but even so, they went off together to a PRIVATE spot by a creek, where they talked for a grand total of 10 minutes.
Sounds like just enough time to get the zipper up [when he noticed his fly was open], down, and up again, and then re-apply the make-up.
I don't know if I can hire her as my maid. I have a strict no-drug-selling policy at my house. So that would mean none of her in-laws could ever come over to pick her up when her shift is finished.
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Morning Stephen.
You are a machine.
Joe
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Hey Joe (that's a great song, by the way).
Eh, I make this look harder than it is. I spend most of my time chortling and saying "you gotta be kidding me," if you want to know the truth. I don't exactly have to compose and edit to be able to respond to the likes of kwiley, dti, JT casey123, Navigator7, and their ilk.
And I multi-task. I've got dual monitors and I'm busy doing other stuff at the same time. So it may seem like I've never left, but in fact I went out to dinner and I just came back and thought I'd see what I missed. Just had to post a couple of the most ridiculous ones that were buried down deep. I wanted them up front for the new arrivals to see. Especially that absurdity about "you can have the country back when I'm done protecting it." Rambo was 1985, dude. You know?
Anyway, morning!
Florida Christian
· 5 months ago
High school monitor pass = not available boy scout merit badge count = not released captain marvel secret decoder ring = not released bong water recycling permit = not available membership in Star Trek fan club - sealed by court order
What is this man trying to hide?
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
The decoder ring made me laugh out loud.
I was chewing at the time. Enjoy the visual.
Thanks!
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Funny stuff FC. I'm still laughing at the reptilian one though.
Wayoutwest
· 5 months ago
Stephen, Keep up the good fight, they are bringing in the big guns, or at least big piles of bs. If superpat is in the military his C.O. will be looking for him. I don't have the energy to keep up. I miss the 60's, when we were in the streets we could feel the power and it was fun to watch the opposition run.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Thanks, wayout. It's not much of a fight, but it's good. Actually, I am fighting with my conscience a little bit for being mean to mentally-challenged racists. I sort of came to the conclusion that their arguments and expression of same were so dumb that there has to be something wrong with those people. And if they have actual diagnosed disorders or limitations then I feel bad.
But they didn't identify and disclose those disorders before they started saying hateful petulant child b.s. So I'm really undecided about whether to continue. I just decided. I'll continue.
Cheers!
Wayoutwest
· 5 months ago
Stephen, If you have some time check out New Mexico Independent. There is an article on the 30yr anniversery of the Crown Point Urianium spill. It was never cleaned up and the mining interests are trying to open up again. The Navajos are trying to stop it and i'm sure they could use some legal help. You probably don't have the time but it might get your mind off these birthers.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
I'm from Albuquerque. I'll look into the story. Thanks.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Here's the thing about the paid blogger idea. This is my first time coming to this site; prior to yesterday I have never posted here. I usually post at Huffington Post or Politico under the name stephenHNIC.
This site is apparently liberal. Judging from the stories the Washington Independent publishes, not by the comments (the latter would be an illogical basis on which to judge).
Why would Obama need to pay bloggers to post comments on liberal sites? Particularly as to an issue about which NO liberal needs persuading - the birther thing. No reasonable person (and no liberal, no matter how unreasonable) believes any of that crap for a second.
So why would the President risk a HUGE scandal by having it exposed that he paid people to say things in a silly little-read liberal newspaper three and a half years before he's facing re-election?
ALL that says to me is that you birthers really fear Obama. He'd have to have more money than God to be able to afford to do that. Because he's pragmatic. If he's paying X people Y dollars per hour or whatever to post here, he's gotta pay 100 X people 10 Y dollars to post at the NYT or Huffington Post, just based on the viewership. And then he's got to do a print campaign. And then he's got to get people on TV. It just goes on and on.
I'm starting to see how this conspiracy theory thing works. Nifty. Not true. But nifty.
cyrano2u
· 5 months ago
I have coined a phrase "Christianized Racism", where in 'conservative' circles, [[note conservative does not mean moral or family values, as evidenced by the emerging hypocrisy of the GOP]], in conservative circles, these sound bite attacks on the President are delivered as a test of loyalty to the cause. I see it in my church from dear friends I have known for years!! this concept of "you are not a good Christian "if you do not parrot the anti-Pres. Obama sound bites; reason, justice, and righteousness be damned, Show us you feel like us, hate like us, and attack this black president. It is about the President being black, the reasons they use for attacking him are so insubstantial as to border on the ludicrous. I AM A CHRISTIAN, I AM A PASTOR, Conservative reformed theology, trained in seminary, and believed many conservatives to be my brothers in Christ. So as I look on the online rants, and the character assassination, I can’t help but consider the same message presented in my circles with more polite sophistry. I actual have close friends, well now I do not know how close, call their president muslim, that he is hijacking the country, he is not a citizen, on and on… Now any one that is white and inclusive is painted as a liberal or left, there are good white folks that are calm, reasonable, sane, LOVING, people, some even DISAGREE with the president. They do not spew the racism that I see in these fringe group.
You know zealots are people consume by the INFECTOUS cancer of hate and rage, like mad dogs reaching out your hand in kindness will only get it bit. Zealots are an ugly thing to behold whether they wear muslim garbs, or a southern confederate flag, or camouflage fatigues. So in the absence of substantive issues to hide the hate in, these people are reveal themselves for the hate and fear mongers they are. They defend the GOP elite, as if they were part of that that privileged power structure. Reminds me of the civil war as poor southern whites died to defend the "rights" of rich southern plantation and slave owners. Those poor white families might think they were part of the rich white franchised power structure but only in their minds, and to reassure themselves they will go and find some powerless black person to lynch to affirm that they too are a powerful white person. Now today they like rabid pack of mad dogs are trying to lynch and pull down the most powerful black person they see, President OBAMA, and like a baying pack of dogs, trying to pull them off the scent is pointless. They must in their minds eye take down a black person(black or Mexican in arizona) so they can again reassure themselves they are part of the powerful white structure. You cannot reason with insanity.
Ethel Brost
· 5 months ago
The curious headline led me to a liberal newspaper. The comments here are wild, vulgar, insipid, arrogant and intellectually challenged hysteria. A dearth of polite, thoughtful debate is unknown to a party of the ilk of Al Franken, John Kerry, Ted Kennedy, and a pretender.
Why is this issue so important to American citizens who were privileged to gain an education before 1960? Because we know our history, not pop culture.
How many times in your life do you need to show legitimate proof of USA residency? Why don't you require it of your president? How many names has the pretender used in his life? Which name is on any documentation of election and inauguration? Why has he been spending hundreds of thousands, perhaps a million by now, of dollars on attorneys to seal his history? Why did he go hiking to the birth records department in Hawaii when seeing his ailing white grandmother? That long CofD published is so farcical that Ronald McDonald would see through it. What passport did he use to visit Pakistan at a time when Americans were banned? Does he have a Social Security account? At least one of his fanciful tomes has been claimed by Bill Ayers as the author. What makes an adult with a bigamous father who abandoned him write such pompous books about such a scoundrel? Why would he never acknowledge a man who adopted him and gave him his Muslim education?
His outright scorn and hatred of America, as well as his wife's open hatred of America, makes one wonder why he would want to be the nation's leader? That, unfortunately, is being revealed in breathtaking speed. Under his illegitimate rule, our sovereignty, culture, society, economy and our very national being has been destroyed.
Please note that the opposition to this man by myself and other conservatives is NOT racial. Race is a liberal issue, so please don't waste your time with inane protestation.
This pretender has been groomed to force us into a new world order. We're already there. Some of us have to be eliminated to meet control numbers, and any one of you could suffer that fate as I.
Ridicule, scathe, scourge, vilify as you will. You change nothing, because you prefer your vacuous existence.
xcott
· 5 months ago
I hope this doesn't come across as vulgar ridicule, but much of what you posted are false rumors that have been debunked for a while.
For example, there was no ban on travel to Pakistan. That was apparently just made up by some dude on the Internet, and repeated by the type of people who uncritically believe some dude on the Internet.
Also, I have been required to show proof of citizenship and residence many times, but I've never had to show more than a passport, social security card, or maybe a reprint of my birth certificate. At no point have I ever had to show someone the original paper document sitting in a government building in Springfield, IL. I'm pretty sure that neither have you.
mannix1962
· 5 months ago
So what does he have to hide? When you have a long form birth certificate it tells us the hospital you were born at and the doctor that delivered you. He could shut everyone up by releasing it
xcott
· 5 months ago
Do you honestly believe that releasing that document will cause all those conspiracy theorists to change their minds, accept the evidence and take down their web sites?
We already know the answer to that question because the Obama campaign released a reprint of his birth certificate. The conspiracy theorists simply said it isn't enough and now they demand the original. If that is released they will then demand hospital records.
That's the way a denial movement works, you continually pretend that you only want one piece of evidence that you don't have yet, and try to make the government look like it's hiding something because they won't meet your demands.
RDS49
· 5 months ago
Two Points:
First, stop the controversy by providing the Long Form Birth Certificate and not the Certificate of Live Birth which is not a Birth Certificate.
Second, on the Certificate of Live Birth it states that the Father’s race is ‘AFRICAN’. In the 1960’s information it would state for race ‘NEGRO’. To use the term ‘AFRICAN’ someone wants to be politically correct and creating a bogus document.
Provide the long form Birth Certificate and end this.
xcott
· 5 months ago
If you think that will "stop the controversy" then you don't understand conspiracy theories. No amount of evidence will stop these people from declaring everything fake and demanding more.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
There are many lies in your post. But to start off, it's interesting that you berate the comments here as "wild, vulgar, insipid, arrogant and intellectually challenged hysteria" before going on to refer to the sitting U.S. President in a time of war as "the pretender" twice?
Because of that ironic slander, and the lies I mentioned above, I wonder how persuasive you expect to be. I doubt that persuasion is your goal. You just wanted to vent.
Hence the "so farcical that Ronald McDonald [and no one else including the State of Hawaii] would see through it"; "fanciful tomes"; "bigamous father"; "pompous books"; "scoundrel"; "outright scorn and hatred of America"; "his wife's open hatred of America"; "illegitimate rule"; and "eliminated to meet control numbers" nonsense. I repeat. Nonsense.
You could have eliminated ALL of that invective from your post and still made some sort of argument for why we should need to examine the President's birth certificate AGAIN. And at least then you would deserve respect, and you would receive it.
But when you put all that crap in your post, it loses any pretense of legitimacy. You are not motivated by some patriotic desire. You just want to slam the President. And it's not because he's a Democrat. It's because he is black. So make up whatever nonsensical strawman you want about race being a liberal issue. We all see the truth.
And then you have to go and lie.
No government attorney, and no private attorney, has racked up "hundreds of thousands, perhaps a million by now, of dollars" "to seal his history." The cases that have been filed thus far, save one that is pending, have been thrown out as frivolous by a judge acting on his or her own motion (sua sponte). That means hardly any, if any, defense costs have been incurred. Obama has not had to spend any time dealing with this.
There is a pending case in which a judge finally agreed to hear the merits of this bogus issue. Once that case is tossed out, as it will be, after the merits have been heard, then it will have preclusive res judicata effect on all litigation about this stupid issue. That is, no one else will be able to bring suit challenging the legitimacy of the President to serve, because the merits have been heard.
That case may, but has not yet, require the President (through the appropriate office representing him, certainly not the President himself) to appear in the suit and offer testimony or evidence. Legal fees, in the form of government staff time, may then become generated. But in all likelihood, the judge in that case will simply allow the plaintiff in the case to have a hearing, where the burden of proof will be on the plaintiff as moving party, and the President's office will say nothing at all, since they do not have to. The moving party will be unable to establish anything that will controvert the public record before the Court.
That is, the Court can look at the documents referenced in the previous cases, including the certified copy of the birth certificate and the words of the officials from Hawaii attesting to its authenticity. When the moving party has nothing admissible that would refute that, the case is over. Without the President doing anything. And certainly without the President racking up a million in legal fees. I just told you the whole thing in five minutes.
Notice that I said the moving party (birthers) will have nothing admissible. None of the nonsensical far-right-wing preacher/lunatic "abstracts" or "articles" are admissible as evidence.
So that's lie 1. I think I'll do at least one more just to drive it home.
Lie 2 - "Why did he go hiking to the birth records department in Hawaii when seeing his ailing white grandmother?"
When did you stop beating your wife? The only one who went hiking is Mark Sanford. Quit making things up.
Okay that was too easy. Let's do one more.
Lie 3 - visiting Pakistan "at a time when Americans were banned" -- that one was covered ably by a worthy colleague. Skip to lie 4.
Lie 4 - "At least one of his fanciful tomes has been claimed by Bill Ayers as the author." That's ridiculous. Ayers never said that he wrote either of Obama's books. A far-right-wing kook said that Ayers wrote Obama's book. There's a vast difference between those two things. Which is why that's lie 4.
Okay I guess that's enough. Thanks for the lesson in civility and truth-telling.
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Hi Ethel,
Nobody is saying that proof of citizenship isn't required for many things, we're saying that it was already duly provided until a judge says otherwise. The 'show us the long form' argument presupposes something required has been withheld, I disagree that this is the case. For the present, Hawaii has the last word.
And characterizing everyone that disagrees with you as wild, vulgar, insipid, arrogant and intellectually challenged, does not constitute civil debate either. There's lots of anti-philosophers to go around, so why generalize?
As for all the other complaints, elections have consequences and I remember feeling as you not so long ago. Since you're slightly older than I am, I guess you've already learned times changed ever and anon?
As for new world order, don't depress yourself with that stuff. Even if were true, you give them more power and due than they would deserve. This world has seen many greedy ages come and go, and the sun still comes up, the birds still sing and babies still smile.
Joe
josephmaine
· 5 months ago
Joe,
Hawaii has never officially stated that they verified anything about the image posted on the internet. Never. People keep coming up with things like Lingle said this or Okubo said that, but none of this is official. Refer to my post. Why did Obama not bring it to the people who issued it, in order to legitimize it and verify it? Instead they show it to 2 people from a website, Jess Hennig and Joe Miller? Who the f*ck are they?
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
josephmaine,
I appoligize for missing your question until I checked my email. I'm going to go with the Republican govenor of Hawaii and the board that say its official. When the highest officials in a state say official, its official util proven in court otherwise.
Joe
kb345
· 5 months ago
Ethel, where in your small, single-thought brain do you come up with this stuff? Where do you right-wing conservatives come up with the ideas like "His outright scorn and hatred of America, as well as his wife's open hatred of America, makes one wonder why he would want to be the nation's leader?" or "Some of us have to be eliminated to meet control numbers, and any one of you could suffer that fate as I." Do you ever read anything factual? I already know that you were a Bush supporter, you're as crazy and egotistical as he was!
jimdonnelly
· 5 months ago
Do Republicans think removing Obama will change the Democrat's policies? He is not a king or a dictator. If the Repubs. are wrong (they're on a roll now), they will appear to be more out for power and political gain than for the good of the country. Isn't this the reputation they are trying to shed?
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
You could have just ended your post after the first three words and it would pose just as intriguing a question.
Just saying. No offense meant. Except toward Republicans.
ccatl
· 5 months ago
Why do Republicans hate this country so much they would waste valuable time on a snipe hunt like this? Over the last 8 years they allowed this country to devolve into an economic nightmare and now they want to spend their time in office on this matter that has already been debunked? Every single one of them needs to be voted out of office.
Kelly
· 5 months ago
Extremist conservatives are such morons. Hawaii has already shown the birth certificate. Even a conservative website had to recant. How was this not issue when he was senator but now that he was running and became president, all of the sudden it is? Listen jerks, just own up to your racism. Just say that you never thought we would be the kind of country that would elect a "negro" president and while you whine and complain the majority of us will be thankful that it is exactly this kind of country.
Alan Smithee
· 5 months ago
People keep saying, "We'll stop when we see the Birth Certificate". Did he withhold it? Did it not go through all the necessary channels? Did he get to where he is by writing "Burf Curtifikut" in crayon on a piece of construction paper and using that as proof? Does Obama have to take it on a tour of America and personally show every buckethead that has ridiculous, unfounded "doubts"?
These "birther" comments do for progress what Amy Winehouse does for erections.
Roger
· 5 months ago
Here's the problem Bobkat... The MASS MAJORITY of americans already believe he is a citizen The President can sit back and watch all you guys say this and say that and basically say look how crazy the repubs are. You have to remember that the support the "birther" movement has is just preaching to the choir. The general public will not be with u on this one without substantial proof. If it existed u bets believe Clinton would have found it during the primary. Addittonally, don't u guys realize a full background check is done on every canidate. NO WAY A MAN CAN GET INTO THE WHITE HOUSE WITHOUT A COMPLETE CHECK. Again, sounds like completely looney.
dragonlady52
· 5 months ago
Breaking News! I have it on good authority that George W. Bush is NOT a citizen.He is actually from the planet Doofus and was on a reconnaissance mission prior to invasion. The proof is out there for all to see on any number number of websites that get their information directly from God. (Those sites also offer a great price on tinfoil hats.) My mind is made up so don't try to convince me with facts.
Roger
· 5 months ago
LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
truthmatterz
· 5 months ago
a spokesman for Centcom took issue with Taitz’s claim, made in a WorldNetDaily story, that this decision verified conspiracy theories about the president’s birth. Later that night, Sean Hannity cited the story on his Fox News show and used Taitz’s version of the facts, not Centcom’s.
“Major Cook and his lawyer expressed joy at this outcome,” said Hannity. “And they took it as an admission on the part of the military that the president is not in fact a legitimate citizen by birth.” **************************************************************************************************** I don't think it is news to anybody that so-called conservatives only support the part of the troops and military that happen to agree with them.
Isn't Sean Hannity a high school drop out anyway? Maybe he should be excused for not understanding that Hawaii is one of the 50 United States.
Danae777
· 5 months ago
LOL RIIIIIGHT. At least Hannity knows that there are only 50, as opposed to Obama telling us he has visited all 57..... umhum. What are the names of those other 7 again? I missed that part of American History I guess.....
truthmatterz
· 5 months ago
I feel sorry for the truly ignorant, but I won't waste my time with the willfully ignorant............
blurch
· 5 months ago
He was probably referring to the 7 territories, stupid.
HowardOF
· 5 months ago
Ah, another one of the idiot right wing's misrepresentations. Obama said 57 CONTESTS, not States. I know it's hard for little Right Winger minds to grasp, but there are elections in the US territories too.
Concerned American
· 5 months ago
You can laugh all you want to about how stupid the right wingnuts are, but if they continue to stir up their wingnut base to generate calls, letters, email, twitters ('twits' may be a more appropriate term, here), etc., over every single lie they happen to want to believe, it will truly poison public discussion about everything else, which appears to be their intent.
Perpetration and perpetuation of lies is a very strong tool. In this case, recently we already see a soldier refusing deployment orders, because he claims the Commander in Chief is illegitimate, because of the claim that he is not really a citizen. Needless to say, if there are a lot of wingnuts in the military like that, it could be very disruptive.
Recall that the 'Swifboat' lies in the 2004 election were certainly enough to swing the entire election. It didn't matter that they were lies. The perpetration and perpetuation of those lies has certainly (and adversely) had a profound effect on the course of our nation, and, indeed, on world history.
Also note that such paralysis of publc discourse was a prime goal of the Nazis before they came to power. The Nazis used every technique they could to discredit democracy, in general, and the Weimar Republic, in particular, during their grab for power in the 20's-30's. This behavior is destructive of democracy, and it appears to be getting worse here.
I'm not sure that this is a sign of desperation. Unfortunately, it may signal a shift of strategy by the right wing core of the Republican party and its adherents to further weaken our democracy to the temptations of authoritarianism - simple answers for simple people.
The leaders of this effort know that this particular uproar is a lie. They also know that their followers believe it. Unfortunately, even if it is debunked, as it already has been, a great number of these followers will STILL believe it, and still cause an uproar. This sort of lie-followed-by-uproar can be used over and over, based on all sorts of lies and accusations to cause public chaos. Expect a lot more of it.
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
So here is a chance for Obama to save "Democracy". You know, "simple answers for simple people". Yes, he can save the military forces from themselves and prevent the poisoning of "public discussion about everything else". He could become "transparent", practice what he preaches and release information about himself. Starting with his birth, and then ordering the release of his school records. We don't want any more "public chaos". We had enough of that with the lefty-commie-lib-youth movement that destroyed the country back in the 60's.
annoyed
· 5 months ago
Yackety Smackety you wing nut freak. This has been hashed and rehashed and NO MATTER HOW MANY TIMES you are presented with the truth you will still refuse to accept it. So please get out your tin fol and perhaps stick your finger in an electric socket. Do you know how annoying it is in this day and age to have idiots like you who refuse to accept reality?
Obama Won. get over it.
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
Name calling again? LONG FORM. LONG FORM, LONG FORM.
WHERE IS IT? WHERE IS IT? WHERE IS IT?
If you are annoyed, go listen to your Beetles albums some more and STFU! Stay out of the debate! Stick your head in the sand! OR learn to debate facts. Don't just be personally abusive. That is the way spoiled brats argue. Notice I didn't say debate. Obama is a f@cking liar. Get over it.
strangely_enough
· 5 months ago
"OR learn to debate facts." Holy cognitive dissonance Batman!!! How does one debate "facts" with someone who won't acknowledge reality?
slimslowslider
· 5 months ago
Obama won.
DownWithIt
· 5 months ago
Accept the challenge that was given to you earlier. Prove that anyone can get the Long Form from Hawaii upon request. If they can't, then Obama has provided the best available evidence and you should concede the point, get over it, and move on.
Name
· 5 months ago
Concerned American, have you lost your mind? If the state has offically declared that he was born there enough said, you have the burdon to prove your retarded argument not the rest of us who have a brain, if you turn up some evidence to show that all these people are in some grand conspiracy then do so or shut the hell up By the way what would all these people have to gain by this conspiracy?
martyr
· 4 months ago
I don't care if he is from Mars. O Bummer is nothing more than an ORGANIZER. One who is surrounded by thugs. Fom Chicago no less. America under him is becoming the New Mexico, or worst yet, Venezuela. Poor and poorer and elites such as he.
Business and industry will no longer be viable in this Socialist Society created by this Communist Community Organizer.
Especially Small business. I have seen more small Mom and Pop businesses go bust in the past year then I have ever noticed ever.
How anyone can still stand in step in your full brown shirt attire is beyond comprehension to the average person possessing plain old Common sense. Remove your blinders, open your eyes and minds if possible, and really see what is happening here in America. The World sees America today very Clearly, and China is warning us and this Organizer that this country is going to hell in a hand basket. This Emperor has no clothes and you fools still follow.. Save your shit response about my typos .. you want to talk points. Talk points. But I could gave a damn how its spelled he is an ass and so are his ass followers..
He bullied people in the primaries when Hillary was winning. He cried racism when the Clintons were still garnering the Black Vote. He won the primaries by flooding the Caucus rooms with his minions and thugs.
Oh and maybe seeing as we can have Black Panthers with billy clubs paid workers at Polling places. Just asking, who knows, but does that mean white hoods and sheets carrying rope can work poll places too? I mean if voter intimidation is good for the goose what about the gander?
I am from Connecticut where the torture and murder of Bobby Seal took place. Black Panthers are militant in case you didn't know. The Panthers equate to the same scum in sheets they possess the same mentality. Hate and be hated.
But your dear leader uses the panthers at polling places.. wow A-con people look too timid and un-intimidating ? Actually Obummer is a rather wimpy looking thing to begin with.. he probably dated all white chicks back in the 70's. Then on to politics and being black, for that ticket.
He is worst then Carter and he is a mulatto, and possibly not even a Black American, at least not one with roots in this country who really rose beyond all his struggles.. He nor Michele struggled. He backed out of transparency He backed out on Public Funding He actually got a pass on being audited for all those fraud charges being used to fund his campaign.
The list goes on. Presidente of the Census Presidente of the auto industry Presidente of the banks Presidente of the insurer AIG, on and on.. yep he is a Communist Community Organizer. Presidente of Service to AMERICA One website for a few million. Can't any of his freaks, maybe one of you reading this with free time VOLUNTEER for America and do the website for free. I would do it just for the FREE advertising of my skills.
But then again I don't live home with M&D. I have a family to raise. So I am a very concerned Citizen. One of those that gagged at the thought of voting for McCain. Being open minded, I even thought once, for a fleeting moment, to give this Leader a chance..
He has had it , and its a little over 7 months now.. No energy independence. Government Dependence for all. Who questions him? Who digs and sees that he is Organizing America to third world sub standards. The media all of it are his doormats. Helen Thomas Asked what are you pulling with your phony town halls. Now the Left thinks she is senile?? There is no objection to anything he says or does because he is a black man .. give me a break. He is a man using his blackness to get where he is. He is no different then Jesse and Al pushing till the door opens OR ELSE.
So that is my opinion of the man, his administration, his campaign..
Tell me what you see that he is planning, or already done, that is good for America?
For the UN maybe. For Mexico yes, but not to the rest of the World that took the blinders off. Unless you count the dictators who approve of your Communist Community Organizer. You know his buddy Chavez, and his and hollywood Loonies cozy pal Castro those who see this menace for what he is, a Dictator the same as them. The real world sees that he is not even near the pay grade of a McDonalds store manager, let alone the President of the United States. The free world leader. The Third world dictatorship he is creating fits him to a "T". Actually I regress, its your turn. You tell me what he HAS done, that you are so approving of? Anyone?
stephenperry
· 4 months ago
You "regress?" Talk about your Freudian slips. It's "digress," doofus.
What do I like that he has done?
Well, for starters, he did something to make you write all that pathetic bullshit.
More to the point, he didn't do anything. You just wrote all that because you're a pathetic bullshitter.
Care to tell us some more horror stories of what you've seen happen in this past year? Obama has been President for six months. We never tire of hearing about shit that Bush did wrong. Surely you blame Bush, and not Obama, if indeed you blame the President, for what happened during 8 years of Bush's watch?
No? You'd rather blame the guy trying to turn the aircraft carrier around after warning us that it'd take 2 years...
than the one who drove it drunk to Iraq and took a picture of himself under the Mission Accomplished banner?
Gee, that makes sense and is awfully fair of you.
Cry me a river.
Glad you understand that Obama is the President.
Beyond that your opinions are your own and you're entitled to them.
Except for that bullshit about Black Panthers at polling places. Absolutely false.
The line for whiny infantile know-nothing ranting is already long. Get in line behind franknowzad and naturalborn.
rkba
· 3 weeks ago
What part about the black panthers was false, exactly? The fact that they were there, or that they were paid workers. I doubt they were paid workers. But, they were definitely there. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=neGbKHyGuHU
franknowzad
· 4 months ago
Does that mean Obama won't be counting on your vote?
Florida Buddhist
· 4 months ago
If there is nothing to this story why has obbummer spent $1.7 billion dollars on lawyers suppressing this story?
Florida Buddhist
· 4 months ago
im joking
franknowzad
· 4 months ago
How about a Freedom of Information request to find out?
franknowzad
· 4 months ago
Hey commies, here's a good one from the WND.com people. A lady in Hawaii has just released her childrens birth certificates for inspection. There's more than enough original information to kill off any doubt that her children are natural born. Obama take note... But here's the rub. The lady's children were born on the 5th August 1961, at Kapolami. The birth cert's number is 151-61-10637. Obama was allegedly born on the 4th August 1961 -at various hospitals!?!- the number of his alldged birth cert? 151-1961- 010641. One day before, but 4 birth certs after the honest cert? It's a sad day when communists can't even lie properly.
stephenperry
· 4 months ago
frank, glad to see you haven't given up. You're still more wrong than fat people wearing spandex. But at least you're still here.
The fact that those two birth certificates have numbers that close in sequence is further proof of the authenticity of Obama's certificate. There's no reason to suppose that the documents arrived in any particular order. Obama was born at 7:24 p.m. on August 4. No government clerical worker is on duty until 8 am the next day. Documents get processed in the order in which they get processed. Unless you could show that there was some deliberate funny business here, all you have is more paranoid racist speculation.
And you cite WND for this? You make it seem as if your link takes you to a specific story. It does not; it's just a link to WND dot com.
And, of course, WND confirmed almost a year ago that the COLB is authentic. I posted about it on this very thread. You're just a disingenuous Brit, frank. Go read up on Walter Annenberg like I told you to.
Here's the WND post: ______________________________
Even World Net Daily has reported that the COLB presented by President Obama is authentic.
"However, FactChecker.org says it obtained Obama's actual certification of live birth and that the document was indeed real. The site discredited some of the claims of Internet bloggers, such as that the certificate as viewed in a scanned copy released by Obama's campaign lacked a raised seal. FactChecker.org also established that many of the alleged flaws in the document noted by bloggers were caused by the scanning of the document.
A separate WND investigation into Obama's certification of live birth utilizing forgery experts also found the document to be authentic. The investigation also revealed methods used by some of the bloggers to determine the document was fake involved forgeries, in that a few bloggers added text and images to the certificate scan that weren't originally there."
Wow. Got that? Authentic. Got that? People claiming otherwise added stuff that wasn't there before.
franknowzad
· 4 months ago
You just haven't got your pointy head around the COLB/BC difference, have you. Proper long form birth certs state place, hospital, physician and all the other bits of info which can determine eligibilty. World Net Daily confuses you because, unlike CNN, Pravda or the Pyongyang Times it presents different viewpoints.Which is called journalism. No one will be able to get to the bottom of the serial number thing until Obama faithfully upholds the Constitution and releases the thing. Until then the doubt will stink like the above mentioned fat person in a spandex catsuit. In a disco.
stephenperry
· 4 months ago
Nice try, frank. Your analogy doesn't work. The COLB is prima facie evidence of birth. Says so right on the document that you can see online.
No reasonable person has any doubt, and no unreasonable person has any evidence. So no stink, fat person in a disco or otherwise.
WND doesn't confuse me. It's a wacko fringe site. But even they saw that the COLB is authentic. See, I know that confuses you. It's ok. I never said you were intelligent.
franknowzad
· 4 months ago
Wrong Stinkovitch! Keep up with the People's Lying Front for Obama's sake! The COLB was SO last week. Are you a secret Birther spy?
stephenperry
· 4 months ago
Are you a real person? You're too stupid and plodding to be anything but a snaggle-toothed Brit, if you are a real person. Don't bite any apples, you ignorant fuck.
xcott
· 4 months ago
None of those bits of info determine eligibility. The specific doctor or hospital in Honolulu does not somehow invalidate one's citizenship.
What does determine eligibility is where you are born, a fact that is listed on the COLB. Indeed, that is why it is listed on the COLB. If the COLB was not sufficient to prove you were born in the state, there would be no point in issuing it.
firstsai
· 4 months ago
I can't swear to it, but another possible explanation, is that blocks of numbers are assigned to each hospital for after work hours, long week ends and holidays. This way, a temporary number can be assigned, and changed later.
Florida Buddhist
· 4 months ago
World Nut Daily has no credibility with any sane person.
Dont even bother responding to franks post, chances are no such lady even exists.
They just make stuff up out of thin air.
franknowzad
· 4 months ago
Right on comrade. Pol Pot lives on through you!
franknowzad
· 4 months ago
It's all got very quiet in the @bamaphile camp. How about an answer to the "how come Factcheck and the Govt checked the original BC during the election. When Hawaii destroyed the original in 2001? Will you halfwits agree "to trust but verify" the Chosen One from now in? Braindead peasants.
deebell
· 4 months ago
Are you on drugs? Where's your proof that Hawaii destroyed the original?
The Republican governor of Hawaii says he was born there. Get over it.
franknowzad
· 4 months ago
There won't be any proof until the Dear Leader releases the proper, full length BC. Until then there's been a barrage of lies from the commies, including the lie ablout Hawaii destroying the originals in 2001. The halfwits trying to lie for Obama can't even make their lies stand up. Why not just release the Usurper's originals? And when did any thinking person take a politician's word for granted? Trust but Verify.
stephenperry
· 4 months ago
What "thinking person" pays a 50% tax rate? Oh, yeah, an Englishman making 150,000 pounds in 2010.
What "thinking person" has a functional government and also a figurehead "Queen" who does nothing but soak up the wealth of the "peasants" and claim all wild geese and swans as Royal property? Oh, whoops, I already said Englishmen, didn't I?
What "thinking person" cannot tell the difference between Dear Leader Kim Jong Il and anyone else? No one at all. Oops, no one besides YOU, frank. So I guess we have to go with Englishmen again.
What "thinking person" accuses anyone of being "commies" after 1971? No one but you. The paranoid buzzword of the day is "socialism." Try to keep up.
Trust but Verify, indeed. Verification in the form of authentication from Hawai'ian state officials. Verification in the form of factcheck.org. Verification in the form of a system of laws.
Oh you mean verification as in "keep asking asinine questions that have no relevance in reality, in hopes of being taken seriously by grown-ups?"
Good luck with that, frank.
stephenperry
· 4 months ago
Peasants are in your beloved England, frank. Not here. I've been to England. Lotsa peasants there. Few teeth.
Your questions are loaded. When did you stop beating your wife? I'm glad you did. But you need to find something else to do now that your silly conspiracy theory has been conclusively and thoroughly and repeatedly exposed as being nothing but a fig leaf for xenophobic racists to hide behind.
Florida Buddhist
· 4 months ago
frnaknogads is a wanker and sources World Nut Daily i.e. a troll not worth anyones time
stephenperry
· 4 months ago
Even World Net Daily has reported that the COLB presented by President Obama is authentic.
"However, FactChecker.org says it obtained Obama's actual certification of live birth and that the document was indeed real. The site discredited some of the claims of Internet bloggers, such as that the certificate as viewed in a scanned copy released by Obama's campaign lacked a raised seal. FactChecker.org also established that many of the alleged flaws in the document noted by bloggers were caused by the scanning of the document.
A separate WND investigation into Obama's certification of live birth utilizing forgery experts also found the document to be authentic. The investigation also revealed methods used by some of the bloggers to determine the document was fake involved forgeries, in that a few bloggers added text and images to the certificate scan that weren't originally there."
Wow. Got that? Authentic. Got that? People claiming otherwise added stuff that wasn't there before.
As if that wasn't enough, here's a point about the claim that Obama supposedly lost his citizenship as a boy in Indonesia:
"In short, the suit claims Obama was not born an American citizen; lost any hypothetical American citizenship he had as a child (Editor's note: This point is not supported by U.S. citizenship law); may not now be an American citizen and even if he is, may hold dual citizenships with other countries."
So how about it, birthers? You ready to call it quits now that even World Net Daily has given up?
Oh, wait, that World Net Daily article was published August 23, 2008, ELEVEN MONTHS ago. That can only mean that 24 ahead dot com and every other loser who cited WND in reliance on this stupid conspiracy was never serious to begin with!
Oh well, I can't say I didn't already know THAT!
franknowzad
· 4 months ago
World Net Daily often publish articles that doubt the Birther case. it's called honest and fair reporting. They also don't go lynching any of their reporters who stray from the Party line. Unlike the Stalinists at CNN. There's a good article today. The point was raised, "if Hawaii did go paperless in 2001 (destroying all original copies) how come Factcheck, and all the other commies, get to touch, hold, feel, smell,etc the sacred Original Obama birth cert? If the originals have been inputed onto a computer then why not just release the damn thing. Obama is now officially more crap, and less liked, than Jimmy Carter. The news outlets supporting him are making themselves look like secretive fascists by their self censorship and horrible witch hunts of investigating reporters. It may be time to just release the Birth Certificate and be damned.
stephenperry
· 4 months ago
"There's a good article today. The point was raised, "if Hawaii did go paperless in 2001 (destroying all original copies) how come Factcheck, and all the other commies, get to touch, hold, feel, smell,etc the sacred Original Obama birth cert?"
Post a link to the "good article." Where'd you get it from? Guaranteed no legitimate site, not even WND, said anything about commies. Nor did anyone claim to have fondled or otherwise handled the original birth certificate. Factcheck and others, including Hawai'ian officials from the state's Dept. of Health, have viewed the hard copy of the COLB.
The original vital records are maintained electronically and state law prevents those from being released to anyone. Tenth Amendment. Americans have Amendments. Englishmen have jealousy and a figurehead Queen. We understand. That's why we left.
Oh, about that source I asked you to provide... I got it from "two inches up my own ass" is not a credible source on this side of the pond, frank.
MilliJoolz
· 5 months ago
(COMMIE)RedGraham 15 hours ago (Sorry Ken for clipping your clipping)
"Yeah I guess you Obama people are right about birthers being crazy, racist, stupid, sorelosers. Just look at who some of them are: Pat Boone, Alan Keyes, Michael Savage, Rush Limbaugh, best-selling author Jerome Corsi, numerous attorneys, numerous military officers, Lou Dobbs, at least eight percent of voters, the 400,000 Americans who signed the petitition for Obama to show his original Birth Certificate, Ron Paul & many other legislators."
Let me say just 1 thing:
1.: After reading through the list of names: I REST OUR CASE!
And I'm unanimous in that.
Florida Christian
· 5 months ago
Pat Boone is a great american and Christian. He is not only a wonderfull entertainer, but has extensive foreign policy experience.
He went on a Journey to the Center of the Earth and fought dinosaurs and got blown out of a volcanoe and everything so show some respect!
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
What's your proof? Did you read it on the side of a box of animal crackers?
JimPA
· 5 months ago
Stephen - You're overcompensating and your fear is obvious. You can’t go toe-to-toe with Pat Boone, he'll kill you. It doesn't take a man to stand there and get your head beat off. There no shame in going on vacation for a while. We’ll all understand.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
Ok then. Have a nice vacation. We'll cover your shifts.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
What you dismiss as a "vacation" I prefer to consider "going to Motown to lean on my Negro contacts to get Pat Boone kicked out of the Gospel Music Hall of Fame for siding against a black guy."
Because, of course, by doing so he is violating the agreement he reached with the black community when we allowed him to get famous by covering black songs for white audiences without letting on that he wasn't the first one to do the songs. He learned that from Elvis.
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Wow jimpa, that could be poetic, let me rearrange:
You can't understand the Boone... He may be loonie, but you cant withstand the man. Or perhaps you're just a dimwitted goon? Your visions of tropical sand, not withstand. We all understand.
(sorry. but as you may have guessed i am irish, and it is friday)
JimPA
· 5 months ago
I went Rocky III on Stephen. Apollo Creed: If you stand toe-to-toe with this bum, he'll kill you. It doesn't take a man to stand there and get your head beat off...! He's just a man, Rock, so be MORE man than him! Go get him; Eye Of the Tiger!
lol. since youre sleeping. good moring. I forgot the reference but I remember it now. i thought you just wanted to work 'beat off' into a sentence. :|
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
He did, jj. Everything else Jim said was just so much filler and fluff so he could work in the "beat off" line.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
Plus a great Christian rocker.
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
I'm a big fan Florida Christian, when your work is complete you should talk to us out of character. this thread is not forever.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
No way. He'll never come out of hiding.
Florida Christian is the hero this blog deserves, not the hero this blog wants.
Makes me wish Heath Ledger was around to do another Batman.
And wish that Florida Christian would come out of hiding. But it won't happen. See above.
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
no apologies necessary, milli he/she-it RICHLY deserves the COMMIE 'label', milli
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
I never had a doubt about how this would play out. the problem that i have is that we need real conservatives. the ppl that ask if every penny spent is actually necessary, so long as they get bogged down in division and conspiracy, then all the cylinders of democracy aren't firing. Just my $0.02
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
They took our trap comrades: they thought our fraudulent Usurper in Chief was the end and not the means. If only they knew how diabolical this really is. That over 50 years ago, not only did we lay the groundwork for our fraud, but we knew this whole movement would come about to bestride their imperial necks as a colossus. They have no idea how willingly they walked right in to make phase II complete.
This is red command, go phase III.
Authentication Query: “the frogs jump high” Authentication Answer: “but only in the spring”
Repeat: we are go phase III
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
I forget. Is phase III where we start using renewable energy to steal back the power that Bush stole from us? Don't those wind turbines like unwind the power company's power cables and bring the power back to the people? Pretty sure that's in the climate change bill. In an appendix or something.
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Yes. We will force them to breathe clean air. Their bodies will live longer, but their minds will be cleansed of smog. In 2 years they won't even know who they are.
After that we'll take superfluous industrial sugar and preservatives out of the food.
Muahhhaaa..
But have a care, 'renewable' is the duress code, but since I forgot to mention that, this will not be considered a breach. Stand down.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Oh hell with all that. I'll give up that usurper's real country of birth before I'll give up sugar. Industrial or otherwise. Commie libtards, try and stop me. State's rights!
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
This just in:
My daily paidObamablogger twitter message just informed me that the Barack Obama 2012 Presidential campaign theme song will be "Born in the U.S.A."
How ya like them apples, birthers? Hey, he IS "the Boss."
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Born on the Hawaiian Archipeligo The first kick he took because his skin brown He could'a acted like a dog that's been beat too much But he kept his head up, and became The POTUS
[chorus:] Born in the U.S.A. Born in the U.S.A. Born in the U.S.A. Born in the U.S.A
(Edited for English... again)
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
jj, it has been my experience that if any REAL American hears the opening bars of "Born in the U.S.A." or "Jack and Diane," then said REAL American gets a tightening in the throat, a misting in the eyes, hairs standing up on the back of their neck, and an unquenchable desire to say "I want my MTV!"
To quote a madman, "this could all be laid to rest so easily." Just blast those two songs at Obama when he tries to do a press conference. If he remains stoic, he's an alien life form. If he starts rockin' he's American.
America Rocks! Whoo-hoo!
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
"America Rocks! Whoo-hoo! "
Perfect!
franknowzad
· 5 months ago
Born in God-Knows-where Born in God-knows-where He's a dirty stinking commie from God-knows-where.
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
' dirty stinking commie' Hmm, reading your posts, I thought this was about due documentation! I knew it! You're and angry right-winger! gasssp!
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
See, there's no point in beating around the bush by pretending to take birthers seriously. Had this birther pegged since his first overseas cable, I mean post!
jackiebell
· 5 months ago
WOW--Mr. Franknowzad--"you're a poet and don't know it"! Don't know what generation is responsible for you?? The more you carry on, Mr. Franknowzad, the worse you look!! Someone should have spanked you soundly as a child, for having failed to respect your "betters".
"A hunter-killer team's primary mission is to seek out and destroy the enemy, particularly in contexts where the enemy is attempting to evade detection rather than seek engagement."
These (after)'birthers' (and worse) need to be 'monitored' & tracked and 'nullified', whenever and wherever they 'pop up'. The only way to nullify the force of their 'argument' (soreloserman tantrums as it were) is to meet them with an equal/superior opposing 'force'.
basic algebra. - 3 + 9 = +6, -1 + 3 = +2
-6 +3 = -3 > can't let that 'happen' cuz that's when the inmates take 'control' (like the Castle (R-Idiot) of the conversation and/or worse, the situation. email addys in 'here', just hit the 'tat' and 'browser search' 'gmail'. there are, will be PLENTY of opportunities to set the record straight and/or 'ID' for authorities the REALLY 'broken' ones. a guy's gotta have a 'hobby', AND the President and the Republic need a hand, so...
form up on my '6', safetys 'off'...
mallets up...
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
lol, you're a riot Ken. Don't forget our stealth Florida Christian, who operates faaaarrr behind enemy lines. Oops, just broke COMSEC.
And who needs a hunter when David Weigel can round them up for us?
:)
JimPA
· 5 months ago
Seems pretty quite here. I'll be late for my shift. Looks like the birthers gave up. Damn facts. Sure, some dead enders will move to school records and books not returned to the library but you kind of expect that.
Kenneth, I'm in. 5 man, surgical teams. In and out. You're too valuable to take point. I'm the new guy. I got it.
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
deal. and, the 'point' should be shared ALL are valued. like one of my historical 'mentors' said:
"Infantry must move forward to close with the enemy. It must shoot in order to move…. To halt under fire is folly. To halt under fire and not fire back is suicide. Officers must set the example" - General George Patton Jr "War as I knew it" 1947
and
"Lead me, follow me, or get out of my way." - General George Patton Jr
bottom line you lead from the front
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Ken, I'm in, as long as the whole team accepts that I'll need Florida Christian to translate for me whenever you say anything about math. I understand it better coming from Florida Christian. It all just make sense people!!!!
When we all go out to dinner to award one of us the Mole-Whacking Mallet of Justice for 2009, I'm going on record saying Florida Christian buys the first round in the bar beforehand. R@t bastard is the only one of us who has never known the eye-stabbing pain of trying to RESPOND to a birther argument.
The green-eyed monster strikes again. Still can't believe he's on the latest thread angering non-birthers into a frenzy.
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
"Inmates are running the asylum!" > (after)'birthers' go ballistic on (R-Idiot) Castle,
is EXACTLY what they 'signed onto' when they let the heavily medicated McSame pull the Palin 'rabbit' outta his ass. And, they deserve every defeat they're going to suffer until the 'after'(birthers' and/or sovereignist and/or secessionists and/or tea baggers all form independent parties PERMANENTLY fracturing the once proud party of Lincoln, founded on an abolitionist platform in in 1854 tears itself apart over the policies of the first black man in the white house. how ironic.
R.I.P GOP 1854 - 2014 [est.
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Ken: "founded on an abolitionist platform in in 1854 tears itself apart over the policies of the first black man in the white house. how ironic."
very profound
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
on the 200th anni of Lincoln's birthday, no less. yes, profound, ironic, sad, AND true. and, we've got a front row seat to it. big changes afoot and most will be for the better, not for 'them', but, they had a 30y 'trickle down' 'shot', and, it got us 'this'. so, it's time to reclaim, invest, and restore long term 'value' v short term 'profit' as THE fundamental econometric model for the US.
Count ME in! I'd recommend ALL early primary state Dems to pull a Rush 'Limp'Balls' maneuver and contribute AND 'vote' for this pairing so Obama-Biden can go 50-0 on their vacuous asses.
josephmaine
· 5 months ago
Dustin, you're just like the rest. If you deal in the facts and respond to the facts, then you don't just call people name, you formulate answers and responses which are real and productive.
Too bad you can't think, just name-call. Sorry you don't or can't use your brain.
DustInTheWind
· 5 months ago
Some of this stuff may have worked before the election but now it just looks childish and desperate.
I read posts on a recent weekend where every third of fourth post was typed in bold caps with explanation points and about this issue. I assumed that a new class of summer interns "brown shirts" had been unleashed by the Republicans.
My reaction was that I'll never vote Republican again. These people are crazy. I may actually vote Republican at some point in the future if I live long enough, but it won't be anytime soon.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
Agreed. Their cartering to the base is driving away a lot of moderates and logical thinkers.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
I think I've expressed a similar opinion a few times here. With more expletives.
Wayoutwest
· 5 months ago
Stephen, I'm suprised you are still here since The Great White Knight Of The Christian Right, Pat Boone, joined the birthers.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
Wayoutwest - We were trying to keep that from Stephen. You can't stop Pat Boone, you can only hope to contain him. I'm sure Stephen will be back at sometime but this Pat Boone has him pretty shaken up.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Well, if you must know, I'm huddled in the corner of my bedroom, hugging my knees, wondering how in the world we will be able to overcome the tidal wave of support Pat Boone will unleash. d2i failed to break me, but I didn't see Pat Boone coming. All is lost.
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
Support of general added to Obama presidential eligibility suit disputed
“You have bad information,” the e-mail says. “I have not joined the lawsuit brought by Maj. Cook. Please retract that information and do not print it again.”
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
Support of general added to Obama presidential eligibility suit disputed
“You have bad information,” the e-mail says. “I have not joined the lawsuit brought by Maj. Cook. Please retract that information and do not print it again.”
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
Support of general added to Obama presidential eligibility suit disputed
“You have bad information,” the e-mail says. “I have not joined the lawsuit brought by Maj. Cook. Please retract that information and do not print it again.”
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
Support of general added to Obama presidential eligibility suit disputed
“You have bad information,” the e-mail says. “I have not joined the lawsuit brought by Maj. Cook. Please retract that information and do not print it again.”
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
"So cheating your taxes is not an offence?" -- franknowzad
No one said that. Particularly because we're not in England and thus we don't say "offence." And no one on our side would have left out the word "on" between "cheating" and "your."
But the substantive problem is this: the penalties Giethner would otherwise have had to pay for failing to pay certain Medicare and related taxes were waived because the IRS usually waives such penalties where the failure to pay tax is the result of a good faith mistake or oversight. He still had to pay the taxes and back interest thereon.
So calm down and stop looking for clean underwear. The end of the world's not coming.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
"Do we need a coast-to-coast whistlestop tour with an official document petting zoo for conspiracy theorists?" --xcott
That may be one of the most effective policy ideas to come out of this thread. It can be funded by the money Sarah Palin will return for the Bridge to Nowhere that she said "thanks but no thanks but I'll keep the money" for. And Sarah will be the conductor. Well not really, her husband is the one who knows how to drive, but she'll be there. She'll find a way to slip her family's cable bill into her expense reimbursement form, but she'll be there.
Any incidental expenses can be paid for by funds fleeced from birthers who pay a fee to sign their name (or make their mark with an "X" as appropriate) on an intimate part of Sarah Palin's body at each tour stop.
Wayoutwest
· 5 months ago
Alert! The Birther Movement brings in the big guns. It has just been reported that yes none other than Pat Boone has joined the ranks of the Glorious Birther Movement. We are doomed. So long it's been good to know you.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
Wonder if he ever sang "Send in the Clowns" in his act in Vegas?
Wayoutwest
· 5 months ago
I don't know, but it fits. He was wheeled out in the 50's to counter the Devil music. All white and shiny. It worked so well for them then why not now.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
"So how about you take your cranium out of your cavernous behind and wake up to facts and reality. You have been had, you didn't vet your candidate, and you elected an usurper. OWN it." -- Gomer Danae777
Really, gomer? "cavernous behind?" Man up. You're challenging the legitimacy of the leader of the free world, remember? You're mad as hell. I know you are or you wouldn't be here. Just say "ass." My delicate sensibilities can take it.
If anyone has been had because their people didn't vet their own candidate, it's the people who signed on with John McCain and SARAH PALIN. One ten-minute "private" meeting by a creek on a private ranch is not a vetting process I would recommend for anything except perhaps the audition process for an oral sex contest.
Which may be hitting a little too close to what happened there, when you get down to it, Gomer.
Still, you go on and curse. You'll feel better. It's not as good as having actual, demonstrable evidence or coherent argument, but it's better than calling for revolution and saying "behind" at the same time.
kb345
· 5 months ago
Has anyone looked away from this thread since it started? New, on the Washington Independent: Key Birther Lawyer Was Disbarred … In 2004 By David Weigel 7/20/09 11:02 AM http://washingtonindependent.com/51798/key-birt...
"One of the more amusing quirks of the “birther” movement is the quality of the legal minds in whom Obama birth certificate obsessives are placing their trust — and their occasional donations. Phil Berg, the original “birther” lawyer, has been forced to pay out sanctions for legal malpractice. Orly Taitz, famously, got her law degree from an online correspondence school. And it turns out that Charles Lincoln, who has been assisting Taitz — he provided judges with amended complaints in Keyes et al v. Obama et al last week and he showed up at the last hearing on the case— has been disbarred in California, as well as Florida and Texas.
At the July 12 hearing on the Keyes complaint, Lincoln identified himself as a “law clerk.” The eyewitness report of that hearing is worth reading, since it contradicts with Taitz’s original, hilarious report of a judge who took her seriously. Actually, Judge David Carter spent a lot of time trying to get Taitz to stop wasting the court’s time with antics such as reading her complaint into the record."
How's that for quality representation, folks? The best of the best in legal minds. If this was so believable, don't you think that there might be some hot shot republican legal eagle trying to get the prez out of office?
JimPA
· 5 months ago
Wheels, off.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Thank you for making me spill my drink all over my keyboard! It was worth it.
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
thanks for the 'heads-up', kb! berg i knew about, Lincoln was 'news' tho, thanks.
and, coming soon to GA, another disbarment for Lincoln to go along with FL, CA, and TX?? must be a poker player, going for two pair or maybe... a full house, if they go back to SCOTUS (for another DISmissal). putzes.
that's where orly's filed HER latest, i believe.
nothing like surrounding yourself with the worst and the dumbest to really SCREAM:
I'M A TOTAL TOOL & DESERVE NEITHER YOUR PITY NOR YOUR TIME !!
What really bothers me, more than the total stupidity of it, is the people who are bitching about it don't seem to mind the extreme costliness of these court cases, yet they go on and on about the bailout. These court cases are a total waste of tax dollars whereas the bailout is a 2yr (at least) plan and we are only 6 months into it.
If any "birther" actually took the time to read any of the numerous links to the Constitution about the definition of "natural born citizen", they would see that a birth certificate is a moot point because Obama's mother is a US citizen who has lived in the USA for more than 5 yrs. Any REAL lawyer would know that! Even if Obama was born in Kenya, he would still be considered a "natural born citizen" because his mother was! No birth certificate is necessary! What is so hard to understand about that? The English language on the US Constitution website is quite easy to understand, you don't need to be a lawyer to understand it, I'm not an attorney.
So if Obama is a natural born citizen regardless of where he was born, WHY all this fuss? He is just trying to do his job, whether you like him or not. We liberals had to put up with 8 yrs. of that dumb-ass Bush, you have to give an intelligent man a chance!
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
"Just as BillyBob Clinton had to submit to DNA tests and self destructed so shall Obama." --franknowznad
If by self-destructed you mean:
Presided over unprecedented economic growth including the longest uninterrupted period of economic expansion (12 million jobs created while in office) in history;
Left a 1.2 trillion dollar surplus to some guy named Dubya;
Didn't start wars with people who had nothing to do with 9/11; and
Left office, even with all the Republican slime attacks to the tune of $80 million in tax-payer funds, with an approval rating of 61%. That's right, an approval rating more than DOUBLE that of your outgoing war-time President Decider.
So if you mean he will do what President Clinton did, I would say you're even more optimistic than I am, but I like the way you think! Well, not really. You don't think, judging by the rest of what you write. But this one was a rare unpolished gem of honesty. Thanks, buddy.
franknowzad
· 5 months ago
Clinton was lucky. He enjoyed the aftermath of the defeat of socialism, had Newt Gingrich to implement worthwhile laws, was able to ignore terrorist attacks and could blame the total defeat of the Healthcare reform on Hillary. Clinton presided over Uninteresting times, which seem a long time ago... The only thing he'll be remembered for is, "Aaahhh did nahhht have sex with thaaaat wummun!" speech. And being the first US president to be stopped by internet power- DrudgeReport etc.
kb345
· 5 months ago
I wonder why McCain didn't bring this up during on of the debates? He was desperate for ANYTHING to hang Obama!
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
He wanted to, kb345. He really wanted to bring it up. But Joe the Plumber shot it down as he was doing a last-minute review of McCain's script in the green room. Wouldn't be enough room for that AND all the plugs for Joe's tax-dodging unlicensed plumbing nonexistent business that McCain contractually agreed to mention during the debate.
How else to explain the 17 references to such a shitty example of why his economic plan would be better?
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
IDIOT ALERT!!
(notso)franknowsad
so, what is it w/all you 'dumbass' (after)'birthers'? really, i gotta know. NOW i remember, 'aggressively ignorant', that's it! it amazes me when you INSIST on demonstrating that not only don't you 'know' anything, but, that you don't even 'get' how the old 'google machine' works. putz!
YOUR latest 'gem':
(not so)frank: "1 Panama is pretty much a US colony..."
WRONG!
Panama is an independent nation (has been since 1903) and a constitutional democracy, but, given what you bat sh*t (after)'birthers' don't know about OUR own constitution i didn't expect much. Dumbass.
"...especially the huge US military bases."
2X WRONG > as part of handing over the 10mile/x50mile Canal Zone in 1999 we closed ALL our facilities, in 1999. remember? oh, wait. i know. how COULD you 'remember'/know that was the year you and your (after)'birther' ankle-biting comrades were FREAKING out/stockpiling food, guns, weapons over 'Y2K'.
Do tell, does going through life, scared AND stupid SUCK as much as i can only imagine it does?
(not so)frank: "Ask Gen Norriega (sic) if you doubt this."
You mean the General Noriega we took down in operation 'Just cause' in DEC 1989, and imprisoned in US Federal prison for drug trafficing until 2007 and are holding for extradition for the French, THAT 'Norriega' (sic)? Another 'good' (after)'birther' 'source'.
do NOT drink from whatever 'source' (not so)frank and the rest of his treasonous Obama hating ankle-biting (after)birther' comrades are drinking from. it not only makes you STUPID, it makes you want to tell the world you are stupid!!
dumbass (credit to stephenperry)
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
I really don't deserve credit for the analysis, just the structure you used to present it. You did your own work and you did it well. This is getting interesting again, boys and girls.
By structure I mean the following format I generally use.
1. I set forth my argument (e.g., a birther is a dumbass) by stating "Dumbass" at the beginning of the post.
2. I present the birther's words, which generally disprove themselves because of internal inconsistency with hilarious results.
3. I present the corresponding correction of the birther's errors.
4. I re-state my argument (that the birther is a dumbass) by ending the post with "dumbass."
I could end with QED but then birthers would just ask me what a shopping network has to do with it. Eh, I guess it seems persuasive enough, since I see that you incorporated a lot of my structure, kenne.
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
'dumbass' was what i was crediting, sp. makes 'em CRAZY, and, in your absence, i wanted to be 'fair'. logic is as logic does as far as the rest of the 'structure' goes. acknowledging it IS difficult as it is to logically answer/refute aggressive ignorance and/or PURE stupidity.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
oh I really don't deserve credit for "dumbass." I just read that off their foreheads. It's not my own phrase.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
"If you tell me just how to go back in time to Hawaii of the 1060's I would be glad to accompany you there." -- Gomer Danae777
That's yet another telling Freudian slip. Take out "Hawaii" and replace it with "the world" and obviously fix Gomer's typo. Gomer means 1960's, in context.
What the birthers want is to go back to the world of the 1960's, before liberals got civil rights for everyone who wasn't the "default" in other words everyone who wasn't a privileged white male.
And Obama as President is the most jarring and undeniable worldwide symbol I can think of to say that "those days are over." And this, I submit, drives the birthers. Well, this and yammering stupidity.
Any disagreement from non-birthers? Show your work.
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
"show your work' does NOT 'compute' w/these ankle-biting (after)birthers, stephenperry, but, it is delicious asking them over and over and over. welcome back.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Oh I just couldn't resist when gomer tried to call you out for a typo, which is different from not knowing what the words actually are. Good to be here, thanks man.
Once again this is the link to a picture of Obama's birth certificate, we understand that you don't like it. It was released on the Internet before an awaiting planet, not one Hawaiian Official has said it's false. Which to the rest of the planet, seems the more correct flow of logic. Which means you own the burden of proof.
What a terrifying world you live in. Poor right-winger, held en thrall by great a terrible forces that can deceive the entire planet, except for poor, poor, poor lonely you. You can believe it all you want, the rest of the planet looks at the scale of the conspiracy you are suggesting, and simply doesn't agree.
I'm sorry that the entire planet disagrees with you, but they do.
/pat /pat
24AheadDotCom
· 5 months ago
HI officials would be breaking the law if they said that picture is true or false.
I'm still waiting for Weigel to answer my challenge. Since the 10/31 statement is only three paragraphs, you'd think he would have found the specific portion by now.
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Tell the nice judge and %1 of the planet my come to believe you some century.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Sorry to say, jj, but I'm pretty sure you just insulted about 0.99% of the country by lumping them in with the 49 people who believe this nonsense. I'm sure you meant no "offence." Let's ask frank-knows-not.
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Since all you people understand is pole position and alpha-male spamming the top of the post, I'll go ahead and post this at the top too. Since all you people want to come and offer this 'evidence' of a bunch of tinfoil hat, inbred websites, with a circuitous list of mutually supporting wrongness, all because you can't accept that you lost an election. Sad.
Danae777
· 5 months ago
It has nothing to do with losing an election. It has to do with right and wrong. Obama got the nomination fraudulently, Hillary should have been the DNC candidate. If you don't believe me, google Texas, Obama and Fraud. Obama should never have even nominated, he isn't a Natural Born Citizen. The burden of proving that is on HIM, and he is failing to do so. He is pulling the wool over your eyes, but you are too blinded by his "glory" to even see it.
Obama is an Usurper.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
With this Hillary argument you really come off as a sore loser. Can I see an image of your long form?
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Usurper is my word for you. You can't tolerate that we have the instutions that we have, with the methods that we have, to 'within it- make a more perfect union.
As soon as you don't get your way, 200 years of American democracy is cast aside.
Tell it to the judge
Danae777
· 5 months ago
What did I usurp? Your argument perhaps. Answer this one, if I can get MY long form, Why can't Obama? He has a LOT more resources than I do.
Tell us all just WHY is it he refuses to do so?
Come on now... admit it, you CAN'T.
255 years of Democracy got thrown out the door with the election of a President who is not a Natural Born Citizen, one that REFUSES to prove otherwise, because he CAN'T prove it. That is the only logical reason why he can't.
If Obama is Legit, then he CAN prove it, and it would make ZERO sense to continue to obfuscate the whole Long Form Birth Certificate issue!
If he is Legit, then the burden of proving it is on him, and he refuses. Therefore he is GUILTY.
Go tilt at windmills sonny, your baller boy is a fraud.
xcott
· 5 months ago
"Tell us all just WHY is it he refuses to do so? Come on now... admit it, you CAN'T. "
I can think of several reasons why.
Reason number 1: there's no point, because birthers didn't believe the last document and they won't believe the next one.
Reason number 2: if I was the Prez I'd purposely blow these dudes off in a vaguely evasive manner, feeding these paranoid beliefs until the birther conspiracy theories completely take over right wing media sources.
Only then, after Rush, Lou Dobbs and the rest have completely committed themselves to the lunatic fringe would I take a camera crew into the HI dept of health, to show everyone the original and make all of my opponents look like xenophobic tools.
Then we watch as the opposition takes a huge credibility hit, their numbers drop as nobody wants to be associated with a bunch of conspiracy nuts, and then the remaining conservatives disown the birthers for ruining everything.
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Obama is Black. Obama is American. Obama was duly elected by the American People. Obama was sworn in by Judge Roberts.
A circuitous list of badly-written, poorly-constructed fringe hate sights- deriving their inbred authority from links to other hate sites, will not hide from the majority (same problem as above) of the people, what this whole birther charade is really about.
This, is the reality in real America, until judges stop laughing this garbage out of court.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
Can you provide a link to your long form?
JimPA
· 5 months ago
Can you post a link to your long form BC?
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
your a 'bug' to Obama, that's 'why', D(UHHH)ane777! like the fly he nailed in that east room interview.
if i were YOU, i'd be spend some time worrying about what Obama's gonna do with the left over illegal spying tools/power grab that BushCo left behind. given your low opinion of President Obama and the fact that the BUSH/Cheney FBI/DOJ had QUAKERS on a 'list', you gotta think that it wouldn't be much of a 'leap' for YOU to get on a 'list', now would it?
as a matter of FACT, i KNOW there are 'hunters' out there looking for treasonous types. as a matter of FACT I am 'one', and, i've 'bagged' (with an assist from the ATF and the Secret Service, of cousre) a FL freeper and a WI '912' wack job so...
so, rant and rave and bitch and moan and babble 'away' but you might want to reign in any border line vitriol cuz the ATF & the SS aren't 'fans', neither is this patriot.
D(UHHH)anae777, like anyone with even a half a brain is going to buy into a (R-Idiot) reich-winger admonishing Obama supporters about 'right and wrong'. PUH-lease, (after)birther say your fu*kin' breath, now hold it. HOLD IT I SAID! now git your ass over in the corner and prepare to 'turn blue', you've got 3.5-7.5 more years to pitch your fit(s), stamp your little (after)'birther' feet, and pout.
SUCKS to be you, 'you betcha'!!
Wayoutwest
· 5 months ago
It's taken what three days but the venom is finally coming out of the vipers. Did you catch the burning flesh reference from navKKK. Shades of Strange Fruit. I should be happy that they are finally showing their true intent, i'm not it only makes me more concerned and sad for this great country. We have come a long way but the Promised Land seems a little further off than it did a short time ago.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
"It seems both of us don't know what "The Black owe the whites a reason they have a collective failure to launch." means. To me it looks like a fragment, or 'launch' is loaded in a way that I havent seen before." -- jjfitz, quoting Original Queen of Comedy Navigator7
jj, I have to tell you, I'm impressed with your manners and ability to be polite. You also are pushing the "willing suspension of disbelief" thing a bit far, in my view.
If you read the whole thing nav7 wrote in his little dissertation on black America, it's fairly obvious from the "sorrow and guilt" language, as well as from the overall thrust of the screed, which is that white-guilt-ridden liberals somehow propped up a black guy for President who didn't deserve it and we blacks should work hard on our own to get a guy who's worthy.
In other words, whites have done enough for blacks. Blacks need to explain why they haven't "taken off," which is what I think he meant by launch.
Can anyone seriously dispute that?
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Thanks. I guess it's all black and white now. :(
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
"Obama is a servant of the American people. If even one person wants to know the specifics about Obama....it should be right there!" -- Queen of Comedy Navigator7
Hmmm. There are many problems here.
1) He's not literally a servant, pal. Not at your beck and call. Doesn't have to fly to Hawaii and show you his papers.
In the slave-holding South, blacks had to have "traveling papers" on their person at all times when, you guessed it, traveling. Otherwise they'd be thrown into slavery if they encountered any white man. Who am I kidding otherwise? "Boy, lemme see your papers." [illiterate grown black man hands over papers, which illiterate white man cumples and throws into ditch] "Slave, get in the wagon."
But those days are over.
2) He did provide specifics. So did authorized representatives of the State of Hawaii. Moreover, his Administration doesn't have to satisfy crackpots. They just have to do what the law requires, which they have more than done.
And all the birther arguments avoid that. They talk about what the law SHOULD require, or what the guy SHOULD do "just to get this over with."
3) It's a waste of time and resources. Because you know what, that's not what ANY government official, no matter how lowly, should be tasked with doing. They all work for the American people in the sense that we elected them to get things done and to govern. Even those who didn't vote for Obama are entitled to expect him to do his job, which is run the free world.
So if they DID waste time trying to satisfy you crackpots, everyone else in the country could legitimately be pissed off at the Administration for taking its eye off the Big Board of Real Issues. Like 2 wars, craptacular economy inherited from guy who ran it into the ground with tax cuts during 2 wars, health care reform that's critical to pass because last time we had a Democrat in office the right wing distracted us and spent $80 million to prove Clinton's heterosexual and unlike any other married man thus far discovered, and things of that stature.
4) I wanna know everything about every Republican Senator then. If your logic holds and if even one person has a question about a public official who represents them, then I have a whole list of questions I want to ask John Ensign about the $96,000 his mom and dad paid his mistress in chunks of $12,000 paid to the mistress, her husband and 2 of their 3 kids. First question is, "what did the third kid do wrong so as to get left out in the cold?" Second question is, "why are you still breathing?" And it goes on.
And so does your endless stream of nonsense. I don't write what I write so I can read it. I could re-read things I've written in years past. I write it so that it's abundantly clear to everyone that you birthers are transparently not credible as anything other than racist slime who do not even believe what they say.
You bring up nonsense like the nut who allegedly claims to have had homosexual sex with Obama in a drug-filled limo ride. Right... like that hasn't been dealt with. Like that ever needed to be dealt with in the first place. When you do things like that you show us that credibility is not one of your concerns.
So, care to elaborate on that military service of yours, country-protector?
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
"How is it you can determine my relationship with the Lord better than me? Even I don't have a clue what how my relationship with the Lord stacks up. Do the diseased minds of liberals posses some hidden magic that allows them to know the unknown? Stephenperry seems gifted with these abilities as well." --Queen of Comedy Navigator7
Can anyone explain how I got dragged into a threesome with country-protector and his imaginary friend? Seriously.
Now I'm "gifted with the ability" to "know the unknown?" Yesterday I was accused of being "very, very, very, very, very VERY intelligent" and coming up with a "strategy of genius." Man I should really cash in before the streak ends. Maybe I can debate Bill O'Reilly. With a sock full of quarters in my hand.
Really, you birthers should get a grip. I'm not your Arch-Nemesis. I'm just a guy. One of many here who doesn't have any trouble understanding that the birth certificate issue is just a smokescreen for racist sore-losers. Hence, free rein to whack you with the very words that come out of your posts. You'll notice I rarely even have to make my own argument; I just show what's absurd about yours.
Get over it. The man won. He won fairly. And if you keep doing this, he will be certain to win again, because you look like total jerks.
I can mock you and be profane and still be called a "hero" compared to you birthers. And you know that this is true; you've seen it. So get over it. Really.
And then I and my cohort of superhero crimefighting Obama paid bloggers will disappear into the liberal mist.
Navigator7
· 5 months ago
"Get over it. The man won. He won fairly. And if you keep doing this, he will be certain to win again, because you look like total jerks. ~ stephenperryski"
Yes. The man won. Ok...he one fairly. Fine...if he wins again us birthers will look like total jerks. Our bad.
But 'cha know what? Obama is a servant of the American people. If even one person wants to know the specifics about Obama....it should be right there! Particularly now that this is the most transparent administration in the universe! Obama has filled rail cars with so much baggage he ain't even being "green" anymore. Those loco's burn diesel! An American product Obama doesn't want produced anymore. Never mind coal.
The longer this goes on.....we will find Obama is scared of the mice for good reason.
Then, Even the liberal mist will become rarified air incapable of supporting life. Proof there is a God!
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
"So you think I wrote racist crap? You failed to see the double standard? Where do you live anyway? Vicinity. I really don't give a shit but I expect east coast." - Queen of Comedy Navigator7
I don't think you wrote racist crap. You wrote racist crap. You failed to understand the difference? One is opinion, like "water's too hot." The other is fact, like "water's wet."
Your point about black on black slavery is a red herring and it's false anyway. I could just say white slave ring and we're right back where we started...with your racism.
But it's a red herring. The point I made is that blacks wouldn't have been enslaved by whites for a DAY if anyone had asked the blacks, so it's not like there's some inherent moral superiority in whites.
Moreover, whites would have kept on enslaving blacks longer if they hadn't been engaged in a 5 year war that killed almost half the breeding population before they finally surrendered. They weren't swayed over a three-day discussion with Lincoln at Camp David. Let's be clear.
They weren't even swayed when General Sherman treated Atlanta like one big frat house and then set it on fire on his way out. It took them literally running out of bodies to throw into the fight before they gave up. You kind of have to admire their bravery while holding your nose from the stench of racism.
And I'm talking on the whole here; there are obviously many many Confederate soldiers who died for their homeland and didn't see it as slavery vs. non-slavery. But the ones in power did. And they were the ones sending the younger ones off to die.
Anyway you say ridiculous things. I don't want to make this about race. I want to make it about making the birther argument go the way of slavery in this country.
Speaking of which, you asked where I lived and guessed east coast. As usual, you're 3,000 miles off. I've said where I live. California, in the Bay Area.
I assure you....the black on black slave trade is alive and well. It's not a red herring ... it's just uncomfortable for you.
Yak yak yak ...if whites only did this, if blacks had only been asked, if the 5 year war...dying for slavery...blah blah blah.
It's called history. Stop trying to rewrite and re-read it.
You say I say ridiculous things! From where I sit your logic has me gagging. .... But I'll accpet the compliment! I'm inspired by the ridiculous antics of our new POTUS. Even his TOTUS (Teleprompter Of The United States) committed suicide over Obama's bizarre ideas. BREAKING NEWS: Obama inherited broken teleprompter from George W Bush!
Frankly, I can't wait what the forces at work against Obama are going to bring forth. It's like smelling a Thanksgiving Day turkey...that first wisp of cooking fleah. (Or in your case...tofu) The mounting pressure must be enormous.
xcott
· 5 months ago
I guess one positive outcome of all this nonsense is that crackpots are learning the meaning of SAT words like "usurper."
It was much more embarrassing last year, when they were trying to shout "redistributionerist."
Or just this last month as they tried to warn us of the horrible evils of "empathy." And what does empathy mean, exactly? "Um, it means like, when you're choosing a decision and it, um, minorities, ... you know, I'm not going to tell you 'cuz yer in the tank."
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
It would be nice if someone could teach them the meaning of the word "Socialism."
Socialism is when the government owns ALL the means of production. Not a stake in a few banks. ALL means of production.
Socialism is not simply taking money from some people and giving it to other people.
Too bad Sarah Palin's not going to be around as Gov. of Alaska, because she could have actually helped educate us. Alaska is the closest thing to socialism we have here. The residents each receive a check from the government just for being residents. They get the money for it by taxing oil companies. In fact Palin doubled the amount of money each resident receives, making it over $3,000 per resident.
I don't see how she got away with crying "Socialist" at every rally. Except, of course, that she never held a press conference. And no one brought it up in the "liberal media." Go figure.
But if she ever runs for office again, she'll hear about socialism. No one will notice, because they'll all be screaming "QUITTER."
Still, it would be nice if the right wing would educate itself before spouting buzzwords.
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Its a neuro liquistic headgame to trick them into thinking that Jeffersonian Democracy is some phreaky-deaky foreign import.
kb345
· 5 months ago
By the definition of "Socialism" that everyone is so terrified of, we've already been living with it for years, with our police departments, fire departments, libraries, etc... All "free" with our tax dollars of course!
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
"Obama was not properly vetted!" - Queen of Comedy Navigator7
By whom? The Bush Justice Dept. when he became a Senate candidate?
The Bush Justice Dept. when he became a Presidential candidate?
Somehow, someway, the Republican White House that spies on American citizens failed to dig up sufficient dirt on a Muslim foreigner who pals around with domestic terrorists? You keep working that angle. Sounds promising to me.
Oh, you said "vetted" and may have been talking about candidates' opposition research, as opposed to the background checks that the Justice Dept. and FBI do for all federal officeholders and certainly the President.
So you're saying McCain and Clinton are to blame for failing to dig up enough bullshit about Obama? You didn't get enough vetting of Obama from them? Hell, they not only vetted HIM, they vetted Wright, Ayers, Alinsky, Pfleger, Soros, and some guy named Joe the Unlicensed Tax-Dodging Plumber Who's Really Named Samuel.
Get a grip!
kb345
· 5 months ago
Still here, folks? Unbelievable! I guess the birthers are only capable of sticking with a single thought. How about this one: when you start complaining about how much the bailout is costing you, consider how much these stupid lawsuits are costing the American people too!
I can picture our laid back president sitting at his desk, being told about another lawsuit, knowing that he is Constitutionally a "natural born citizen", and telling his legal team to go ahead and let the judges handle it, he's too busy with REAL problems. REALLY..... why SHOULD he show a birth certificate when his mother was born in AMERICA! Read your Constitution and amendments! If you don't like it, why don't you all move to Texas and secede the union?
Navigator7
· 5 months ago
"""Still here, folks? Unbelievable! I guess the birthers are only capable of sticking with a single thought."" ~ kb345
I think the burden of proof is on you birfers to show that an official birth certificate of Hawaii is fraudulent. The one saying he was born in Honolulu. And you must also prove state officials have continuously lied about it, including the governor. Yes you're right, its a 50yr conspiracy by all the powers that be just to shit on the constitution and enslave the white race. Yes, thats so much more likely, isn't it?
kb345
· 5 months ago
The birth certificate that is needed for proof is Obama's MOTHER'S certificate, not his! Unless SHE wasn't a "Natural Born Citizen" there isn't even anything to talk about. If she was an alien, THEN he would have to prove his birth. Do you understand that birthers???
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
1. Hawaii says said matter resolved, show us your extra-legal authority to demand what is not required.
2. It's a democracy, when you lose the other side executes a different agenda.
very simple
kb345
· 5 months ago
Navigator, aren't you getting the fact that the birth certificate isn't necessary? According to the Constitution and the amendments, Obama is a citizen EVEN IF he WAS born in KENYA!!! http://www.usconstitution.net/consttop_citi.html Why the big fuss over the birth certificate?? Obama's mother was "a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years" and even though his father "an alien", currently, Title 8 of the U.S. Code fills in those gaps. Section 1401 defines the following as people who are "citizens of the United States at birth" says any one born outside the United States still is eligible to run for President or Vice President. Read it and weep! It doesn't matter WHAT his birth certificate says, he is a "natural born citizen."
With all of the lawyers that ran for president, don't you think this would have been discovered sooner? Especially Hillary, who wanted the presidency more than life! Pleeeeasse GIVE IT UP!
Navigator7
· 5 months ago
Right.
So what is the big deal?
So which hospital was it in Hawaii or Kenya?
There must be finality in all this.
If things were as simple as you say....we wouldn't be having this chat.
I think Obama has described who his father is inaccurately. Frank Marshall Davis perhaps?. That would make him an American citizen. It would put Obama in a rough spot.
We could all put our weapons down is only the president would do the right thing???
But he won't.
MilliJoolz
· 5 months ago
It's addictive. I'm afraid I'll have withdrawl symptoms when I click this site away. And forgive me any spelling errors. This is not my first language, and I am only a permanent resident ;-) and the only bad part of that is that I could not bring out a vote for Obama.
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Welcome
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Wow. Holy shamolies. You get the next pink jellybean prize. You managed to make multiple posts without a single lie. And English isn't even your first language!
Let MilliJoolz stand as a shining example to the birthers of what they could be like if they'd apply themselves.
The ironic thing is that while a sane, rational, non-frothing-at-the-mouth person like MilliJoolz was not allowed to vote, plenty of birthers were.
No justice, no peace.... Oh wait, our side won the election. Carry on.
A new fan
· 5 months ago
Stephenperry.... I found this site through Buzzflash. I usually lurk at Wonkette for my belly laughs but I think I have found a new favorite! I was wondering about your thoughts on the wingnuts using BO to refer to our brilliant president. All school children know what that usually brings to mind. A part of me believes that President Obama has a wicked sense of humor in naming his dog Bo. lol What did you think? Have a great day. Peace.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Sorry I didn't see this before. I think it's silly but useful. Look at the micro and the macro.
Of course it stands for Body Odor as used by the wingnuts. So they are trying to show disrespect.
The key is to think of the world in terms like jujitsu and water. Things are going to happen (water will flow), people will take actions, and you cannot stop them. So what do you do? Use jujitsu and use their momentum against them. Water finds a way to its destination and goes around any and all obstacles without hesitation. Water is soft but given time, it goes right through stone.
Micro: what ordinary people like you and me can do.
If anyone refers to the sitting President in such a juvenile way, it immediately identifies them as someone not to be taken seriously. Which saves me a lot of time I'd otherwise have to spend listening to them or reading their opinions about real issues.
So it is sort of an intellectual water-witch.
Macro: how it may affect national politics.
I think it's just one more distasteful thing that ordinary people will want to steer away from, especially as the election fervor goes (went) away. No one wants to be the guy who's still acting like a drunken fool the day AFTER the big party. And few people want to vote the way that guy votes.
So when ordinary people, who have little intersection with politics in daily life, see such things maybe on the news or online somewhere, it will hopefully turn them off. And they will hopefully notice that everyone saying such things about President Obama just happens to be a Republican.
And maybe that will help some Independents become Democrats. I'm not saying it will drive Republicans to become Democrats, but I do think it could and does make Republicans become Independent. Every Republican who wanted to be a Democrat switched before Obama became President. But some may be finding that they no longer want to be Republican.
Sorry that took so long for me to see.
Wayoutwest
· 5 months ago
Allo is anyone out there? My children need wine. Good morning web-warriors it appears that the forces of darkness have returned to their mole holes. I just placed my coffee in the cup-holder on my puter and am ready for battle. I guess our opponents are at their churches praying to their white Jesus. I've noticed a strange phenomenon about these birthers and people on the right . They try to project their character flaws and prejudices onto anyone that disagrees with them. We are the racists, we are destroying the constitution, we hate freedom, etc. They do this with a straight face and no sense of irony. Are they trained to do this or is it natural for unaware people to behave this way?
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
"They try to project their character flaws and prejudices onto anyone that disagrees with them"
While protecting/insulating their own 'transgressors' . See Rachel Maddow's continuing series re: 'The Family' for more on their '"appointed by god" sense of privilege.
Can't do any wrong, cuz (their 'sky) god says it's 'ok'.
These are the same folks who denigrate[d] the native american and tribal cultures of the world as simple and backward while forcing the baby jesus down their throats OR just killing them if they didn't 'sign on'.
“When facism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross.” Sinclair Lewis
“Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it, you'd have good people doing good things and evil people doing bad things, but for good people to do bad things, it takes religion.” Stephen Weinberg
“All religions are founded on the fear of the many and the cleverness of the few.” Stendhal
“For seventeen hundred years the Christian sect has done nothing but harm” Voltaire
'an so on' (Kurt Vonnegut)
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Thanks for the quotes, here are some of my faves.
In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own. -Thomas Jefferson, letter to Horatio G. Spafford, March 17, 1814
They [the clergy] believe that any portion of power confided to me, will be exerted in opposition to their schemes. And they believe rightly; for I have sworn upon the altar of god, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man. But this is all they have to fear from me: and enough, too, in their opinion. -Thomas Jefferson to Dr. Benjamin Rush, Sept. 23, 1800
History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of ignorance of which their civil as well as religious leaders will always avail themselves for their own purposes. -Thomas Jefferson to Alexander von Humboldt, Dec. 6, 1813.
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
you're welcome
a couple of additional favs:
"A cult is a religion with no political power." — Tom Wolfe. -- "A religion is a cult that succeeded."
"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich." — Napoleon.
and my all time fav:
"Mankind will only really be free, once the last king was strangled with the entrails of the last priest." — Buy at Amazon.comJean Meslier ( -1729), French priest, in a letter he left after his death.
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Hi Wayout,
Welcome back, if StephenPerry wasn't a machine, he'd pass the baton. But at the moment he can continue posting from his blackberry whilst water skiing AND preparing a legal brief to be argued before the Supreme Court tomorrow, and if there's time, he's also address the UN with a workable plan for world peace. ;)
Joe
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Easy, big fella. You keep talking about me in those terms and I'll have ObamaGirl stalking me and trying to kill me so as to ensure that I don't run against That One in 2012.
I don't have any spoken-word Grammys and I am not going to be photographed shirtless in Hawaii.
Nor do I plan on giving any anti-war speeches.
I'm just a guy. A guy who scares birthers into thinking he's lurking behind every lamppost, waiting to zap lying doofuses with my "are you sure you wanted to write THAT" Liberal Elitist Ray Gun.
Wayoutwest
· 5 months ago
Stephen, I was worried they had grabbed you and taken you in for Reneducation. Don't worry about the adulation, we need Lawmen like you countering the echo-chamber ditto-heads Pete.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
"My children need wine."
--That's the guy at Euro Itchy & Scratchy Land. "Who are you to resist, eh?" I knew there was something good about you, wayout. this makes up for the lack of reparations.
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
I liken this birther 'debate' to The Kübler-Ross grief cycle. I'm aware it was created for terminal illness, but it's not unlike what many of the birthers are feeling.
Recap:
Shock stage: Initial paralysis at hearing the bad news. Denial stage: Trying to avoid the inevitable. Anger stage: Frustrated outpouring of bottled-up emotion. Bargaining stage: Seeking in vain for a way out. Depression stage: Final realization of the inevitable. Testing stage: Seeking realistic solutions. Acceptance stage: Finally finding the way forward
Please birthers, we are not trying to destroy you or the country. Elections have consequences. You're getting bogged in the Denial Stage. Obama is an American. Obama won.
Just get active and produce useful arguments, you're wasting valuable time.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
"You can have this country when I'm done protecting it." - Navigator 7
Seriously, does your mother know you wear her pearls when she's at work? You've got to be the biggest queen on this board. I thought it was superpat. But all he did is swear an oath to oppose all that President Obama stands for. You've got him beat by a country mile.
PLEASE GOD tell me how you're protecting this country. If you say that it is by shining your big Truth Ray into the darkness of these comment boards I will be disappointed.
I know it has to be more than that.
Are you one of those "vigilante" people who has taken it upon themselves to spend Sunday afternoons shot-gunning Coors Lights while pretending to defend the U.S. - Mexico border?
Are you a Jedi Knight regardless of whether you're attending a Star Wars or Star Trek convention?
Do you belong to your local neighborhood watch?
Do you serve food to members of the Coast Guard when they're off-duty and wander into your employer's restaurant?
I know it's got to be a doozy. Please do tell.
Navigator7
· 5 months ago
Sweet! stephenperry...you're fellow minions seem to have high regard for your mental disease but I simply see you as just another swept up by the Obama persona. Your types are all cookie cutter molds gifted at insulting the opposition without providing any sound logic to why Obama's Stimulus is not working.
It was never supposed to work. It's is a failed ideology. It is only gleans the party with power and makes the people indebted to the state.
Your ideology is high on color. You are the true racists. You see a black man and it's over. Never mind the words and the meanings behind the words. Throwing a country under the bus you are. All glitz and no substance.
ALL his ideals are counter to the American way...except guns and ammo..which despite his best efforts his ideology has caused records sales of both.
Libs consistently makes this out to be a black issue.
IT'S NOT!!
It is ideological. Obama wants to take from the wealthy and give to the poor. He wants to redistribute wealth. He wants nationalized health care. This is terror. Basically, he wants to lower the human condition to that found in slaves. We become Obama's chattel How ironic.
I don't want his safety net. I don't want the wealthy to pay more than their fair share. I want an across the board tax rate of 8% of sales. No more...regardless of income. I don't want the poor to benefit from the sweat of another's brow. I want an opportunity to succeed or fail in life...not a guarantee. I don't want the poor to get handouts without effort. I don't want the illegals to have opportunity in America. I don't want an Appeaser in Chief. I don't want Government Motors I don't want Acorn telling home lenders what they will do. I don't want Community Reinvestment Act and all the liberal pork attached to it to survive another day.
I want a free country. Limited government. I don't want the government to help with things beyond the constitution. Healthcare is way off base. Shovel Ready Projects create slaves not prosperity. I want the rule of law enforced in a timely fashion. I want spending bills read and understood before a vote I want people to be able to use their property as they see fit and not stolen by the government for the next crazy idea coming down from on high. I want life in the womb respected. Marriage is between a man and a woman. Freedom is not free and musty be defended every single day.
Liberalism is The Enemy Within. You and your liberal socialistic friends are an enemy of the state and an enemy of mine. But unlike the foe of America you people can't make up your mind about....I'm not interested in slitting your throats or inflicting pain. It a war of ideas. Our nation is dying under Obama's stewardship. You are part of the problem.
I can accept it for now.
This just in this morning: """A controversial suit brought by a U.S. Army reservist has been joined by a retired Army two-star general and an active reserve Air Force lieutenant colonel."""
Despite all your name calling, jabs and holier than thou attitude....you have hitched a ride on the coat tails of a Usurper. He will bring America only pain. Your liberal ideology broth America to Obama. Obama was an entity of corruption and would not have been elected were it not for thre corruption of liberalism...a mental disease attacking our nation.
WHERE'S THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE, OBAMA?
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Navigator, I'm not responding to any of your childish protests about what you don't want. Nice gloom-and-doom scenario though. You forgot to mention that since Obama was elected President, your laundry won't come as clean as before. Whites aren't as bright. No smell of summer rain.
And I'm not responding to anything at all that you say until you explain how EXACTLY you are "protecting" the entire nation as referenced in the quote I took from your post.
But I will say two things that are really meant for other readers:
1 - Bitching about why the stimulus isn't working is asinine. First, it IS working. There's money flowing out and money being spent and jobs being created. Second, it's a 2 year plan and you're only a few months into it. So just concentrate on taking care of you and yours, and if the stimulus doesn't work in 2 years, bitch and complain THEN.
2 - Neither I nor Navigator want the wealthy to pay "more than their fair share." I just don't think most people are realistic about what that means. And I have no idea why he would even say that. For what it's worth, I would bet my dogs and cats that I make more money than Navigator7. In fact I bet I made more than him in every year since 2000, when I graduated from law school. But I'm not the one bitching about taxes. It's like when Joe the Unlicensed Tax Dodging Plumber started all that socialist nonsense even though he would have been much better off under Obama's tax plan than McCain's. All these Republicans bitch about paying higher taxes but hardly any of them make six figures, let alone a quarter of a million.
Taxes pay for infrastructure and other things that EVERYONE needs. Soldiers. Nurses. Teachers. Clean water. War. Oh wait. Only Republicans need that. And they try to slip the cost through in a supplemental bill instead of including it in the actual budget, as Obama correctly did. But yeah, Republicans act like they can just fight two wars and cut taxes at the same time. No. You can't. Because it ruins the economy. As it did. A trillion dollars got sucked out of a giant hole. So yeah, the rich have to pay their fair share too.
So, what's a rich person's fair share? Considering how the rich make their money (hint: it's not via a paycheck; it's through collecting rents and selling stock), taxing income from labor isn't merely going to cut it, but that's a good place to start. I understand tax law fairly well. It is incredibly easy to shield income earned from investment from taxes. But it is difficult to shield income earned from labor. So that means the rich get away with not paying taxes and the poor and middle class, whose money comes from a paycheck, hold the bag and look foolish.
Looking at real purchasing power, the poor and middle class pay a much higher percentage of their income in taxes than the rich do. If EVERYONE paid 20%, for example, then we'd have more than enough money to bomb bomb bomb, bomb bomb Iran like McCain wanted, AND give health care to all the Iranians we maimed, let alone every American.
But I don't need to answer the "fair share" question, just to throw the concept out there as something non-asinine that Navigator7 said. Of course, if you asked Navigator what HE thinks the rich should pay, I'm sure I would not agree. Even though, as stated, I doubt seriously that the guy makes squat.
Because how could he? He's protecting the entire country. And soldiers make something like $20,000/year. Which is a NATIONAL SHAME. Speaking of national shame, wouldn't you expect a guy who is protecting the entire country to be too busy to post those long-ass whiny lists of Ways America Has Changed That Make Me Uncomfortable? That's pretty much what all of Navigator7's posts are. Where the hell does he have the time? I mean, I'm just an understimulated liberal lawyer with some weekend free time. I don't need to protect anything but my own house.
socks22
· 5 months ago
Stephenperry, I LOVE your posts. You rock, dude!
Navigator7
· 5 months ago
Good points, stephenperry.
I like the part where you are not responding to my childish protests but responded anyway.
1 - "Bitching" in general is what now.....Anti-American? There is no way on God's green Earth Obama "plan" will succeed. It's outright THEFT of the fruit of productive Americans. And you betcha...I want his p[plan to fail like now other because it is criminal and cancer for our country.
2. More textbook liberal playlist. Attack me with no substance. You haven't a clue about me or my history, my work ethic, my morals or my values system yet you attack me personal with insults to what end???. I love it. It shows you are MT.
"2 - Neither I nor Navigator want the wealthy to pay "more than their fair share." I just don't think most people are realistic about what that means. And I have no idea why he would even say that. For what it's worth, I would bet my dogs and cats that I make more money than Navigator7." ~ Stephenperry
Only a liberal would not understand fair share.
3. "So, what's a rich person's fair share? Considering how the rich make their money (hint: it's not via a paycheck; it's through collecting rents and selling stock), taxing income from labor isn't merely going to cut it, but that's a good place to start.""" Stephenberry
Spoken like a true tax and spender. Regardless of how anyone earns a living, a quick witted liberal will confident conclude how another's money should be spent paying taxes. And in the process will somehow add the impression a rich person's wealth is ill-gotten gains from the poor sheeple.
4. "Taxes pay for infrastructure and other things that EVERYONE needs."
"Steph The Liberal" makes the jump and implies Nav thinks no taxes is a goal. Yet has no problem with Obama spending more of American's dough than all the other presidents combined who came before him. And you have the Audacity to blame Bush. How are you going to communicate when the "Blame Bush" is no longer part of your arsenal?
5. ""'Looking at real purchasing power, the poor and middle class pay a much higher percentage of their income in taxes than the rich do.""" ~ Stephenberry
Uhmmmmmm? Errrrr...is this another way to suggest the wealthy do not deserve the money they have earned? Attacking the wealthy is absolutely most punishing on the poor and middle class who you "portend" to help. I do not believe for one second liberal ideas help American citizens. Rather, liberalism assures a ready supply of "downtrodded" helpless at the hands of rich and wealthy business owners. Our public school system, a vast oasis awash in the liberal mindset assures this as well. You attack the very strength of our country and punish exactly that what puts people to work: The success of others. American Exceptionalism, rugged individualism, American ingenuity puts people to work...Not a president or a party. Lower the tax rates on the wealthy to 8% and government coffers will over flow.
6. """Of course, if you asked Navigator what HE thinks the rich should pay, I'm sure I would not agree. Even though, as stated, I doubt seriously that the guy makes squat.""" ~Stephenberry
More proof of the disease affecting the liberal mind. Stephenberry seriously doubt I make squat. So this must mean the values of my words are based upon my income? The more money I make the more value my words carry. The less I make...well you get the idea.
How profound Stephenberry!! So....Does that mean the soldier questioning Obama's qualifications has no right as his reasoning ability is hampered buy his income? How much money should a soldier earn before they have the right to question whether their Commander in Chief is really a USURPER IN CHIEF???
7. """ I mean, I'm just an understimulated liberal lawyer with some weekend free time. I don't need to protect anything but my own house.""" ~ Stephenberry
Locks exist because you guys do a piss poor job. Want to ruin a civilization? Deny justice to the common man.
SHOW US THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE!
I've endured a lifetime of groaners watching the outcome ...or should I say byproduct of court proceedings. The NJ Fire Fighters and Sotomayor for example.
Just another minor area where we disagree.
Everything is at stake. Obama has no faith in the average American because the average American is a victim. Destroying wealth and the wealthy along with individualism gains party strength.
It's right down Saul Alinsky and Bill Ayers playbook.
And I just love how you trouble yourself with how much time I have on my hands. On the bright side, when America goes socialist at least there won't be any calls for lawyers. Justice will be dispensed as the state sees fit.
Perfect harmony! When we go socialist
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Broken Navigation System,
The only thing you said in your whole post that was remotely true was when you referred to me as a "quick-witted liberal."
Whoever can point out something else that is factually true in that diatribe gets a pink jelly bean.
See, people, this is why I showed you his stupid long-ass whiny post.
He bitched and moaned through about 600 words of nonsense but never once addressed the only issue anyone gives a shit about when it comes to him:
WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY SAYING "YOU CAN HAVE THE COUNTRY BACK WHEN I'M DONE PROTECTING IT", doofus?
Navigator7
· 5 months ago
Ahahahahahaha!
What...have you guys banned me now????
ROTFLMAO
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
Different day, same 'droppings" from the nav
"guns and ammo..which despite his best efforts his ideology has caused records sales of both."
the uptick in guns and ammo sales is DIRECTLY attributable to a very small minority of VERY frightened little people retreating into what they (mistakenly) perceive as a 'defensive stonghold', weaponized reich-wing rhetoric.
Navigator7
· 5 months ago
"""The uptick in guns and ammo sales is DIRECTLY attributable to a very small minority of VERY frightened little people retreating into what they (mistakenly) perceive as a 'defensive stonghold', weaponized reich-wing rhetoric.""" By the very ignorant Kennethtucker
I beg to differ, buddy. Your response is fear incarnate.
Fleet Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto, advised the military junta that ruled Japan that attacking America by a landing force was an impossible task because "there would be a rifleman behind every blade of grass." The fact that our citizens are armed has saved our bacon three times now: The Revolutionary War - won on these soils The War of 1812 - Won on these soils World War Two - Won on foreign soils, thanks to the "riflemen behind every blade of grass".
The fact is American are simply not going to put up with this socialistic BS assaulting us nearly every single day. Most of us are quiet. There will be an activating incident. Our Obamanation has just about touched the last nerve. Peace is not going to last. And you know what...It's going to go apeshit right in the heart of Bluesville because the very people you expect to pay for Faith Hope and Change are leaving!
I'll give Obama his due. he's doing what he said he would do. What I don't accept and challenge is the ideology of those such as the posters here who support Obama and his ideology.
Yours is a cancer to our nation. Sorry, I can't produce the type of fluent individual personal attacks the rest of you are so adept at due to the fact I am a conservative, bible toting, gun clinging neocon who feels pity for your baal worshipping liberal disease.
Thanks in advance for all the personal insults directed my way. 'I'll be here all week!'
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
"The fact is American are simply not going to put up with this socialistic BS assaulting us nearly every single day."
Sounds like a thinly veiled threat of armed insurrection to me. This assumes you 'American(s)' are going to grow a pair, instead of just 'sounding off' like you had a pair.
"Most of us are quiet."
Agreed! Anonymous, Chickensh*t ChickenHawks to be totally accurate.
"There will be an activating incident."
Do tell! Any plans? Or, just more bible-totting, gun-clingling chickensh*t chickenhawk 'squawking'. We (and when I mean 'we' I mean the me and the Secret Service/ATF) are 'detail' lovers. Do share. or, are you just saving that for your 'secret' communications (ha ha ha, not since BushCo changed the rules AND Obama isn't in ANY rush to change them) with your freeper/912/nazi buds?
baal huh ? cool old testament reference.
"The land of Canaan was devoted to the worship of Baal. The Semitic word Baal means "lord" or "master" and the Canaanites believed that Baal was in absolute control over nature and over people. They believed that the only god who was superior to Baal was his father El, but Baal was the principal deity of the land. It was he who was in charge of the rain and the weather, and man's survival was dependent upon Baal's provision."
a) i don't worship any of your/their 'sky gods' , i'll leave that to you little-brain (after)'birthers'. whatever keeps you simple fu*kers busy for an extra hour or so 1x week and maybe helps keep you little-brains from stealing, raping, pillaging, and murdering is fine with me. if all it takes is the 'promise' of a 'hell' and/or eternal damnation. good.
b) as old testament gods go, a rain and weather deity seems like a pretty good choice to worship given the move to a grain based agricultural society, given the knowledge base at the time, YOUR ancestors (assuming they aren't all No European/Nazis) probably worshiped him too.
You ChickenSh*t ChickenHawks buckbuckbuckBUCKAW aren't the only ones (supposedly) armed to the teeth, trained in weapons and tactics and keeping a watchful eye. Difference is, I/we volunteered for service, have combat cred, and, will not be just 'talking the talk'.
btw, I've already 'tagged' a FL freeper and a WI wack job for overt threats to Obama (May and June), but, I'm o'fer July, wanna make it a hat trick ?
socks22
· 5 months ago
Navigator7, I hereby declare you batshit crazy. God, have mercy on your poor soul. Amen.
Navigator7
· 5 months ago
Thanks socks22!
I'd rather be declared batshit crazy by a bunch of anemic liberals than be welcomed into the fold via the content of my posts.
Insults coming from individuals who helped elect a president that is making Jimmy Carter look great means a lot to me.
"""I contend that for a nation to try to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket and trying to lift himself up by the handle. -----Winston Churchill"""
b) him and his 'soul'? fu*k him, and the rest of his treasonous batsh*t crazy, shallow end of the gene pool, fly over comrades.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
"Now I have stated that IN MY OPINION I believe that Obama's presidency is appearing that THUS FAR a black person cannot competently lead this country" - casy123
Now, who was it that was accusing liberals of playing the race card?
If I let you get out of here and only call you a "dumbass," then you should consider that you got off lucky. Because I didn't even quote your ridiculously stupid post in its entirety. But the part I did post is more than sufficient to call you a dumbass.
And a racist.
And I didn't make casy123 say that stupid shit. I certainly didn't make Navigator7 say that he's defending the fucking country.
My god you people are comical.
I went out for a while and thought I'd come back and see if I missed anything. I didn't. You're still stupid. And yet you're simultaneously ridiculously arrogant. Arrogance and stupidity do not mix well. See, e.g., Bush, George W.
FTW
JL
· 5 months ago
There is a microfilm of Obama 1961 birth announcement from Honolulu Advertiser
Would have been a real back-to-the-future thing for someone back in 1961 to put that announcement in the paper, somehow knowing this baby would be running for president of the U.S. some day.
JL, this is still more of the same. I don't disagree with you, but what is he hiding? C'Mon, you have to admit that he is hiding something. What do you think it is? Why do we not have access to all the things he is refusing to release and litigating against?
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
I cannot take you seriously. "what is he hiding?" What? Two books. Fifty bajillion debates. Fifty-five bajillion speeches. Seventy bajillion interviews. A ridiculously detailed website. He posted the stupid birth certificate online (I can hear the dumbasses screeching "but not the real one!").
And yet he's hiding something?
The only thing he's hiding is his disdain for stupid people like you. He does a better job than I do. But then, I'm not running for election. You're really stupid. Or at least you say really stupid things.
Florida Christian
· 5 months ago
Youl ibs are so stoopid you cant see the obvious facts.
Let me lay it out for you, Obama was born in Kenya. Immediately after he was born, his mother took a Virgin Airlines flight directly to Hawaii with money given to her by George Soros and Saul Alinsky. Because it was obvious that this small black child would someday run for President, it was important that she bribe the Hawaii state department of health into filing a birth certificate listing his birth in Honolulu. She also got ACORN agents who were working undercover at two different local newspapers to run phony birth announcements.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
If these get any better I'm going to blow your cover as one of us again. You've walked a fine line quite admirably thus far. But you did well enough to fool one of our own, so I can't continue to take the risk.
gopfail
· 5 months ago
exactly!!! It was so insightful and brilliant that Obama's mom knew the racist America of the 60s would pick her child, HER child, to be pres, and so she did the smart logical thing and conspire with the state of Hawaii in what turned out to be a 50 year cover up, all to deceive us whitepeople into thinking BHO was natural born. Of course filling out the paperwork to get a foreign born child of an American their citizenship woulda just limited her son's future. Wow, she was smart.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
I just wonder how many pennies they get for every word they might want to correct. corrrrecct, hmmmmmmmmm, korect oh well. big bucks huh?
Florida Christian
· 5 months ago
You have to be 35 years old to be president you morans. Berry Obama was born in 1979. Records were faked and he just looks older because of his diet. (mustard on a hamburger?)
Besides there are actually only 49 states since Hawaiis admission into the union was never ratified.
There is an affidavit published on the highly credible web site World Nut er Net Daily by Reverend Kweli Shuhubia (real name withheld to protect him from Obama nijas) that Berrys grandmother said in a phone interview that Obama was born in Kenya. (ignore the you tube video of the complete conversation, it is as fake as the moon landing)
Besides techdude (not his real name) studied the birth certificate and stated that if he was an expert he would conclude the document was fake. As sood as he gets his GED he plans to reexamine the document.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
I'm very glad you pointed out the fakery about that moon landing. They taped over it, so they say. My tookus. Whole thing was done in Roswell. In 1957. They just held on to it till the American people were about to vote Republican. They knew that would be the end of all their crazy liberal ways. So they stuck it out there for JFK.
It made kids want to go to school and learn things. Made them think they could be something special.
Damn fake moon landing! You ruined Real America!
FemmeKat
· 5 months ago
There seems to be a great deal of confusion over whether or not President Obama is a "natural born citizen."
It should be quite apparent that if he did NOT fall under this classification, there would have been many constitutional scholars, especially those who are Republicans, that would have written about it and made it public knowledge WELL BEFORE the election. After all, it has been known for quite some time that President Obama's father was from Kenya.
His mother, an American, gave birth to him on August 4, 1961 in Honolulu, Hawaii, which is in the United States of America, thereby giving him what LIKELY falls under the classification of a NATURAL BORN citizen status.
The problem is, no clear-cut definition of that term exists. What the founders meant by "natural born" has been interpreted to mean "anyone who acquires citizenship by any means other than naturalization," but there have been other interpretations as well.
*+*+*+*+* "The term "natural born Citizen" has never been defined by the Courts in the course of a Presidential qualification challenge."
What many people either don't know, or have overlooked, is the fact that CONGRESS ITSELF is not clear on what the definition is. There is at least one bill introduced that was sponsored by Senator Don Nickles seeking clarification of the term "Natural Born Citizen." The last hearing on it was held on October 5, 2004:
*+*+*+*+* "A bill to define the term "natural born Citizen" as used in the Constitution of the United States to establish eligibility for the Office of President." (See #79. S.2128)
But if there was a REAL PROBLEM with President Obama having one parent who was not an American citizen, don't you think John McCain and Hillary Clinton would have been all over that? And if not them, surely there would have been scholars, and educators, and other politicians who were opposed to Candidate Obama and his proposed policies that would have proclaimed LOUDLY and PUBLICLY that he was ineligible to seek the office of President of the United States of America.
There have been lawsuits brought by individuals questioning his legitimacy that have not only been dismissed, but their claims have been discredited as well... one of them spotlighted by none other than WND.com itself, a site that supports the "Birthers":
Another point of contention is whether or not President Obama lost his citizenship if he was adopted by Lolo Soetoro. Being adopted by a foreign national does not make one lose their American citizenship, though I've not had the time to locate the proper governmental link that supports this. If you read the article at the link above, though, there is verification of this from undisclosed "citizenship experts."
Here is what it states (from link above):
"Also, consulting citizenship experts contend that if Obama indeed obtained Indonesian citizenship, it simply would not have been recognized by the U.S., but the presidential candidate would retain his American citizenship."
If anyone has another link to an Authority Site that confirms this (government, not news media, blogs, or personal sites), please post it here.
Hope this helps some people to gain a bit more clarity on this issue.
Unfortunately, given the impassioned comments in several sites that have written about this "Grand Conspiracy" (and that's what it would have to be), it's unlikely those who have made up their mind will be inclined to embrace the facts.
But there is still hope.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Ack! Those look like facts! Get 'em away! The light! It burns!
Seriously, femmekat, thanks for providing facts. Unfortunately, as with all conspiracy theories, all facts that disprove the conspiracy theory are instead taken by the conspiracy theorist to be nothing more than evidence that the conspiracy is bigger and more complex than previously suspected.
All the same, those of us who are not conspiracy theorists appreciate having the primary source material so readily available. Thanks.
FemmeKat
· 5 months ago
Haha! Yes, it really does appear that FACTS ARE THE ENEMY in the eyes of "Birthers."
The barricades they've constructed in their minds to protect them from seeing anything other than what they want to see are like impenetrable fortresses.
Too bad. Their distortions, delusions, and toxic emotions are not healthy for them, or for the rest of the country.
But thanks for checking out what I posted. You are probably one of the few who actually read it. Everyone else is too busy looking for posts that verify their Big 'Ole Conspiracy Theories.
kb345
· 5 months ago
It's absolutely futile, FemmeKat, giving these people real FACTS. The actual Constitution and its amendments have been printed here with the information on natural born citizenship and they are not willing to believe it. They are more willing to continue this propaganda train in all its absurdity because it is what they want to believe. They are the same ones who believed that Bush was a "great" president and if you've got a bridge to sell, I'll bet someone's buying.
FemmeKat
· 5 months ago
You are right, kb345. I just read a very, very long post that made such claims as...
"...the only plausible definition of an undeniable U.S. citizen is the birthers' definition of "natural born citizen" -- a U.S.-born individual whose parents are both U.S. citizens,"
and...
"According to the birthers' understanding of history and law, if his father was not a U.S. citizen, President Obama cannot be a Constitutional natural born citizen, regardless of where he might have been born."
and...
"Mr. President, you are being asked to show, beyond reasonable doubt, that you are eligible to hold the office that you are currently holding..."
and...
"If you cannot or will not show the Court, beyond reasonable doubt, that you are eligible to be President, this Court has the power and the authority to remove you from office."
So the birthers believe their interpretation of the Constitution enables them to take legal action and enforce their version of the law?
It is sad, and a bit scary to see so many frantic people deluding themselves into believing they can remove from office our LEGALLY ELECTED PRESIDENT.
They are blinded by their hatred and their perception of righteousness.
Very sad.
I hope they will be able to channel their disappointment and negative emotions into more productive activities, because there is no way in hell that President Obama will be removed from office, unless he is voted out in 2012, or reaches the end of his second term in 2016.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
d21 no matter what is said on this site we are racist, stupid and many other names. It like if you have you own thought or should I say INTELLIGENCES Then that means we are not smart. So let them all scream inside there own heads and maybe we will be able to talk. Ya think?
d2i
· 5 months ago
Oh yes, indeed we are the stupid morons. Not them. Heaven forbid they are wrong or better yet that they are getting paid to disrupt this critical dialogue. Nope. We're the conspiracy theorist's, yeah right, and I've got a bridge to nowhere to sell ya.
kb345
· 5 months ago
Finally, an admission of truth! "Oh yes, indeed we are the stupid morons."
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
I know! Took 'em long enough.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
You have that bridge to nowhere? I knew it! Sarah Palin said no to it but kept the money. I knew she didn't spend all the money on that stupid hunting road. Where's the bridge? I'd like to drive my environmentally-friendly car across it and take a look at Russia.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
If you have you own dictionary as well as you own thought, consult it to see whether intelligence has a plural form. And if you're feeling up to it, flip through it and try to master "they're," "there," and "their." Maybe also you and your and you're.
If you're still going strong, then flip to ANY REPUTABLE ONLINE SITE and read about the stupidity of the birther argument.
That would be quite a day's work.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
hehehehehehehe I do agree d2i hehehe loved that one.
d2i
· 5 months ago
they truly are something. if nothing else they do their jobs well. doubt they are getting paid anything more than minimum wage, oh, but wait a minute, they might be getting paid a bit more do to our stimulus dollars going to pay them. Ads have been running in lots of lib rags.
but they are doing something a bit new. Femme downstairs came onto the blog with a post that obviously took some time to put together. So, she earns trust but then the paid bloggers gently bash and they giggle, and then she's in. Poof! Starts bashing everyone else just like the other paid bloggers do. Watch out for Femme. She's still questionable.
Wayoutwest
· 5 months ago
Thank you Stephen my skin was beginning to crawl just being associated with them folk.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
I refuse to respond to people who call other people names and cant talk to others with out trying to be little other people. Or maybe it makes them feel bigger, um stronger, ho-hum and I close?
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Lets see, now that they are smarter them me, on spelling. Hmmmm? what dont I maspell? Jump on it guys. I forgot how to use my putter as well as others do/ LOL
WHERE IS THE LONG FORM BIRTH CiRTIFICAoeTE? OOOPS!
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
We're not just smarter than you now. We always were.
You didn't forget how to use your computer. Never learning how to think isn't the same thing as forgetting how to type.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Not only does Acorn have lawsuits to deal with but are in the middle of a name change
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
There it is. First Acorn sighting of the hour. I win the prize.
Florida Christian
· 5 months ago
kwiley9711 is right!
Anyone that does not agree the Obama is a space alien in a paid blogger. The get paid in russian dollars by the ICC. (International Commusist Conspiracy)
Also the entire Hawaii Department of Health Records and the Governor of Hawaii are on Obamas payroll. Al Gore is working with ACORN to undermine the internet so that you cant get the truth about the aliens.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
I bet you kwiley agreed with your post the first two times he read it.
Wayoutwest
· 5 months ago
INSANITY!!!! When someone does the same thing repeatedly and expects a different outcome. If anyone out there hasn't reached a conclusion yet on this subject they have been hiding at an undisclosed location. These so called birthers were the young republicans in the 60's. They cheered when the students at Kent State and Jackson State were gunned down. They fear any movement that is based on the masses. Paternalism is their creed. Father knows best.Praise the Leader.I thought after the 70's we could find common ground and work for good of the country, i was naive. Their seething resentment of anything progressive is boiling over. If they can manipulate just one leftie to go postal and attack someone on the right they will have their justification to increase their physical attacks. They are cowards so they only attack churches and health clinics. If this doesn't persuade us to return to our lattes and yoga classes then they will go even further to the dark side. It's a mistake to see these people as misguided or stupid, they know exactly what they are doing.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
I completely agree. Except in one regard.
While I don't regard them as misguided, I do regard them as stupid.
I believe they know what they are doing, so they are not misguided. This is why I often tell them "you don't believe the nonsense you are spewing" or something like that. I believe they say these things without believing them with an ulterior purpose.
Most often that purpose is purely to vent the frustrations of their hurt inner racist children.
But sometimes they actually intend for their actions to have consequences.
Most often they just want to take up time and space that will (they hope) draw resources away from liberal causes, while drawing a spotlight on the issue, so that they can feel powerful. They may actually hope this will become some sort of distraction for President Obama and his administration as they try to accomplish things on their agenda, but I find that unlikely.
The Congressmen who signed this stupid bill are the only ones who could plausibly have that motive, but it is far more likely that the Congressmen just want to get their names in the paper without having to pay for it. There's a lot of money to be made by appeasing the far-right-wing and pandering to the base, and there are a lot of fund-raising dollars to be raised on a lot of rubber chicken circuits. They run in safe districts, thanks to Tom DeLay's re-districting, so the absurdity of their position won't actually cost them anything electorally, though it may hinder their long-term prospects for higher office in any race against the Democrats.
But I think all of them, from the Congressmen down to the people who are so cowardly that they won't even give you a FAKE name on this comment section, are stupid. Make that stoop-id. You'd have to be. You can be stupid and malevolent at the same time.
Actually it's better that you are stupid, if you are malevolent. It would be far worse to go up against these people if THEY were the ones who were Editor-in-Chief at Harvard Law and Obama was the one who went to five colleges in six years to get a journalism degree but still doesn't know what "gotcha" journalism is.
As it is, I think the Prez has it covered just fine. They are, as I've said, good advertising for his re-election campaign. Would you rather vote for the guy who's taking responsibility for everyone else's problems, and perhaps not fixing it as fast as you'd like, or the guy who said nothing and did nothing except blame all of society's problems (even the ones we had before he was born, let alone took office) on THAT guy?
Pretty easy choice.
Otherwise, like I said, spot-on.
pradwastes
· 5 months ago
Type your comment here./ text of Obama's birth certificate. STATE OF HAWAII DERTMENT OF HEALTH HONOLULU HAWAII USA
DATE OF BIRTH: HOUR OF BIRTH: August 4, 1961 7:24 PM
CITY, TOWN, OR LOCATION OF BIRTH ISLAND OF BIRTH HONOLULU OAHU
MOTHER'S MAIDEN NAME: STANLEY ANN DUNHAM
MOTHER'S RACE: CAUCASIAN
FATHER'S NAME: BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA
FATHER'S RACE AFRICAN
DATE FILED BY REGISTRAR AUGUST 8, 1961
readyforrevolt
· 5 months ago
Unfortunately....or should I say predictably....SOMEONE got the Major FIRED from his job...um...wonder who the vicious, vengeful SOMEONE might be??? Could it be the same one who only lets CERTAIN of the MEDIA cover the twisted events of the day?
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
It was the "vicious, vengeful" Department of Defense. They didn't want anyone on their property who filed suit against THEM. The employment contract is "at-will." And it works both ways. He is free to quit, and they are free to fire him. And they did. Because he sued them!
Did you forget that Obama is the Commander in Chief? He's one of them. They take that shit seriously. Soldiers live by a code of honor. Our brave men and women are out there in harm's way and every single one of them knows exactly who our President is. He came out and swished a three pointer on one trip and repaired America's standing with the Muslim world on the other. And those men and women are going into combat zones and chasing terrorists on his Presidential orders. Get it straight.
Taco Bell and KFC are owned by the same company. If you sue Taco Bell, KFC will not hire you. I don't see what's surprising about that.
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Stop pretending that "Produce the Long Form Birth Certificate" contains any compelling reasonable request. You are not the State the of Hawaii. Hawaii says Obama was born there, maybe all the state's authority should be revoked? Maybe we should repeal the 10th Amendment?
"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
RDS49, your right on my husbands birth ceriticare it does say NEGRO. I never thought about it. I am a white female and even for this I was called names. Oh yeah racist was the first. Ya gotta laugh
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
You are a liar and for that you were called names, including liar.
You don't have a black husband. Or a Negro husband. At this point I'm willing to pretend you have a husband.
Even if you did, though, it wouldn't prove the point. Obama's father is not a "Negro" since that term only applies to blacks in America. I would tell you to study the etymology, but then you would just get confused by the word "etymology" so there's no point.
So, even if your mythical husband has a birth certificate, and even if his pretend birth certificate said "Negro" for race, that does not mean Obama's father's race (as opposed to Obama himself, who, being born in America is American and thus Negro) should be listed as anything other than "AFRICAN" given that they did not get into what specific African tribe he was from, et cetera.
But you lie. Racist isn't the first name you were called. Liar was. Yet another lie!
And where's your birth certificate? I have been asking you since yesterday.
d2i
· 5 months ago
Don't respond kwiley - stephen is a troll and is being paid by 0bama to demean you and call you a liar so as to provoke a response. he gets paid for every response. please, please, please don't respond
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
I have to say, d2i, this is getting amusing. Let's play it out a bit.
I don't work for Obama or anyone else by posting what I do. I certainly don't get paid for doing it.
But if I did, what's it to YOU? I mean, why should you be so personally concerned? You're shrieking "please please please don't respond" in multiple posts! Are you worried that Obama will tax you, and you alone, the $5 dollars or something that a person could make sitting on his ass writing blog comments?
You'd think that you would want Obama to bleed his purse dry paying people to write on his behalf. You'd want him to run out of money and fail. Because you don't want him to be President. I get that part, at least.
But what I don't get is why you're hitching up your petticoats and running around begging people not to respond to me. It's hilarious, but puzzling. I await your response, or re-post or whatever the hell you're going to do. Loser.
jilly82
· 5 months ago
d2i, are you real. What rock did you crawl our from underd? Please take your lies and crawl back. There are much more important issues that are truth and matter to realo people. And for that matter who cares what color anyone is, Just another right wing lie. Give it up. You lost. Move on to real issues.
Florida Christian
· 5 months ago
It is a well known fact that Barry is a reptoid alien shapeshifter! I have absolute proof in the form of a forwarded email I received last April 1st!
If Barry wants to avoid a complete rebellion in the military he should have a MRI done live on Fox News and monitored by netural impartial medical experts like Glen Beck and Sean Hannity!
phxgwen
· 5 months ago
"On the other hand, I'm not interested in insulting any of my liberal opponents other than to suggest their ideology is a cancer destroying the country."
Hmm. And yet looking back through history the country seems to do better under Democratic Presidents rule then Republicans. Odd.
Looking at recent history as an immediate example.
Did a liberal or democratic president allow 9/11 to happen on their watch while they spent the majority of their time as President clearing brush off their ranch, playing golf, fishing and repeatedly ignoring information that claimed an attack on the states was imminent and might involve planes and high profile buildings?
Did a liberal or democratic president declare war on a country that they had taken great care to claim previously had no WMD but suddenly after 9/11 inexplicably must be invaded immediately becuase they SUDDENLY had WMD yet had not made a legitimate threat against us that has ended up costing the American tax payers 665 billion and 5,000 brave American soldiers lives? When we should have been concentrating on the war in Afghanistan (you know the place the terrorists that masterminded 9/11 are or were actually hiding).
Did a liberal or democratic president take a $236 billion surplus and turn it into the biggest deficit in American history?
Did a liberal or democratic president turn his back on an American city hit by a natural disaster and allow people to die, starve, suffer for days without a proper response and even years after the fact fail to properly address or right the situation? And instead pat the inexperience unqualified for the job friend he appointed to the organization in charge of the emergency response on the back who had previously been in charge or a horse association for the bang up job he did?
Did a liberal or Democratic President reverse the Clinton tax changes (which had raised taxes on the wealthy and lowered them for middle and lower class Americans and resulted in producing one of the longest sustained economic expansion in American history) by giving over the top tax cuts to the richest in America while cutting programs to help middle and lower class families and letting financial institutions pillage without any oversight until the economy collapsed under its own out of control debt and corrupt practices.
Hey.. but the rich are still rich. So its all good. By the way.. were there fewer rich people in the 90's?Were the rich unhappy during the Clinton years? Did they not make money in the 90's, were they declaring bankruptcy and threatening to refuse to make a dime over 250,000 just to avoid that extra little bit of taxes that Clinton imposed on them? Or did they just get way to comfortable with the freebies that buddy Bush was handing out. Isn't there a name republicans like to use for lazy people who enjoy freebies?
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Phoenix, that was good. So good, in fact, that I do not expect any birther to respond to it. So I will, on their behalf.
"Oh yeah? Well, the liberal guy is black. So that means we need to see more proof that he's not black before this Constitutional crisis can be averted."
Sorry for any correct spellings in the quoted part.
Navigator7
· 5 months ago
@ phxgwen,
Democratic rule. It has a nice ring don't you think? Can you describe what it is? As it stands today democratic rule is a seething cesspool of political leaders who only want one thing: Political power and are willing to work harder than an attorney to get votes. Lies, deception, corruption and an innate ability to bite the hand that feeds it. Democrats threw America under the bus during the Iraq war. You are a treasonous bunch.
A $236 billion surplus only existed because of the 104th Congress led by Gingrich.. It's just like a liberal to twist history or ignore history.
And you still use Katrina as a fulcrum to blame Bush and his god-like attack of the poor people of New Orleans living below sea level on the Gulf Coast? New Orleans should be a landfill. Katrina was proof what an idiot nation we have become. Electing Obama underscored it.
Have you stopped using Bush' speech characteristics as a sword against him ever since it was discovered Obama can't talk without a Teleprompter? Did you hear one of Obama's own Teleprompters committed suicide in disgust last week?
Liberals attack on the wealthy and prosperity better stop soon. You are born from the something for nothing crowd. That is why socialism is so appealing to your species.....something for nothing? If there is one thing that needs to occur is everybody pay their fair share which includes raising the taxes for lower and middle class...as they don't pay squat now! Wealth Redistribution is not the panacea it's made out to be. Obama's stimulus is only going to stimulate a much longer recovery ...or riots. I'll never understand the bassackwards mentality that heaps with contempt our nations problems on the backs of the wealthy.
Liberal's attack on prosperity and the American Way is a mental disease. It has got to stop!
""""Isn't there a name republicans like to use for lazy people who enjoy freebies?"""" ~Phxgwen
What are lazy people to you? Rich people?
Omama's ideology is wholesale theft of the producers and creators in this nation. In order to promote his lame agenda he must fist "TAKE" from those who have earned in order to "GIVE" to those......ingrates we believe they are owed something for nothing.
You should be ashamed.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
"Democrats threw America under the bus during the Iraq war."
Please, please, please tell me what role YOU believe Republicans played. Including without limitation what role you think the Republican White House, which endlessly beat the war drum and lied at every opportunity (including by having Cheney create his own separate "intelligence agency" when the CIA wouldn't confirm that Iraq had WMD or had any ties to Al-Qaeda.... and whaddaya know? Cheney's intelligence agency found what it needed. Saddam was trying to buy yellowcake from Nigeria. Saddam was trying to buy high-strength aluminum tubes. Who says so? Dick Cheney. Who else says so? Who cares?
But I digress. Please set forth the role of the Republican party in getting us into the Iraq war.
And then don't say anything else. Nothing you say has any relationship to the truth. And if you are still doubting that Bush's Justice Dept. did background checks on Obama, just let me know. I'll send you links to that self-evident information as soon as you provide me the opinion I've requested of you here.
mannix1962
· 5 months ago
Can't handle the truth so what do Liberals do, they change the subject
kb345
· 5 months ago
You go! Don't forget about the trillion dollar war in a country we had no beef with! Now all of these crybabies are complaining about the money being spent trying to fix the mess the "good ole boy" got us into with his lies and schemes! And all they seem to care about is where he was born, even though his mother was already a citizen, making him a "natural born citizen" ANYWAY! Imbeciles!
Wayoutwest
· 5 months ago
Stephenperry, I think that Palin drove the last nail into McCains coffin. He was already loosing and she was a Hail-Mary call to the base that backfired. I have developed a Turing test to determine if casey123 is actually a black guy or a dittohead droid. It consists of four questions. 1.The album Hot Buttered Soul was written by ? 2. What is the song on that album with the longest title? 3.What would Bush have been called by black kids in the 1960's ? 4.What would Cheney have been called by black kids in the 1960's ? If he can answer these questions you will have to cut him some slack.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
I agree that Palin was a Hail-Mary. I think McCain fundamentally misjudged women. He doesn't respect them (left his first wife after she was disfigured in a car accident so that he could marry the new USC cheerleader he met at a Navy party - I'm a double Trojan so that stung - then called the new wife a cunt in front of three journalists just because she teased him about his thinning hair).
He believed that the Hillary Clinton primary voters (like myself) would be swayed to the Republican ticket just because he picked a woman. The insult in that assumption was very hard to miss.
And I like your test, but I will be the one to decide whether to cut casey123 some slack. I will only do so if casey123 shows me his or her long form birth certificate. The original.
vergelbradford
· 5 months ago
Let all wingnuts spend their money frivolously on birthing law suits. It may help GOP fund raising in general doubling its efforts looking for money not tied up in the courts.
damajah
· 5 months ago
vergelbradford: Brilliant...you know, I never thought of it that way. As long as these idiots are chasing smoke and spending their own money, they help the Democrats, not only by squandering resources, but chasing off the more sane people let in the Republican party. I'll bet this was the Democrat strategy all along! ROTFLMAO!
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
I've been saying that since the beginning. Including in these posts. Let's let them keep it up, but the real danger is that someone will take it upon himself to do what that nutjob who shot up the Holocaust Museum tried to do.
That's why you have to pay attention to what the slimy underbelly of the Republican Party is up to. That is why I believe in free speech and a marketplace of ideas. I really want to know the unvarnished opinion of the people I have extreme disagreements with politically. Not because I really think they can be persuaded, but so that I will know what they really think. And when one of them says something truly alarming, as they often do, we can be aware of it and hopefully take protective measures if necessary to avert any more needless harm.
damajah
· 5 months ago
Are you people out of your Vulcan minds? Are you trying to imply, that President Barack Hussein Obama, survives the scrutiny of his own party, to include Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden, the slime machine of Faux News and Sean Insannity, who banged his Wright/Ayers drum for over a year (and still does it to this day) and the Republican propaganda machine that would have made Joseph Geobbels blush, never found ANY evidence to support this BS, or they would have long since used it, like the non-existent Michelle Obama "whitey" tape, and the ACORN/Obama alliance. My gut instinct tells me that the "birthers" are suffering from a type of mass hysteria..
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
"My gut instinct tells me that the "birthers" are suffering from a type of mass hysteria."
damajah,
a) well, there IS a black man and his family in the WH and that IS pissing them off BIG time
and
b) that's your limbic mind' you are referring to (gut instinct) and, interestingly enough, it's the same part of the mind (limbic center) that is driving the (after)'birhters' mad.
Jenine Garofalo was the first I heard mention it and it 'tracks'. This shoe 'fits' these (after)'birthers'.
phxgwen
· 5 months ago
It is the strangest conspiracy theory conversation?
Fiction: Prove you were born in the US.
Truth: Ok, here is a certified copy of the birth certificate.
Fiction: That doesn't look like my birth certificate so I don't believe you and you blocked some things out before you posted it on the internet . Prove it again.
Truth: Ok, we will bring some people in from a fact check organziation and let them review the document first hand and investigate it with the state of Hawaii.
Fact Check people: It appears by all accounts to be an actual valid birth certificate and our research with the state of Hawaii supports that as well. We deem it valid and authentic.
Fiction: Sorry but that's not good enough for us. We want to hear it from an official.
Truth: Ok.. here is someone in charge of vital records in the state that produced the document.
Truth State Offical: We can verify (since that is our job) that it is an official and authentic copy of a Hawaiian birth certificate and is a valid legal document showing he was born in Hawaii.
Fiction: Sorry that is not good enough prove it more. What about the long form or the "real" certificate on file? Prove its real.
Truth Official: Ok, even though it is not available to the public I can verify that we have reviewed the original live birth certificate on record and we can verify with 100% certainty that the document on file is valid, authentic and clearly states that Obama was born in the state of Hawaii.
Fiction: Sorry that is not enough proof.. because it is simply not what we want to hear and we will not believe you until you tell us what we want to hear.. that it is a fake..cause we just know deep down in our fear driven hearts that he is not American enough to be our President.
Truth Official: Ok, can you stop calling us now in the middle of the night and making veiled threats against us cause we don't know how many times we can tell you the truth and make official statements regarding the validity of a document before you accept the fact that it is a real and valid document. How many times do you need to hear the truth? Security!!!
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Excellent summary.
xcott
· 5 months ago
You forgot to add:
Fiction: Until this is settled we may be in a constitutional crisis that could end in a civil war!
Truth: Then why don't you just accept all the evidence?
xcott
· 5 months ago
Notice that conspiracy theorists are always asking for just one tiny piece of evidence. All they want is this one document, or just one investigation, or just one photo.
But it's just a ploy: if you give them that one document they'll just toss it on the pile of things they don't care about anymore, and ask for something else. If you launch an investigation they'll call it a whitewash and ask for a real one. If you show them a photo they'll call it counterfeit. That's how conspiracy theories work.
It's all a song and dance to make them look like the good guys and keep repeating their false claims forever.
Bo
· 5 months ago
John Q Birthers -- It is their one and only last hope. In the end, they cannot abide a liberal negro in the White House, a Dem majority, and the undoing of all they hold sacred about GWB and his post-911 Cowboy America. They can't beat Obama with words because he speaks in words that they are too willingly stupid to comprehend. Real life for them is uncertain and confusing so they cling to conspiracy, shared hatred and spittle. You can't argue with them, you can't get them to see the truth or even their own hypocrisy... all you can do is out-vote them and hope they go on to live their short, squalid little lives without taking any of us with them.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
You can also hand them a microphone and ask them to repeat themselves. Their arguments are transparently empty. They are a wonderful advertisement for the Democratic party.
Remember McCain's rally in Minnesota where that confused-sounding old woman said she couldn't trust Obama because he's an "Arab?" McCain knew that was so bad that he had to take the mic away from her and say "No ma'am. He's not. He's a good Christian family man." (Does that in fact mean that no Arabs are good family men?)
That incident was replayed over and over on tv and it made a lot of independent voters take a hard look at just what the Republican party is about. Most people decided they wanted nothing to do with that kind of ugly racism. And then a few months later, Minnesota voted for the black guy, as did a whole lot of swing states. All of them, in fact.
So while it is tempting to wait for these people to inbreed themselves out of the population, we have to remember to harness the power of their idiocy and use it to generate a light that shines on the ugliness of their views. Can you see how many seats they will lose in 2010 after all the racism and condescension toward Sotomayor? No reasonable person, and certainly no reasonable Hispanic American, could have thought that what they did to her was fair or respectful -- especially considering Democrats have always had the votes to confirm her, so all that stuff was just for show and never had any chance of de-railing her nomination.
So just as with the birthers themselves, the Republican Party writ large has shown that all it cares about, even during this time of national economic and military crisis, is wasting time and trying to embarrass the sitting President and Commander in Chief.
The rest of us have to decide what we will do. Nothing? Point out idiocy wherever it lies? Or some third option that is not clear to me. I choose the second option.
d2i
· 5 months ago
Is this the best you can do? Insult. Demean. I'll bet you were a playground bully!
Just so you know I'm Jane Q Birther and a Dem. I loathe all things GWB.
This is not a minor matter by any means. It is a significant Constitutional matter in which this Dem finds extremely important to the safety and freedom of my country.
May I ask you if you've done any research on this matter? Have you read the countless factual articles written by investigators, journalists and countless other informed citizens. Do you really think these individuals would go on the public record and state such claims knowing they can be sued for it? Give me a break!
Why do you wish to continue to divide us as a people? Just b/c we know for a fact that he is ineligible does not give you any permission to retort with such lame spittle (your word not mine). Do me a favor and educate yourself on this matter before you stick your uninformed opinion NOT FACTs into the middle of such a serious matter.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
My bullshit detector is going crazy.
You aren't a Democrat. No Democrat would say anything remotely as stupid as what you said.
You haven't done any "research into this matter." Care to cite any of the "countless factual articles written by investigators, journalists, and other informed citizens?" No? Would that be because there are NO FACTUAL articles written by ANYONE on this subject? Instead, the right-wing lunatic fringe (who I take you to be describing as "other informed citizens") is the only set of people who write about this. No one cites to them, because they're lunatics.
Put it this way. When birthers call right-wing talk radio, the radio hosts SHOUT THEM DOWN and cut them off. Because they know it's stupid. When Fox freakin' News even says "there is no truth whatsoever, zero" to the birthers' claims, (Shep Smith, the beacon of light in the Faux Noise wilderness) you know it's time to pack it in.
"Why do you wish to divide us as a people?" Wow, that's the best example of irony I've seen since my college English seminars. You're over here trying to argue that the President is not the President, during a time of war. You want to ask yourself the question you asked us?
Go back to the shithole you swam out of this morning.
d2i
· 5 months ago
aahhhh, Stephen, hit a nerve did I? Did you have to go beat someone up after my challenging you and your sheer lack of knowledge on this subject?
First, see my post upstairs to your taunt and I provide you with the best site on the web that has chronicled the eligibility issue with FACTS since last summer. Read it all. Everything you ever wanted to know about this issue is there.
Btw, it's Democrats like you that gives Democrats like me a bad friggin name. Don't you dare doubt my lifelong work to forward the Democrats plank! How dare you! Who the hell do you think you are? I've managed, volunteered, given money, housed operatives and so much more to support my Party. And for a yahoo like you to insult and degrade my work over 40+ years shows your lack of civility.
Yes, you and your ilk are and have divided us. Do you know why? Because of the way you address people, their thoughts and their opinions. Because they somehow differ from yours they are insulted and bullied by bloggers like you. I didn't work my a$$ off for Dems like you to be so negative and hateful. Grow up! You're destroying MY Party!
JimPA
· 5 months ago
links please
jjfitz
· 5 months ago
Nice to meet you Jane Q. Birther (Democrat), I'm the Easter Bunny.
Heaps of right-wing propaganda money to perpetuate baseless doubt? What's so hard to believe about that? Seems to be a lot simpler to believe than a grand international conspiracy.
Factual? We're talking about the legitimacy of the State of Hawaii to say who was born there or not. I keep reading 'Constitution this' and 'Constitution that', none of it challenges the legitimacy of the legitimacy that we have set up. If this fraud had the intentions that it says it does, it would be arguing entirely within that framework if only to perfect it for posterity.
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
"Have you read the countless factual articles written by investigators, journalists and countless other informed citizens."
Have you read the SCOTUS DISmissal of Phol Berg's (after)birther suit?
RDS49
· 5 months ago
Two Points:
First, stop the controversy by providing the Long Form Birth Certificate and not the Certificate of Live Birth which is not a Birth Certificate.
Second, on the Certificate of Live Birth it states that the Father’s race is ‘AFRICAN’. In the 1960’s information it would state for race ‘NEGRO’. To use the term ‘AFRICAN’ someone wants to be politically correct and creating a bogus document.
Provide the long form Birth Certificate and end this.
beverlyadams
· 5 months ago
jimpi: I have never listened to rush. I make my own conculsion.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
My mistake. Please provide some proof. You never answered my question, Do you think Americans walked on the moon in 1969?
senevada
· 5 months ago
and the racists in congress continue to reveal themselves....
jackiebell
· 5 months ago
The bottom line here is that these "birther" folks are trying to divert President Obama from his job as President, and put in the shade, ever how long, all the plans for recovery which we must go forward with. Dignifying these conspiracy nuts would be a waste of time, considering they, being conspiracy nuts, would never be satisified anyway. Obviously,Obama would never have been able to enroll in public school without a birthcertifcate, much less be able to run for government office, etc. It's interesting that no one bothered wondering about his birth certificate until he ran for President. These birthers are ignorant racist bigots---that's all.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
LOL No one is trying to divert anything. They have been trying to get him to show his long form birth certificate for A YEAR now! Geez, what is so hard about it?
He can make all these people shut up about it if he would just show the long form. And do you think he is being diverted? He has had his legal team dealing with this. He isnt doing anything.
Dont start on his school years either. He never showed college records or anything else for that matter. You are talking about a very secretive man who put many of his records under lock and key. Who can blame anyone for wanting to know more? He makes things worse by being so secretive like he is trying to hide something.
jackiebell
· 5 months ago
Wonder why the President needs to show his college records to anyone--that's none of your business anyway! I thought that you were sooo worried about his birthcertificate?? What "records" are so concerned with now?? And yes, as an educator I KNOW that public schools require birth certificates, but I'm sure you would think that they were forged. God, you people are so paranoid!!!!!
We are a nonpartisan, nonprofit "consumer advocate" for voters that aims to reduce the level of deception and confusion in U.S. politics. We monitor the factual accuracy of what is said by major U.S. political players in the form of TV ads, debates, speeches, interviews and news releases. Our goal is to apply the best practices of both journalism and scholarship, and to increase public knowledge and understanding.
The Annenberg Political Fact Check is a project of the Annenberg Public Policy Center of the University of Pennsylvania. The APPC was established by publisher and philanthropist Walter Annenberg in 1994 to create a community of scholars within the University of Pennsylvania that would address public policy issues at the local, state and federal levels.
The APPC accepts NO funding from business corporations, labor unions, political parties, lobbying organizations or individuals. It is funded primarily by the Annenberg Foundation.
Brooks Jackson Director, Annenberg Political Fact Check
Brooks Jackson is a journalist who covered Washington and national politics for 34 years, reporting in turn for The Associated Press, the Wall Street Journal and CNN. At CNN he pioneered the "adwatch" and "factcheck" form of stories debunking false and misleading political statements starting with the presidential election of 1992. His investigative reporting for The AP and the Journal won several national awards. He is the author of three books: "Honest Graft: Big Money and the American Political Process" (Knopf, 1988); "Broken Promise: Why the Federal Election Commission Failed" (Twentieth Century Fund, 1990); and "unSpun: Finding Facts in a World of Disinformation" with Kathleen Hall Jamieson (Random House, 2007).
Viveca Novak Deputy Director, Annenberg Political Fact Check
Viveca Novak is a journalist who covered politics and government in Washington for nearly 20 years, reporting in turn for Common Cause Magazine, National Journal, the Wall Street Journal and Time magazine. At Time she was a co-winner of Harvard University's Goldsmith Prize as well as the Clarion Award for investigative reporting into the campaign finance scandals of President Clinton's 1996 re-election campaign. She is co-author of "Inside the Wire" about the Guantanamo Bay detention center (Penguin Press, 2005). She holds an M.S. in journalism from Columbia University and an M.S.L. from Yale Law School.
casy123
· 5 months ago
The only dunce is you-------if you believe their results! Their credentials and mission statement is worth about as much as day old fish!!!!!
kb345
· 5 months ago
And your expertise is......? Idiot!
kennethetucker
· 5 months ago
THAT'S (r) IDIOT
jackiebell
· 5 months ago
Sir-- Why is that no one insisted on birth records, college records, etc when Obama ran for the Senate?? Funny. I guess that some folks just had to get used to an actual black person in Congress, since there were already a "few" already. And, pray tell, why did the birth certificate gang morph into the college records gang, etc.? Do you all want his dental records as well? And I guess that you dismiss school records as being unimportant because they, along with shot records, etc. are necessary to enroll a child in a public school. Lame! Now, to really dignify your efforts, why don't you ask for everyone in Congress to show their birth records, etc. Fair enough? I am a natural born citizen of the great state of Texas. I grew up during segregation as an Anglo, and witnessed the injustices abound. I was not raised to be prejudiced, but I was taught that it was wrong, and I raised my children to know that prejudice (racism) is for the small minded brain.
But sir, I know a prejudiced mind when I encounter one. In this era, the modern racist has got to think on his/her feet, and deciding that Barack Obama is not a natural born citizen is a very cleaver way to rouse up the typical hatred necessary to stir other "scaries".
There always have and always will be scattered groups of loonies who bestir themselves whenever a "cause" raises its ugly head. Don't you think that President Obama and his advisers know this? Do you think that the President is going to halt his important agendas to dignify the likes of you? You take yourselves as being far too important!
Why don't you decide to actually contribute to society, by joining a community organizing group, helping to improve neighborhoods, like Habitat for Humanity has been doing. Your fellow citizens need you today--right now. Help the homeless, among them so many children who need you. Charities are running out of food donations--why not start a food drive. Spend your spare time volunteering to help the elderly, and the sick.
I spent my entire career in public service, as an educator and counselor. I have seen, first hand the lives that can be turned around, or saved from gangs and drugs. There is nothing more fulfilling than to help your fellow man. We are all our brothers keepers, even our black brothers. Jackie
Wayoutwest
· 5 months ago
I have some more amo for the birthers. Did you know that JFK was responsible for Obama Sr. getting to Hawaii to attend school in 1960? The Kenyan students lacked the funds for transport to the US so JFK and others raised funds to fly them in. We all know that the Kennedys are founding members of The New World Order. JFK was killed for breaking ranks with TNWO, but he had already sown the seeds for future world domination. The only thing that doesn't fit is that Obama should have red hair, maybe he dyes it.
d2i
· 5 months ago
Your information is inaccurate and was debunked over a year ago. I believe it was the Rockfeller's who flew the Kenyan students into study in America.
glacialhills
· 5 months ago
Hey libs, seems if I was gonna post something as important as my COLB online, and I wanted everyone to believe it is a valid document I would...
1.Show it to, and Post it with the three major news agencies and not some mom n pop web blog site that none had heard of.
2. Not go around spouting that the jpeg is a birth certificate when it is actually a certificate of live birth (big difference between the two). Bound to make people suspicious when you mis categorize the only document you want to show as your proof of your eligibility,
3. Not alter or black out an area on the document when the bottom of the document tells you if you do that it invalidates the said document.Makes people think your hiding something again.
4. Use at least 72dpi when posting a jpeg to the internet(creating such a small scan screams I dont want you to see any details!)
4.(MOST IMPORTANT WAY TO PROVE VALIDITY OF AN ONLINE INTERNET BASED DOCUMENT) Use government protocols for validating an official document via computer generated image. So it will stand up to scrutiny if examined(like he knew it would be).Gee, I would think a Sitting Senator and his staff would know about government protocols for documents and things like that...hmmmm
I have to show 3 proofs of id in person when applying for some government documents,my daughter needed her original BC to play AYSO soccer this year.And the best a candidate for the highest office in the land can produce to prove he meets the eligibility clause in the constitution is that jpeg? My Mom posts better images of the grandkids on the web than that, and she is 73.
So, if all you have to show that Mr. obama meets the qualifications set forth in the Constitution to be President of the United States of America is a fuzzy, unofficial, non government protocol, nebulous jpeg posted on a couple of obscure websites and his say so, I say I want a bit more proof of the man I am entrusting with the nuclear football and my kids future for gosh sakes!!!
Like, oh I dont know, some corroborating evidence to prove where he was born, when did he return and regain citizenship after living abroad, when and how did he obtain a passport to travel to foreign countries in the 1980's, Has he went by more names than barry and barack (he didn't list the name barry on his bar exam as an alias)What is the definition of "Natural born citizen" is it just being born here? If that is the only criteria, why did the founders say you have to be a NBC or citizen at the time of adoption of the constitution if there is no difference between the two,Can you be a NBC if your father was Kenyan and never a citizen and you were a dual citizen at birth as Barack has said... you know those type things...proof other than.... Cause he said so and cause he is smart and good looking and cool. And no other president needed to show anything...bla bla bla. Oh and the racist bs... maybe a few KKK members have joined in but most of us really want to get past race in this country...If Condi Rice or Colon P. would have won (both natural born citizens) I would be as proud as a peacock. Too bad you only could find a good looking, Clean, well spoken (Mr. Bidens words) 1 year senator, with questionable friends( W Aires, the guy who barack launched his senate race with) Rev. Wright, the minister he never in 20 years heard say a racist remark, and a guy with an almost unknown background. He seemed to be able to fly all around the world while in college with no means of support or income. Did he ever have a real job? How did he pay for some of the most expensive colleges in the US when His grades were mediocre and not full scholarship worthy. These are the things that would backup his COLB and prove or disprove his NBC status. There has been only one person that has come forward and said they were present at barack obamas birth, his Grand mother who said she was there when he was born in Kenya.. and two witnesses have sworn that that statement is true.Not one person has come forward to negate that claim and said they witnessed him being born in the US, NOT ONE! I believe all recent presidents have shown their medical records and other documents when asked. Mr. Mccain showed his BC and other docs when he revealed he was born abroad( I dont believe he was eligible either by the way, no matter what congress said.)
So Some of us wont blindly follow this man because he said he was eligible and showed us a blurry Jpeg on the internet...that is what freedom is all about....Being able to question our government and not worry about being threatened or called names. Just as the left did with GWB. Look at what happened to the peeps in China that peacefully protested their government. Do you want our country to be like that?
just john
· 5 months ago
OKAY BIRTHERS, TELL ME THIS!
When did the conspiracy begin?
I mean, when did the acts of deception you claim to happened start?
Were these nefarious forces aligned before he was born? And, if so, what made them sure he was Whitehouse-bound?
Please elaborate. We know you're here. Silence will be construed as an admission of defeat.
just john
· 5 months ago
(Okay, typo. I meant "to have happened" instead of "to happened." Must be those space aliens pushing my elbow again.)
GH5877
· 5 months ago
This is just another attempt to "distract" the American people from the real issues facing all of us. This is an attempt to hide what they are doing in the backroom........STAY FOCUSED on what really matters. That really ticks them off.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Riiiigggghhhht. Because US conservative want to distract America from what Obama and the dems are trying to shove through with Obama Care and Cap/Trade. Yeah, WE are the ones that dont want people to know about everything that is in the thousands of pages of those documents.
Please, get some common sense. The media might not want to tell you about everything in those bills, but the conservatives will. Because unlike your politicians, some of us actually read that stuff. And yeah, its kinda scary to see the stuff in the bills so far. Bigger government, more money being taken away from YOU, etc, etc
Again, why would a conservative want to distract anyone from what Obama and Congress are doing? We are the only ones trying to shed light on it.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
I still cant get over your post. Do you remember who is running the White House with his 20 or so czars? Who controls the house and senate? Yeah, its the Democrats. So why exactly would we want to distract Americans from the shenanigans they are trying to pull? Seriously, think about it.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
StepHen,
Who cares who has more money? Does it really matter? Its probably equal anyways. Either way, it will be more than just the rich who will pay for Health Care and Cap n Trade. Common sense tells you that the rich people who give people jobs, will pass their extra taxes and such along to the consumer as well as cut costs further by laying people off and moving even more jobs over seas. All a result of Obama's agenda. We are in enough hurt not economically, why they want to pass the other garbage down our throats is beyond me.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
I'm sorry, chuck. You've already proven that you're a doofus. You already proved you do not understand the decades of history of deficit spending in this country, and why deficit spending is essential but unpleasant in certain situations, like to head off the worst effects of a deep recession.
You just proved that you cannot discern sarcasm.
Now you are proving that you do not understand Reaganomics. See, we tried what you're talking about. Starting in 1980. Even though in the primary debates that year, George H. W. Bush said to Reagan that his plan was "voodoo economics." Poppy Bush is a POS for the Willie Horton ads (and for continuing to follow Reagan's voodoo economics when in office) but he was right about trickle-down economics being a total scam for the rich.
You should be banned from ever trying to discuss what "common sense tells you." Because you have no common sense.
But before you go back into hiding under your bridge (well, the government's bridge), tell us, chuck, just for shits and giggles, what do YOU think the President should do, short of resign from office because you don't like him? DO you have any sort of coherent economic philosophy that has actual application to this generation? Or do you just have a poorly-pieced-together grasp of discarded Republican talking-points from 1980 that haven't been tried out since McCain left the campaign trail?
I bet I know which of those two it is.
Name
· 5 months ago
No wonder the country is in so much trouble. The racism and ignorance that is America is truly appauling.No wonder other countries have America's number as the country spends too much time on small and petty as well as the hateful come on people is this the Jesus principle to hate your brothers I do not think so. Get over it Republicans you have eight years of seeing Obama and we are praying for him. You repubs see the light that his policies will work and then the party of hate will be no more. The country is showing its ugliness which people pretended had died but look at this how do these ignorant people sleep at nights.
kb345
· 5 months ago
Unfortunately, we are only guaranteed 4 yrs. of Obama, not 8 yrs. The next 4 remains to be seen. If it is Mitt Romney he is running against, he might have a slight fight on his hands, depending on the next 3.5 yrs go.
painbodyII
· 5 months ago
kelleyye you are not a well-read person. You, like many in the USA, are defending your white skin because you have nothing else --no education, no manners, no integrity, no money, no respect from your fellow citizens and no fellowship with God. Try looking in your mirror and saying 3 times each morning, I love you "kelleyye", I love you "kelleyye", I love you "kelleyye". You'll start liking yourself and stop hating people you believe in your deepest heart are "superior" to you. Try it before you burst into flames and ashes.
Julie King
· 5 months ago
This is insane. Unbelievable. In my neck of the woods (Southern Calif) there isn't any talk whatsoever about this--I thought the thing died when Obama showed it back when. This is truly amazing, what it says about that part of the country and that type of thinking. Good for those among you trying to reason w/ these irrational things--I'll have to move on, it's too just plain weird to read any more of this. And to think we survived 8 years of Bush and Co's daily continuing lies to have THIS become an issue? Pathetic.
kaywynn
· 5 months ago
Kobach is just adding fuel to the fire. It's an old but effective tactic that has helped get and maintain the GOP's base of supporters. They feed into the fears of those who, for whatever reason, bigotry, party loyalty etc, don't like the president. Remember how ugly it got for Clinton, and that was without the aspect of race as an issue. When it comes to taking down President Obama, hold on to your hats people, the GOP has only just begun.
kevinwires
· 5 months ago
Perhaps it is time that the Democrats forget the bi-partisan crap, since it is apparent that the Repubs are going to continue with whatever scurrilious gimiicks they can think of. It is time to start a number of onvestigations with independent prodecutors, to look into the many violations of the Bush administration. There should also be an investigation into the tax status of the C street housing facility where the current GOP romeos are housed. They hold political/religious meetings in what is registered as a church. They provide DC housing at reduced rates to office holders. That could be construed as a bribe. The "Family" may need to be investigated as well, since they own the C street Frat.
jn2222
· 5 months ago
GOP are showing their true colors; and they don't like anyone's color other than their own. What a bunch of hypocrital racists!
chuckj
· 5 months ago
"what? How dare anyone speak nothing but blessings on Obama! They must be racist!"
When will the racist line end with you libs? Ever? And what exactly have YOU done for minorities? The Dems seem to be the party that minorities like but sadly not all of them have figured out that the liberal agenda isnt to help them, its to make them continue to think they need the government to survive. Continue to think they are victims. Liberals havent dont a damn thing to help minorities over the past couple decades. better watch out, sooner or later they just might figure it out. Then youll be in trouble because their vote, which is all the liberal politicians want, want be guaranteed anymore.
theodosa
· 5 months ago
When will you wingnuts listen to your queen, Malkin, and get over your ODS, Obama Derangement Syndrome already.
Give it up, you lost.
waynel28
· 5 months ago
Conspiracy theorists for the most part are harmless and the majority of them have mental health issues. No harm.. Let them be.
Ricardo
· 5 months ago
If you think Obama isn't legitimate to be in the White House, stop doing chickens**t stuff like writing blogs about it and go down to DC and drag him out of his office. Just let me know when you will do this so I can set my TIVO.
I mean, come on! Just drop the bag of chips, get out of mom's basement and ACT. Christ on a crutch!
murray19
· 5 months ago
“It’s crazy,” said Janice Okubo, director of communications for the Hawaii Department of Health. “I don’t think anything is ever going to satisfy them.”
Okubo, who said that she gets weekly questions from Obama ‘Birthers’ that are “more like threats,” explained that the certificate of live birth reproduced by Obama’s campaign should have debunked the conspiracy theories. “If you were born in Bali, for example,” Okubo explained, “you could get a certificate from the state of Hawaii saying you were born in Bali. You could not get a certificate saying you were born in Honolulu. The state has to verify a fact like that for it to appear on the certificate. But it’s become very clear that it doesn’t matter what I say. The people who are questioning this bring up all these implausible scenarios. What if the physician lied? What if the state lied? It’s just become an urban legend at this point.”
John
· 5 months ago
This is my favorite part:
“It’s crazy,” said Janice Okubo, director of communications for the Hawaii Department of Health. “I don’t think anything is ever going to satisfy them.”
Okubo, who said that she gets weekly questions from Obama ‘Birthers’ that are “more like threats,” explained that the certificate of live birth reproduced by Obama’s campaign should have debunked the conspiracy theories. “If you were born in Bali, for example,” Okubo explained, “you could get a certificate from the state of Hawaii saying you were born in Bali. You could not get a certificate saying you were born in Honolulu. The state has to verify a fact like that for it to appear on the certificate. But it’s become very clear that it doesn’t matter what I say. The people who are questioning this bring up all these implausible scenarios. What if the physician lied? What if the state lied? It’s just become an urban legend at this point.”
Hawaii is a state. It's not a foreign counrty. Any one of these birthers could travel to Honolulu, drive up to the DHHS offices and obtain a copy of the birth certificate. Of course, it would look just like the one everyone has seen.
Best post of the year:
"Try applying for a passport or a Federal job and send them a photograph of your birth certificate posted on a website."
Hmmm. A passport, like the one President Obama has and used this month to travel abroad? A Federal job, like being U.S. Senator, which President Obama was? Or U.S. President, which he is? That's a Federal job.
Dumbass. Epic fail!"
screenname05
· 5 months ago
Okay, I'm going to start a new rumor. George Bush violated the SEC act by using insider information to sell all of his stock in his oil company after receiving the accounting report three weeks ahead of the BOD. He wasn't prosecuted because his daddy was President of the U.S.
Oops, that's not a silly rumor, its true. Guess it doesn't qualify after all.
suu
· 5 months ago
I have one better, Obama use to be white and dyed his skin black. He consulted with M. Jackson on how to do it.
brendand
· 5 months ago
>>M. Jackson<<
Mahalia?
Wait, wait, that can't be right...
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Stop hijacking the thread. We are here to discuss important things, like how much the President spent when he had dinner in New York City with the First Lady.
That's what the people need to know. Never mind how much it cost to wire the entire town of Crawford and turn a ranch into a Presidential fortress with secure broadband connections. I'm sure that was just a few dozen million dollars. Chump change.
I wanna know how much the Broadway show tickets cost! Never mind how much we're going to be paying for the next 20 years for Bush's war of choice in Iraq, fought purely to finish what Poppy Bush started.
No sir. Americans should not sit idly by and watch a President spend any money trying to date his own wife. There are plenty of Other Women around. Mark Sanford and John Ensign can only handle so much traffic between them.
cathy
· 5 months ago
You know, I haven't heard a single peep from these people about the fact that McCain was born in Panama, in the Canal Zone.
Not an American state like Hawaii, but a U.S. territory that was only technically U.S. soil at the time and has sense been returned to Panama. In other words, he was born in a place that we were leasing from another country.
Why no cries of "not a citizen" on this? Yes, his father was in the military, but a much stronger case could be made that this does not qualify him as "natural born" then all the crazy legalities pitched by the anti-Obama birthers.
As for that birth certificate.....these people would cry "fake" if Moses went to Mt. Sinai and brought back a copy of Obama's birth certificate carved on a stone tablet.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Cathy,
There wouldnt be anymore lawsuits if he showed the proof he needs to show. He hasnt. And if you has any clue, you would know McCain was born on a military base, his family was in the military. Oh and guess what Cathy? Congress held hearings to determine his eligibility. But NOOOOO, cant do that to Obama.
slimslowslider
· 5 months ago
I have no problem with lawsuits bankrupting all you silly birfers. keep it up! chuckj, have you personally donated to any of the birfer lawsuits? please do!
cathy
· 5 months ago
I was born on a military base, dimwit. In Peru, when my father was down there as a liason to the Peruvian Air Force. When I was ten, I had to get a certificate of naturalization. I am a naturalized citizen, not a natural-born citizen.
I don't have any problem with McCain's eligibility, I just want to know what the hell you people would accept as proof? Not a birth certificate issued by the state of Hawaii, obviously. What would you accept as proof? The answer, of course, is nothing!
student2
· 5 months ago
Hello cathy. I am curious about your naturalization. If congressional hearings granted John McCain natural-born citizen status, does that not set a legal precedent for you? Making you eligible to file for natural-born status. Were both of your parents American citizens? I ask because I'd like to know if there are any differences in your case versus John McCains. I take no sides on the issue being debated. I am only interested in the legal aspects. Regarding President Obama, I have no opinion either way. I am only here for research purposes. Thank you for your time. Oops, I also forgot to ask your age. Sorry.
Billy
· 5 months ago
kwiley9711:
"Ok on proof of certificate??? Put it on the net for FREE???"
It's been there for more than a year, cracker. "Buh-buh-buh it's a fake/forgery/etc." Yeah sure cracker.
Hypathia
· 5 months ago
I say, let the birthers have free reign to pursue this hoax as far as they like, and in return let's have a full bore investigation of the Bush gang's crimes. Sound fair?
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
I say let them have free reign to pursue the hoax, as long as they guarantee to get themselves news coverage.
It's the best advertising Democrats could buy. Republicans are 20% of the country, and less than 5% of Republicans believe any of this birther nonsense.
NONE of the rest of the country believes it. They instead see it as the death throes of racists who cannot accept that the President is black.
It would be very difficult, and very expensive, for Democrats to make political ads that trash the opposing party's stupidest-yet-most-vocal element. But the birthers are doing it for free.
More to the point, every day one of these clowns is on television, every day that Ensign/Sanford/Vitter do not step down for adultery even though they all demanded that Clinton step down, is a day when Republicans cannot claim to be the party of morals, family values, decency, or respect.
And aren't Republicans always up in arms about showing deference to the Commander in Chief during a time of war? Haven't we been at war since before President Obama took office? Doesn't that mean that these birthers and the Congressmen who enable them are showing an inexcusable lack of respect for our supreme commander at wartime, when hundreds of thousands of our best soldiers are in harm's way?
I really want to see these dolts insult our President to his face, or in front of the military that is HONORED to serve under his command.
You know, I really despised President Bush. I could not think of one policy he had that I liked. But once the Supreme Court installed him in office, I never doubted that he's our President or that as such he is entitled to a generous measure of my respect. I was taught that you respect the uniform if not the man wearing it.
The right-wing crowd is always so gung-ho about the rule of law and respect for the military and unitary executive this and that. Turns out it's all just hot air from them. Big surprise.
Hypathia
· 5 months ago
I actually agree with *everything* you just said. Thanks stephenperry! :^)
Char316
· 5 months ago
This is so silly, the President travels abroad and has to have a Passport, His passport is in a black book unlike the blue book that the average citizen has. A State Dept Employee carries it around for him while abroad. Now listen to reason, you cannot get a Passport without a BIRTH CERTIFICATE. So if the President's Passport is illegal, who is handing out bogus Passports, is it a Republican?
kerfuffler
· 5 months ago
If there were really anything to the idea that Obama isn't a citizen, don't you think that Hillary would have used it to push him out of the Democratic primary? Obama HAS provided proof repeatedly, but the birthers think everything is a forgery, and that everyone is in on the conspiracy. They need to take their tin foil hats off and watch a real news show.
Mike McGuire
· 5 months ago
I think you're missing the more likely strategy here, one that dovetails with Republican efforts to keep minorities from voting whenever possible and especially out of office. There are quite a few native-born Americans, mostly poor ones, who cannot produce a birth certificate when challenged. In some cases they were born far from a hospital, but natural disasters have also destroyed vital records in some localities (again, predominantly poor ones). It's not really about Obama -- it's about voters and candidates to be named later, once the Republicans get a requirement to show documents every time a person attempts to use any of their everyday civil rights.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Good catch. They're planning for ways that they can close any door that is open for minorities, while simultaneously opening any door that is closed for Sarah Palin.
hyperbolefreaks
· 5 months ago
Very good point. Anyone who debates otherwise has never worked at the polls in an urban area or is completely blind to the egregious voter suppression that takes place in this country.
mgabe
· 5 months ago
I agree. Poll tax, birth certificates, speaking English, hanging chads.... All of these represent the Rethugs' attempts to disenfranchise minorities. Now that one of those minorities was elected President, they've extended they're tactics to the highest office of the land. I'm just waiting for them to pull out their jackboots and hoods. (Maybe some of them already have.)
gypsysailor
· 5 months ago
It's pretty obvious that God not only doesn't speak to Limbaugh, but she doesn't speak to the Republicans either. How do I know? She told me.
asirishasbarackobama
· 5 months ago
I think a lot of the birthers don't realize that President Obama is a "junior." His father was also named Barack Hussein Obama and his father was born in Kenya. Obama senior was smart enough to get a scholarship to the University of Hawaii, where he met and married Obama's mom. Is it possible that some of the conspiracy theorists don't know that President Obama is named after his dad, and they are getting the two confused? In other words, are they crazy paranoids, or are they just stupid?
smmiranda
· 5 months ago
Let's call it what it really is, "The Sore Losers Movement" .
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
amen.
mikeG56
· 5 months ago
Are they nuts! They want to pass a bill making it mandatory for Candidates to prove their citizenship. Yet when Obama produced such evidence they don't believe him. Why then would they believe anyone else? What exactly will this bill accomplish?
Let's face facts; if Obama were O'bama the Irish President we wouldn’t be having this conversation. The fact that he’s Black scares the hell out of these racists, and make no mistake about it, that is exactly what they are.
During the campaign there was some question as to McCain’s citizenship giving the fact he was born in Panama. Yet know one asked to see his proof of citizenship. The state of Hawaii has provided proof and there is no reason to believe there is a conspiracy on the part of the Hawaiian government. If you thought there was such a conspiracy then you would have to believe that they new that Obama would run for President some day and concealed his real birth place to further that cause. GIVE ME A BREAK!
The bottom line is you’re never going to satisfy the folks, so the best thing to do is ignore them. No news reports, no newspaper articles just simply ignore them. There is noting to prove and they will never prove their theory. They have noting to say that is fact based.
My challenge to these folks is to produce proof of their citizenship. And no matter how many times they show me the document(s), I won’t believe them. I just don’t believe any of them are true citizens. After all they’ve told us time and time again, document can be forged by anyone.
nonpartay
· 5 months ago
Not only that, a true citizen would have better things to do with their time than to make up phony accusations against the President of the United States. This is about as unAmerican as it gets, imho, since President Obama was duly elected by a majority of voters, not to mention his landslide in the Electoral College.
kladinvt
· 5 months ago
This is the far-righties version of Whitewater, Vince Foster, Travelgate, etc, which follows the rule that "if you say a lie enough times, it must be the truth". Or at the very least, you get those with the lowest IQs to bob their collective heads in unison and drool, while they wait for someone to toss them a fish!
valenHarris
· 5 months ago
Who knew the Republicans would *literally* lose their minds when they lost power. I know it's tough out there in the wilderness but their desperation here is just pathetic.
kb345
· 5 months ago
Didn't you notice that they had lost their minds when they were IN power? Just wait, Bush, Cheney and the rest of the power-hungry freaks will have their day in court soon enough!
grace brown
· 5 months ago
Wasn't McCain born out of the country to American parents?
Victor
· 5 months ago
I don't know how much longer I'm going to keep living in Kansas. I was born here, but this state is getting more and more like Alabama with each passing day. Between, Kobach, Brownback, Tiahrt and our state board of education, this state has no hope. These extreme, evangelical conservatives are ignorant and ridiculous.
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
Why don't you move to Uganda then? You'll be much happier there I'm sure. Not a all like Alabama (well, some parts of it). You'll find some of the local evangelists there to be quite different for sure. They spend most of their time trying to persuade the locals not to chop each other up with machetes in tribal warfare. (In the name of Christ of course.) Do you have your birth certificate ready for the passport people? B-bye now.
Dotty
· 5 months ago
As reported on Keith Obermann, the Major referred to was then refused entry to his defense contractor job and fired, so his lawyer didn't do him many favors. The Pentagon apparently doesn't want employees in sensitive jobs who have issues with the government and the Commander in Chief. Seems reasonable to me.
nellpost
· 5 months ago
In my opinion, cook is a self serving over the hill loser.
pxl
· 5 months ago
the birther bill... another jim crow law wrapped up in a pretty red-white-and-blue bow
palmharbor
· 5 months ago
Does anyone mind that Rush Limbaugh is a love child of Herman Goering? Take a look at Goering's photo and then Rush Limbaugh photo. You can see that they are related and both Goering and Limbaugh have the same body styles...obese. Both smoked cigars....both share Fascist views.
David
· 5 months ago
This is beyond disgusting. Because the man's father is Kenyan and Muslim, the President must necessary be foreign-born? He must necessarily be a man that hates America? How long do we as a country have to suffer this nonsense unless the people stirring it up are neutralized as a viable political and cultural force?
metrowestmike
· 5 months ago
It's all so unbelievable. Do you nutcakes really think that on a faraway island 47 years ago some people in a hospital got together, and decided to lie in unison about some little baby - just in case he became President of the United States? That all of the many people who might be in a position to access records the would prove or disprove Obamas citizenship, are all being quiet together? Maybe, one by one, they are all dying in car accidents or in other mysterious ways, you know - to cover up the conspiracy. Maybe when Osama Bin Ladin was 12, he conspired to put this little boy into the US Presidency to facilitate his take over of the world...there are so many possibilities...but we'll never know the truth, will we. You know why, don't you? I know why. It's because "THEY" don't want us to know. Who is "THEY" you ask. In our crazy conspiratorial glee, we never have figured that out... Maybe Ronald Reagan and Elvis are still alive somewhere orchestrating this whole thing...
Find something real to worry about...
Ryan
· 5 months ago
Oh great...now I'm just waiting for this Osama bin Laden as a 12 year old conspiracy to take hold among these freaks. Someone prove to me right now that Elvis and Reagan aren't behind all of this.
metrowestmike
· 5 months ago
This whole conspiracy thing has Michelle Bachmann written all over it
sasha2009
· 5 months ago
Former Reps. Mickey Edwards (R-Okla.) and Chris Shays (R-Conn.) made the argument that if the Republican-controlled Congress had exhibited greater oversight during former President George W. Bush's time in office, they could have prevented some of the most calamitous results of that administration and even saved thousands of lives.
… Shays argued that had more members of Congress, including Republicans, gone to Iraq and visited Abu Ghraib, prisoner abuses would have come to light sooner.
"That would have alerted the administration to what was happening, the command authority to what was happening and it probably would have saved a 1,000 lives," Shays said.
Shays said the Bush White House abused its powers in a way that resulted in many of the domestic and international problems that have unfolded recently.
"This past Republican Congress hurt this administration by not having some hearings," said the Connecticut Republican. "Had we had hearings it would have nipped those problems in the bud."
Mickey Edwards (R-Okla.) was even more critical.
He mocked members of Congress when it came to flexing their constitutional oversight authority.
In particular, he lamented the House Republican lawmakers' unified opposition to holding hearings to investigate the firing of U.S. Attorneys by the Bush White House.
"One of the most shocking things was when the House voted to hold [Counsel Harriet] Miers and [Chief of Staff Josh] Bolten in contempt because they refused to obey a congressional subpoena," said Edwards.
"Every single member of my party, except for three, walked out. Members of Congress walked out of the chamber rather than stand up as members of Congress so that congressional subpoena (would) be obeyed. Party trumped Constitution."
strangely_enough
· 5 months ago
Unfortunately, far too little and far too late. And, I would suspect someone, if not everyone in the White House knew about Abu Ghraib and the attorneys firings.
Donald
· 5 months ago
I find it most strange that ONLY President Obama needs to prove his citizenship. While all hte other 22 Presidential Candidates don't.
It is more strange that it IS an known fact that John McCain was NOT born in America. Why weren't the birthers up-in-arms about his birth?
Answer: RACISM plain and simple racism. One way or another, we are going to get that n****r out of office.
jeninoh
· 5 months ago
I am all for keeping this "controversy" going... all the proponents look absolutely foolish.
And, for the record johndk7, the fact of the matter is that the Health Department of the state of Hawaii stands by the assertion that Obama was born in Hawaii... that's good enough for me. Not that I was concerned to begin with, but their spokeperson is right... she could drive to your house with 53 pieces of documentation proving it, take you out to lunch to convince you, and you would still throw on your tinfoil hat and claim it was all a scam.
Char316
· 5 months ago
This is so silly because when the President travels abroad he has to have a PASSPORT, which is in a Black Book unlike the Blue Book that a regular citizen has. The state department employees hold the President's PASSPORT for him. So, the Moral to this story is, NO BIRTH CERTIFICATE, NO PASSPORT!!!
B1RD67
· 5 months ago
Did any of these wingnuts questions McGrumpy's birth in Panama?
AdmC
· 5 months ago
Let's play along and pretend Obama was born in THE KREMLIN:
Constitution of the United States, Article II, Section 1, Clause 5: No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.
Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Edition: "Natural born citizen. Persons who are born within the jurisdiction of a national government, i.e. in its territorial limits, or those born of citizens temporarily residing abroad."
George Romney presedential candidate in 1968, born in Chihuahua, Mexico; parents were U.S. citizens so he was a natural born citizen.
John McCain presedential candidate in 2000 and 2008 born in Panama; his father was stationed in the service, also "natural born"
karela
· 5 months ago
Hawaii is a state in the Union. Their legal word is and should be as compelling as that of of New York, California, Texas or Ohio. The state of Hawaii has many times repeated it's certainty of Obama's birth there and his legal citizenship. If the Republican party really cared as much about the rule of law as they claim, instead of about partisan below the belt bashing, they could put this entire thing to rest. All it would take would be a strong statement of Obama's legitimacy that was presented by Republican and Democratic House and Senate leadership and that was signed by the House and Senate Republicans and Democrats. They know that this is ridiculous. Why should the state of Hawaii be treated as though it weren't a "real" state in the United States of America. Since 1959 Hawaii's senators and congressional representatives have been proving their citizenship with Hawaiian birth certificates. This is only a big deal because the President is black and has a funny name. Time for the Congress and Senate of the United States to step up and speak for what they know to be the truth. How about a little patriotism from the elected leaders of the country???
Roger
· 5 months ago
You know, if I were the President, I would be more than happy that these rumors keep going. Even if credible, you have have to realize how "looney" these allegations actually sound to the general public. The republican party is already hard pressed to attract moderates. Having this controversy that sounds to the non-ideological segment of the population as complete craziness only makes the left look more reasonible. Look at it this way... Those who support the president will NEVER give this story a second thought, those inclinded to believe he is not a citizen wouldn't vote for him regardless.. and the vast majority in the middle will more than likely think those promoting this story as "cooks". Unless there is absolute proof he isn't a citizen, which probably doesn't exist 8 mnths into his term... the President wins this one.
grannycarol
· 5 months ago
How much faith in our country and our constitution do "birthers" have that they can honestly believe that someone who was not born in the United States of America can be elected president? I think "birthers" are the most un-American group of people to be ever called un-American.
Lava Lee Pyre
· 5 months ago
OK, 24aheaddotcom: the director of communications for the Hawaii Department of Health has stated on the record that the State of Hawaii verifies the place of birth before it puts it on the COLB. Obama's COLB states he was born in Honolulu, The State of Hawaii verifies the place of birth. That pretty much makes swiss cheese out of most of your theories.
What do you have left? An international conspiracy 40 years in the making? How much time did you waste on this issue? What will you complain about now?
Irish_Wake
· 5 months ago
With all due respect: 1) The original document as released is acceptable evidence in a federal court of law. 2) 'Birthers' do not accept document as evidence. One must either conclude that 'Birthers' do not accept the more common legal, ethical, or intellectual processes/outcomes, or that their goal is to create an atmosphere that makes political discourse impossible.
Why do you assume these people will absorb information and alter their views?
David Weigel
· 5 months ago
I'm at least a little optimistic, because the supposed lack of clarity from Okubo was a central argument by the 24AheadTypes. In our conversation yesterday, she very clearly said that the state has verified that Obama was born in Hawaii.
Lava Lee Pyre
· 5 months ago
You should write a book about this insanity.
GOPtosavethenation
· 5 months ago
is that all the socialists can say, "Anyone who disagrees is nuts. "? If there is nothing to hide why hide it? Why did the dispicable governor of Hawaii not allow any requests for the birth certificate? (ANS: She is a Democrat). Wake up Wendy child born to US military family while overseas is a Natural born US citizen. Does the fact that the President is black mean he can ignore the law? Please get off the race thing! His own aunt said he was born in Kenya and she was there.
Why won't Cheney admit to being gay? I heard from a number of people that he was definitely gay. When is he going to give us the proof that he isn't? His word doesn't mean anything nor does the fact that he's married. I want written proof from a reliable source in the government that he isn't gay. Can you prove he's not? Did you also know that Cheney's maternal grandmother was black? It is hushed up for the conservatives. Can you prove me wrong? And do you think I will believe you?
strangely_enough
· 5 months ago
I'm still waiting for Cheney to give us proof that he's human...
Wayoutwest
· 5 months ago
I think these birthers are not as crazy as they seem. They have an agenda like many others on the right. They can not accept the fact that Obama was elected. All of the effort they put into denying people the vote and manipulating the outcome didn't work and they can not accept the outcome. Disqualifying him is only one of their options. If that fails then a coup is next, many have backed the overthrow of a democratic government in central america. Can they use this as a rational to overthrow this marxist-socialist president? I don't think they will succeed but they may try. Their last option is the most disturbing and dangerous, assassination. This is the reactionary response of cowards and bullies when they can't get their way. We have already seen feeble attempts, luckily Obama is well protected. The murder of the police officers and the people in church was the result of these terrorists inability to hit their real target, Obama.
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
It still boils down to a cut and dried, black and white issue (so to speak). We can all go back and forth with this until doomsday but until a form with more complete information about the "blessed event" is made available to the citizens of the US, this will never go away.
This isn't a conspiracy theory. It is looking like cover-up at very high levels. Really, it is just a widely asked and simple question that needs an answer. And if it is so obviously frivolous, ridiculous and silly, well then why not prove it so and produce the long form BC? We aren't trying to get him to release proof of the existence of Big Foot. We are asking for a copy of the original hospital generated piece of paper that Hawaiian officials claim to have in their vault. Isn't this the very reason why "all 57 states" of the union have adopted a policy of keeping birth records?
Apparently the State of Hawaii has in the past been pretty loose and sloppy with issuing birth records, with little follow-up investigation and even less dedication to accuracy or certifications that their silly rules were followed. Since this COLB of Obama's was allegedly provided by Hawaii to his campaign just last year, he must have been using another copy of it or some other birth record in the past, to get into school, get a passport, get a driver's license, pass a security background check for being a US senator etc. (As the anti-birther's have repeatedly pointed out.) So I'm wondering WHAT DOCUMENT he has been using all this time, what is on it and WHERE it is. It couldn't be this one they have "produced" on the web. It would have to be something much older. So, where do you suppose IT is? Why didn't he just show a copy of that one on his websites? Doesn't anybody else wonder about that? And where is the actual paper copy of this alleged COLB that is repeatedly touted as his proof now? I mean, the one that was supposed to have been scanned, and photographed and posted on his sites. Will any third party document experts ever bee allowed to analyze that one. I doubt it. Very fishy smelling.
Wendy
· 5 months ago
Why don't you just come out and admit that you hate Obama because he is black and cut out all this smoke-screen garbage.
Never bothered any of you to check up on Bush Jr who might not have been born in the US or McCain who was definitely not born in the US (Panama). If you're white, you're A-OK!
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
Hey, they check up on McCain like flies on SH!T. And if you will remember, it was Hillary Clinton and her attorney friend BERG, a Jewish guy with 30 years of membership in the Democratic party that started this whole deal with Obama's citizenship questions. I suppose that one of the main reasons why nobody wanted to check on Obama's eligibility issue is purely BECAUSE HE IS BLACK! It would not have been politically correct to question him too much. Now do you have any intelligent response to the questions in my post above or are you just going to sidestep the argument and call me a "racist"?
marlrat
· 5 months ago
"her attorney friend BERG, a Jewish guy" Psst randwulf...your racism is showing.
bobkat5
· 5 months ago
Obama is not black. He's white. By your logic, if you can call him black because he's half black, I can call him white because he's half white.
I supposed you dont like the outcome of elections. If you were so concerned about election rigging you should have been up in arms about Bush and Florida in 2000 and the Voting Machine Fraud in 2004.
Please stay away from electrical outlets in the future
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
So "factcheck" verified their own forgery. Yeah, that proves it!!! And what the hell this has to do with alleged voter fraud from years ago, is beyond me. Oh and thanks for the electrical safety tip. I know as a left winger, you couldn't resist throwing in at least one little demeaning jab. You guys can't help yourselves in that regard.
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
Wow. Tighten that tin-foil hat JUST a wee bit more.
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
Yadda, Yadda, Yadda,,, Ha Ha Ha, Tin Foil Hat, VERY VERY FUNNY!! You are soooo witty!!! Can't discuss facts but you are great at throwing insults. Discredit the messenger and you discredit the message, right. The entire left-wing argues that way. Just like small children.
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
Let me clear this up: I am saying BOTH that 1) the argument is utter, sheer, treasonous nonsense, and 2) that you're a conspiracy-believing, tin-foil-hat-wearing, knuckle-dragging un-American pinhead. You have chosen to ignore the rule of law of this fine nation, a beacon of democracy to the world, making you an enemy of everything America stands for.
All you need to know is that EVERY COURT THAT HAS EXAMINED ANY OF THIS HORSESHIT HAS COME TO THE SAME CONCLUSION: It's sheer, utter hogwash, and our President needs to do nothing more about it... no school records, no photo of the 'vault copy' of his birth records, NADA.
The Supreme Court of this nation, the same court that decided that Bush won the 2000 election, REFUSED TO EVEN HEAR THE CASE. That means they believed it had no merit whatsoever. Get it? The Chief Justice, a lifelong conservative, swore Mr. Obama in. There's nothing being hidden. No conspiracy. Swamp gas; that's all.
Either accept the hard, provable fact that the President was born in Hawaii, and remain the above-delineated pinhead, or join the sane, law-abiding world.
At that time I would be glad to personally, publicly declare you a non-pinhead, and fully retract my statement.
And as for ad hominem attacks being a "lefty" thing, consider how many wingnuts attack the fact of global warming by pointing out that Al Gore is a doofus.
The Right Wing doesn't have a TOTAL monopoly on ad hominem fallacies, hate-mongering, racism, hypocrisy, immorality, and corruption... but let's just say they have a 'strong position' in the market.
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
HEY F@CK OFF with all your name calling!! Now read this.OK,
The question is "WHY DOESN'T OBAMA HIMSELF AUTHORIZE THE RELEASE OF THE LONG FORM TO SHOW HE IS A NATIVE BORN CITIZEN?" Or any kind of a US citizen for that matter.
This reason he won't is because it will show no place of birth in Honolulu, Hawaii, USA!!! Pretty simple. He was born and bred a KENYAN. Alright?
Further, it is only a matter of time before one, single, federal judge, with some B@LLS, somewhere in one of the many lawsuits working this issue will allow discovery to go forward. And then, we shall see, what we shall see. I already know what we will see. We will see what Mr. Obama has prevented and will continue to try to prevent us seeing at all cost. We will see that he is in no way, shape of form a US citizen. He never was. He is an illegal alien. He will be removed from office. Oh, yeah, BTW, McCain produced all of his records on request. Even his dental records were included.
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
Ah. So you've chosen to remain an America-hating scofflaw conspiracy nut and an official pinhead.
I am saddened by your choice.
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
You know. I'm 54 years old. I registered for the draft when I was 17. I was drafted three days after my 18th birthday. I avoided going into the army by basically joining the Marine Corps. I had in fact already been accepted into one of their commissioning programs prior to being drafted.
I'm an Eagle Scout, university graduate, former USMC officer, holder a master's degree from a major university and a self-employed construction manager for the past 20 years. I have never taken money form the US government for anything other than my scholarship from the Naval ROTC program in which I enrolled to be commissioned upon graduation and the pay I received while on active duty. I don't ask much from government. I expect it to defend our shores, maintain a highway system and leave me and the rest of the citizenry alone. I believe in small government and free enterprise. I do expect my government not to lie or withhold information from me. They are supposed to work for and be responsible to US.
So if that makes me "an American-hating scofflaw conspiracy nut and an official pinhead" well, I plead guilty. I guess I just don't measure up to what the NEW AMERICAN type is supposed to be. But I was saluting the flag and doing my duty, while others were burning and spitting on flags. I was working when others were laying around waiting for their welfare checks. I proudly wore the uniform and followed my orders while others grew out their hair and bad-mouthed their country. Now those people are calling ME "America-hating"? Whatever.
I distinctly remember the Navy requiring me to get them a copy of my original, long-form BC in order to enter my officer training program to become a 2nd Lt. It was a photocopy of the original with a stamp and official's signature on it. Notarized. I still have that in a file with my Honorable Discharge.
I had no misgivings about producing it for the Naval authority since it was required. That is just to be a 2nd Lt. So now I wonder why the Commander in Chief has a problem handing over a copy of his. That should "sadden" you more than my "American-hating" I should think.
neliberal
· 5 months ago
Actually, the military only ever required a raised-seal certified birth certificate. Long or short form, it didn't matter. I used a short form when I enlisted in 1971. They certainly had no problem with it.
Since mine was good enough for DOD, I guess Obama's is good enough, too! From what I just read, the US Supreme Court certainly believes it to be good enough since even Scalia and Thomas have tossed appeals from the Birthers out.
Simple truth is, some on the right are literally incapable of accepting that they could honestly lose an election, so when they lose, they have to invent whole mythologies around the idea that evil people have done something. In 1993, an entire cottage industry grew up around the idea the Clintons were criminal masterminds (murders, drug running, rape, fraud, illegal land deals...on and on and on). We ended up with the Starr Persecution, 8 long years, $70 million taxpayer dollars wasted, hundreds of Federal lawyers and FBI agents digging into peoples lives. And other than the crime Starr himself set up, how much criminal activity did he ever find against Bill or Hillary Clinton? ZIP! In fact, his final report essentially absolves them of any of the crimes the CDS affected crowd accused them of committing.
Now, another Democrat beat a Republican. NO! Can't have that! Can't have happened! Must be something evil at work!!! I know! Let's claim he's really a Muslim...No, he's really a Kenyan! YEAH! He's not a "real" American!!!!
Totally false. Total waste of time. But for the GOP, it has the advantage of (a) keeping the whacky part of the base fired up and contributing, and (b) it distracts and diverts from allowing the President to actually do his job, as we elected him to do!
neliberal
· 5 months ago
The reason he won't show it is it won't make any difference. You and the tinfoil hat wearing brigade will simply declare it another forgery, just as you did with the certified, verified, confirmed Certificate he DID release (the one that clearly states exactly where he was born...and remember, the HI Dept of Health has confirmed the place of birth entered will show foreign locations, for those born outside the U.S.).
You seem to just ignore the TWO contemporaneous birth announcements in Hawaiian papers, which were NOT placed by Obama's family but (as was normally done back then) from a call from the Dept of Health giving birth info on live births the previous days. Incredible planning to get that in papers 48 years ago! You ignore the witness interviewed by the Buffalo News in January who clearly recalls Dr West, a now deceased OBG from Honolulu, talking about Obama's birth in 1961. You seem to belive a 9 months pregnant woman flew from Hawaii to Kenya, had a baby, and returned, all in the space of about 3 days (since witnesses on the street where they lived in Honolulu then have confirmed they remember his very pregnant month leave for the hospital and return just 3 days later with a baby)... You seem to believe something that would have to involved literally hundreds of participants, a massive coverup, including Obama's political opposition...
Ever hear of Occam's Razor?
Brian H.
· 5 months ago
I like the part where you ignore long standing laws and evidence.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
That's awesome. Understated humor is so rare. Good one.
marlrat
· 5 months ago
When YOU have "facts" to discuss, come back. Until then STFU!! All you have are kooky conspiracy theories.
Char316
· 5 months ago
Did you ask all the other Presidents of the United States for their Birth Certificates. This is so ridiculous. You will do anything to try and keep a Black Man down.
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
Actually, it may be Alan Keyes (a Black Man) who will be most instrumental in keeping this "Black man down" by the time it is all said and done. And as far as any of the other presidents are concerned, I don't think there have been any in recent history who had a foreign parent. And why is the constitution "ridiculous"?
marlrat
· 5 months ago
Oh! Alan Keyes! He's someone to look up to and believe! Yeah, right!
neliberal
· 5 months ago
You're not serious!
Couple of nights ago on Lou Dobbs' show (hosted by Pilgrem), the host spent literally 3.5 minutes of a 6.5 minute segment detailing all the evidence that exists that Obama was born in Honolulu in 1961, there is that much of it.
She then asks Keyes, "So what do want the President to do?"
Keyes just looks at her and says "Just present some evidence!"
Everyone else on the show can be heard laughing their butts off, he sounds so stupid! Yeah, push Keyes, and we'll just keep replaying a 3.75 minute video...3.5 minutes of proof Obama is an American, followed by Keyes saying "But I want some evidence!" It makes him look like an idiiot!
mantis
· 5 months ago
This isn't a conspiracy theory.
Yes it is, moron.
It is looking like cover-up at very high levels.
No, it isn't, moron.
And if it is so obviously frivolous, ridiculous and silly, well then why not prove it so and produce the long form BC?
Because the State of Hawaii doesn't do that. They have laws. The laws allow them to issue a COLB. It is verified. They aren't going to change the law because a bunch of deranged lunatics insist they must.
We are asking for a copy of the original hospital generated piece of paper that Hawaiian officials claim to have in their vault.
Too bad. You can't have it. You can't have it for anyone born in the State of Hawaii. You can look at the COLB. That's the law. Deal with it.
Isn't this the very reason why "all 57 states" of the union have adopted a policy of keeping birth records?
No, the states don't keep records to accommodate insane people. That is not the reason.
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
OK, MORE NAME CALLING!! That's wonderful kids! You are all so witty.
That's all fun and stuff but back to the issue. OK?
The question is "WHY DOESN'T OBAMA HIMSELF AUTHORIZE THE RELEASE OF THE LONG FORM TO SHOW HE IS A NATIVE BORN CITIZEN?" Or any kind of a US citizen for that matter.
This reason he won't is because it will show no place of birth in Honolulu, Hawaii, USA!!! Pretty simple. He was born and bred a KENYAN. Alright?
Further, it is only a matter of time before one, single, federal judge, with some B@LLS, somewhere in one of the many lawsuits working this issue will allow discovery to go forward. And then, we shall see, what we shall see. I already know what we will see. We will see what Mr. Obama has prevented and will continue to try to prevent us seeing at all cost. We will see that he is in no way, shape of form a US citizen. He never was. He is an illegal alien. He will be removed from office. Oh, yeah, BTW, McCain produced all of his records on request. Even his dental records were included.
mantis
· 5 months ago
The question is "WHY DOESN'T OBAMA HIMSELF AUTHORIZE THE RELEASE OF THE LONG FORM TO SHOW HE IS A NATIVE BORN CITIZEN?"
Because he can't. He can get a COLB from the state, and already has. That's all they give out.
Tell you what, birthers. You find a Hawaiian around Obama's age, and get that person to go to the Hawaii Department of Health and request their "long form" birth certificate. If they succeed, I'll join in on the call for Obama to request his. Of course, since Hawaii doesn't do that, he/she won't succeed, but I encourage you to give it a try. You can find at least one birther nut in Hawaii, can't you?
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
That's a great idea. I wish I'd read it earlier. I would have passed it off as my own. No, kidding, I'd give credit where it's due.
I made a similar challenge, which was a bit less likely to be accepted. I asked the birthers to present a Hawaiian birth certificate, short form, that says exactly what Obama's says except it would have the birther's name instead of Obama's. So it would say the birther was born in Oahu in 1961, his mom is Stanley Ann Durham, etc.
Since they kept saying that "anyone can get that" form of birth certificate, even those who weren't born there," it seemed fair to me.
But your idea is better. Kudos. And I notice that, unsurprisingly, no birther even responded. Because, as I said, your idea is good and it would expose them as lying racist sacks of shit.
Nonnie
· 5 months ago
You hit the nail on the head! It's a black and white issue! It has been the underlying issue from start on this stupid fake birth certificate theory. I'd love to see the opinions from these "Birthers" if they think a black man should or shouldn't be elected president. I think you'll find the real answer behind their rants.
I believe if President Obama personally took these Birthers by the hand to Hawaii and actually showed them his actual birth certificate that is on file they still wouldn't believe it because that isn't the real reason they'd like to see him out of office.
The Birthers need to face reality. He is a black man, he was elected and he is our President. Get over it.
bobkat5
· 5 months ago
With his white mother and all, isn't Obama just as much white as he is black?
edge
· 5 months ago
But that won't satisfy people will it? It'll be just dismissed as a forgery. I mean the groundwork has already been laid to dismiss any and all additional evidence. So, either you buy into this wrack-job theory, ample evidence has been provided, or you don't and never will because it all be "forged".
face it, at it's base this is a racist argument. Obama does not look like McCain, Bush, Cheney, Gore, Kerry, Clinton, Dole, Bush, Dukakas, Reagan, Carter, Ford, Nixon..., and so he must be a foreigner. Did anyone seriously question the citizenship of any of these candidates? did anyone demand the "long form" "vault copy" or the freaking holy grail? No. Because they where safe looking white guys.
grow the eff up.
Chad S
· 5 months ago
Unfortunately, Obama could present a video of his birth with Don Ho behind his mother confirming that they were in Hawaii and the birthers wouldn't believe it.
space2k
· 5 months ago
I'm really enjoying watching the GOP follow these birther turds right down the toilet.
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
Spend a lot of time playing with your toilet?
VoteDem
· 5 months ago
Well, I guess they've run out of substantive things to criticize the President on.
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
How about this? He thinks there are 57 states in the Union.
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
Jeez... if you believe that, I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you.
gregoryj
· 5 months ago
Hi grannycarol, fabulous friday to you, I do like your straight to the point comment, and it is so true to call them UN-AMERICAN in their attitudes. In a time when so much is needed to heal and bring us back to a Nation of Respectability and Morals, they would rather try to beat us down for being right. have a nice day
gregoryj
· 5 months ago
This issue is so funny ti makes saturday night live and Tina Fey and the entire cast look like real amateurs. Are the Birthers asking us to believe that the entire Congress, the Supreme Court Justices and so many learned American of Distinction are that naive and stupid as to not have inquired and investigated this issue for a long time now?
As one of the comments suggests, there is no way that you or anyone can make the Birthers accept and believe that our Legally Elected President, Baarak Obama is a NATURAL BORN US CITIZEN.
So I would like to suggest that Maj. Stefan F. Cook, a reservist who volunteered for duty in Afghanistan, and then decided that he would not like to to serve in that capoacity anymore, be Unceremoniously and Dishonourably be Stripped of his rank and casahiered out as just rewards from the Military that he has just disgraced with his action.
conservetheconst
· 5 months ago
Then why didn't they do that? Why didn't they just kick him out and come up with the birth certificate? Doesn't it make you wonder? If they had proof, whouldn't they just show it already and shut everyone up?
mantis
· 5 months ago
They already did, you moron. The State of Hawaii issues one type of birth certificate, the COLB. That's it. That's all you can get. It's verified by the state, indeed the Hawaii Department of Health is on record numerous times stating the COLB is legit, and he was born in Honolulu. There's nothing more anyone can do without changing the laws in Hawaii, which no one is going to do simply because a group of deranged birthers demand it.
conservetheconst
· 5 months ago
Then why wasn't he discharged for refusing to go unless his charges were valid?
AdmC
· 5 months ago
Cook obtained an attorney beforehand, arranged this volunteer assignment just so he could obtain standing to file suit
it is all a stunt to get into court
I guess he wants to be famous--and he no is famous -- but as one big idiot
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
I think Oily Taints should provide copies of her Law Degree.
dtrott
· 5 months ago
These guys aren't well. But it's good to see that the wingnut psychos are spending so much time, effort and energy on this important issue now facing our republic.
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
Yep. Don't you love these clods spending their hard-earned money on Birth Certificate billboards?
Hilarious!
Greg H
· 5 months ago
Don't these people realize that it doesnt matter where Pres. Obama was born anyway? His mom was an american citizen at the time of his birth, that automatically makes him a natural US citizen. Period. End of Discussion.
Brian H.
· 5 months ago
You do realize that the rule for Presidential Candidacy is worded as "Natural Born Citizen?"
I firmly believe Obama meets this, but get your facts straight.
dragonlady52
· 5 months ago
The definition of "natural born citizen" includes someone who is born to an American citizen anywhere in the world. I learned this in second grade. I am amazed at how many people don't know this. Basic civics seems to be missing in today's educational curriculum.
AdmC
· 5 months ago
speaking of "facts," learn what "natural born" means--children born abroad of US citizens are considered "natural born"
this is settled law, legal precedent and is in Black's legal dictionary
lynnnoe
· 5 months ago
What if this means without surgical intervention? What if it means without anesthesia of any kind? What if it means at home in your own bed. Please.
What do you think it means??? It means he was born the child of at least one citizen of the USA - nothing more, nothing less.
logicprobe
· 5 months ago
"the campaign reproduced a Certificate of Live Birth from the state’s Health Department"
No, the campaign actually produced a CERTIFICATION of Live Birth, which is not the same thing. A real CERTIFICATE of Live Birth has the signature of the physician who delivered the baby and the signature of the person who reported the birth information (baby's name, parents, etc.)
Personally, I believe Obama was born in Hawaii, and there's something embarassing on the full Certificate of Live Birth that he wants to keep private.
homogenius
· 5 months ago
Wrong again. The campaign produced a certified copy of Obama's birth certificate. This is the same thing I have from the State of California that I used to obtain my passport. It is what Obama used to obtain his passport and security clearance as a Senator.
This is the only thing that is available from the State of Hawaii. The top officials in Hawaii have stated publicly that the certified copy that Obama provided is the real thing. The so-called "long form" original is a state record and under state law cannot be made available to the public.
In order for the certified copy to be faked, multiple officials in the State of Hawaii would have to be involved in a massive conspiracy.
But the bottom line is this: No matter how much evidence is provided, or how many assurances from Hawaii state officials, the birthers are never going to believe that he is a citizen.
karela
· 5 months ago
Yeah, it would take a mass conspiracy-----that goes back to the time of his birth when his birth announcement was published in the Honolulu newspaper. And then of course there are the friends and relatives who knew him as a kid in Hawaii, the pictures taken there with his family when he was a little kid, the friends of his mother's who remember what a cute baby he was when he was born. But you're right, crazy people don't care about proof.
Chad S
· 5 months ago
The birther brain donors also think that there's no proof that Obama was in the US until 2007. Logic, reason and facts are wasted on them.
logicprobe
· 5 months ago
"The so-called "long form" original is a state record and under state law cannot be made available to the public."
It can't be made available to the public, but an individual person can get a copy of his/her own "long form" birth certificate. I ordered one from the Department of Health where I was born so I could get a passport a few years ago. It has all sorts of information, including both parents' birthdates, etc.
mantis
· 5 months ago
Personally, I believe Obama was born in Hawaii, and there's something embarassing on the full Certificate of Live Birth that he wants to keep private.
Personally, I believe you are an idiot who hasn't a clue what he/she is talking about. The certificate the state issued is the only one they issue. There are no others to be had. Deal with it.
Wendy
· 5 months ago
The certificate produced by Obama is the only certificate Hawaii produces. My son was born in Hawaii, and his birth certificate is just like the one Obama produced, which was authenticated by the state. Time to move on, fellas. This horse, she is dead.
logicprobe
· 5 months ago
"The certificate produced by Obama is the only certificate Hawaii produces."
Oh really? Then I guess the Department of Hawaiian Home Lands is lying when it says:
"The Department of Hawaiian Home Lands accepts both Certificates of Live Birth (original birth certificate) and Certifications of Live Birth because they are official government records documenting an individual’s birth."
AdmC
· 5 months ago
you are thinking of the novelty certificates--like the one I have that even has my baby footprints on it
not valid for the top secret clearance I had years ago--I had to get the one similar the O has posted to get the security clearance as well as my passport--that is the "real deal" the only valid one you can obtain from the government for legal purposes
now why are we not asking about every other politician's birth certificates? How do we know where they were REALLY born and what THEY are HIDING?
could it be the color of Obam's skin?
logicprobe
· 5 months ago
"you are thinking of the novelty certificates--like the one I have that even has my baby footprints on it"
No, I am thinking of an official goverment document. Generally it's a scan of the actual paper form filled out by the attending physician at the time of birth. The Department of Hawaiian Home Lands web site refers to the two types:
"The Department of Hawaiian Home Lands accepts both Certificates of Live Birth (original birth certificate) and Certifications of Live Birth because they are official government records documenting an individual’s birth."
B1RD67
· 5 months ago
"Personally, I believe Obama was born in Hawaii, and there's something embarassing on the full Certificate of Live Birth that he wants to keep private."
Something embarrasing huh... oh, I know, maybe it says that he's black!. Assprobe would be a more approriate screename because you wouldn't know logic if it bit you on your ass!
logicprobe
· 5 months ago
"Something embarrasing huh... oh, I know, maybe it says that he's black!."
Actually, that information is on the "short form" which has been widely published. It says, "Father's Race: African".
"Assprobe would be a more approriate screename"
Pretty lame ad hominem. Try again, after some fact checking, okay?
slimslowslider
· 5 months ago
factcheck is in the pocket of the Messiah!!!111 dont you know???? AFRICAN ZOMG!!!!
dragonlady52
· 5 months ago
Obama's mother was an American citizen. That makes Obama an American citizen no matter WHERE he was born. Every schoolchild knows this (at least I learned it in grade school-I have no idea what they're teaching now). SInce Obama's birth certificate is in the public record this idiotic questioning is beyond ridiculous-it can only be construed as an attempt to divide and conquer. I find it reprehensible that the neocons are doing whatever they can to be obstructionist at a time when the need for unity is urgent if we are to solve the pressing problems the we are facing. It seems they would see they would rather see the country go down the tubes thna relinquish one iota of power. And why is there never any mention of the fact that John McCain was born in Panama?
Bob
· 5 months ago
Well they obviously taught you wrong in school. In 1961 , the law stated that she had to have spent 5 years living in the US after the age of 14 in order to pass on US citizenship to a child born out of the US.. She was 18 when he was born. Thus, she did not meet the criteria to pass on US citizenship. So you are WRONG when you say he is a citizen no matter where he was born. He is only a citizen if he was born in the US
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Bob, it's a damned good thing he was born in Hawaii, then, huh?
Either way, the President is a black guy. Hooray!
twosurfside
· 5 months ago
No, there are plenty of substantive things on which to criticize the President. Have you actually read the healthcare bill? Here it is: www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h3200/text
I've pasted an important section below that you must read to truly understand what the bill intends:
**************************************************************************************** SEC. 102. PROTECTING THE CHOICE TO KEEP CURRENT COVERAGE. (a) Grandfathered Health Insurance Coverage Defined- Subject to the succeeding provisions of this section, for purposes of establishing acceptable coverage under this division, the term ‘grandfathered health insurance coverage’ means individual health insurance coverage that is offered and in force and effect before the first day of Y1 if the following conditions are met: (1) LIMITATION ON NEW ENROLLMENT- 5 (A) IN GENERAL- Except as provided in this paragraph, the individual health insurance issuer offering such coverage does not enroll any individual in such coverage if the first effective date of coverage is on or after the first day of Y1. ****************************************************************************************
The title in disingeneous and misleading at best. The words matter here. Yes the President did say that you can keep your current coverage, but what he failed to mention is that your current coverage will be the last private coverage you will ever have. What the bill language above actually means when you decypher the legal terminology is: on the day the law goes into effect you cannot enroll in any new private insurance. Sure, you can keep your existing policy (it's grandfathered in), but if you change jobs or want a different policy after the law in in force, your only option will be the government plan, no private options will be legal. Over time, this relegates everyone to the government plan and completely removes your choice of a private plan. It also will eliminate the private insurance sector altogether. How many jobs will that "save"?
So to give some people a government option that don't have insurance now, Obama is willing force everyone (200 million people) into a government run plan. This is not freedom of choice, it's a trojan horse meant only to centralize control. This is not about party, it's about basic freedom of choice.
This is only on page 16, I wonder what we will find after reading the entire bill.
Greg H
· 5 months ago
Nope. First off, this isn't Obama's bill, this is Congresses' specifically I believe you are looking at the House of Representatives proposed bill.
Secondly, no, you do not understand what that means, what that means is that any new private insurance oyu buy will have to be under the rules established by this bill, ie being portable, and all the other new rules for how private insurancce operates.
You are hitting on the grandfather clause saying that no currently existing plan will be changed for those currently on it and then assuming, completely erroneously, that that means that you wont be able to buy a private plan ever again unless you are grandfathered in. That is just stupidly misreading the bill, either out of ignorance of the style of how such legal docs are written, purposeful misrepresentation, or idiocy.
twosurfside
· 5 months ago
You're right. Obama did not right the bill, but no President does. All bills start in the House, but he will sign it; making it ultimately his decision whether it becomes law and thereby making his law in the end.
Where is the portabilty clause? I could not find one. I also could not find where accessibility to new private insurance is provided. Please let me know where it is when you find it. As I said before this is not party politics to me. If you can show me the language in the bill, I will defer.
By the way, the grandfather clause only means that you can keep what you have. But even if you have an existing policy, you will not be able to change it later (i.e.: when you change jobs or want a different private policy). The grandfather clause does not allow to get a different private policy just because you have a policy now. That's the point that I am trying to make. Through attrition, private insurance will go away altogether over time, as people change jobs, get laid off, etc.; leaving the government plan as the only available option.
strangely_enough
· 5 months ago
"Through attrition, private insurance will go away altogether over time, as people change jobs, get laid off, etc.; leaving the government plan as the only available option." You say that like it's a bad thing not to get ripped off by insurance companies...
twosurfside
· 5 months ago
So you actively support something that will remove any possibility for freedom of choice? And, you would be truly be satisfied with the government controlling yet another aspect of your life? Name one aspect of your life that the government does a better job of managing than you can do yourself?
stephenperry
· 4 months ago
Healthcare.
Next.
edge
· 5 months ago
Out of context.
But, this is a standard tactic nowadays: pull a small part out of something and make the entire issue about it, devoid of the rest of the content. It is disingenuous, lazy and intellectually dishonest.
Sanity, not Hannity
· 5 months ago
What a bunch of whack jobs. Add them to the list of "Area 51" lunatics, holocaust deniers, and others with a tenuous -- if any -- connection to reality.
I expect a spike in "moon landing fraud" flat earthers given the attention to the 40 year anniversary of the Apollo 11 on the 19th...
edweirdness
· 5 months ago
So, what is the problem with President Obama providing a copy of his birth certificate for scrutiny? It seems like a perfectly reasonable request considering the man is restructuring our economy. It's little short of irresponsible for President Obama to continue to allow this corrosive speculation to continue if he has the simple ability to put the issue to rest once and for all. His refusal to take this simple, prudent, responsible action only fuels speculation that something isn't right. Indeed, if that ultimately proves to be the case, he and all involved should be brought up on charges of treason. You do realize that we went to war in Iraq because the bizarre egotist Sadam Hussein refused to provide proof or allow demonstration through investigation that no WMD's existed. One can only speculate what might have been if Iraq's leader had simply complied with a reasonable inquiry, and allowed inspectors access.
AdmC
· 5 months ago
HE DOES NOT NEED TO--HE IS A NATURAL BORN NO MATTER WHERE HE WAS BORN
WHY DO YOU NEED TO SEE IT?
Fred Harris
· 5 months ago
Because I would like to see it. It interests me.
Jwm
· 5 months ago
Then go get it yourself. Just because I want something doesn't mean it has to be provided. Go get it yourself.
Greg H
· 5 months ago
HE DID PROVIDE THE STUPID THING. Ed, have you paid attention to any of the comments or the original article or anything else. The actual real birth certificate issued to him/his mother by the state of Hawai'i has been provided repeatedly upon request and is available online. He isn't actually restructuring our economy, he is doing very little to the structure of our economy (unfortunately, given that our economy has been broken since Nixon and in worse need of restructuring than GM), and it doesnt matter where he was born, his mom was a US citizen at the time of his birth, making him automatically a natural born US citizen regardless of where he was born. Barack Obama's mom could have given birth to him in mexico, bali, mars, jupiter, alpha century or the andromeda galaxy and so long as she was a US citizen, he is too, from birth. Like Romney and McCain.
AdmC
· 5 months ago
BTW, Saddam DID ALLOW access and the inspectors found NO WMDs
I suppose you didn't read THOSE reports EITHER?
Boy, you do tend to ignore evidence all around you!
edge
· 5 months ago
RTFA: "the (Obama)campaign (re)produced a Certificate of Live Birth from the state’s (Hawaii) Health Department"
Terry
· 5 months ago
A "Certificate of Live Birth" is NOT the long-form birth certificate (the real document at issue).
Why won't 0bama simply do the right thing and provide it? Where there's smoke...
cjk002
· 5 months ago
Because he doesn't have to. He has provided all of the documentation required to prove his birth in any court of law.
strangely_enough
· 5 months ago
"You do realize that we went to war in Iraq because the bizarre egotist Sadam Hussein refused to provide proof or allow demonstration through investigation that no WMD's existed."
You do realize that Iraq did provide that information, corroborated by UNMOVIC, and that there were inspectors on the ground also confirming that, when Bush told them to get out of the country because he was about to bomb it, right? Are you seriously saying that there were no inspectors in Iraq? Seriously?
twosurfside
· 5 months ago
You're right. The birth issue only distracts from the real issues at hand. Those complaining about the distraction, please read and comment on the healthcare bill post below. That is a real issue that must be understood. Unless you really want the government as your ONLY healthcare option, then your support for Obama has been hijacked for an agenda of which you may not be aware.
edge
· 5 months ago
yet, the healthcare bill says nothing about the government being the sole provider of healthcare.
Here is the section to which I am referring. All current issuers (i.e.: all current private insurance companies) will NOT be allowed to write new policies when the law goes into effect. Think it through. What option does that leave for you?
**************************************************************************************** SEC. 102. PROTECTING THE CHOICE TO KEEP CURRENT COVERAGE. (a) Grandfathered Health Insurance Coverage Defined- Subject to the succeeding provisions of this section, for purposes of establishing acceptable coverage under this division, the term ‘grandfathered health insurance coverage’ means individual health insurance coverage that is offered and in force and effect before the first day of Y1 if the following conditions are met: (1) LIMITATION ON NEW ENROLLMENT- 5 (A) IN GENERAL- Except as provided in this paragraph, the individual health insurance issuer offering such coverage does not enroll any individual in such coverage if the first effective date of coverage is on or after the first day of Y1. ****************************************************************************************
Greg H
· 5 months ago
Nice way of conveniently not posting the entirety of the section. It says "Except as provided in this paragraph" and then you ignore said paragraph. Also you seemingly ignore the fact that this is disussing buying it outside of any plan, just you as an individual going and buying it, something which a very tiny percentage do. With an employer mandate, even fewer will. So you don't include the exemptions and you ignore a crucial point. As I said either intellectual dishonesty, ignorance or outright idiocy.
twosurfside
· 5 months ago
"Except in this paragraph" refers to the grandfather clause (a); meaning existing policies can remain in force. "(A) IN GENERAL" refers to all new policies, stating that the issuer cannot issue new policies; meaning that you will not have the choice to get a private private policy after the law is in force, because the issuers (insurance companies) will not be allowed to issue a policy to you.
I also posted the link to the entire bill to prove that my excerpt was not doctored or taken out of context. Please read it before you comment.
Look, this is not a matter of party politics for me. It has to do with the freedom of choice that I (and all Americans) should except. If you want to enroll in a government plan, that's your choice. But don't try to force me to enroll too.
Greg H
· 5 months ago
Re: Brian H
Yes I am fully aware, hence the fact that he was born to a US citizen making him quite properly a Natural Born US Citizen and acceptable from a legal standpoint as president without it mattering where on earth he was born. Hence McCain being born in Panama being all a ok, hence the children of US businessmen doing business out of the country still counting as natural born citizens. I was born in london, england, I technically could claim UK citizenship, but as far as any government is concerned I am, and always have been, a US citizen, from birth.
mobedda
· 5 months ago
I suppose it makes me an elitist to be so offended by counterfactual thought, but if that's what I have to put up with, so be it.
thinkwell
· 5 months ago
Who is this guy, anyway?
Regarding the digital COLB, an online image is easily altered and is meaningless as real evidence (legally it is hearsay). As far as I know, no court, judge or government official responsible for certifying the candidates or the election has ever actually touched or seen an official State copy of either 0bama's COLB or the original long form BC (which, by the way, he claims in his autobiography to have found while in high school - so why doesn't he show it?).
In the minority of States that even required it at all, 0bama's vetting consisted of Pelosi (as party head) and 0bama signing a statement that the candidate met all necessary qualifications. No state or impartial government official has ever done any actual checking or verification. 0bama, as an employee of We the People, has a responsibility to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that he is a Natural born citizen. Right now, the number of people who are coming to have serious doubts about 0bama's bona fides hovers around 50 percent and is growing by leaps and bounds every day.
If he were to open up his records to the same degree as have prior candidates (for example, McCain), then most people would be satisfied and all this would stop (one way or the other). :)
Of course, since he's been so secretive to date, he would need to be extra transparent about the process (hey, didn't somebody somewhere promise just that?). For example, he could call in impartial neutral experts (perhaps from both sides) such that they could examine and verify his original vault birth certificate, his missing school records, adoption records, passport applications and any other records that may directly relate to his Natural born citizenship status. Further he would probably have to direct the SCOTUS to rule on the definition of Natural born citizen (because he was born with dual allegiance and dual citizenship due to his foreign father).
This list is perhaps a little longer than normal, but he has a background that is more than a little weirder than normal and he has been more than a little more secretive than normal, so this is to be expected.
If he took the bull (so to speak - you 0bama supporters should like that) by the horns and actively and openly faced all these doubts head on AND his qualifications actually survived (like all past Presidents surely would have), then no one could reasonably question his legitimacy again. Anything less, and this cancer of doubt will continue to grow unchecked to the detriment of all.
Think well -- see clearly.
edge
· 5 months ago
No.. because the groundwork has been laid to deny any additional evidence. People have already stated anything now produced would be a forgery. None of the other candidates have produced a "vault copy long form", there is no "like all past Presidents surely would have". indeed this is all at it's base an attack based on looks. No one else running for president has been asked these questions. Did you ask it of Bush, perhaps Barb gave birth while out of the country? Clinton? perhaps his mom skipped down to Mexico? Bush Sr? His dad and mom did do a lot of overseas travel. Reagan?
grow up
dragonlady52
· 5 months ago
Following your logic the citizenship of everyone in government-and everyone else, for that matter-is open to question. It isn't likely that any kind of conditions would satisfy the perpetrators of this distraction since most, if not all, don't believe in its substance themselves.
Milly Bloom
· 5 months ago
Do you not think that Hillary Clinton would have found and used any evidence in the primaries that would delegitimize her major rival for the White House? There are many pressing issues that need attention, but this is not one of them.
patience
· 5 months ago
Dimwit - The FBI does the background check on the POTUS, not Nancy Pelosi.
trueblue
· 5 months ago
Ah right - ignoring a moron means the moron must be right? lol
ben guthrie
· 5 months ago
Actually it doesn't matter where he was born. One is "native born" if at least one of your parents is a US citizen at the time of your birth. For instance, George Romney ( Mitt's father ) who also ran for the republican nomination was born in Mexico City. no problem, his parents were US citizens.
the distinction is between "native born", that is by circumstances of birth, and "naturalized" ( like Arnold )
mp266
· 5 months ago
Where were you all before the elections? Don't you all have anything else better to do for the American citizens?
ldyforce6
· 5 months ago
I want to see RUSH, Hannity, et.al.'s Birth Certificates! I want them all to go through the same scrutiny that Obama has had to go through and have people dog them!
This is ridiculous.
First of all, the birth certificate IS legitmate if it comes form the STATE of Hawaii's department of statiscs. Many have had to get "copies" of thier birth certificates to get Passports, etc since it IS difficult to keep track of the orignal for MANY people expecially when you move a lot.
Secondly, WHY would his parents have felt the need to do anything when he was born to perpetuate such a "farce". Did they know he would grow up to be a politician.
And, finally, there are copies to be found in TWO NEWSPAPERS announcing his birth! Are THEY are in on all this as well!
Too bad these people didn't care about George Bush's military record (or lack there of) as they are on this nonsense. IF that had been dogged as much, perhaps, we would not be in the mess we are right now in this country.
Danae777
· 5 months ago
Sorry, but having been born in Hawaii, I can tell you for certain that ANY child regardless of where they were born could get a Hawaii Certificate of Live Birth. Maya, Obama's sister has a Hawaii COLB even though she was born in Indonesia. Things in Hawaii were pretty loose back then. Still are. That being said, that COLB is NOT evidence that Obama was born in Hawaii. Only the LONG FORM would be, and I am betting that it lists a home address for place of birth, which is how any child could get a COLB in Hawaii. I know that for certain, because my Long form has a place to use a street address for place of birth, all you need to do is have a "witness" sign it as well. I was born in Queens Hospita, and because of that I have a Dr..'s name on it as well.
Obama's will too. IF he has one that lists a hospital, which Iagain, I am betting it DOES NOT.
OWN it, you Democrats didn't vet your Candidate, and now we have a POTUS that may not even be qualified, and is resisting PROVING that he is to the tune of 1 MILLION bucks!!!
Hello! That alone STINKS to high heaven. A Long Form Certificate would be SO much cheaper! Don't you think?
Ryan
· 5 months ago
this is moronic tripe. where do you folks come from?
cjk002
· 5 months ago
Maybe you should read the article. The Hawaii official who was qouted said that yes, you can get a COLB from Hawaii if you were born somewhere else, but You CANNOT get a COLB that says you were born in Hawaii if you were born somewhere else.
This is a perfect example of just how uninformed and nutty you birthers are. You take one fact (that anyone can get a COLB from Hawaii) and omit the information that would put that fact in the proper context (That the COLB can only state that you were born in Hawaii if you were in fact born in Hawaii).
This is why Obama is ignoring you, you aren't in posession of the facts, and you choose to believe only what you want to believe, and most of what you believe is completely made up.
slimslowslider
· 5 months ago
Where is the proof for this claim "resisting PROVING that he is to the tune of 1 MILLION bucks!!!"?
FreakOfNurture
· 5 months ago
Even entertaining your deranged argument for a moment, how could that possibly make him unqualified? It wouldn't lessen the experience he has had and his education and being a constitutional freakin law professor.
Do you really think that because dumbya was from Connecticut that he was actually QUALIFIED???
Where did this theory even come from to begin with???
Danae777
· 5 months ago
Ever read the constitution? Maybe you SHOULD instead of believing what your sheepherders tell you.
As for OholyO, he should put up the document or RESIGN.
truthmatterz
· 5 months ago
Obama's sister does have an Hawaii COLB even though she was born in Indonesia, however the certificate does state that she was born in Indonesia and there are no newspaper archives announcing her birth in Hawaii, like there was for Obama.
Unless of course, Obama's mother was planning for him to to become President nearly 50 years later, and she thought he would need to prove that he was born somewhere, so she somehow managed to get the Doctors and the hospital in Hawaii as well as the Hawaiian newspapers to record his birth. Wow, so many people involved in this enormous scheme just so a non-white man could lead the U.S. Imagine? Well, I guess if they are all they smart and capable then they deserve it. After all, the conservatives have scared off any intelligent Republicons out of their party. I would rather have something that was hatched lead the country than the whacko's who are in charge of the new Republicon party..
Danae777
· 5 months ago
Look, for 45 bucks he can get his long form Certificate and the matter is OVER. Only in liberal land is 45$>1,000,000$. Instead he is fighting it in COURT? WHY? Just produce the documentation! Isn't that a WHOLE lot easier? I mean he said in his book he had them right, so why not produce the Long form?
Because he CAN'T. The Army REVOKED Major Cook's orders instead of producing the documents. Such a SIMPLE thing, unless you don't have any, or are honestly NOT a natural Born Citizen.
Pony up the paper Usurper Obama.
Ryan
· 5 months ago
putting it in CAPS makes it more true.
slimslowslider
· 5 months ago
the birfers are huge fans of the CAPZ LOCK POSSE!!!
Greg H
· 5 months ago
Becuase there IS no such thing as a "long form certificate" available from the state of Hawai'i? Because he hasnt spent any money fighting it in court, these things get thrown out before they reach that part. Because he was born to a US citizen so this entire discussion is pointless, doesnt matter where on earth (or even if he wasnt born on earth) so long as a parent was a US citizen. Because the army's officer corps isnt exactly an "unbiased" group of people politically (i think it is 70% republican, last time I heard numbers quoted, compared to the like 19% of the actual general population) Because the army is allowing his orders to be revoked so the man can have his day in court and therefore is just following proper procedure.
Because you are an idiot who cannot stand the fact that democracy works and your hypocritical, criminal and downright unamerican candidate/party lost. Deal with it, it happens. Now go and try to win an election over this issue. It will make Alf Landon, Barry Goldwater, Walter Mondale and George McGovern look like they were competitive.
Dessert39
· 5 months ago
You are mistaken about the Army part. Since Major Cook's enlistment was voluntary (in May) he had a certain amount of time to change his mind. Since he changed his mind (yeah, right) a month later, the Army automatically rescinded his orders. This was all staged by Major Cook and the attorney to bring this idiotic issue into the press again. That is why the case was dismissed yesterday. The fact that the Army had already rescinded the deployment based on Major Cook's request rendered the lawsuit moot!!
patience
· 5 months ago
He has already provided the only certificate that Hawaii gives it's citizens AND there are birth announcements, produced from both major HI newspapers, where his birth was announced in 1961.
Please provide a link that explains where Obama is fighting an order to produce anything in court. Crazy birthers are going to court to try to get the court to make Obama provide something he already has provided.
The army revoked major Cook's order because he is a NATIONAL GUARD VOLUNTEER, and as such, has the right to chose not to be deployed.
Danae777
· 5 months ago
I could get my Long form if I needed it. I know, I called the HDH and asked.
Danae777
· 5 months ago
As all reservists are. How many reservists are there and what percentage of US forces are they? Yea, and if a significant number of them ALSO question Obama's legitimacy, then that is a BIG problem. If NOTHING else, that issue has to be cleared up.
trueblue
· 5 months ago
Gosh - wish should just give in and admit - YES - OBAMA is secretly in cahoots to thwart your search! there does that make you feel better? what? no? a new paranoia - geez louise - start taking your meds on a regular basis guy!
BrooklynGirl
· 5 months ago
Did it occur to you that every court in the land that's thus far rejected the lawsuits over Obama's birth certificate has the legal right to demand an authentic birth certificate from Hawaiian officials? Or are you trying to now implicate the justice system in your 45 year old conspiracy theory to elect the first African American president? Poor baby...you assume that this country would stay racist enough to reject such a possibility. But in reality...you're the minority. Disgusting and marginalized!
Name
· 5 months ago
The law states the following
"If only one parent is a U.S. Citizen at the time of ones birth, that parent must have resided in the United States for minimum ten years, five of which must be after the age of 16"
O's father was not a U.S. citizen. While O's mother was a citizen she does not pass that test since she was 18 when O was born. She CANNOT pass her citizenship on to him.
Therefore it becomes of crucial importance whether or not O was born in the U.S. or outside the U.S. If he was born outside the U.S. he is not a citizen.
The birth certificate would prove the issue once and for all. All O has to do to shut everyone up is the call upon Hawaii to release all his birth records. He has not done that and as a result that leads to suspicion.
Name
· 5 months ago
p.s. The "certification of live birth" was released electronically and did not come from Hawaii but from a campaign staffer. Furthermore that is a different document than an actual "birth certificate" which shows things like which hospital he was born in and the name of the doctor that delivered him.
madmainer
· 5 months ago
It is the same certificate released for all Hawaii residents. Hawaii officials at the highest level of state government have certified that this certificate is accurate and authentic.
Keep ignoring the facts... It is the only way you can sustain your argument.
Danae777
· 5 months ago
Sure, the Certificate is valid. It does NOT prove he was born in Hawaii. The long form WILL if it shows that he was born in hospital. If there is a street address listed for his birth, then it is quite possible he was born somewhere else.
The long form CAN be gotten. It would be EASY for him to get it, they could have it printed out 2 minutes after getting the request! It would settle EVERYTHING. Why isn't he doing that? Thats by FAR the easiest thing to do. But he refuses. WHY? Everyone should be asking this, and Democrats ought to be pissed as HELL that the party didn't do this for them already! Democrats, more than anyone else, got seriously ripped off, and if I were you guys, I would be demanding it as well! If only because if he isn't Natural Born, then he defrauded all of you and he OWES you on that score!
evilcompassion
· 5 months ago
Not only is Obama foreign born - he's from MARS! MARS I TELL YOU! He's an Alien! And he can dribble AND shoot. Believe it! And his fingers are like... like... duck fingers. And, and, and he's African-Martian, that's it. African-Martian! Do you hear me? Do you understand? Do you care? Good Lord people wake up! Do you not know what he's capable of? DO YOU!!!??? He could... he could... preside. Preside over us. As... a... president, like. Yeah, that's it; as a president would. He'd do things like address a failing economy, crazy stuff. If we let him. Propose health care reform... yeah, sinister stuff like that. He's a commie too! And a socialist and a fascist and a Michael Jackson wannabe. That.
He's, he's, black I tell you! Black!
The fruit cakes on the right are hereby officially notified that the above was typed in jest - lest you be tempted to cut and paste somewhere.
Ryan
· 5 months ago
find something different to be crazy about.
madmainer
· 5 months ago
It would resolve nothing for the Birthers, just give them more information to question.
Is the doctor alive? dead? Did he forge his name? How many calls do you think this doctor would receive from Birthers?
Birthers would ask for records concerning the address... Is there any proof Obama actually LIVED there... on and on...
No producing that document would do nothing to the Birther movement except provide more ways to try and question his legitimacy.
The simple fact is that HE was vetted and is now sworn in. The burden of proof now resides with you Birthers. He does not have to in any way facilitate your investigation. If you have no proof then you have no argument.
Please provide physical evidence that Obama is not a natural born citizen... Until such time that you can... you really have no reason to utter another word on the matter. Everything at this point the Birthers say is conjecture and meaningless.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
OK DIMWAD you say you are from Hawaii, you could get your "Long Form" if you needed it, get it! Post it on the internet back up your BS retard. I am so sick of you clown ass redneck heathens with this. The President has hid nothing! Even World Nut Daily seen it reported on it as being REAL!! But YET somehow you REICHWING retards with the VULCAN MIND MELD capablities swear up and down we are wrong. BACK UP YOU BS OR STFU PERIOD!!
bobkat5
· 5 months ago
This eligibility controversy is going to be a HUGE campaign issue in 2012. Obama's long form BC, his school records, his state senate records, and all other records must be produced with full transparency to lay this matter to rest now.
Greg H
· 5 months ago
I only hope that is true, we will beat the republican'ts by the largest margin in history if they think they can get traction arguing what is essentially a Bircher position. (yes I did mean Bircher not Birther, anyone not in the know that is a referrence to the Birch Society a bunch of nutters who think floride is a communist conspiracy and McCarthy was right)
BrooklynGirl
· 5 months ago
Well the other faux controversies worked so well last fall why not give the birth certificate BS a whirl??? What more can anyone expect for the insanity of the Republican party than to try the same things over and over again expecting a different result?
Keith Pollard
· 5 months ago
Here is some facts, the Maj. who is obviously a coward, tried to use this stupid certificate reason to hide his sissy position. Now that he is also out of his contractor job, he can hide under his bed until the war is over.
Danae777
· 5 months ago
Consider this for a moment, If Obama isn't a legitimate President, then the Major is not only correct and doing his duty, he is a hero. The Military is in the middle now, with only a thin veneer of having a legal chain of command. If any other soldiers do this, they can expect to also have their orders revoked. Now imagine for a moment if the numbers of those soldiers goes up to say, 1000, or 3000, entire Reserve units... yea, This is a serious issue.
Obama ONLY needs to provide a long form birth certificate! And its EASY to get! But he refuses? Why on earth refuse something SO SIMPLE?? Because either he can't, or it proves he is not a Natural Born Citizen.
cramflow
· 5 months ago
But if the state of Hawaii has falsified the COLB, then why wouldn't they falsify the long form birth certificate? What would it prove? If it were released, showing Obama to be a citizen, you would all just cry that it was false.
Roger
· 5 months ago
Because the whole controversy makes the right look like loonitics. I'm not judging anyone, but the only people that give this story even the slightest of credibility is the FAR right. Dems are more than happy to have the right champion a cause that make u "LOOK" crazy.
Greg H
· 5 months ago
Nope, even if he is correct and Obama isnt eligible for the presidency, then Biden would be president and it isnt like biden wouldnt so order anyway. Plus it is MUTINY to refuse to follow a direct order from your superiors.
"Obama ONLY needs to provide a long form birth certificate! And its EASY to get! " No it isnt, because, THE STATE OF HAWAI'I DOES NOT ISSUE SUCH THINGS. The only documents which one can get from said state are presented already. done. End of story. You are just a conspiracy theorist nutjob who cannot accept that elections sometimes dont go your way.
Danae777
· 5 months ago
Sorry Zippy, but having been born in Hawaii I CHECKED with them. If I needed it I could GET it.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
You DO need it, Danae. Get it and post it here. Now.
But since you didn't check with "them" you cannot do that. And if you did check with "them" they would tell you what they tell everyone else.
Now go cry yourself back to sleep. When you wake up, the leader of the free world will still be black.
Ryan
· 5 months ago
this is moronic tripe.
twosurfside
· 5 months ago
I don't know the truth is. But I pose this question: If the orders are legitimate, then why is the Major not under Court Marshall? Why were his orders simply revoked? Seems a little fishy...
truthmatterz
· 5 months ago
According to his superiors, it is because he is in the volunteer reserves and has the right to volunteer or reject a particular assignment. His assignment was already withdrawn before he thought he could get a lot of publicity for it.
Perhaps he wasn't aware in May when he actually volunteered for the assignment that Obama was President. Face it, the guy got cold feet and latched onto a hairbrained excuse. I say it is good that the brave soldiers in Afghanistan don't have to rely on a nutcase like him.
twosurfside
· 5 months ago
I did not know he was only a reservist. If those are the rules for reservists, then no court marshall makes sense. Thanks for the info.
mslindab
· 5 months ago
Try looking up some facts readily available. Since Maj is a reservist he only has to notify the military that he has changed his mind and doesn't have to go. That is what proves that this is a ploy. He asked to go to active duty AFTER Obama became President and then a month later said he wouldn't go because Obama wasn't eligible to be President. A publicity stunt.
mslindab
· 5 months ago
Obama does not have to prove anything to anyone about the validity of his citizenship.
BrooklynGirl
· 5 months ago
Did it occur to you that every court in the land that's thus far overturned the lawsuits over Obama's birth certificate had the LEGAL authority to demand the long form birth certificate that you're whining about? Did it dawn on you that perhaps the reason every court has rejected this lawsuit is because that evidence was already presented?
strangely_enough
· 5 months ago
"Now imagine for a moment if the numbers of those soldiers goes up to say, 1000, or 3000, entire Reserve units... yea, This is a serious issue." If they couldn't be bothered to not participate in an illegal war, somehow I get the feeling you getting the vapors over Obama isn't all that important.
24AheadDotCom
· 5 months ago
Let me state a couple things up front:
1. Dave Weigel is a liar. Not only that, but after he wrote about me on his personal site, he refused to approve a comment I left showing how he was wrong.
2. Okubo (the Dep't of Health spokeswoman) is either lying or confused. Go take a look. She says there's only the short-form of certificates, yet a simple search will show a long-form certificate at several sites. What she told someone else is easily seen to be false. Whether she was lying or just wrong isn't known.
If you want the truth about this issue - no speculation, no tinfoil hat talk, and no attempts to mislead such as Weigel engages in - see my completely fact-based overview.
This post will probably be followed by a series of comments designed to mislead or just throw up dust. Few of those people will have read or understood the link and will simply use the same old misleading statements debunked at the link above. Their goal is to mislead; don't let them do it.
madmainer
· 5 months ago
It is funny that you claim these individuals are misleading when you in fact mislead on your website.
1) The law you cited was created in 1982 and as such had no precedence at the time Obama was born 21 years earlier. So please cite the laws applicable for the time period that Obama was born.
2) The 1982 provision does not amend a child's records to imply they were born in Hawaii, it only provides a Hawaii birth certificate. That certificate as has already been verified by state officials would show the place of original birth on it. So if Obama was born out of the US, the certificate while issued by Hawaii, would show his original place of birth, not Honolulu.
So in fact you are misleading people with your site. A neutral site without an agenda would have these facts along with the ones that support your position. When it is all taken into context, there would have to be a whole host of individuals at the state level that would actively be participants in a conspiracy to get Obama certified as a natural born citizen. Unless this document was freshly minted they would have to be prognosticators to see into the future that he would become president.
The most likely answer is the simplest one... He was born in Hawaii and has a birth certificate that proves it. He has been sworn into office. At this stage the burden of proof no longer falls on him, but his accusers. Please provide PROOF that he is in fact not a natural born citizen. Everything else is rhetoric and conjecture... nothing more.
jamie461
· 5 months ago
Excellent synopsis. The burden is indeed on these nutjobs to produce PROOF, not on the president.
Lava Lee Pyre
· 5 months ago
Yeah, that's it: You're not mistaken, it's the other people who are lying or confused! How Convenient! It doesn't matter how many links you put up, or how many "Fact-based overviews" you post, they mean nothing unless you can prove that Mrs. Okubo is lying. and you can't. and you know it.
David Weigel
· 5 months ago
So your argument is that a "a simple search" on the internet is more factual than an official statement from the government of Hawaii? Heh.
trueblue
· 5 months ago
Exactly - we have some similarly 'truthful' documents found on the internet for this goon head. LOL.
slimslowslider
· 5 months ago
But but... that doesn't get more blog hits!
taotebjp
· 5 months ago
More proof that the right wing is inhabited by racist nutjobs with absoultely no sense of reality.
Roger
· 5 months ago
This is exactly what the general public thinks of this.... like it or not.
Ola
· 5 months ago
When we talk about racism, people are prepared to go to any lengths.
Sad the republicans will never change to me,they are the face of hatred.
Leave Obama alone.
Ola Paris
tina11111
· 5 months ago
The birthers are about as stupid as the people who claimed that Palin's baby wasn't hers.
No proof will ever be good enough for the lunatics out there.
geo12
· 5 months ago
These "birthers" are idiots. If it wasn't this there would be some other issues that would have their panties in a bunch. Obama won the election. He is the president, like it or hate it. Just grow up and deal with. Three and half more years is all you have to wait. It will go by quickly, the years always do.
m
· 5 months ago
0bama has refused to release any of the documents concerning his early life: college transcripts, passport records, genuine Long Form Original Birth Certificate. Hell, he won't even release his medical records!
He is a manufactured puppet mesmerizing us while we are bound up in a National Socialist fascist State. Impeach. Depose. Imprison. Sic semper tyrannis
Irritable
· 5 months ago
Oh, you mean kind of the way GWB refused to release his military records? Like that?
pixiepotpie
· 5 months ago
LOL, not to mention Stealing the presidency. Doh!
TomMaske
· 5 months ago
Sic semper tyrannis? Oh wow, seriously only one historic person used that, and that was John Wilkes Booth. Yes nothing like threatening death to an elected official, must make you feel all warm inside to post that knowing Lincoln (someone who President Obama clearly admires) was shot dead by Booth. You are a traitor to this country and to the Union Lincoln helped to preserve.
mslindab
· 5 months ago
Thankfully you folks are dying out. In the future America, you could find yourself in a growing minority fighting for equality from those whom you would deny now.
jamie461
· 5 months ago
Get some mental health care, "m." Maybe you and the rest of the "birthers" can get a group rate.
littlepearl
· 5 months ago
Gee, "Saint" John McCain didn't refuse any of these either., and he was born in Panama. What do you mean by 'manufactured puppet'? I think If you look up fasicsm, you'll see a picture of Cheney and Bush, not Obama.
jahyarain
· 5 months ago
2 be a tyrant, my uneducated friend, one must take away rights (Patriot Act), lie 2 keep control (the war machine), surpress education (NCLB, the piggy cry of "the educated are elitists!"), and control the exchange of information (fox "news", "it's a Liberal media!!!!").
we all know who WASN'T ever really President. let's just call him "w". since neither you nor he have sense enough 2 spell out his name. put the am radio down and pick up a book, traitor.
davidvolz
· 5 months ago
Reservists who volunteer for duty have the right to back out up until the day they are deployed. Why did he volunteer (in May) in the first place? Obama was President in May -- or did he not realize that? What a nutjob.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
He volunteered to serve in Afghanistan because he knew that doing so would generate papers - specifically an order requiring him to report for his (volunteer) duty.
Then, shortly after the orders were generated, he filed his bogus lawsuit. The order requiring him to report for duty is a prerequisite to filing suit. I'm a lawyer. I'll try to say that in english.
He could not sue until he could show that he had received orders to report. So first he had to get the orders generated. It was ALWAYS just a political set-up. His attorney has done the same thing before, with similarly spectacularly miserable results. It's all just to score ridiculous points with the right wing lunatic fringe.
It really goes too far on many levels. Not least of which is the contempt it shows for the military AND the judicial service. You know, we ARE at war. And thousands of our bravest young men and women are fighting and dying in Afghanistan and elsewhere to preserve our freedoms. Having this no-account weasel volunteer for service under false pretenses, just so he could try to grandstand with an obviously bogus legal theory, is really more than any of us should have to sit through.
It's bad enough that the Republicans play the race card from the bottom of the deck for four straight days with Judge Sotomayor, or that the Republicans in Congress cannot do anything except avoid answering questions about Republican sex scandals while keeping their fingers crossed that whatever Obama tries to do fails, so that America will be worse off and the GOP can get re-elected.
But when you have weasels tie up the system with fake lawsuits and make a mockery out of all those people whose tours have been extended, that's just too much.
Iskra
· 5 months ago
Treason.
richheithold
· 5 months ago
I did not realize that there are long form, short form, electronic certificates, etc. Since, everyone was paid off, according to the "birthers," then this would seem to be a big waste of time. Birthers, (you don't mind if I call you birthers) Fox News, World Net, Limbaugh, Hannity have all duped you folks into this insanity. Don't you have anything better to do than develop paranoid, delusional, neurotic and just plain stupid ideas. Admit it, the old Pillsbury dough boy, Beck, has you all turned into his program, buying his books and buying his craziness!! And let's pretend Obama is an illegal alien and has to quit. The birthers are still irrelevant in 2010 through 3000.
ridiculous
· 5 months ago
generously ignoring the blatant misinformation in this article (for example, Obama's half-sister also has a Hawaii COLB but was definitely not born in the state), i can't help but wonder why if i had to pay$10 to get and to show a certified copy of my original, long-form birth certificate to get a driver's license, then what's the big deal about producing a certified copy of same to be President?
as per watergate, it's not the offense, it's the cover-up; $10 to release the long form birth certificate (which is not the same as the COLB) would clear this up completely.
Occam's Razor suggests there is something to hide.
mslindab
· 5 months ago
Don't you think Obama has had to show a birth certificate to get a passport, entrance to schools and/or a drivers license? Do you think all forms of gov't have given him a pass his entire life so they could fool us now?
jamie461
· 5 months ago
OMG, these people are totally devoid of ANY reasoning skills!! They apparently think that, for his ENTIRE LIFE, Obama has been "getting away" with "fooling" our government into giving him a passport, social security card, jobs, college scholarships and student loans, etc. They need to seek mental health care NOW.
jamie461
· 5 months ago
He DID produce a certified copy of his birth certificate, you dolt!
Irritable
· 5 months ago
As another poster said, he's had to produce such a document to get passports, drivers licenses, etc. What really chaps you is that he isn't bowing down to these ridiculous demands and jumping through your hoops, and you're using that as a veil to (very poorly) disguise your own racism. Good for him--I wouldn't dignify this junk with compliance, either!
pixiepotpie
· 5 months ago
this whole arguement is a huge time and money waster, which is exactly what i expect from the "right" repeatedly for the next 4 years, at which time the repugs will cry and whine that nothing was accomplished. standard subterfuge.
pixiepotpie
· 5 months ago
I'm quite sure extensive Illegal Wiretapping was indeed a problem, covering it up only made it worse. your name could not be a more accurate description.
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
You, my friend, are a conspiracy-believing, tin-foil-hat-wearing, knuckle-dragging un-American pinhead. You have chosen to ignore the rule of law of this fine nation, a beacon of democracy to the world, making you an enemy of everything America stands for.
All you need to know is that EVERY COURT THAT HAS EXAMINED ANY OF THIS HORSESHIT HAS COME TO THE SAME CONCLUSION: It's sheer, utter hogwash, and our President needs to do nothing more about it... no school records, no photo of the 'vault copy' of his birth records, NADA.
The Supreme Court of this nation, the same court that decided that Bush won the 2000 election, REFUSED TO EVEN HEAR THE CASE. That means they believed it had no merit whatsoever. Get it? The Chief Justice, a lifelong conservative, swore Mr. Obama in. There's nothing being hidden. No conspiracy. Swamp gas; that's all.
If you don't like and/or accept the structure of federal and state laws and the U.S.Constitution which have served us so well, that have found that Obama was born in Hawaii, then PLEASE LEAVE OUR COUNTRY and take all the other "Birfers" with you.
Our national average IQ would shoot up 20 points immediately.
BG
· 5 months ago
Link, please, on the existence of Maya Soetero's Hawaii COLB? Does it make a false claim about her birthplace? Proof? Because according to THIS VERY ARTICLE, you can get a Hawaii COLB but it shows your actual birthplace and requires verification.
And the document you got for your driver's license was, by your own admission, a CERTIFIED COPY given to you by the state or county, not the original document. So you concede it's OK for the record-keeping authority to issue you a document attesting to your birth record and not a photo of the original? Nope, the state accesses its database and spits out a piece of paper with a stamp to show that this is a reflection of the state's records. Guess what -- that's the kind of document Obama DID order for ten bucks and put on the website.
What I'm trying to get at is... the CERTIFIED COPY you got is good enough for you to become president of the united states. The CERTIFIED COPY that any other person born in Hawaii can order (which would be exactly like Obama's publicly released copy) is good enough for any other Hawaii-born person to run for president?
So why the different level of proof required for Obama?
evreport
· 5 months ago
I'm glad the country is in such great shape that Birfer idiots can spend their time harassing government this way.
ChillyDogg
· 5 months ago
To be "natural born", both of your parents must be citizens of the country in which you are born. Obama admits his father was a foreigner at the time of his birth. Therefore he is NOT a natural born citizen and is a usurper. The whole COLB thing is nothing but a red herring to distract from this fact. All of you arguing that if one parent is a citizen it doesn't matter where you are born, or if you are born here to non-citizen parents you are "natural born", you are totally, completely and absolutely wrong.
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
Absolutely false. There is NO requirement that EITHER parent be a citizen (thus the concept of "anchor babies" born to illegal farm workers.)
Before you spew such rubbish, howzabout you LOOK IT UP FIRST? Call a lawyer; every one has studied the laws of citizenship in Law School.
Unless you enjoy exposing yourself as a gullible, incurious, vague-minded dipstick; in which case, pray continue.
Ryan
· 5 months ago
This is idiotic.
mslindab
· 5 months ago
Anyone born in the US is a natural born citizen. What nationality your parents have or don't have doesn't matter. Some are trying to change this to stop the influx of Mexicans who come here pregnant.
betha
· 5 months ago
Check your facts before posting these lies. You only have to have BOTH parents be citizens if you are born OUTSIDE THE US.
Here, this has links to the actual laws...so stop trying to sell your racist nonsense here. OBAMA IS AND ALWAYS WILL BE A CITIZEN OF THE UNITED STATES...
Persons born in Hawaii (8 USC 1405) A person born in Hawaii on or after August 12, 1898, and before April 30, 1900, is declared to be a citizen of the United States as of April 30, 1900. A person born in Hawaii on or after April 30, 1900, is a citizen of the United States at birth. A person who was a citizen of the Republic of Hawaii on August 12, 1898, is declared to be a citizen of the United States as of April 30, 1900.
.
lamar powells
· 5 months ago
your stupid natural born means what it says naturally born in the US both of your parent dont have to be hear they dont even have to be citizen they coul be illegal it doesnt matter if you were born on US soil or property you are a Natural born citizen
BlueKansas
· 5 months ago
That is not true. One parent is all that is necessary.
Irritable
· 5 months ago
Which is completely irrelevant, as the Constitution (may I introduce you to that esteemed document?) states that a President must be, and I quote:
"a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States..."
And with that, poof! Your argument is reduced to smoke.
jamie461
· 5 months ago
Obama was born on U.S. soil to an American mother. He is a natural born citizen. You "birthers" are WACKO.
littlepearl
· 5 months ago
to be natural born, only one parent has to be American. Get over it. He is President and you are not.
maryoca
· 5 months ago
You misstate the definition of "natural born". See the 14th Amendment of the US Constitution: "All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside."
Title 8 of the U.S. Code is even more specific. Section 1401 defines the following as people who are "citizens of the United States at birth:"
Anyone born inside the United States * Any Indian or Eskimo born in the United States, provided being a citizen of the U.S. does not impair the person's status as a citizen of the tribe Any one born outside the United States, both of whose parents are citizens of the U.S., as long as one parent has lived in the U.S. Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is a citizen and lived in the U.S. for at least one year and the other parent is a U.S. national Any one born in a U.S. possession, if one parent is a citizen and lived in the U.S. for at least one year Any one found in the U.S. under the age of five, whose parentage cannot be determined, as long as proof of non-citizenship is not provided by age 21 Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is an alien and as long as the other parent is a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years (with military and diplomatic service included in this time) A final, historical condition: a person born before 5/24/1934 of an alien father and a U.S. citizen mother who has lived in the U.S.
* There is an exception in the law — the person must be "subject to the jurisdiction" of the United States. This would exempt the child of a diplomat, for example, from this provision.
terragazelle
· 5 months ago
If both parents had to be citizens of the country in which you were born..George Washington and the rest of our early presidents would have been illegitimate. Their parents were still citizens of Britain at their birth and you are totally, completely and absolutly wrong.
Obama was born in Hawaii...a state of this union to a Citizen of this nation. You think that secret service does not undertake a serch on people running for president?
guyinsanfrancisco
· 5 months ago
With the problems in the ecomony and health care, social issues, etc. going on, can we please eject these useless members from congress? They are wasting taxpayer dollars by getting paid to do nothing else then generate stupid conspiracy theories while the country is hurting.
betha
· 5 months ago
You congressmen and senators already KNOW that Hawaii has confirmed over and over that Obama IS a citizen. Continuing to pretend this is otherwise so your illiterate constuents can disguise racism and hate under this lie of his birth is embarassing and a waste of the time of the 80% of us who aren't racists and have already listened to Hawaii defend this poor man over and over from these ridiculous attacks.
There is not going to be a second Civil War just because a black man has finally entered the front door of the White House. Get over it!
mslindab
· 5 months ago
GOP HI governor has also confirmed Obama's birth certificate is valid. Guess she is on the conpiracy too!?! Such nonsense.
Josh
· 5 months ago
Like this country doesn't have bigger things to worry about that these jerks find it worthwhile to waste taxpayer dollars chasing some conspiracy theory. Obama wasn't elected to office because we all believed him to be a natural citizen. That would suggest that it was the only qualification he needed for a majority vote. Give me a break.
robert
· 5 months ago
Frankly, this is nothing to do with the issue of where the President was born. It is another type of covert racism. They are making this issue because America has a first black president which some republicans cannot comprehend. These are "allelua" and holier than thou" christians who feel threatened evertime a colored person achieves leadership position. Obama has a perfect family and upbringing with so far no skeletons in the closets. However, if Obama was white then these so called conservatives would have gone to find out with whom he is sleeping as they did to Bill Clinton. Remember Mr. Melon who invested by giving millions to these fringe people to go after Clinton. God save America. Hypocrites all over.
boomking
· 5 months ago
Don't you "birthers" get it? You are on the wrong side of history. You will all be remembered as those last scraps of white racists that could not get over the fact that a minority is president. You will be a reminder of ignorance and how NOT to act.
You will NOT be remembered as the heroes who exposed "the truth." How you could ever think that would happen is mind-boggling.
Do yourself a favor and wise up while you still can.
Joe Hill
· 5 months ago
Hey "m"....
You DO realize that you moonbat radical righties don't have a monopoly on deadly force, don't you?
"Sic semper tyrannis" yourself....
See you at the barricades. :-)
soonerman
· 5 months ago
Fist Black President....'nuff said. Alan Keyes is even in on it. Read about Jackie Robinson and others who broke color barriers, you'll see the similar stupid crap.
When color barriers are broke, those with conscious and sub-consious prejudices get exposed.
Hank
· 5 months ago
Wow! These birthers must really really want Joe Biden to be president!
emar333
· 5 months ago
No- Biden gets thrown out with Obama. it's Nancy Pelosi they want!
littlepearl
· 5 months ago
1 I think it is far more important for a presidential candidate to pass a psych test. 2 Obama's mother and her parents were Americans, ergo Obama is American. 3 Don't these people have a real life?
mp266
· 5 months ago
Birthers get lost.
vastleftwingconspiracy
· 5 months ago
A few things here folks:
1. The birther movement is comprised of many of the same characters who say 9/11 was a conspiracy by Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld. Check it out for yourself. Doesn't take much googling.
2. The birther soldier was dismissed by the military. This was touted as a "victory" for the birthers.
3. The next day, he was fired by his employer, who it turns out, has only one client: DOD.
4. Yesterday, the Fed. Ct. dismissed his lawsuit summarily.
Now the guy has no income from the miltary or a civilian job. Good goin!
5. This lawyer got her law degree online. She's completely batsh*t crazy.
Why doesn't BO just release (whatever it is the birthers want him to release) the document?
Because he's rolling on the floor laughing each time he gets to rub these people's noses in their own sh*t.
One lawsuit at a time.
franknelson
· 5 months ago
I try sometimes to listen to Sean Hannity, I really do, but his continuing distortion of facts, his use of out of context quotes to support whatever 'point' he is trying to make, is really unnerving. For me, it makes everything he says, even if by chance he has something valid to say, completely irrelevant. I don't believe him. It's unfortunate that talk show hosts like Hannity don't make some reasonable effort to argue their point of view with some intelligence and insight instead of intentional distortion. His continued insistence that there may be some validity to the Obama birth certification question is only one of many cases in which obvious and intentional distortion of fact is his mainstay argument on his show. Doesn't he have anything valid to argue his conservatism? One has to question his motives.
I hope for the sake of our country that his followers do not take him at face value. Even as a commentator, he's a fraud.
frank nelson
FrogWhisperer
· 5 months ago
'birthers' = another name for 'racists'. The ONLY reason these f-tards are doing this is because they can't stand the fact that a black man is our President. Its time to grow up y'all. Time to stop the hate! Stop embarrassing yourselves and our country. Get an education.
greg285
· 5 months ago
Sad and time in America when this type of foolishness gets legitimize in court! If this was a white man, this would not have even been an issue. Get over it Old White America, the country you knew is gone forever and young people have spoken! They do not agree with you logic and/or racists attitude. If you thought these clowns were upset, just wait until 2016? A woman as POTUS! After that? An Hispanic as POTUS…….Priceless
betha
· 5 months ago
Greg, I agree with you completely...except remember not ALL old white people are this stupid. Some of us, mostly Democrats, were there side by side with minorities during the Civil Rights movement. As a baby boomer who has walked that line, broke the gender barrier as the first female manager in my national company...and took unbelievable cr@p for daring to be a manager from the old white men...I can tell you that many of us old white people are incredibly embarassed by this racist group of our generation.
Don't forget that people like the Kennedy's, the Clintons, the white men and women in the Democratic party have all been there during those years where we were criticized incredibly by our family and friends for demanding equal opportunity for all. We are all still here fighting for Obama and Sotomayor and gays etc... Your generation is my final hope that this discrimination will end...I raised my own two children to know better...they are YOUR generation and I'm beyond proud of you guys!
mr. right
· 5 months ago
obama was born during the fake moon landing. wear tin foil on your head or the fluoride will enable him to read your mind!
ih1449
· 5 months ago
There is nothing that anyone could ever produce that would stop the birthers from believing what they wish to believe. Ignorant people, all of them.
Springfieldsfinest
· 5 months ago
all he has to do is show his long form birth certificate. that would put an end to all of this. why cant he produce that?
tried and true American
· 5 months ago
Beacuse if he did produce it, birthers would claim it is a fake.
Springfieldsfinest
· 5 months ago
do you even listen to yourself? if he produced it, it would put an end to it. there would be an attending physician signature on it.
jamie461
· 5 months ago
No, it would not put an end to it! The "birthers" would claim it's a fake. They will not be deterred from this bizarre conclusion that they have already formed in their schizophrenic minds.
Donald
· 5 months ago
All he has to do is continue doing the wonderful job he is doing.
If Jesus Christ were to show up with the document in hand and hand it to you, you would call JC a liar.
Tolkien
· 5 months ago
GOPs are not only brain-damaged but spiritually bankrupt. They feast on each other's malevolence, and expose their kinship with Gollum. Behind their masks, they sport Gollum's snarl.
koriparker
· 5 months ago
It all boils down to racism. They don't want a black president. I didn't think they would question John Mcain's birth certificate if he had won the election.
Springfieldsfinest
· 5 months ago
congress held a hearing into McCain's elgibilty for the presidency, was that racist? asking Obama to produce a long firm birth certificate isnt racist, its constitutional. the republicans are the ones that ended slavery. the dems are the one with a former KKK member sitting in the senate.
jamie461
· 5 months ago
He presented a legal copy of his birth certificate. Just like the legal copy I have of my birth certificate (I was also born in 1961, though in a different state). There has not been ONE SINGLE COURT in this country that has found ONE SHRED of merit in this silly business.
And the Republicans like my ancestors who supported abolition would have nothing whatsoever in common with the Republican party of today. That is why I left it.
Robert
· 5 months ago
McCain's eligibility got scrutiny because he wasn't born on US soil. Obama was.
The Republicans may have ended slavery, but after LBJ signed civil rights legislation, and Jim Crow began to end, the racist southern Democrats switched to become Republicans. Makes no difference how the GOP started, it's the party of racists now.
usurper
· 5 months ago
When Barry Soetoro went to Pakistan in 1981, he was not using the name Barack Obama. He used his Indonesian name of Barry Soetoro so he could travel to Pakistan with his Indonesian Passport. He got into Harvard and Columbia the same way his Kenyan father got into the University of Hawaii, foreign student aide. This is why he refuses to show his PP, school records and birth certificate. The man is a fraud By the way Pakistan was under Martial Law in 1981 when Barry went there to visit the two hot spots of muslim unrest Rumor? Then what keeps Barry from showing his documents?
The truth scares him is why
sickofrepubcrazies
· 5 months ago
What an insane bunch of lies. You crazy conspiracy theory militia types give America a bad name
terragazelle
· 5 months ago
You are so wrong where to begin? But then you Birthers would not take the truth...you are like Christians that blame the devil when caught in a sin.
The supreme court has said that this is not worthy to talk about...the conservative majority court at that. I have seen his Birth Certificate and read the letter from Linda Lingle (Gov. of Hawaii) and the Director of the Health Department that the original copy of Obama's Birth Certificate is on file, as well as all "long copies" (original copies) of everyone born in Hawaii. Obama's doctor that delivered him was Rodney T. West...2 minutes of research ...at the Children and Womens Medical Center of Honolulu.
His documents have been shown...I have been to North Africa...I lived in Libya...1953. So what?
sasha2009
· 5 months ago
Just like you like your foreign news-faux clown show- foreign owned-
we like our foreign president
he does not have to show you anything
country first do nothings
jamie461
· 5 months ago
Everything you just published in your post is a lie. EVERYTHING.
The voices in your head are going to have to look for some facts next time.
Donald
· 5 months ago
When God was handing out intelligence He must have gone out on a break when your turn came up, because you are completely devoid of any intelligence.
Let me ask you a question; where are the birth certificates for any of the previous Presidents? Is it that they don’t need to prove their births because they are WHITE, or President Obama needs to prove his birth because he is BLACK?!
w
· 5 months ago
BARRY?!? You are referring to the President of the United States in this manner? Your profound lack of respect is foul.
Your lies would be hilarious if not so dangerous.
FRAUD?!? The ONLY reason you find the President of the United States a fraud is because you do not have the b alls to call him what you want to (and what you do in private) a N*G*ER.
Foul and disgusting.
Tara
· 5 months ago
This is all these Republican freaks have to offer? They are utterly and entirely useless.
sasha2009
· 5 months ago
Let them keep going
after all they are not only the party of no country first- but also the do-nothing congress
let us not forget that
2000-2006
Nothing!
johndk7
· 5 months ago
For all those who don't want Obama to be exposed, thus sharing in this apparent cover-up whether willfully or unintended due to ignorance, I call your attention to the part above where it says, "To push back against rumors that he was not born in Hawaii, the campaign reproduced a Certificate of Live Birth from the state’s Health Department. Instead of terminating the conspiracy theories, that inspired new theories — that the certificate had been forged or that even if it hadn’t been forged it was the sort of certificate that could be given to someone born outside of the United States. But the certificate is specific about Obama’s birth in Honolulu, down to the 7:24 p.m. time."
Problem: Obama DID NOT put a certifiCATE but a certifiCATION which differs much from an ACTUAL certificate. GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT! A birth certificate shows DETAILED info like the Dr. of birth, the actual hospital, etc. But the certification proves only that the guy basically exists. Fact: In 1961 Hawaii issued CERTIFICATIONS of live birth most of the time for FOREIGN born children.
Worldnetdaily.com is just reporting the GLARING facts about this CONTROVERSY -- and I wouldn't call it a theory especially since Obama STILL won't release his actual birth CERTIFICATE, and that's A FACT.
I really encourage all who are opposed to the birthers to PLEASE log on to wnd.com and just read what they have to say and examine their material INSTEAD of just blowing them off because you may just be putting yourselves and this country in great constitutional, financial and moral jeopardy by legitimizing a "president" that might not be president AFTER ALL...
jamie461
· 5 months ago
The only thing in jeopardy is your sanity.
I had to get a copy of my birth certificate from PA a few years ago. It does not list the doctor who delivered me, nor the name of the hospital. Just my name, the names of my parents, the city and county of my birth, and the date and time. It has a raised seal on it from the PA, just like Obama's copy of his birth certificate had a raised seal from Hawaii.
Here's the deal: YOUR TEAM LOST. You people need to get a grip on what's left of your sanity and move on. This whole business is even crazier than those loonies who kept trying to claim that Bill and Hillary Clinton killed Vince Foster. No matter how many times Foster's own wife AND the police AND the coroner confirmed he killed himself, the loonies insisted he was murdered. You people won't take ANY piece of evidence from the state of Hawaii as factual!!
As someone else stated, the burden of PROOF is on you birthers. You have compiled a lot of lies and innuendo, but no PROOF of your claims. The president should not have to prove that you are wrong -- you should have to prove that you are right. PERIOD.
johndk7
· 5 months ago
au contraire pal, read the facts and stop SLANDERING. Act like an American not an idiot.
jamie461
· 5 months ago
I think an objective review of your post vs. mine would indicate that the only idiot is you.
Facts don't matter to you birthers, anyway. You have a conclusion in your schizophrenic mind that your convoluted conspiracy theory is true, and there is no amount of evidence that will deter you from believing it.
Again, there is not ONE SHRED of evidence to support these bizarre claims. No court in this country believes you. NO SANE PERSON believes you. Why? Because YOU HAVE NO EVIDENCE TO SUPPORT YOUR CLAIMS.
slimslowslider
· 5 months ago
What kind of American says "au contraire?"
DragonMama
· 5 months ago
Go get a NEW copy of your birth record from wherever you were born. It'll look like Obama's in most states. What he's shared isn't the original birth certificate, which would have the information you indicated, but a modern official document with verifiable security measures (such as special printing) that are less easily faked than the embossed stamp that they put on them back in the day. They also only include the information actually needed for legal documents such as passports, not all the extraneous but interesting stuff like the name of the doctor. The same thing happened with my Ohio birth record. I have an unofficial xerox of my original 1976 birth certificate, but I needed an official one a few years ago and went to get one. The one that I got from Cleveland City Hall looks a lot like Obama's. Also, I have two children and their official state-issued ones look like the one Obama posted and the one I got as an official legal document - no mention of doctor, just date, time, my name and country of origin, father's name and country of origin, city birth occurred, etc. Doesn't even have birth weight from what I remember, only maybe 10 data points. However, both births I had a LOT more paperwork than that to fill out for them and I know more was submitted - you just have to request it apparently, it's no longer on the legal document.
I seriously encourage all the Birthers to go get a new official copy of their birth records before they make total fools of themselves, so they can see what has changed since whenever the copies they're used to seeing were issued. Some of this WILL vary by state and juristiction, but Obama's birth certification is pretty typical of what's being issued these days. I'm pretty sure he went and asked for a NEW printing of it from the official sources specifically to try to preempt the "it's a forgery" stuff that the 1960s original would have suffered (since an older document would have been easier to fake, whereas the one he produced, the person who handled stuffing it in an envelope is probably still working there and can verify it's authenticity).
Seriously. It's OVER. You're just making yourself like Tin Hat Fashionistas.
Robert
· 5 months ago
My children's birth certificates, which I obtained from Virginia shortly after their births, does not list the hospital or doctor on record.
How could Hawaii certify any birth that didn't occur in Hawaii? That in itself would be fraud.
It's amazing how dumb these birthers are. Go back to discussing how there was a breeze blowing the flag in the faked moon landing. Box of rocks.
WND is an OPINION site. It is not a news site. It is OPINION.
sickofrepubcrazies
· 5 months ago
You are the pathetic idiot johndk7! Get a life you sore loser!
johndk7
· 5 months ago
I am not a sore loser just a concerned American. Again, if you people can't act civil and follow the facts them something is a miss.
Simpleton
· 5 months ago
This is why people who believe Hannity, Rush, and other such celebrities, are idiots. If you do not want to be an idiot, don't believe such lies.
Really as simple as that.
christineky
· 5 months ago
Do any of you Birthers have documentation that Ann Dunham left the US at the end of her pregnancy to go to Africa? And why would ANY pregnant white American go to Africa to deliver her baby, and then return to the US to go to university a few days afterward? Sorry, it doesn't make any sense to me. I'm sure it doesn't make sense to you either, but racist emotions have to be fed. Get over it, the days of white supremacy in this country are over. Good riddance, too. And I'm white!
LOLOLOLOL
· 5 months ago
I am afraid ignorant hicks like yourself are putting this country at greater risk. The greatest threat we face today is from within. From bigoted, neoconservative fundie nutbags like you, refusing to accept reality and to move on.
The whole movement you believe in is a right wing whack job theory meant to continue the hatred and ignorance of our past, and keep you people distracted while they continue to sabotage our country in the name of "goodness" and "morality" while selling it to you neatly packaged as being "patriotic" so that you crazy bastards will eat it up.
sasha2009
· 5 months ago
we liek em foreign just like our news- faux clown show
Hubkal
· 5 months ago
He did produce a real live certificate. I have seen it and it includes the actual seal,raised...you are an idiot!
johndk7
· 5 months ago
NO HE DIDN'T! Check AGAIN. There is birth certificate but HE WONT SHOW IT. Havn't you been reading what we have been asserting? I guess not.
Denese
· 5 months ago
You. Are. Stupid. Please shut up. Racists all.
johndk7
· 5 months ago
I am a racist? How? By stating FACTS. WOW. Oh, you think all white people are against Obama but that's not true so stop unrighteously judging those who want to save this country from disaster. - Thanks!
lucey1
· 5 months ago
Okay..so your saying that instead of using his Messiah powers to have something forged that would look like a an original BC, he instead somehow got the Health Department in Hawaii to whip up a falsified Certificate of Live Birth? And now all of their employees are lying to protect him. Wow.
And what about the newspaper birth announcements that are on microfilm in Hawaiin libraries. Are they forged to? Wow, this conspiracy must involve hundreds of people.
You people are frightening.
zerobeat
· 5 months ago
My birth certificate doesn't detail who the doctor was either. I would say you're grasping at straws, but that does a disservice to straws, which exist and are useful.
evolved
· 5 months ago
wnd is a joke. lately half that site has been dedicated to this krap for koolaid drinkers. recently they even presented screenshots of some edits someone had done in wikipedia which made it appear that there's an actual controversy.
The numbers they write about being "in the movement" are contradicted from one headline to the next-can't even stay consistent in their lies! Joeseph Farrah is a HACK!!
dayton52
· 5 months ago
I was born in Ohio, of parents who were born in the U.S. So I guess I'm legit. If there is truly any question of his citizenship, and in the spirit of this ridiculous argument; then he can have my citizenship and I'll to some other country with a clue!
booksnmore4you
· 5 months ago
This sort of inanity is what the country gets after 15 years of idiots dominating over AM radio. Our political culture has thereby been ruined for a generation.
solafidelity
· 5 months ago
Among the errors in this article, the most significant is that the link says "Certificate of Live Birth", but the document linked says "Certification of Live Birth". None of the articles scoffing at the so-called "birthers" have addressed the difference between the two documents. Anyone who cares to learn the truth can go to hawaii.gov and research the "Certification of Live Birth" and see that it is a different document than a Birth Certificate and could easily be acquired by parents of foreign born children up to a year after birth. You'll have to pardon those of us who fancy ourselves free men if we don't get back in line with the sheep and believe every word that comes out of O's mouth (or every jpeg posted to his website).
Donald
· 5 months ago
RACIST!!!
Prove that John McCain is american!
solafidelity
· 5 months ago
First. You don't know me. It is quite a leap to take my comment and infer that I am a racist. Second. You demonstrate your ignorance on the issue. I don't have to "Prove that John McCain is american", because congress certified him. They looked into his birth history, had some hearings, and concluded he met the natural born citizen eligibility criteria. No such investigation was done for Obama. He was simply taken at his word. To date, no legal entity, court or congress, has certified Obama as meeting the natural born citizen eligibility criteria. What do we have offered as proof that he meets the criteria? An image on a website offered by the Obama campaign. Basically, we are taking the word of the president on the matter. That is not how a free society operates.
Q-Comp
· 5 months ago
You note that no legal entity... has certified Obama as meeting the natural born citizen eligibility criteria, when in fact, the Supreme Court of the United States swore him into office. How is this anything but the ultimate legal certification of his eligibility? Exercising independent thought is part of what makes America great. But at some point, "independent thought" that runs counter to fact (essentially ignoring the legal authority of the SCOTUS) is motivated by something other than dogged pursuit of the truth. One can not assert that President Obama was born outside of the United States (BTW, that rule was adopted to keep Alexander Hamilton from becoming President as he was born in Barbados) without accusing him of massive fraud which, running counter to truth, is outrageous slander.
clroberts
· 5 months ago
If you believe the first African-American was taken at his word regarding his place of birth, you may be delusional as well as rascist.
I don't know you, but I do know your kind, having been born and raised in the segregated South.
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
They most certainly have, Einstein. You used 'infer' correctly, so I think you have some brains. But you compromise your integrity by entertaining this drivel, making you a conspiracy-believing, tin-foil-hat-wearing, knuckle-dragging un-American pinhead. You have chosen to ignore the rule of law of this fine nation, a beacon of democracy to the world, making you an enemy of everything America stands for.
All you need to know is that EVERY COURT THAT HAS EXAMINED ANY OF THIS HORSESHIT HAS COME TO THE SAME CONCLUSION: It's sheer, utter hogwash, and our President needs to do nothing more about it... no school records, no photo of the 'vault copy' of his birth records, NADA.
Here is one court's written opinion:
The court finds the claims against Mr. Obama’s citizenship “wholly unpersuasive and bordering on the frivolous, especially in light of the complete absence of any first-hand evidence on any critical issue” and further classifies it as “conspiracy theory of the lowest sort, fueled by nothing than internet rumor and those who truly want to believe egging each other on.”
Either accept the hard, provable fact that the President was born in Hawaii, and remain the above-delineated pinhead, or join the sane, law-abiding world. At that time I would be glad to personally, publicly declare you a non-pinhead, and to fully retract my previous statement.
Q-Comp
· 5 months ago
"To date, no legal entity, court or congress, has certified Obama as meeting the natural born citizen eligibility criteria. "
So are you saying that you don't recognize the legal authority of the United States Supreme Court? Independent thought is all well and good. But playing fast and loose with facts to support outrageous claims of fraud takes motivation beyond dogged pursuit of the truth. Ultimately, you're right. Free society operates by having nutcases advance whatever theories they want. Have fun!
solafidelity
· 5 months ago
The SPOTUS has not addressed this issue. Rather, following a secret meeting with the then president elect, they have dismissed without comment all inquiries into his birth history.
Yikeyikes
· 5 months ago
lol....you were there in person somewhere where they held this secret meeting...right?
Donald
· 5 months ago
You are still a racist.
When did congress or any other government organization certify any other previous President's birth??
When did congress or any other government organization certify any other previous Presidential candidate's birth??
Have you ever thought that congress did not question then Senator Obama's citizenship because he was and still is a natural born AMERICAN?
This would go in line with the fact that they did not do this for any of the other Presidential candidates either. Sorry, that would make too much sense and go against accepting that the black guy is an American.
You are still picking on PRESIDENT OBAMA because he is black.
So, what does that make you in light of the facts? RACIST!
sickofrepubcrazies
· 5 months ago
You are pathetic! Get a life and use your energy for more contructive means! Sore losers...
solafidelity
· 5 months ago
Devastating rejoinder. Please, do continue. You only weaken the waning credibility on your side of the issue.
Robert
· 5 months ago
"Waning credibility" LOL.
Yum yum, that's some good irony.
Simpleton
· 5 months ago
This is why people like you who believe Hannity, Rush, and other such celebrities, are idiots. If you do not want to be an idiot, don't believe such lies.
Really as simple as that.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Saying "your side of the issue" gives the false impression that there are two sides and indeed that there is an "issue."
There's only one side: rational truth. And we're all over here, and we're glad you've decided not to join us.
And there's no issue. Our President's name is...say it with me...Barack Hussein Obama. His mother is American. No matter where he was born, he's American. And he was born in Hawaii. So no issue.
Personally, I couldn't be more pleased to have nutjobs like you out there spewing this ludicrous birth certificate nonsense. Like having Sanford and Ensign twisting in the wind, it is the best electoral message a Democrat can hope for.
Because it's like running a very powerful ad that says "Do you want to be on the side of those people who are trying to take the country forward, or those who are obviously trying to hold it back?"
Will you vote for the poseurs and hypocrites who screwed up the economy and yet now have no idea how to fix it except by doing more of what got us into trouble, or the guy who inherited their mess and yet stood up and said "Give it to me; I want that responsibility. It's my job to lead, not to stand on the sidelines and carp and gripe?"
Do you want to be a member of the party that draws in young and old, rich and poor, male and female, college educated and high school dropout, every ethnic group under the sun, or the party that has shown its @ss at every opportunity in the past 20 years? The party that consists almost solely of one age range of one ethnic group of people in one undereducated region of the country? The party that lies to the middle class and foments culture war to distract the people from the issues that actually matter to them? The party that tolerates the insane rantings of racists like you?
Please, please keep it up. And try to get yourself on Fox News while you're at it. Some of our voters are getting complacent and need a reminder that work needs to be done. Particularly in the area of education. You're doing all this public service for free. When Obama gets re-elected, he should really thank the nutjobs like you -- it just makes his path to re-election all the more of a glide.
solafidelity
· 5 months ago
Sweet, so "there is only one side" of the issue and "there's no issue". What was that you were saying about "rational truth"?
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Not sure where I lost you. Sorry if the words were too big. And I couldn't figure out how to use sock puppets to convey the point.
Go back to talking about what you "fancy" yourself doing, loser.
jamie461
· 5 months ago
It is a certified document from the state of Hawaii, which confirms the date and location of his birth. I care about the truth -- you birthers, on the other hand, only care about your looney conspiracy theories. Even if the state of Hawaii went into their archives and pulled out his original birth certificate (which NO ONE else has EVER had to do to prove their citizenship - you people think, for some reason, that Obama should be held to a higher standard than the rest of us), you people would still claim it was "fake."
Get some help. Seriously.
Yikeyikes
· 5 months ago
Hawaii does not simply hand out a certification of live birth. If that were the case, dont you think many illegals would go to Hawaii first?
The sad part is that there are so many important issues facing this country and people like you take time away from everyone by keeping up this crap.
Original birth certificates are kept in state archieves. All any of us have are copies.
jamie461
· 5 months ago
EXACTLY. I have a certified COPY of my birth certificate from PA; I have a certified COPY of my daughter's birth certificate from Ohio. Why should Obama have to meet a higher standard of proof than the rest of us, just because some loonies are demanding it? It's ridiculous.
nonpartay
· 5 months ago
On file in Hawaii: http://msgboard.snopes.com/politics/graphics/bi... Here's it is. It looks just like other birth certificates from Hawaii. Now please, get over this fetish so we can talk about the important issues of the day.
politiliedetector
· 5 months ago
Online just search for it, that's what makes this so ridiculous, he posted the certificate on HelpFightTheSmears.org druing the campaign, but evidence is the last thing one looks for when filing a frivilous lawsuit, and perpetuating a political misdirection campaign, to take attention away from the lack of ideas in their own party, and a excess of poitical capital for a democratic President.
Walter Starr
· 5 months ago
As an avid Obama supporter, I am quite pleased that the Birfers are sticking to the Republicans like a sign saying "Kick Me".
darylwalmsley
· 5 months ago
It's strange that these birther freaks often have no problem believing heresay that some "virgin" gave birth 2000 years ago, yet they can't comprehend how the son of a Kansas woman could be a naturalized citizen. Cretins...
Dee Downes
· 5 months ago
Believe it or not I am sixty years old, born in New York city and I have an old black and white photocopy of my birth certificate. It even has a C on it which stands for colored. Back in the day coloured birth certificates were filed separately, in a different place. It is the copy my mother applied for and received in 1948 just before we left New York. My mother always used it for me when she had to verify my birth etc. and then she gave it to me to use when I turned 21. My mother was an organization buff and I guess so am I that's why I still have the original with signatures. It's a keepsake now, because it's no longer considered valid. I had to apply to New York for a new copy of my birth certificate to use to get my passport 2 years ago. The new one has almost no information on it, just certifies that I was born in New York in 1948, but it's considered valid and the original is not, go figure.
If people understood just a little about Africans and other cultures they would know that Obama could not have been born in Africa. Africans (in all African countries) do not accept marriages to foreigners. So Obama's father could never, never, never have taken home to Africa an American woman as his wife. That's why he left his wife and Obama in America. He went back to Africa where he probably already had a wife, or wives, or had a woman who the family had arranged for him to marry as soon as he got back to Africa. Africans are almost like Indians who will kill their own child if they marry out of the culturally accepted group. Americans, black or white are not a culturally accepted group for Africans to marry into.
serena_f
· 5 months ago
This is not true at all. I am of African descent, and I have been to Africa many times. So many of my family members have dated and married people are not African; in fact, my ex-boyfriend was from Ghana, and he is mixed; his mother was from Hungary and his father is Ghanian. My uncle married a Black American woman and they now live in Africa, and she is doing just fine. There are many Africans that marry people of other races and cultures and their families are just fine with it. I don't think it was a good idea on your behalf to make generalizations like that. Of course, there are some that are not okay with it, but definitely not as a whole.
Dee3
· 5 months ago
I too have been to Africa many times, and I love it there. Key word, that you said, "of African descent", and you are here, not there, and yes you can go to Africa and be accepted as a welcome visitor, but you can't just join the culture.
I stand by what I say, Africans don't marry an American woman and take her home and she is accepted there. I know 3 women who were left here in America with their children when their African husbands went back home. It happened a lot when I was in college. Some Africans marry here and stay here, but most all Africans eventually go back home without their American wives.
One woman I know was nearly destroyed when her husband left, he tried to take their 2 girls back to Africa but not his wife, the children are accepted, but not the wife. She went there and was sent away. Her husband had another wife, and he was Ghanian, and yes, Africans still have more than one wife. Even if American African wives could go back to Africa they cannot accept the cultural lifestyle. Another reason they are not taken home. Life in the cities is changing though, city dwellers don't as often take more that one wife. However they are often ostracized from their ancestral group because they are changing their life style.
I have met a few Africans who married here and stayed here with their American wives. Primarily because they themselves could not go home. While here in school there was a coup in their country and they were part of the losing group, and so were more or less exiled from their country.
I dated a Nigerian while working on my masters degree and have hung out with many Africans of various cultures, then and now, but some things remain the same. Many of them had a wife sent here from Africa if they had to stay in America several years. Not too long ago, in the Detroit suburbs, there was a story in the news about a Nigerian couple who would not let their daughter go to her prom unless she went with a Nigerian. They imported one for her to go to the prom with. So again, I stand by what I say. American wives don't go home to Africa.
rationalwoman
· 5 months ago
You're as whacky as the birthers. That's all I have to say about that.
Mark
· 5 months ago
When Bill Clinton was elected and remained hugely popular, the only way the far wrong could disrupt him was to hang him up on his zipper. The country's self-annointed moral watchdogs -- Gingrich, Sanford, Ensign and the like -- ground the country to a halt because the president got a hummer and tried to hide it. They had no ideas, no vision, just a low-life hypocritical tactic to bring down the popular Democrat. Now we have the same thing happening, except the only thing they can do is keep harping on the birth certificate. Produce proof? Hey, it's forged. These idiots have no hope of removing Obama from office, but they want to be just disruptive enough to keep the whacked-out far wrong roiling. And that can only have really, really bad results. The racists and the rest of the far-wrong are coming out of the closet to spew their hate, with General Buchana helping to lead the way. Be afraid. These are the people who are turning the U.S. into a third-world nation.
JHS123456
· 5 months ago
Where was George W. Bush's birth certificate, Bill Clinton, or George Sr. or gasp, could it be that Ronald Reagan was not born in the US either?, I have never seen any of their Birth Certificates. It is scary, if you are Republican you can start a baseless war, waste 1 TRILLION dollars to destroy a country, drive up oil costs from $36 dollars a barrel to $145 dollars a barrel, be phtographed kissing the Saudi Prince (Where 15 of 19 hijakers on 9/11 came from), and then find any way you can to whine, moan and complain when you cannot rape the poor in the US any longer, go away you cancerous, anti-democratic, anti-civil liberty morons, aren't there some more extra-marital affairs out there waiting on you, or some other scandal.
politiliedetector
· 5 months ago
Great Job GOP, Well done!
Hopefully every GOP presidential campaign rally in the future will be full of these ridiculous caricatures of informed American voters, the anti-intellectual angle that was intended to misdirect the mainstream has deflected back into your own party base in the vacuum of legitimate ideas, It's wonderful how your own can make clowns of your of party so much better than liberals ever could, from self-righteous vainglorious cheaters, and homebreakers, to right-wing terror-committing extremists, to fringe conspiracy theorists unappeased by rationality or reason, I might send the RNC a few bucks to keep up the great work, P.S. great stuff steele with the the chicken and potatoe salad bribe to blacks, priceless, that a get em'
Wellread1
· 5 months ago
As a Naturalized citizen of the United States who followed all the rules I've long appreciated that I was never eligible to become the President. This is clearly stated in the Constitution. I personally think the founding fathers had the right idea in enshrining this rule because your mindset is to some degree conditioned by where you were born. I have followed this debate from the beginning regarding's Obama's birth and it is very clear there are irregularities here. I think it no coincidence that Obama chose to become a professor of Constitutional Law because he knew from a very young age, despite his ambitions, he was not eligible. He reasoned that by becoming familiar with the law he might find a loophole. The psychology behind career choices is often very revealing.......
We are on the threshold of a Constitutional crisis. Obama hopes to ride out the storm by making it very embarrassing for all concerned to depose him.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
You cannot be serious. You expect us to believe that there's this VAST conspiracy of white people in Hawaii who, IN the 1960's, looked at a pregnant white woman named Stanley and a black man named Barack Obama and said "we gotta protect whoever that couple's baby is, because SURELY he will be the nation's first black President?"
AND then, even after all that nonsense has to be swallowed, you expect us to believe that President Obama chose to teach Constitutional Law at THE MOST RIGHT-WING top-tier law school in the country? Univ. of Chicago is where Richard Posner is. It's where classic neoconservative thought is centered. It is NOT the place where you'd go as a black man to hide out while you're scheming how to take over the free world right from under the nose of the white men in power.
NONE of what you argue is plausible. I don't even know why I bother trying to refute your absurdities with facts; it isn't as though you have the slightest interest in what is actually true or even POSSIBLE.
Roger
· 5 months ago
HELLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, DON'T U GUYS GET IT.... THE AMOUNT OF VETTING A PERSON GETS BEFORE HE CAN BECOME A SITTING US PRESIDENT IS MONUMENTAL. NOOOOOOOOOOOOO, PERSON WITH ANY DEGREE OF CONSTITUTIONAL KNOWLEDGE CAN SNEAK INTO THE WHITE HOUSE. DO YOU REALLY THINK THE ENTIRE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT JUST HEPPEN TO MISS OR SIMPLY FORGOT TO VERIFY HIS CITIZENSHIP. JESUS. U GUYS SOUND ABSOLUTELY BONKERS!!!!!!
davidmoore2328
· 5 months ago
You're an idiot.
clroberts
· 5 months ago
Born and raised in South Carolina. I have never been able to get the actual birth certificate from the state of South Carolina when I have applied for jobs or schools. What makes you think that anyone in this country can get the actual certificate of their birth.
You are right. You have brought your paranoia with you from where ever it is you came from. There is no logic to YOUR reasoning, but don't let that stop you.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
The worst part about your post is that you call yourself "wellread." I've read more informative words on bathroom stalls. Do tell what you have EVER read that would justify your screen name.
And it's well-read, by the way. You're right about one thing. "It is very clear that there are irregularities here." But all the irregularities emanate from YOU, not from President Obama.
rationalwoman
· 5 months ago
You are a joke. You actually believe that because he became a constitutional lawyer, he must not be a citizen? This is your version of logic? What about all the other constitutional lawyers? Are they all secretly foreigners also? And what exactly do you mean, it's clear that there are irregularities here? Name one. Just one, but base on the facts, not your crackpot psychology. The only irregularities here are the idiots like you who are determined to twist reality completely until it looks like the world you WISH you lived in. Here's a hint: stating over and over again that something is fishy doesn't actually make it fishy. But I don't expect that point to penetrate very deep into the fog you call a brain.
wolf
· 5 months ago
What specific irregularities are there, aside from your not having been there to worship his birth? Also, by your logic, we should suspect that everyone that has ever become a constitutional law secretly wishes to violate the constitution, and every policeman secretly wishes to break the law. You're making leaps in logic that are no short of superman-esque.
LOLOLOLOL
· 5 months ago
If I could jump sharks with the mastery of some of these fools I would be a very cool dude.
XLintLuvR
· 5 months ago
Would a video of his parents conceiving him and a gps of his mom until the moment of both satisfy you?
dickm
· 5 months ago
Obama's Mom was an American citizen - no one disputes that !! So where's the irregularity? You're a moron and an a-hole too :-) ...
bonnetteblj
· 5 months ago
You are believing the "anti-Christ" hype in thinking Obama is so devious he would plot his Constitutional Law degree and sneak into the White House. President Obama was elected by a hugh majority of the American people. He did not sneak into the White House. Others on this site have commented on him being a natural born citizen, having a valid passport and going through extensive investigations by the Government agencies prior to becoming President. In addition, President Obama provided a copy of his birth certificate online during the primaries and the general election. The people who continue this conspiracy theory are either racists or nuts!
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
Your handle reminds me of the conversation in A Fish Called Wanda:
>Apes don't read philosophy!
>Yes, they do... they just don't UNDERSTAND it.
KMD
· 5 months ago
Trust me when I tell you that Obama could ride dancing thru the streets in Underoos, blowing a Kazoo wearing a hamburger on his head, shrieking like a drunken duck......and the world would say it's STILL less embarrassing and obscene than how this country was perceived under the Bush administration.
Keep digging the hole. Just remember it's yours - not his, you've fallen into.
edgraham
· 5 months ago
...and the Earth is still flat.
Bert Certificate
· 5 months ago
Birthers will file their frivolous lawsuits in any court that will have them, and get overruled and dismissed up until January 20, 2017. Then they'll claim victory - "See, we forced the pretender out of office".
Theirs is a separate reality.
Richard
· 5 months ago
Scares me that these people are making our laws This country is in deep trouble Is there something in the water making people crazy ?
dawgspiel
· 5 months ago
This is a NON ISSUE....
The requirements for citizenship, and its very definition in American statute law, have changed since the Constitution was ratified in 1788. Congress first recognized the citizenship of children born to U.S. parents overseas on March 26, 1790, stating that "the children of citizens of the United States, that may be born beyond sea, or out of the limits of the United States, shall be considered as natural born citizens: Provided, That the right of citizenship shall not descend to persons whose fathers have never been resident in the United States."[10] To date, the Naturalization Act of 1790 has been the only U.S. law explicitly conferring "natural born" citizenship. In 1795, Congress removed the words "natural born" from the law; the Naturalization Act of 1795 says only that foreign-born children of American parents "shall be considered as citizens of the United States."[11]
It doesn't matter whether Obama was born in Hawaii or not. His mother was a U.S. citizen. His father resided in the U.S. when Barack was conceived. He is a natural born citizen. This is nothing more than the wingnuts looking for an excuse to disallow the outcome of the 2008 election.
He's your president now just as Bush was last year when the sane would rather have had just about anyone else in the job.
Get over it.
jeninoh
· 5 months ago
again with the Facts... why you gotta rain on the parade?
dickm
· 5 months ago
My Mother was an American citizen who gave birth to me in Canada.
I went to get my Passport as an adult and because she had been dead for many years, it involved proving that she lived in the U.S. for 4 years after her 14th birthday (which of course she had) and prove her birth in the U.S. and the mariage certs of her parents, etc. - all reasonable stuff).
It was simple process. The citizenship of my Father was never discussed - one of my parents was an Amercian who lived in the U.S. for at least 4 years after the age of 14 - so I am an American AND SO IS OBAMA.
Why can't someone simply put an end to thios racist crap?
virginiafey
· 5 months ago
I think ALL of those GOPers should have to show their "official" birth certificate-- whatever that is-- cos I know the one I have for myself looks a lot like the one Obama is showing us. Raise your hand if you have something different than the kind he is showing us! Not many people do. This is a silly faux hub-bub designed to scare people and incite distrust. So-- really, ALL of those folks wanting to see some other sort of Obama bc should have to show their own.
btinc
· 5 months ago
This whole movement is "borne" of racism, pure and simple.
I have never seen my birth certificate, although I'm sure I could order a duplicate if I needed one. I know a lot of Americans who don't have their original birth certificate.
nonpartay
· 5 months ago
Well, fortunately, President Obama is not one of them. :)
Simpleton
· 5 months ago
This is why people who believe Hannity, Rush, and other such celebrities, are idiots. If you do not want to be an idiot, don't believe such lies.
Really as simple as that.
jeni2
· 5 months ago
How can someone who has never been to Kenya (Read the book) give birth in Kenya. What a waste of taxpayers money to spend all this time on a raciist 'witch-hunt'.
dorzic
· 5 months ago
Appoint a special prosecutor to look into this scandal so that we can spend $100 million to see if Obama has a stained blue dress in his past. Sound familiar?
mary c
· 5 months ago
but why not just release the original document? and even if he was born her he rescinded his citizenship in Indonesia. so either way it's VOID.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
I'm waiting with bated breath for you to tell us exactly how President Obama rescinded his citizenship in Indonesia.
The only VOID is the one between your ears.
Just get used to saying President Barack Hussein Obama. You'll get plenty of chances in the next 7 and a half years.
rationalwoman
· 5 months ago
What "original"? They DID release the original. Just because some people have more fun saying that it wasn't the original doesn't actually mean it wasn't.
And on a related note.. where's your original birth certificate?
mediumbusinessowner
· 5 months ago
He lived in Indonesia when he was a small child......Oh sure He rescinded his citizenship..MORONS . These people with their rumours are laughable
nonpartay
· 5 months ago
No one gets the original document. It is on file at the state of birth. We all get COPIES. He did NOT rescind his citizenship in Indonesia as he was only there a few years and came back to America--where did you get that idea? Ever read his book? I doubt it. His mother was an American citizen, and his grandparents were, too. Now, please get a life, and stop distracting the country from what is really important. And btw, here is his birth certificate, though I'm sure it won't be good enough for your high standards: http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthcerti...
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
Actually, I have the Court Opinion on that as well:
"5. Mr. Obama did not lose his U.S. Citizenship based on the acts of his parents, including adoption by an Indonesian citizen. The Court held that no action taken by the parents of an American child can strip that child of his citizenship. The court cited the 1952 Immigration & Nationality Act, Title III, Chapter 3, Sections 349 and 355, which was in effect in the late 1960s when Obama went to Indonesia, and which stated that a minor does not lose his US citizenship upon the naturalization of his parents or any other actions of his parents, so long as the minor returns to the US and establishes permanent US residency before the age of 21. Thus the adoption of Obama did not serve to strip him of his U.S. citizenship. Furthermore, the Court held that traveling on a foreign passport does not strip an American of his citizenship. The Court noted first that there was no evidence that Mr. Obama traveled on an Indonesian passport (Mr. Berg and others never provided any evidence of this claim or any other of the claims.) Nonetheless, the court held that such travel does not divest an American of his citizenship."
Suck harder on those Sour Grapes, Birfers.
dsincal
· 5 months ago
Because we all know that the arbiter of who is born where is "part of the military." If there was video of the President being BORN they'd say it was faked, just like the moon landing...
grumpyoldcoot
· 5 months ago
The chances of proving George Bush was AWOL from his National Guard duty are far greater than of proving Obama is a foreigner,
mreguy
· 5 months ago
A researcher found the Honolulu Advertiser announcement of Barack Obama's Aug 4, 1961 birth (published August 13, 1961):
Unless someone time-travelled to fake this evidence, then Barack Obama WAS born in Honolulu, Hawaii
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
Actually, TWO newspapers. There was one in the Aug. 14th 1961 Star Bulletin also.
Of course, they were actually elaborate microfilm forgeries.
NOT.
joelg
· 5 months ago
.. Ah don' know nuthin' bout birthin' babeez, Miz Scarlett.. ah's a rebooblican..
mgabe
· 5 months ago
poor taste...
Cappy
· 5 months ago
What do President Obama and God have in common...neither one is a Republican.
BB
· 5 months ago
I would beg to differ on that one. Republicans, like God, do not support the killing of the unborn.
CookSucks
· 5 months ago
ahh and I suppose "God" like "republicans" supports the killing of hundreds of thousands of Iraqi Civilians in a war against the "Axis of Ebil!!!!!11!11"
Serious11
· 5 months ago
But god does not exist.
hansmeiser
· 5 months ago
No, just kill those who are already born.. Deuteronomy 21:18-21 tells parents to kill their disobedient children with stones.
Republicans don't seem to know the bible well, they're too busy thumping it.
politiliedetector
· 5 months ago
God wouldn't soil himself with our politics but if he chose to I'm would hope that like progressives would deplore all acts of violence, murder, warfare, false arrests, adultry, etc get the point.
The Devil is the great accuser who attempts to mislead the children of men, by convincing them that their particular sinfulness is to great to be forgiven, once one gives up on themselves they find it difficult to approach the throne of grace, repent, be forgiven so they can continue on living a enlightened life, unbounded by the sin inherent to the natural human condition.
God doesn't support any killing, he sent his son to die for us all, no more death is necessary for truth and righteousness, only repentance and acceptance through faith.
Only if you so chose however, none of this is binding.
IDoubtThat
· 5 months ago
"Everyone who is caught shall be run through; to a man, they shall fall by the sword. Their infants shall be dashed to pieces in their sight; their houses shall be plundered and their wives ravished," says God, in Isaiah 14:15-16. I would imagine at least a few women were pregnant when he smote Sodom and Gomorrah. No, God most definitely supports the killing of the unborn.
TJ
· 5 months ago
I think we should call upon all Presidents, from the first one to this one, to see their Birth Certificates. Why only this one?
Ellen Brodsky
· 5 months ago
Your story omitted a few relevant facts about Maj. Cook that cast very serious doubt on his credibility and, as a result, Sean Hannity's and Fox News' for reporting this case without checking the facts: Maj. Cook volunteered to serve in Afghanistan AFTER President Obama was elected and AFTER boasting about having joined another birther lawsuit. Also, Cook could have had his deployment revoked through administrative channels, rather than going through a federal lawsuit. The fact that the military revoked his deployment says nothing about President Obama. But the whole issue, including his subsequent suggestion that the revocation indicates the military wanted to sweep the issue under the rug, says lots more about Cook.
The fact that neither Hannity nor Fox bothered to look beyond Cook's claims for their reporting also speaks volumes.
tedvaill
· 5 months ago
John McCain was the only 2008 Presidential candidate not born in the United States. He was born in Panama, Canal Zone when his father was stationed there in 1937. It was not until the next year, 1938, that the Congress fixed this, and made any person born of U.S. citizens while serving abroad in the military a U.S. citizen, with the full rights of a citizen. But the law said nothing about the U.S. Constitutional requirement that a President must be a "natural born citizen", and the law was not specifically retroactive. In recent years, a court decision found that the law applied to persons born before the law was passed in 1938, such as John McCain, but it did not deal with the issue of eligibility for the Presidency.
Those who question President Obama's birth in Hawaii are desperate for an issue to derail a successful President's agenda, which hopefully will restore the country to the respect it had before George Bush was elected President by the vote of one Supreme Court Justice, and proceeded almost to wreck the country.
Deaner1971
· 5 months ago
Why is the press giving these nutjobs this much attention? These people are actually crazy. The press has no issue telling Holocaust deniers, AIDS deniers, Doomsday cults, Klansmen, Star Wars fetishists and every other group who ignore rationality to seek professional help and yet they take a "neutral tone" in this. Wow, that Left Wing press is really showing their pro-Obama colors...
The Sunshine Empire
· 5 months ago
Just another way for Republicans to make sense of the fact that the country abandoned them. It couldn't be because their ideas don't work, it has to be something more sinister.
elross
· 5 months ago
I recently drove through Kansas for the first time. I have resolved to NEVER return to that homeland of bigotry and stupidity. I spent NO money in that hell hole and will never return.
Rush Limbaugh is no standard for anything except stupidty, and that applies double to his audience and the entire audience of Fox Noise. No, I am not nice to neocon conservatives. To me the F in "Fox" only stands for ONE word-and you can infer what that word is. Hint-it isn't "F"air.
truthmatterz
· 5 months ago
Lt. Col. Maria Quon, U.S. Army Public Affairs Officer, U.S. Army Human Resources Command-St. Louis, said Tuesday evening, Cook was no longer expected to report Wednesday to MacDill Air Force Base in Florida for mobilization to active duty.
... Earlier today, Quon said Cook submitted a formal written request to Human Resources Command-St. Louis on May 8, 2009 volunteering to serve one year in Afghanistan with Special Operations Command, U.S. Army Central Command, beginning July 15, 2009. The soldier's orders were issued on June 9, Quon said.
"A reserve soldier who volunteers for an active duty tour may ask for a revocation of orders up until the day he is scheduled to report for active duty," Quon said.
As the "milblog" Mudville Gazette notes:
In short - Cook never had to go in the first place. Unlike most soldiers who deploy as part of a unit, Cook - a reservist - had volunteered to go as an individual augmentee. The Army generally seeks volunteers to fill such assignments first - if no one does so then a non-volunteer is tapped.
... Even without going to court, the Army says - essentially - hey, no problem. You were the one who wanted to go in the first place.
Actually, there is one "Major" problem. Because Cook waited to the last minute to take this action, either someone is going to get a very short notice non-volunteer assignment, or else the unit in Afghanistan will have to get by without one soldier for a while. Since that soldier would be a field grade officer, it's likely that the position will be of some significance.
This is something they cooked up several months ago in order to get some publicity. What a bunch of losers!.
CookSucks
· 5 months ago
which to me sounds like the work of some traitorous bastards attempting to smear the good name of our President and our country.
Cook deserve's a nice lawsuit, or some jail time. This was most certainly planned and done so with the intention of defaming Obama's name in an attempts to politicize/legitimize a right-wing conspiracy theory steeped in racism.
mattthomas
· 5 months ago
It does not matter to me. Its better to have a President who protect people from Predatory lending, Credit Card exploitations, some one who care for all Americans health than just only healthy , some one who care for Global envorornment etc .. than have a George W Bush as a President. ...What did Republicans did? Still they are talking for 5% top rich people. Stand with Avarage Americans...if you want to win?
2bill
· 5 months ago
When BO went to Indonesia @ 10yo, did he have a birth certificate?
abdulrehmanshaikh
· 5 months ago
i am telling these racist republican and their nazi allies that times have been changed different realities on the ground if you accept these ok other wise get fucked .liwsten sotomayor is the supreme court justice. latinos are very close to so called white majority.
HusseinO
· 5 months ago
OK so he is a natural born American, why will he not release his college records, is there something there he does not want us to see?
kladinvt
· 5 months ago
College records? Now you don't believe he graduated from college? Wingnut, you are truly pathetic! Wake up....YOU LOST THE ELECTION...GET OVER IT!
LOLOLOLOL
· 5 months ago
release nut job.
o wait. Devry was fresh out o'degrees that day?
and NEWSFLASH. he did. during the damned primaries. Use the interwebs for something oher than porn and fundie sites and you might know this.
LOLOLOLOL
· 5 months ago
release yours too*
:D
politiliedetector
· 5 months ago
He did, release his college records, but I would imaginie that you referring to his actual undergraduate college coursework, term-paper and the like.
and nobody else has released coursework, so what's the point and besides that we known that this President was in the top of his class, and the Editor of the Harvard Law Review where he was well respected by both conservative and progressive contributors alike by the way.
Funny how we harp on Obama's failure to appease your unjust cynicism of his credentials, when we know full well John McCain was kicked out for failing grades, only to be reinstated against policy, likely due to his family's long legacy at the Academy and still ended up at the bottom of his class, but failure on his part is acceptable, and reasonable huh?
I wonder why?
argyle
· 5 months ago
Just another example that republicans are batsh*t crazy. They don't even realize how idiotic they look.
HusseinO
· 5 months ago
valenHarris: just showes how little you know, the republicans lost power in 2006, which by the way is when a once great country began to go hell.
commonsense1211
· 5 months ago
this country started to go to hell when that senile old man reagan took over in 80
daltonII
· 5 months ago
Right, a once great country, under George W. Bush and Dick Cheney.
Duh.
lsu
· 5 months ago
HusseinO: just showes how little you know
indeed
uboreme
· 5 months ago
HAHAHAHAHAAHHA---you got to be kidding. That is as lame as saying 911 was the fault of Bush. Liberals wont win that argument and conservatives wont win yours. But thanks I needed a good laugh.
Name
· 5 months ago
The longer the Dems let this go on---the easier it is to tie these nutjobs to the Republican party. Letting the opposition and their supporters hang themselves is politics 101.
daltonII
· 5 months ago
This is what you get when your political party has no ideas and is loaded with these idiots.
In Virgina the GOP has a woman who says we should make changes via the "bullet box" versus the ballet box, you've got plenty of members continuing to deny any form of climate change, and yesterday I see a poll that says 72% of Republicans think Sarah Palin would be great as a President.
snesich
· 5 months ago
Wasn't this "Obama birth certificate" thing settled a long time ago? Why do the Republicans keep on bringing this up? Don't they realize this makes them look dumb and wacky?
DrSam8
· 5 months ago
It also make them look stupid and desperate! Good post. Dr. Sam
gordonwagner
· 5 months ago
Excuse me? Was that not an ad hominem attack? PROVIDE THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE. WE ARE NOT ASKING FOR A PIECE OF THE MOON, HERE, JUST PROVIDE A BIRTH CERTIFICATE.
gchope
· 5 months ago
I'M GONNA YELL TOO! HE HAS PROVIDED THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE! YOU'VE SEEN IT! Hawaiian officials have provided and authenticated it. Is Hawaii just a pretend state to you or something. WHAT DO YOU NEED TO UNDERSTAND! Must he go to each of your homes with it in a manilla envelope and let you touch it! HE WON...LET IT GO!
Name
· 5 months ago
Nope, one of Obama's PR flacks has provided an electronic copy of a "certification of live birth" which is not a birth certificate. Hawaii officials say they have a birth certificate but will not release it without Obama's say so. Instead, Obama has spent a ton of money trying to prevent its release.
I think it's more like provide proof there isn't one..That won't be happening. Don't you think if in fact Obama has 39 social security numbers (that's what the wacky dentist/ lawyer Taitz is claiming) someone who has access to social security records would have come forward by now. Of course if there was someone, they wouldn't dare speak up or they'd lose their job you say. Of course they'd make hundreds of millions on books and tv appearances so I guess that, like so much of this fabricated story, holds no water, not even any condensation... They guy has a passport. In order to get it he needed to provide the long form birth certificate, unless "THEY" figured out a way to game the system...I actually wouldn't mind seeing him produce it, but only if I thought it would silence the lunatics, but that's the problem you see - lunatics aren't rational. We could teleport back to the delivery room and than the story would run very much like the "we didn't really land on the moon" story. Maybe he'll clear the air before he's sworn into his next term...
khrish
· 5 months ago
The only thing I can say is that these people are so ridiculous and ignorant they aren't even worth the time to try and prove anything to them. How stupid can you get?
midnight
· 5 months ago
These guys make themselves look so shabby. Have they no shame? It is almost as if they unzipped and flashed their inadequacies to the world.
ghorton
· 5 months ago
This is insane. Even if there were some error re: Obama's birth certificate -- less than 1 in 100, 000,000 chance, I'd guess-- it would not invalidate a presidential election. The only way to remove a president is by impeachment, and only grounds for impeachment is "high crimes". Crimes require intent: how can a newborn have intent? If somebody fudged the certificate, it certainly wasn't the person who has been using as authentic his whole life. We could far more easily challenge everything the executive branch did from 2000-2004 on the basis that the Supreme Court had no jurisdiction to decide that election!
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
You're right, ghorton. This is insane. But it doesn't have to get as far as how to remove a sitting President.
Even if there were an error with President Obama's birth certificate...his mother was still an American citizen when he was born. Period. End of story. So everyone else can collect their tinfoil hats and go back home. If you all hurry, you may be in time to catch the last 2 hours and 45 minutes of Rush's broadcast...
DrSam8
· 5 months ago
If Centcom did that (i.e., cancelled Major Cook’s deployment to Afghanistan), the officers in charge have not only failed to serve the national interest but are disloyal to the President, their Commander-in-Chief. Their decision sets a bad precedent that many other service men and women in the Armed Forces could use to avoid deployment. Yet, there is clearly no basis for Major Stefan F. Cook's assertion that President Obama is not a US citizen. As one would expecte, FOX NEWS is only to ready and willing to promote Mr. Cook’s grandstanding. Some bloggers have even suggested that Fox News is behind Mr. Cook’s stand. There is a well-established jurisprudence that the onus of proof lies with the one who allleges. It does not lie with CentCom, and surely not the President of the United States.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
You need to understand the story, with all due respect. Cook VOLUNTEERED for service in Afghanistan. It is the military's policy that a volunteer can back out any time prior to the day on which they are scheduled to ship out. So when Cook filed suit that said he no longer wanted to go, the military just said "ok, bye bye. You didn't need to file a lawsuit; you could have just told us you didn't want to go."
The best part is that Cook's actual job was working for a defense contractor. And of course, the military said that now that he sued the Army, he is not welcome on military property. Instead of getting to look at President Obama's birth certificate, now Cook can spend all the time he wants studying his own pink slip.
GEmil
· 5 months ago
This is the end. Every time I think I might vote Republican (I was asked to support a Republican candidate for Governor of Wisconsin today), some crap like this is proposed. I am sick of this shit. Republicans: I will not come back to you until you have reassumed some sanity in your positions. Even if I think President Obama and the Democrats in congress might be on the wrong course, they are still light years ahead of the Republicans.
jupitor
· 5 months ago
It was seattled in court and out of court! Even republicans are fed up with this nonesense! Long time voteres say the party has gone completely nuts. As a old republican who voted Dem this year, I not pleased or ready to return to the party! I think they have enough problems with Sanford,Ensign, Palin, and I hear another GOP looked for Sex alse where than his own bed. It's time to clean house, or I don't care what happens with the economy, no republican is going to truest reprepublicans unless they are real stupid!
gordonwagner
· 5 months ago
I had to get an "official" birth certificate to get my kid a US Passport -- the hospital had given us a "birth abstract" which had been ok for Little League and soccer registration, but not for a Passport -- and so, then, should it be TO BE PRESIDENT. Put up or shut up! Let's see the damned birth certificate. What's the big deal? If it exists, provide it. If it doesn't exist, then Osama isn't qualified to be President of the US.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
The only part of your whole post that makes sense is where you said Osama isn't qualified to be President. I agree. But no one has yet suggested making Osama bin Laden President. He has a better chance in 2012 than any Republican, but that is to say he has zero chance.
President Barack Hussein Obama will be President until the end of his second term.
Your post shows that you have no logical skills. President Obama HAS a passport. That means he has satisfied ALL requirements of proving that he is who he says he is, including without limitation producing a birth certificate.
It HAS been provided, and is easily available online. But you aren't one to let facts get in the way of your argument, are you? Tell me, when John McCain had to take the microphone away from you, just how silly did you feel for saying President Obama is an "Arab?"
terragazelle
· 5 months ago
So you are saying that since Obama has had a PassPort since he was a young boy that he does have a legal American Birth Certificate. Thank you.
Branname
· 5 months ago
If he has his passport, then he shouldn't have any trouble producing the document.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
WHERE IS YOURS? HOW DO WE KNOW THAT YOU ARE NOT A ESKIMO TROLL OR WHAT NOT?/ PRODUCE YOUR LONG FORM BC OR STFU
Are you people HIGH? It is a birth certificate issued by the state of Hawaii, it looks almost identical to the one I have that says I was born two years later and in a different state, down to the weird cross hatching background. So let me get this straight, a man whom two years ago hardly anyone would have ever thought would have ascended to to the presidency, PROACTIVELY perpetrated a mass conspiracy involving the State of Hawaii, a doctor, attending nurses, his parents and his grandparents who put an ad of congratulations in a local Hawaiian paper a week later KNOWING that eventually his citizenship would be questioned? Start passing out the foil hats!
uboreme
· 5 months ago
Are you really this immature? Osama? Really? This is why conservatives are no longer taken seriously?
Dee3
· 5 months ago
Believe it or not I am sixty years old, born in New York city and I have an old black and white photocopy of my birth certificate. It even has a C on it which stands for colored. Back in the day coloured birth certificates were filed separately, in a different place. It is the copy my mother applied for and received in 1948 just before we left New York. My mother always used it for me when she had to verify my birth etc. and then she gave it to me to use when I turned 21. My mother was an organization buff and I guess so am I that's why I still have the original with signatures. It's a keepsake now, because it's no longer considered valid. I had to apply to New York for a new copy of my birth certificate to use to get my passport 2 years ago. The new one has almost no information on it, just certifies that I was born in New York in 1948, but it's considered valid and the original is not, go figure.
Kiki1kat
· 5 months ago
I should feel sorry for you. President Obama HAS given them his birth certificate. Look. I have to enroll my child in middle school and they need the original. Well guess what? I can't put my hands on it so I will go a get a certified copy of it. That is just as good as the one that the hospital presented to me on the date of my child's birth. If I had to present MY original birth certificate, I would not be able to because it was generated over 50 years ago. You and others like you need to find a island to go live on and stay there. If the did not believe he was a REAL U.S. CITIZEN then he would not have been able to run.
The governer of California could never run for a United States Office because - GUESS WHAT? He is not a U.S. born citizen. So what makes you think they are going to ignore that in order to let the POTUS be in his position? You idiots need to go away.
Kirth
· 5 months ago
..
Traitors and secessionists.
..
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
Yes, that is precisely what the British authorities were saying about my ancestors back in 1776.
Don't Tread On Me! A$$HOLE!!
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
RoadScholar said to Randwulf 1 hour ago
"Ah. So you've chosen to remain an America-hating scofflaw conspiracy nut and an official pinhead. I am saddened by your choice."
Logged in as Randwulf
Randwulf 2 minutes ago
You know. I'm 54 years old. I registered for the draft when I was 17. I was drafted three days after my 18th birthday. I avoided going into the army by basically joining the Marine Corps. I had in fact already been accepted into one of their commissioning programs prior to being drafted.
I'm an Eagle Scout, university graduate, former USMC officer, holder a master's degree from a major university and a self-employed construction manager for the past 20 years. I have never taken money form the US government for anything other than my scholarship from the Naval ROTC program in which I enrolled to be commissioned upon graduation and the pay I received while on active duty. I don't ask much from government. I expect it to defend our shores, maintain a highway system and leave me and the rest of the citizenry alone. I believe in small government and free enterprise. I do expect my government not to lie or withhold information from me. They are supposed to work for and be responsible to US.
So if that makes me "an American-hating scofflaw conspiracy nut and an official pinhead" well, I plead guilty. I guess I just don't measure up to what the NEW AMERICAN type is supposed to be. But I was saluting the flag and doing my duty, while others were burning and spitting on flags. I was working when others were laying around waiting for their welfare checks. I proudly wore the uniform and followed my orders while others grew out their hair and bad-mouthed their country. Now those people are calling ME "America-hating"? Whatever.
I distinctly remember the Navy requiring me to get them a copy of my original, long-form BC in order to enter my officer training program to become a 2nd Lt. It was a photocopy of the original with a stamp and official's signature on it. Notarized. I still have that in a file with my Honorable Discharge.
I had no misgivings about producing it for the Naval authority since it was required. That is just to be a 2nd Lt. So now I wonder why the Commander in Chief has a problem handing over a copy of his. That should "sadden" you more than my "American-hating" I should think.
Name
· 5 months ago
How many times does it need to be produced and authenticated by the State of Hawaii to be accepted as evidence, that's the question. If Obama weren't black, would hundreds of people and half a dozen talk show hosts be questioning his birth? Do you doubt his age so that Hawaii wasn't a state when he was born? I just don't get it.
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
"How many times does it need to be produced "
Once would be great!
Oh, and we just want to see if it said "negro" which would have been the right term at that time or if it said "African" which is something that has been cooked up by liberals in recent years.
nonpartay
· 5 months ago
Excuse me, but you seem to forget, President Obama's father WAS African. And from what I have heard, it was common to use African if someone actually was from Africa at that time in Hawaii. Why do you think Hawaiians are lying about this?
Jackie Jones
· 5 months ago
All I needed to join the Navy, get my passport, and apply for my security clearances, was the computer-generated copy I sent for issued by the state of New York. I am not much younger than you, so there you go. Get over it and get a life, already.
Ed
· 5 months ago
So you don't rely on fire departments, police department, you're not going to collect social security, will not not accept help from the national guard in a natural diaster, are against everything NASA does, don't really think we need a border patrol, want the FBI to be abolished, don't really want mail delivered to you or by you, have no intention of using Medicare when you become a senior, would like the network TV stations shut down, think that National parks should be closed, don't want Arlington National cemetary to exist anymore, want the Smithsonian to be closed and the Veteran Administration closed?
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
To you, and you only, Sir, I apologize. I am almost your age, a business owner and employer. Your service to America does you credit, and I mistook you for one of the usual "he ain't really mah President" kooks responding to these articles. You sound like an upstanding fellow; again, my apologies.
It would be a blotch on your status as a productive, loyal American, however, to refuse to see the facts... as countless Conservative writers, court opinions, official inquiries, etc. have come up with no evidence whatsoever that Obama was not born in Hawaii, or that he ever renounced the citizenship accorded him by birth, and have found no substance to these charges.
Do you really think someone forged the microfilm copies of his birth announcements in Hawaii newspapers? Do you really think the Hawaii Bureau of Records personnel are committing deliberate fraud? Do you understand that even though COLBs can be had for naturalized Hawaiians, they always list place of foreign birth? That every record of his entire life that showed "place of birth," even Indonesian elementary school records, lists Hawaii? That it is illegal to remove an original birth certificate from the vault in HI or photograph it? That every State has its own laws regarding these certificates, negating the arguments that "I had to show mine" and "I got the 'long form' etc.?
In questioning the legitimacy of the office of the President, you have lent your support to a dangerous, wasteful, baseless attack on Mr. Obama, which he does not deserve, and is unworthy of a man of your accomplishments. I urge you to repudiate it.
My calling Birthers "America-haters" is partially tongue-in-cheek. It is a reaction to the many long years those of us who protested Mr. Bush's Iraq war and his trampling on Constitutional Rights had to endure; that for doing so (never once, mind you, advocating violent protest or government overthrow) WE were called "America-haters," and I wanted Birthers to see how it feels.
I have one ancestor who emigrated from Ireland and fought alongside Ethan Allen, and another who was a minor Confederate General. My Great Uncle Adm. Frank Lyon signed the surrender papers with the Japanese aboard the USS Missouri. The notion that I am 'against the USA' is abhorrent to the bottom of my soul, and it was maddening.
But as I said, I absolutely retract my remarks to you, Sir. You may be mistaken, but I have no reason to suspect or accuse you of disloyalty.
May your days be long and prosperous.
SLRNashuan
· 5 months ago
Well, I'm a voter for over 40 years and if anyone asked me to produce the long-form hospital birth certificate to prove I'm a citizen, I couldn't. I have no idea where it is now or ever was kept. And, the hospital where I was born no longer exists. I do have a certified copy of my birth from the city where I was born, which I have used for documentation for my entire adult life. My "citizenship" would be questioned by wingnuts who don't accept a certified copy of public records. I'd challenge each and every one of you to produce your own original birth documentation.
Obama has an advantage over me . . . his mother was a lifelong citizen of the US who had not renounced her citizenship. I am satisfied that he was born in Hawaii where his mother and family lived but even if he was born in outerspace, he would be a citizen just like him mom. I'm sure you'd question my documentation since my mother became a US citizen just 30 days before my birth. Further, she was in the hospital for 2 weeks afterward and didn't file the city hall papers until she was released. Hmmm. Sounds suspicious to me.
What is wrong with you people? Just as John McCain, who was born in Panama (unclear if he was born on US base or in hospital off base), is a natural born citizen. Just like the kids of service people and diplomats stationed around the world are citizens. Just like ex-pats working for private global corporations off shore give birth to US citizens. Just like women traveling give birth to US citizens, usually unexpectedly. Look past your obsession with the "original" document and review the circumstances in totality.
I suggest you go to snopes to see certification of his birth. Snopes is a non-partisan fact check site.
Randwulf, with your level of education and achievement, what reason do you have for not taking the time to read Immigration, Naturalization, and Citizenship requirements on the government website and other factual information before adopting your stance? Had you done so, you would not be able to propound this false claim.
Name
· 5 months ago
Huh? The draft ended in 73. It was a numbering draw system by then. Something does not add up Mr. university graduate maybe none of your story does. You certainly did not face Vietnam.
Kansasguy
· 5 months ago
Mr. Weigel:
Considering the name of your website, your article is not very open-minded. You and the commenters who insult persons who question Obama's eligibility only show your ignorance of the subject matter.
The Constitution requires that the President be a "natural born" U.S. citizen, but does not define natural born. The definition has been addressed only once since the Constitution was written, in Minor v. Happersett. In that case the U.S.Supreme Court wrote that a person born in the U.S. to U.S. citizens was natural born. The court stated that it had doubts about persons born under any other circumstances. Such circumstances would include one parent not being a U.S. citizen, as is the case with Obama. They would also obviously include the birth of a person outside the U.S., which might also apply to Obama. The public has never seen his long form birth certificate, showing the hospital and attending physician. The COLB Obama posted his on FightTheSmears website was first posted on the Daily Kos website. Is that not peculiar?
I would have thought that a top-notch university such as Northwestern would have taught you to do some actual historical research before writing such a confident article about "frivolous" lawsuits. It is not the fault of persons like me that the political and legal systems have failed the American public on this issue.
dsincal
· 5 months ago
Uh...well, neat that you couch this bilious argument is such a calm and faux-educated fashion, (in much the same style Dick Cheney presents bs as fact). Last I heard, Hawaii was part of the US when Obama was BORN THERE, as the state of Hawaii as consistently affirmed he was. Nor is there any actual issue of the court having "doubts" bearing any legal weight - it does not. People born in the US are natural born Americans. Period. Nice try though.
nonpartay
· 5 months ago
I dunno. Maybe Hawaii isn't white enough for them so they don't consider it a State? Could be. It's a mystery to me how anyone could be this willfully ignorant.
nonpartay
· 5 months ago
Right. His white American mother went to Kenya on an AIRPLANE at FULL TERM (not allowed in those days) to have a baby, never having been there before nor had she established a patient relationship with any doctor) either during or right after the Mau Mau Rebellion. LOL Sure. I would too! AS IF!!!!
CT_Katie
· 5 months ago
It wouldn't even matter where his mother was when she gave birth. She was American. Her children would be Americans. The end.
nonpartay
· 5 months ago
True. You know, I think this is a case of the bigger the lie the more likely people, some of them, are to believe it. It's so outrageous, no one could have made this up, right? Well, it's still a lie, and I just really wish people would stop to think about what they're doing when perpetuating it. It doesn't look very good for the mental or intellectual state of our nation that this has gone on this long.
t
· 5 months ago
And your point is...
ScottRS
· 5 months ago
The Constitution also does not empower (a) closeted bigots or (b) those simply too stupid to face facts, to define "natural born", either.
politiliedetector
· 5 months ago
It is a frivilous lawsuit, period. Long Form birth certificate whatever, how many presidential birth certificate have you ever seen?, how many were long form?, how many were not? This is reaching, this is activism in search of a desired outcome, and serves absolutely no purpose legally only politically, for those who lost this election on the merits, this guy volunteered after this President was elected, how's that for irony, as I said and will say again this is a frivilous lawsuit that the plantiffs have never even imagined actually winning, this is misdirection, this is sleight of hand, this is what children do when they can't have the candy, at the checkout aisle
"The Constitution requires that the President be a "natural born" U.S. citizen, but does not define natural born."
So you are suggesting that the supreme court do what besides defining "natural born" to facilitate your particular political agenda, isn't that activism.
Oh I forgot you need to be an "other" ruling against the "status quo" to be an activist according to Sen. Grahm, get out of here with the fluff. Your entire point is frivilous as well.
Great Article Weigel
anthonysobin
· 5 months ago
Any idea where John McCain was born? Look it up. It wasn't the USA pal.
Victor
· 5 months ago
For those of you whinebags who keep yacking about Obama to show his birthcertificate, HE ALLREADY DID! You freaking idiots! Pull your heads out of your damn asses!
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
Oh, that was eloquent!
Mnoriega777
· 5 months ago
Amen!
Frankie
· 5 months ago
America is the greatest country in the world. Do you want me to believe that Dick Cheney, Fox News, Rush, Hannity, Beck, Dobbs, O’Reily CIA, FBI, DEA, Homeland Security, US Congress, and Supreme Court Chief Justice Roberts cannot verify that President Obama is a US CITIZEN?
President Obama is my President.
Jackie Jones
· 5 months ago
GOP: The party of religious zealots, tin-foil-hat nutjobs, skinheads, gun nuts, racists, hypocritical adulterers and perverts, crazies and dullards. Thanks, but NO THANKS!
richardba
· 5 months ago
Only this president is asked for a BC, where was a noise when it Bush or Reagan, backhanded racist nonsense. I would hope our elected officials have more important things to do, what a bunch of morons.
Name
· 5 months ago
McCain was born in Panama and the Dems took him to court to make him prove that he was born to two American citizens so your remark is nonoperative.
Read the comments by all the eminent lawyers talking about how unclear the law is. McCain produced his documentation. Why does the same law not apply to Obama?
seattlefran
· 5 months ago
They lost, get over it. At least he won the popular vote and the electoral vote and didn't have to voted in by a corrupt supreme court.
Wellread1
· 5 months ago
In reading the other comments below, I note that most people are focusing on the idea that surely Congress checked Obama's credentials before allowing him to run. That is the puzzle in this mess. There is nothing explicit in the Constitution that requires verification of the President's birth; rather it is only stated that the President must be a "natural-born Citizen". In the smaller world of our founding fathers where everyone of importance knew everyone else, confirming citizenship was probably not required. People were born at home and the townsfolk knew very well who was born to whom. Today circumstances are more complex. I suggest that because Obama's mother was American, most people therefore assumed he would be as well. Furthermore, the race-card was probably very subtlely played here---who would dare to question the rights of a black candidate? This is not to say that Obama is not a deserving candidate who loves his country---he probably is. But the law is the law and the Constitution is inviolate and forms the basis of every legal decision made by the Supreme Court. Hence violating this law is an impeachable offense if there ever was one. Governor Shwarzenegger of California, born Austrian, knows this since he too has had Presidential ambitions. The question now becomes how to manoeuver our way out of this crisis. That is a troubling question......
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
"I suggest that because Obama's mother was American, most people therefore assumed he would be as well."
Wow. My head hurts. For a minute there it sounded like you were making sense. Because that's the law. President Obama's mother was American. He could have been born on the polar ice cap. He's American.
And let's see, what else did you say? Oh yeah -- "who would dare to question the rights of a black candidate?" Hmmm. I will answer that for you since you seem to have forgotten the entire general election campaign. Answer: The Republican Party.
Or did you forget all those ads about Ayers, the stupid birth certificate lawsuit, and the parade of non-sense the GOP subjected us to? The birth certificate thing was dealt with explicitly during the campaign. Even World Net Daily said the b.c. is legitimate.
You're just embarrassing yourself and scaring Democrats into donating to the President's re-election campaign.
politiliedetector
· 5 months ago
"Furthermore, the race-card was probably very subtlely played here---who would dare to question the rights of a black candidate?"
I would imagine the "---who would dare to question the rights of a black candidate?" line was an attempt at sarcasm right
who would illegitimately question the birth state of a black candidate? Well I'll take a swing...
Those who exist in the same ideological echo chamber as the unconfirmed SCOTUS nominee with a history of racist slurs who just happens to head the opposition's assault of a latina Judge with a 17 year history of unbias decisions following the letter of the law.
Ridiculousness, yeah the state of Hawaii knew some 40 years ago that this child would run for the Presidency one day in 2008 right?
Say that in the mirror a few times, and see if Lee Atwater appears as you reflection.
Name
· 5 months ago
Hey Wellread1, I appreciate this well put 2gether post. Very articulate. But if you really think Obama's citizenship is in at all questionable after 1 and a half years of the Clinton's digging and another year or so of the entire Republican Party digging, along with the US vetting process. You and this whole Birther movement are doing nothing but grasping at straws and look more and more fringe.
I don't think the birthers believe that PRESIDENT OBAMA is not a citizen. I think that they can't just come out and say that they hate Ni@&%*'s, so what they are trying to do is make it as difficult on PRESIDENT OBAMA as they possibly can. They do this in order to make the next non white think twice before running for President. But, those pieces of garbage will not win. Racists take heed because your time is up. What you are doing is going to be synonymous with Custer's last stand. You are all Trash!!!!!
Jackie Jones
· 5 months ago
Bingo, that's the main issue. Hawaii has verified his place of birth, over and over again, and the birthers won't accept because they won't accept that they lost to a black man. The seething hatred and denial are all you need to realize what's happening.
summertime
· 5 months ago
You have a point, i can think of no other reason except Racists, and making changes to help all Americans which is something that the Republicans has done, Bill Clinton tried to reform Healthcare and the Repub's were against that and nothing got done. No President Obama is trying again and all they are thinking about is how much TAX will the RICH have to pay, not thinking about the Middle Class who has been paying along. They will find every excuse in the book to keep Healthcare the way it is going up every year for the working and the retired people.
24AheadDotCom
· 5 months ago
Here's a question for Dave Weigel: is he accusing Janice Okubo of committing a crime? Because, if she did verify anything relating to Obama's private information, then she's broken Hawaiian state law. Here's their statute against revealing private information.
Is Weigel accusing her of breaking that law?
Either that, or Weigel is trying to mislead again. If she didn't break the law, then she didn't verify the certificate that's pictured on Obama's site. In other words, we're back to square one: there's no guarantee that what's shown on Obama's site matches what HI has on file.
If you want the truth about this issue - no speculation, no tinfoil hat talk, and no attempts to mislead such as Weigel engages in - see my completely fact-based overview.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
SO let me get this straight....we are somehow someway suppose to believe you instead of the whole government of Hawaii? Who are you? Where did you go to college? Why should we believe anything that comes out of your mouth? Come on retard you have some splanin to do
afisher
· 5 months ago
Minus all the BOLD FACE yelling, the same question could be put to any citizen of the USA, especially those who were born at home. How can we trust that hospitals are telling the truth...blah blah blah.
As you and those like you are so sure that President Obama was born elsewhere...go find the THAT PROOF!
As for all the legislative efforts....a waste of taxpayers dollars! But someone is making money off of all this...are you? Who is paying for the lawsuits...as we know that lawyers rarely really work for free.
Lava Lee Pyre
· 5 months ago
Wow. Took you like, 6 hours to come up with a crazy accusation and yet you still have nothing to rebut the facts in this article. Face it, you've wasted large amounts of time on a complete fantasy.
ObamaSupporter
· 5 months ago
I hate 'birthers' with a passion!!!!!!!!!!
How dare they try to take our wonderful president away from us!!!!!!!
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
Oh no! Not a HATER!
He is taking himself away from you by refusing to come clean on his own.
How has he not come clean? The state of Hawai'i has produced the birth certificate. Did you read the article?
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
Oh NO! Not another HATER!
He is taking HIMSELF away from you with every deception he continues.
Alice Fried
· 5 months ago
The face of America is changing and these sad people can't handle the change. President Obama has us looking into our souls for change and there are those who only understand power and money. And because so many Americans are willing to take a chance on something different, the powers that be are trying to destroy the man who offered us the opportunity. It's too bad that those who know better, are willing to prostitute their integrity in order to maintain their status quo in American government. Nothing the President has said or done justifies this. Only the color of his skin. Shame on us for allowing this garbage to become mainstream news.
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
"Shame on us for allowing this garbage to become mainstream news."
What mainsteam news has it entered. They are all a-hush over it. The last thing they want is for it to spill over into TV land. It has already gone viral on the net and the rest of the world is amazed that nothing has been done to find out the truth in the matter. Oh, and most of the people of Kenya believe Obama was born in Mombasa, just as his step-grandmother Sarah stated.
hyjanks
· 5 months ago
Obama's mother. American citizen. Child born to American citizen is American. End of story. Me thinks Randwulf and his ilk need to go back to McGuffey's Reader or the tales of Dick & Jane. If they study the text really hard, maybe they will learn how to read.
BoogityBoogity
· 5 months ago
HAHAHAHA
It's fun watching right wingnut heads explode.
He's a Muslim too.....and the White House is heated with a furnace full of aborted fetuses....but only the white ones....
LOLOLOL
Pete
· 5 months ago
The 'birthers' are a little group of nut jobs which just proves that there are as many or more basket weavers running around loose as there are in confinement.
ottothescourge
· 5 months ago
A lot of these Republicans began as innocent feces as well.
CT_Katie
· 5 months ago
What I don't understand in all of this is: There is no dispute that Obama's mother is an American citizen. Even if she had given birth overseas, which she didn't, but even if she had, when an American citizen gives birth overseas, isn't that child automatically an American citizen? If I give birth in England, the baby I bring back to the US is an American citizen. Sigh. It doesn't matter. I know conspiracy theorists only use facts as fuel to further their conspiracies.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
But Katie, don't you see? That's just what they WANT you to believe. It really turns out that his mother isn't Stanley. All the real paperwork was intentionally destroyed. And then President Obama had to fly to Hawaii to murder this Stanley person before she could spill the beans about the secret that the entire state of Hawaii had for some reason been keeping for 47 years up until that moment.
All this had somehow gone unnoticed when President Obama was running for prior public office. Don't ask me how. I'm pulling sh*t outta my @ss as fast as I can just to get this far...
Geez, being a conspiracy theorist is easy. Facts that don't support the conspiracy just go to show HOW DEEP AND PERVASIVE the conspiracy really is!!!!
CT_Katie
· 5 months ago
Point taken. They come from a dark place, go to a dark place, then keep digging. Can it all be pure racism? Racists unite with conspiracy theorists, each unhinged in their own way, to produce a staggeringly dishonest campaign to....what? In the end, it all stems from an effort to turn away from the real dangers that society faces. That's my best take on it. And it only serves to further the same purpose: it keeps them - and others - from confronting the real dangers that society faces. Maybe that's the real danger of it?
Dave
· 5 months ago
His mother was a citizen; therefore, he is a citizen. That's all there is to it.
Why are they too stupid to get this?
stevo
· 5 months ago
There's no satisfying Fascists
johnbakalik
· 5 months ago
This ole WW2vet cannot believe how dumb some who are in this US government are, Obama should make millions of copys of his birth certificate , autograph them and put them on sale for another term of his presidency. So keep it up you dumb repugs !!!!!!
MarciaJ720
· 5 months ago
They have already released copies of his "Certified Copy of Live Birth" and that's all anyone is ever going to see.
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
It is a fake and no real one exists. So I guess you are right.
John Donald Carlucci
· 5 months ago
Please explain how you know it is fake and cite source proving it.
Dude, you're pretty computer savvy! Name a price for the autographed birth certificates! ROFLMAO!!!
jbridy
· 5 months ago
It's like the "Whitewater" investigation without the land, the loans, the money, the 'official' investigation or any end in sight or an honest conclusion even desired. It is the corporate think tank plan and the paid for media's repeat of the big lie that counts when deliberately deceiving the American public.
Marilyn
· 5 months ago
What will happen when every person has a DNA test and all birth information is made public and all children can go after their biological parent and sue them for abandonment of parental responsibility? Be careful that these accusations don't come back to bite you!
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Um, im not running for President. If you are wanting the job as President, most of your privacy ends or should end. The American people should know as much about you as humanly possible. Strangely enough, many of Obama's past record were sealed. Like I said before, if you want this to end, simply show the Birth Certificate. That is all he has to do. I dont know if he has it or not but it sure makes you wonder why he has refused to release it for at least a year now.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
SEALED?? PROVE IT OR STFU
John Donald Carlucci
· 5 months ago
Please cite exact sources in detail before talking general crap. Specifically name the records that are sealed and the research you have done (besides listen to Fox or talk radio) to confirm the sealing.
I hope this news makes it big time. When they realize that Obama is really a citizen and everyone hears about this ridiculous fiasco that party is going to just fade away. PLEASE FADE AWAY REPUBLICANS...keep talking the trash so we can through you out.
MarciaJ720
· 5 months ago
I wish these birthers truly understood what a "Certified Copy of a Live Birth" really is.
Original documents are NEVER, EVER, EVER released from any Country Registrar's office. Instead, all they can release is what they call a document that "Certifies" that there is on file with the Registrar's office an official birth or death announcement.
Obama would not have a valid passport without that original birth being on record. Idiots. Pure, gullible idiots to believe this stuff when FactCheck.Org (a right-leaning group btw) has dismissed this whole charade.
Fox News, et al has managed to make a whole lot of people paranoid and this paranoia is so close to what certain elements in Germany were doing before WW2.
The truth is that there are plenty of people in this here United States who to this day do not recognize a black man as anything but 3/5's a human being. Case-in-point.... my mother and father-in-law are still caught up with family losses from the Civil War.
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
Go back to your TV inspired lunacies. Blame it on Fox. Blame it on the NAZIS. Blame it on the 3/5ths compromise.. And for God's sake, get over the Un-Civil War.
I believe the president could probably get a good photocopy released or arrange for the original to be examined by some unbiased third party examiners of several of them, if he weren't afraid to show it. There should be a long form there in the file. Or not.
Many states release photocopies of the original long form on request.
Laurie Davis
· 5 months ago
Why do you even care? Good grief, do you ever need a LIFE! Why don't you spend your intellectual energy on trying to help others, instead of trying to tear them down? We've got work to do, dude, I'll bet you know plenty of people who are unemployed/underemployed, schools that need help, families that are suffering without healthcare, etc. Go do something USEFUL!
JohnQPublic
· 5 months ago
Why does this even matter?
His mother is from Kansas. She is an American citizen. That makes her children American citizens. Are birthers saying that a Mexican woman can come into this country and give birth to an Amercian citizen, but a girl from Kansas cannot?
Are they saying that because his father had British citizenship, that trumps the mother's birthright? Do the birthers know of a little thing called "The Revolutionary War" where we severed ties with England?
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
You've never read the Constitution, have you?
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
I carry a copy and have committed much of it to memory. JohnQ is correct. Born on US soil = Natural-Born Citizen.
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
Yes, but do you understand it? And who said he was born on US soil? Hell, Obama himself can't even get it straight which hospital he claims to have been born in. Maybe he needs to get a copy of his long form and read it himself. You know, so he can try to keep it straight. Kapi'olani or Queens? Which is it?
akarmenia1
· 5 months ago
RoadScholar - Could you pointout to me where in JohnQ's comment it says "born on US soil?" His argument is that Obama's MOTHER was born in Kansas, which makes HER a natural born citizen, not him unless he, too was born on US soil. Therein lies the debate, not in his mother's birthplace. So it looks like your little pocket-sized Constitution doesn't help you much there.
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
By golly, you're right. John Q was saying that her mother being a citizen makes the children citizens. He's wrong. Born on American soil = Natural Born Citizen, regardless of the citizenship status of the parents.
And the Constitution reads the same no matter what size it is.
By claiming the Hawaii COLB is not sufficient, Birfers are advocating ignoring Hawaii State law, and accusing their Bureau of Records personnel of fraud.
The claims are nonsense. Here's one Court Opinion:
The court finds the claims against Mr. Obama’s citizenship “wholly unpersuasive and bordering on the frivolous, especially in light of the complete absence of any first-hand evidence on any critical issue” and further classifies it as “conspiracy theory of the lowest sort, fueled by nothing than internet rumor and those who truly want to believe egging each other on.”
susanfrench
· 5 months ago
JohnQ...Yay you. Thank you. And as someone else here said: doesn't anybody here work? What a waste of time this whole argument is.
akarmenia1
· 5 months ago
Another blind Obama worshiper who has NO idea what the Constitution says (or perhaps even what it is).
smidget
· 5 months ago
The Constitution says that anyone born on American soil is a natural-born US citizen.
The Constitution doesn't get more specific than that. US Laws were written to supplement the Constitution and clarify what being a "natural-born US citizen" is.
Do you have any idea how ironic it is when someone who has NO idea what the Constitution says try to call other people out for the same?
hyjanks
· 5 months ago
Question: What do Rush Limbaugh and god have in common? Answer: Neither served in the military in spite of being physically fit. Oh. Excuse me. There's that little matter of Rush being excused from the draft because of a boil on his a$$. The jury's still out on weather or not Jesus has a similar malady.
summertime
· 5 months ago
Stefan Frederick Cook case questing President Obama Citizenship was dismisses by a Federal Judge on Thursday. With all the problems Americans are struggling with today the Republicans has nothing better to do than question the Birth Certificate of the President Obama six month into his Presidency, this is some kind of sick what must the World think of this country.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
What you people dont understand, is ALL this would go away if he simply showed the damn Birth Certificate. I see many of you liberals want to pounce on those asking him show it. Excuse me but common sense says end the speculation by showing it. If he does indeed have the stupid thing, then doesnt it make you wonder why he has yet to show it? Why is he fighting it if there is nothing to hide?
Some of you are so damn quick to pounce on anyone who dares question your saviour, you fail to see the common sense in all of this. Let me break it down one more time for you that are apparently really really slow. IF OBAMA WOULD STOP FIGHTING IT AND JUST SHOW THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE....ALL THIS GOES AWAY. There, you get it now?!
Joe Einloth
· 5 months ago
He showed it online and you STILL ain't buyin' it!! So, WGAS what you tinfoil hat wearin' buffoons think!
chuckj
· 5 months ago
That WAS NOT his Birth Certificate. That has been proven over and over again. A certificate of live birth is easily attainable even if you werent born where said live birth certificate says. Show the real certificate and it all goes away. It is that damn simple.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
Still waiting to see yours idiot
slimslowslider
· 5 months ago
why would anyone want this sideshow to go away? any lawyers working for obama are doing it pro bono and it keeps you goofballs busy instead of getting out there and causing real trouble. plus, for most of america, you folks are hilarious!
also, please, more CAPZ LOCK!
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
PROVE IT OR STFU TROLL
WashIndepend
· 5 months ago
Do you have a Certificate of Live Birth that shows you were born somewhere you were not? What proof do you have that it is easy to obtain such a document? No one has their original birth certificate. It is submitted to the state by the doctor or hospital where you were born. The state keeps it. Some states provide you with a photocopy of the original birth certificate and some states only provide you with a Certificate of Live Birth that contains the pertinent details of your birth. Hawaii is one of those states. The state of Hawaii certifies that the birth occurred in Hawaii. It is a legal document accepted by all agencies and courts in the US. You can get a passport with it, a driver's license with it, a Social Security card with it. It is for all intents and purposes your legal birth certificate. I know I'm wasting my breath on those of you who just won't accept the evidence that has been provided. I can only pity you.
pslong009
· 5 months ago
What do you think about the announcements in two newspapers in Hawaii announcing his birth? Especially considering that announcement came from Hawaii's Dept of Health, not his parents? Do you really think that Hawaii's Dept of Health would have given out false information 48 years ago on the extremely slight chance that the child might grow up to be President of the United States?
Jim
· 5 months ago
"A certificate of live birth is easily attainable even if you werent born where said live birth certificate says. "
This is not true. The certificate of live birth, which is Hawaii's name for what is commonly known as a birth certificate, is computer generated from records that the state certifies to be correct.
Joe Einloth
· 5 months ago
A$$hat!!!! Who's gonna certify a live out of state birth? YOU'r damn simple!
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
WHERE IS YOURS? SHOW YOURS HOW DO WE KNOW THAT YOU ARE EVEN HUMAN?
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
Hey, your cap lock is on.
slimslowslider
· 5 months ago
the only people speculating are morons, bifers make up like .00007% of the population. no one cares what you think, dig? we are laughing at you. all of us. also, glad to see you see you are a member of the CAPZ LOCK POSSE!!!
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
Laugh away! See you at the insurrection! Got Ammo?
slimslowslider
· 5 months ago
don't forget your walker, gramps! i will be the guy pointing and laughing at you.
achiles
· 5 months ago
Yep! Loaded to the teeth. Bring it idiot!
LeftyODoule
· 5 months ago
He's half black, his father was Muslim, he MUST BE A FOREIGNER. The greatest thing about Obama's presidency is how pissed it makes you racists.
Dorothy: Wow, I'm glad we're not in Kansas anymore, Toto!
Toto: Me, too! I'VE got more brains than this a$$h@t!!
Wayoutwest
· 5 months ago
I have a question, does anyone work anymore? I'm having trouble understanding why people are debating this topic. The birthers are not interested in the facts, they want one thing, the removal of a president by any means. They can not accept that Americans elected Obama. Their tactics of voter intimidation and manipulation didn't work this time and they are mad as hell. They are not crazy they have an agenda. First try to delegitimize him, he isn't really an American. Next demonise him, marxist-socialist, Antichrist. Then if they can't impeach him try to overthrow him, good luck with that. Look at how they responded to the coup in Guatemala, it's ok if he is a marxist. When these tactics don't work assassinate him, actually i think this was their first choice. Luckily for us Obama has excellent security. Because they can't get to him they go after "liberals" like the people in church and the police officers who were murdered. Call these people what they really are, traitors, cowards, terrorists.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Youre an idiot. The only agenda is to find out if he indeed has a birth certificate. Thats all. If he has it, show it and its all done with.
I realize you look to Obama as your King but he's no king and hes no saviour.
Now, please stop saying he hasn't shown it. You have seen it with your own eyes if you clicked on this link. Also, I recommend reading Dreams From My Father. It explains all about his background and was written long before he had decided on a political career.
Wayoutwest
· 5 months ago
Come on Chuck say what you really mean. We had King George, or was it King Dick? The birth certificate thing is b.s. and you know it. Have the guts to to state your real intentions. Come on let it out and you will feel better.
nonpartay
· 5 months ago
You know, all this may be the reason they haven't found a church since being in office. It may just be considered too dangerous. Between "good" church people stumping for his failure and other terrible things to happen to him and the fact that church isn't safe (reference Dr. Tiller), they may have decided just to hang up going until he's through being President. I wouldn't blame him. I wouldn't blame any of them.
emberAZ
· 5 months ago
Thank you so much for your words. I agree with you.
jtjsrch
· 5 months ago
RIGHT ON! Most of the old "classic Country Club" Rs whom I know have not voted R in YEARS. It has ceased to be a party.....it is now a group of racist, religious wackos.
subterfugitive
· 5 months ago
I'm sorry GOP. Try as you may but you will never convince me that government doesn't work. You will never get my cynical or hateful vote, especially when it is you who is, with unprecedented desperation, trying to stop government from working, trying to plant cynicism in the hearts and minds of the American people, and are promoting hatred and xenophobia in a most fragile time in our nation's history.
Shame.
akarmenia1
· 5 months ago
As if cynicism towards government is such a bad thing. Try reading any single document of the Founding Fathers (like, maybe the COnstitution to start) and you will undoubtedly see that cynicism towards government is what this great nation was founded on. Not a heavy reliance on the nanny state to make sure you don't fall down and scratch your knee without anyone to sue.
mikeG56
· 5 months ago
Don’t you know he’s a Black Gay Muslim Terrorist who yearns to live in San Francisco someday, is a direct descendent of Hitler (on his mothers side) stills pals around with terrorist (he did recently meet with George Bush) and can see North Korea from his house, which is a good thing because he’ll be able to help his friend Kim Jung ILL guide the missiles in to help America become free from the capitalist stronghold. I don’t know about you but this guy scares me.
No the other hand being a Gay Muslim he may not have time for all of the above as he is probably tied up (and I don’t mean that in a sexual way) with redecorating the Whitehouse not to mention prayer 5 times a day. It’s all about color.
Did I mention he’s not a citizen.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Some of you are so damn quick to pounce on anyone who dares question your saviour, you fail to see the common sense in all of this. Let me break it down one more time for you that are apparently really really slow. IF OBAMA WOULD STOP FIGHTING IT AND JUST SHOW THE REAL BIRTH CERTIFICATE....ALL THIS GOES AWAY. There, you get it now?!
If he has it great, then the people who question it can move on. If he doesnt then there is a problem and it needs to be looked at. I dont know if he has it or not but common sense tells me if he's put a a fight for a year now in refusing to show it or address it, it kinda makes you wonder why.
subterfugitive
· 5 months ago
You just said that.
americanteacher
· 5 months ago
Did you read the article chuckj? Did you see the link? Did you click on it? Did you see the birth certificate? Will you be satisfied with it? I'll bet you won't.
LawGirl
· 5 months ago
chuckj - did you know that none of us can show our "real birth certificate". The only thing any of us can get are "certified copies". Real birth certificates are kept somewhere safe in a county clerk's office.
Tell you what - go down to the county where you were born and ask to see your "real birth certificate". Let us know what happens.
DucksInDenver
· 5 months ago
It looks like you haven't read the article. Obama has shown his birth certificate - he even posted it on the Internet last year. Take a look:
The people who think he doesn't have a birth certificate are so blinded by their racism and hatred, that they simply ignore the fact that Obama - certifiably and undeniably - has one. The state of Hawaii has already proven this beyond any reasonable doubt.
rcwblessed
· 5 months ago
Hey Stupid,
Guess what? I strongly believe President Obama's refusal to produce his birth certificate is his way to EF with you ignorant, inbred birthers. He produced a legitimate birth certificate, which you asinine people refuse to accept. Accordingly, Obama is not dealing with this silliness. However, it must be fun from his point of view to sit back and watch so many of you idiots wasting your time and money on law suits. I'm getting a kick out of that too. One thing all of you fail to acknowledge... Obama is an extremely brilliant and shrewd politician. He will have the last laugh in this matter. Deal with it!
mikeG56
· 5 months ago
What in your opinion would be the real Brith Cert? What would satisfy you?
chuckj
· 5 months ago
His real birth certificate. Thats it. I dont understand what the issue is. He can either show it and all of this goes away, or continue to fight it and the law suits will pile up. Why is he making it so hard?
I have no theory if he was born in Hawaii or not but the fight and refusal he is putting up makes me wonder.
dzerres
· 5 months ago
He hasn't "refused". His campaign put the actually picture of the birth certificate on the internet. What do you people want? I know, I know ... the moon landings didn't happen either. They too were staged. You people are idiots.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
dz, they put up a picture of a Certificate of Live Birth. Not his birth certificate. If he had indeed showed his real birth certificate, there would not be any law suits.
Name
· 5 months ago
Hey Chuck. Got a REAL question 4 u. Do you believe this country is so idiotic that the entire US Presidential Elections, matter of fact the US Government, can be tricked into electing a foriegner as President of the United States, simply by asking some 2 bit Clerk in some office in Hawaii, to say,"Hey, he's a citizen and here's a altered photocopy of his birth certificate". If that's true, then Iran, Russia, China and every other enemy of the state must really be kicking themselves in the a$$. "After all this time wasted with money and spy networks, all it took was a $5 fake birth certificate, DAMN"
Name
· 5 months ago
this from the same party that, in 2006, started screaming that foreigners should be eligible for the presidency so you could put another actor in the white house to fool everyone from knowing that Goldman Sachs, Monsanto & the Carlysle Group would be running/raping the country????
Do you have dementia? i live in california and all we heard from the retardlicans was that schwarzenegger was the next reagan and your #1 goal, other than to send more americans to die for iraq's oil, was to get rid of the born in the us requirement so you could start parading Arnold for the presidency. so NOW that the dark skinned guy actually won, you are running 180 degrees in the other direction.
stability and consistency is best when raising children and dogs/cats - now to start trying to raise the knee jerk retardlicans the same way and there might be some sanity restored to the world
swat68
· 5 months ago
A Certificate of Live Birth is the same thing as a Birth Certificate -- each state can call it whatever they want. The state of Hawaii has verified that it is accurate. What else would you have him do? How about the "birthers" prove that he is NOT a citizen? Why should the burden of proof be place on him? Where is the proof that his mother left the country and give birth to him elsewhere? Do you really think that the FBI, etc. would allow him to take the Oath of Office without doing a thorough background check? People are ridiculous...
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
MAKES ME WONDER HOW THE HELL YOU TIE YOUR SHOES....OR DO YOU EVEN KNOW WHAT SHOES ARE?
Rich Monk
· 5 months ago
McCain was born is Panama. What's your fricking point? You rethugs, you bunch of ignorant fat-ass Dopes,. How about bombing some abortion clinics or killing innocent Doctors for fun? Haven't you done enough damage in the name of religious Christian republican family values such as racism, hate, greed, bigotry and intolerance? After all it's what Jesus would "never" do.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Wow. From the side that preaches tolerance comes folks like you Richmonk. You are among the many hypocrits on the left. Seems to me, youve got some issues with anger and hate. Might want to get that checked out. McCain's family was also in the military and apart of the military when that birth occurred. Oh and the democrats made sure McCain had to prove all that, yet when something simple is asked of your saviour, people like you get offended and angry. See, I can have a conversation without being hateful and angry. Why cant you? You mustve been among the many liberals that showed nothing but absolute hate for our previous President, yet here you are spewing this garbage.
LawGirl
· 5 months ago
What you mistake for being "offended and angry" is my wishing you would either fix the economy, get millions their jobs back, fix the Middle East, fix Wall Street, fix my 401K or STFU already.
We have bigger issues ahead of us, and you are content to just sit there and throw stones from the sandbox. Enough already. Admit that you don't like him because he doesn't look like you and be done with it already.
John Donald Carlucci
· 5 months ago
I haven't seen a birther movement develope around McCain, but I don't watch Fox (fair and balanced) News.
Love how you always roll out the lack of tolerance from the Left right before you spew your ugliness.
Here is one for you - love how you repubs always roll out the family values and sanctity of marriage... Then your leaders get caught with their dicks in the wrong places.
Please explain why any of us should be tolerant of idiocy.
Why should we suffer fools? You are worthless to society as a whole, useless at making any type of rational argument, and really the only thing you're good for is making us laugh at your ever-increasing stupidity.
Also, why shouldn't we be hateful and angry at how far our society has fallen to create people with such inability to think for themselves, use rational thought, logic, and reason? We should be past angry at the dumbing down of our society. We should be downright hateful that people like you even exist. You should be WAY smarter. It's simply indicative of incredibly poor educating.
akarmenia1
· 5 months ago
Here is your typical liberal argument...you sound like my college professors, Richmonk, and not the smart ones.
Name
· 5 months ago
oh come now, your argumentation shows plainly you were home schooled - so i guess your "college professors" were showing you sesame street and those were the ones that were "smart" to you Seriously, Jesus did not advocate MURDER and BOMBING and KILLING Dr's - like your group does - so you are, by definition, a complete hypocrit
chuckj
· 5 months ago
As a matter of fact, I think im reporting your comment Richmonk. Save your bigot, hypocritical hate for some where else.
SodamY
· 5 months ago
Yo rip on republican closet hero Fred Phelps, god hates facts and fact enablers.
mikeG56
· 5 months ago
How many Birth Cert dose he need to show you before you'll believe he a US citizen?
Name
· 5 months ago
how many of these wingnut psychos would have or did vote for McCan't - you know, the guy who was PROVEN TO BE BORN IN PANAMA??????
dzerres
· 5 months ago
... and the Army got him fired from his civilian job in the defense contracting industry because the Army said that the former Major is not longer allowed on any military installation (kookiness is a security risk, after all). So, the military is not backing the Major's claim, in fact the opposite is true, although this fact, along with all the other facts, don't seem to bother the right wing wingnuts.
akarmenia1
· 5 months ago
Are you seriously blowing smoke over a joke with questionably bad taste? The hypocrisy is astounding. Where were you when Letterman joked about Alex Rodriguez knocking up Sarah Palin's daughter? Or Wanda Sykes wishing that Limbaugh's kidneys would fail? Talk about "bad taste." The double-talk from the Huffington Post is outright ridiculous. The same people who blasted Republicans for caring about the fact that Bill Clinton had multiple affairs while in the Oval Office are now showcasing every Republican who ahs an affair. Which is it? Are they just jokes or are they bad taste? You can't decide what is right depending on who said it about whom.
hemnebob1
· 5 months ago
i don't know about you but entertainers are not my compass for political matters. if they determine who you like or dislike, well then that is your burden not mine. for how many years has blimpbaugh the druggie, been slinging crap all over the airwaves? way before clinton took office was this obese man sliming up the airwaves towards who he hated so don't take no high road on this crap. lots of entertainers make jokes in bad taste but they aren't making policy nor do they determine who or whom i vote for.
get real akarmenia1
Name
· 5 months ago
you are completely off the rails with any sense aka, republicans spent MILLIONS of taxpayer money investigating Clinton and trying to impeach him - NOT because they "cared" about maital fidelity, but because - as they have shown with an astounding clear light, that they are partisan witch hunters at their core.
SO, when those SAME rethuglicans who screamed for Clinton to resign over a marital infidelity are almost ALL shown to be committing marital infidelity, and bribing the mistress' families to shut up, etc etc OF COURSE it needs to be given AT LEAST the same amount of attention that Rethugs gave Clinton - that's just playing fair.
i know you can't handle that - you want Darth and Jr back in office so they can strip more rights away from citizens, allow more massive terror attacks to occur in the us (they were in charge of protecting us on 9/11 and they DID NOT) and all that dictatorial crap we suffered for 8 years.
sorry buddy, can fool all of the people some of the time, & some of the people all of the time, but not all of the people all of the time - oh yeah, you might want to teach Jr that phrase, since as the president and leader of the most powerful country in the world he couldn't even get through the first paranthetical phrase before screwing that up like he did this whole country.
akarmenia1
· 5 months ago
I'm Sorry, name, you're going to have to catch me up on the witty nicknames that you liberals give to everyone you demonize. Jr? Darth? Whatever. Your logic doesn't add up, no matter who you give the pet names to.
The fact of the matter is that while Republicans were impeaching for purgery, Democrats were yelling at the top of their lungs that what goes on in the bedroom of politicians is none of our business. Now all of the sudden it's a huge deal when GOPers do it. I agree, though, that all politicians who cheat on their spouses should be put on the spotlight. I'm glad that you've come around to understanding that infidelity is a serious offense and ought to be given attention. The next step is to stop complaining when Repubs do it and then praising the Huffington Post when they do it.
Double standard is the name of the liberal game.
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
At least we can spell.
smidget
· 5 months ago
No, personal lives are not of the public's business.
But when someone has the nerve to comment on "family values" and rail against people who have affairs claiming they should resign from office, and then they get caught having an affair, it is not the extramarital sex that liberals like to point out, it's the blatant hypocrisy.
I wouldn't expect a con to recognize hypocrisy, or to see the big deal, since it's the only way you know how to function, but you could at least try to figure out what people are actually complaining about instead of making sh!t up as you go along (although I know that's also instinctual for you people).
hemnebob1
· 5 months ago
i don't know where you have been living chuckj but that issue isn't even an issue anymore. don't you have anything with substance? have you already finished reading the national enquirer and have nothing else to whine about? this is a non-issue and the fact that for some reason you wish to evade reality is your issue. so nobody i know regards our president as anyone other than a man (except you) and as far as most of America? you are just a loser and have some real profound mental issues...bet you temper is quick to ignite and nobody around you is right but you... yep... THERE, YOU GET IT NOW??
you are a loser.
peterdv
· 5 months ago
These guys are just tin foil on the windows, knuckle dragging freaks!!! Why don't they just wear their hoods and come out of the closet!!! Hey Whigs... I mean Republicans, you lost, your out of touch. Your experiment for the last 30 years failed. This country is in deep crap because of your policies and beliefs. Go away!! This country has had enough of you!!!
sinking
· 5 months ago
I challenge any 'birther' to produce their original birth certificate. To acquire an U.S. Passport, you must should your birth certificate. Every state that I know of will provide you with a 'certified' copy of your birth certificate, but you'll never see nor touch the original.
newsmonster09
· 5 months ago
I think it has become somewhat dangerous to make statements like this. Rachel Maddow did a good segment on it a while back which I am too lazy to look for, but you should check it out. Her point was that, it is dangerous when a swath of people believe that the President is illegitimate. It is the kind of hostile, not-so-subtly racist belief that can lead to crazy fringe group violence.
LawGirl
· 5 months ago
As a life-long progressive, I applaud the "birther" movement, the Tea Parties, the Sex Scandals, the C-Street Scandals, the hiking of the Appalachian Trail, the mindboggling resignations and the speeches that go with them, the Minutemen, the Ricky Ricardo comments to our next Supreme Court justice, the racist mailings, the racist E-mails, and CD's with racist parody songs and the efforts to ban timeless classics.
Keep it up. You might get the White House back again in 2112. Maybe.
Benjamin
· 5 months ago
@LawGirl, hear hear. The parade of constant, absurd xenophobia may play well with the hardcore Republican base, but totally alienate most Americans -- as do the repeated acts of moral hypocrisy of the "upcoming stars" of the GOP.
Name
· 5 months ago
double agree with both of you - without the independents or 'non-party' voters neither a dem or rep can get into the white house.
and all of this 'we're proud to be retarded, just like Jr is' is making any independent with a modicum of a brain run like the wind away from the rep party.
so funny - does anyone remember in 2005/06 when ALL of the Rethugs were trying to tout the english mangling, cocaine fried frat boy Jr as the best American president ever? while eating freedom fries?
how can anyone take any of these guys seriously and not want to put them into a white, strapped jacket?
SPECOPS
· 5 months ago
Did the F.B.I NOT DUE A BACKGROUND CHECK FOR A SECURITY CLEARENCE FOR PRES, OBAMA? HOW DUMB ARE THE R?
CT_Katie
· 5 months ago
This Orly Taitz person who financed the reservist who volunteered to serve in Afghanistan only to then say he couldn't go because Obama is not an American? She's a Russian-born dentist-lawyer who lives in Orange County, CA. Who cares a lot about American democracy, because she says she doesn't want to see the same abuses happen here that happened in the old Soviet Union. So she's using propaganda and disinformation to promote a rabid and dishonest hate campaign against the first black president. Makes complete sense to me.
dorkus54
· 5 months ago
Hello, I"m a "birther" and I have serious mental problems. I only trust the government that I voted for and all my allegiances to my country are contingent on getting what I want. I think the earth is 6000 years old, that humans hand-fed dinosaurs and that the "Flintstones" is a documentary. Why won't anyone take me seriously?
hemnebob1
· 5 months ago
kobach is a loser just like the republican party. get over it people, something should be ringing in your ears right now like "hey...we lost, must be that we have the wrong idea about Americans... they don't like our principles..."
like, duh...
they will never get it.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Why do I let myself continue to be surprised about that amount of hate from liberals. I mean seriously, look at these comments. All from the side the touts 'tolerance', equality, etc etc etc.
There would be no issue here is he showed his BIRTH CERTIFICATE and not a easily attainable Certificate of Live Birth. The matter would have been put to rest by now. Some men in the miliary have refused to take any orders for deployment until a birth certificate is shown. They have every right to do so. So please, Mr. Obama, just show your damn birth certificate! WHy is that so damn hard?
LawGirl
· 5 months ago
chuckj - please go down and read my comment below. No one can show a "real birth certificate" and for very good reason. They like to keep those things safe in the county clerk's office.
I can tell you this, however, if you ever got a passport or ran for office after 9/11/2001, you were subjected to amazingly stringent background checks. And given that it was the Bush Administration who would have handled those background checks - something tells me that they would have flagged Obama, if there had been a problem.
Really...read a book sometime...stop reinforcing the stereotype.
SodamY
· 5 months ago
HE DID SHOW HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE YOU #^%%#$ MORON. DID YOU ACTUALLY READ THE ARTICLE YOU NEO-CONFEDERATE SACK OF STUPID!
MD
· 5 months ago
chuckj Soldiers who refuse to serve or take orders because of this should be sent to court. Such soldiers are despicable cowards and very clearly looking for an excuse not to serve our country. They need to be asked; Do you believe in the United States of America or do you believe in looney conspiracy theories that only serve to hurt America? Would you choose to stand up and defend America or would you cower and use conspiracy theories as an excuse to not fight? Enough of this b.s. If you choose to serve America in our military you serve America - not conspiracy theories and [actually] not any one politician. You serve an idea that is America. It goes way way beyond the things you do not like about a sitting president.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Hear, hear.
snesich
· 5 months ago
Actually, just one little dope has refused his military orders because of this moronic "birth certificate" thing. And he should be dealt with like any military person who refuses to honor his oath.
Name
· 5 months ago
The law says:
"If only one parent is a U.S. Citizen at the time of ones birth, that parent must have resided in the United States for minimum ten years, five of which must be after the age of 16."
O's mother was only 18 and does not meet this test. She did not and can not pass her citizenship to her son. Sorry you don't like how the law is written.
Name
· 5 months ago
ugh, this is why you need actual degrees from established universities before you show the grade schoolers laws.
here is your MASSIVE mistake - that quoted requirement is for U.S. Citizens that become U.S. Citizens after having moved here from ANOTHER COUNTRY -
if the parent is a U.S. Citizen from birth, born in this country like O's mom was, then that requirement does NOT apply.
but if you want to carry water for it fine - let's deport every and all people born to parents in the US that were under the age of 26 - because in your little mind they are not U.S Citizens so they must be illegal aliens -
and let's start with Trigg Palin ... his parents were both under 18 when he was born so get his illegal alien ass out of the country, right? birthers, here is your next cause!!! DEPORT TRIGG PALIN!
see - following retardlican logic will get you into trouble ...
Name
· 5 months ago
You DO understand that 18 is older than 16, aren't you?
rep50
· 5 months ago
That' applies to those that are not natural born US citizens She was born in the USA. She was already a citizen.
smidget
· 5 months ago
Actually, it only applies to people who were born outside of the US.
smidget
· 5 months ago
You are forgetting the inconvenient fact that he was born on American soil.
Oh, that's right. Facts mean nothing to you idiots.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
I simply believe Obama is hiding and this is why he has sealed off all of his records. I have asked myself so many times, WHO IS THIS MAN? No one can tell me. My next question is, why or what is he hiding? I would show my birth certificate as needed. I DONT have nothing to hide. Whats the problem? What is he hiding? This is a very simple request and Obama still refuses to show us all. Obama can end it by showing the long birth certificate, but wont. This tells me and many others he is lieing. He was born in Mombasa, Kenya. He used the name of Barry Soetoro to go to school. WHO IS THIS MAN? And by the way, now when did he have his name changed? Every one knew him as Barry tell when? kwiley9711
chuckj
· 5 months ago
See, that is using logic and common sense. Youll realize soon that all the liberals here cant seem to understand that.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Okay, can you please tell me exactly what evidence you have that the president was born in Kenya? President Obama was born in Hawaii; he has provided evidence of this. Can you provide evidence to the contrary, including evidence showing that what exists in Hawaii is a fake?
You accuse the president of lying about where he was born, and yet you provide no evidence to support your claims. This is not "logic and common sense," as Chuck below asserts; this is just the paranoid delusion of partisanship of the worst kind.
Wendy67
· 5 months ago
If you've asked yourself, "Who is this man?" so many times and no one could tell you, perhaps you should ask somebody else.
slimslowslider
· 5 months ago
bahaha... good one.
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
Listen carefully... you have to actually TAKE the anti-psychotic medication. Don't just leave it in the bottle.
Lillibet2nd
· 5 months ago
Soetoro is the name of Barack ("Barry") Obama II's stepfather. Barack's mother, Stanley Ann Dunham, a US citizen was born (of US citizens) in Kansas. She moved with her parents to Hawaii in 1960 after she had completed high school (near Seattle). She met Obama Sr, a fellow student (born in Kenya) at the University of Hawaii and married him (in Hawaii) in 1961. She divorced him in 1964. Subsequently she married Lolo Soetoro when Barack (II, or Barry) was about 6. Dunham and Soetoro had a daughter Maya, Barack's half-sister. The State of Hawaii stands behind the birth certificate. Obama is not lying or hiding anything regarding his background. I hope this helps.
Some crackers just can't handle a black president.
Drives them crazy. Literally.
Simple as that.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
What I dont understand, if you liberals are 100 percent certain Obama is a born citizen and you dont have a problem with him not showing his Birth Certificate, why are you here complaining?
If some believe he should have to show it, that is their right. This man is the top man in the country. If people want proof of his citizenship so be it. Give them the proof, they shut up, end of story.
Mean while, your saviour is running up debt to disasterous records, continues to lie about transparency, has lobbyists all over DC, etc etc and you come here to complain, hate, and spew your typical garbage. Why all the hate? You control the White House. You control Congress. Why cant you liberals EVER be happy? LOL its sad but funny at the same time how some of you, the only thing you know is how to be angry and hate
Roko1
· 5 months ago
I havent seen McCain's birth certificate either, but it does not suggest that he does not have one. What it means is that I have not made the effort to the county of birth to verify. In other words, I am lazy and would like someone else to do the work for me.
joebob30
· 5 months ago
actually, we all know McCain wasn't born here, he was born in Panama...Congress passed a law regarding it that made him eligible
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
No one who is legitimately interested in the truth has ANY doubt that President Obama is perfectly eligible to be President.
He DID produce the stupid birth certificate. The news media covered it. Factcheck.org covered it. Snopes.com covered it. Even freakin' World News Daily covered it. ALL of them say there is no controversy.
"If some believe he should have to show it, that is their right." What? Do you have any notion of what a legal right is? Here's a hint. It has nothing to do with what you believe. President Obama HAS shown his birth certificate to the public, but he has never HAD to do so. And someone else's "belief" to the contrary doesn't mean anything.
For example, it is my "belief" that former President George Bush should have to sit before Congress and testify under oath about every single thing he has done wrong that we do not yet know about, to save us the hassle of looking under all the rocks to see what's hiding under each one. Does my belief have ANYTHING to do with a "right" to make the President do that? Of course not. But then I know what legal rights are and you do not. And more to the point, I care about the truth and you do not.
Do us all a favor. When the subject is something as ludicrous as birthers, just don't post anything. It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak up and remove all doubt.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Chuck, the problem intelligent people (not just liberals) have with this idiotic posturing is that Obama HAS PROVIDED sufficient proof. It's not that "some people believe he should have to show it" -- it's that it's been shown, and conspiracy theorists continue to defy the facts, like a bunch of little right-wing Fox Mulders.
What I, however, don't understand is how these birthers can lambaste the president and "liberals [who] are 100% certain Obama is a born citizen" while decrying the same "liberals" for simply asking questions about Trig Palin's birth. The difference between the two is that President Obama provided the evidence when asked, while former Governor Palin didn't. I'm not saying or insinuating that Trig isn't her baby, or wasn't born in exactly the way she described, or anything of the sort; frankly, I don't care. However, it seems rather odd to me that concrete evidence is not enough for a Democrat, but a complete and utter lack of evidence is more than enough for a Republican.
And I don't have any hate, dude. Isn't it conservatives who always accuse liberals of being tree-hugging hippies? And aren't hippies supposed to be all about peace and love? Heh.
smidget
· 5 months ago
"What I dont understand, if you liberals are 100 percent certain Obama is a born citizen and you dont have a problem with him not showing his Birth Certificate, why are you here complaining?"
Because he HAS shown his birth certificate. The complaint is with morons like you who refuse to accept any level of evidence. No matter how many times the evidence is presented, it won't be good enough.
As for "spewing your typical garbage".....how dare you accuse others of spewing garbage when you're too stupid to read a g0damn birth certificate and accept that there is no giant, multi-country and multi-state conspiracy that would be required to fake it. The level of idiocy here is astonishing.
The sad thing is, I generally refrain from insulting people by calling them idiots, morons, or stupid, but there is literally no other way to describe birthers. It's amazing you people are capable of tying your own shoes....although that's a huge assumption on my part, I'll admit. I would not be at all surprised to down look at your feet and see velcro.
slimslowslider
· 5 months ago
i am not angry, i am laughing at you.
snesich
· 5 months ago
Why are we here? To laugh at people like you. Everyone needs comic relief now and then and you right-wing bozos are like a three ring circus. You are so predicable and rarely disappoint.
Now, talk some more about this "birth certificate" thing; and while you're at it, get me some more popcorn and tell me the one about Black Helicopters containing aliens.
mikeG56
· 5 months ago
If a Mexican Citizen who is in this country illegally, give birth that child is automatically a US citizen. It doesn’t matter about the status of the parents. Get your facts straight.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
That is a different circumstance than this. Either way, that "law" needs to be changed. Whoever put that in place is a fool.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Do you often insult the Founding Fathers, chuck? Because, you know, that rule has been around since the United States has been around.
Oh, and before I forget, the Founding Fathers were all white. Every last one. Even Thomas Jefferson. He dipped his pen in the plantation ink, but he was white. So, therefore, using Republican reasoning, everything they did is good and nothing they did is bad.
So get over yourself. If you don't like America there are 190 other countries that will take your tax money. Don't forget to write us when you get there.
smidget
· 5 months ago
The "fool" who determined that people born on American soil are citizens regardless of the citizenship status of their parents are the same "fools" who wrote the US Constitution.
I'm truely shocked at your incredibly low level of intelligence. How did you even figure out how to post a comment to this site? I can't imagine that you're actually capable of using a mouse and keyboard, what with only two brain cells functioning. You're truely a marvel.
notsonuts
· 5 months ago
Typical Republican. Calls the Founding Fathers fools because he is too big of a fool to know the origin of the "law" he is bashing. It is in the Constitution you ungenius.
mikeG56
· 5 months ago
Chuck how can you say with 100 percent certainty that he is not?
chuckj
· 5 months ago
I am not certain if he is or isnt. But after reading a little bit about it, it just makes sense to me perhaps to end all this, he should just show the long birth certificate. The real thing. Then all this stuff ends. The only reason I began to question it was because for a year now, he has refused to do the simple, easy task of showing it. Now we have some military personnel who want to know if their Commander in Chief is legal. I think it's time he just show it and get it over with.
joebob30
· 5 months ago
No, you have a coward who tried to use the military to prove an agenda, specifically volunteering for duty after Obama was sworn in by the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court (they must be in on it too), but then deciding to make an issue of it...he volunteered to go in May, 2009, he wasn't requested...But his dishonorable discharge will be worth it, maybe someone will be nice enough to show him the way to a VA hospital so he can get his meds, you can follow him
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Chuck, you're a troll. You're starting to annoy me. You don't have any interest in truth. So I write this not to refute your points but to educate anyone who might be unlucky enough to read your drivel without context.
You KNOW that no government agency will send out an ORIGINAL birth certificate. Go to your safe deposit box and look at yours. I bet you my mortgage that it is a certified copy. You can inspect the original on site, but you cannot take it away, for obvious reasons. You can get a certified copy, or go inspect the original.
You also know that there are no military personnel who actually doubt whether President Obama is their legitimate commander in chief. The fact that our heroic men and women are following his orders in ACTUAL COMBAT overseas tells you that. That moron ex-Major Fox or whatever his name is was just pulling a political stunt. He VOLUNTEERED to serve in Afghanistan. He did not need to sue to get out of going, a month later. He is allowed to change his mind, since he's a volunteer. So that's that. No need for a lawsuit. Unless you're a wingnut trying to stir up other wingnuts. His lawyer already filed and LOST several such frivolous lawsuits.
Now go wash out your mouth. You've told enough lies for one day.
wayouthere
· 5 months ago
The Republicans just can't accept that the great majority of Americans just don't want them in charge. They have an accurate memory of what 8 years of Bush and the Republicans have done to their lives and to their standard of living. Personally, I believe both parties have overstayed their welcome. But the Republicans have been a bit more overbearing therefore they should go away first.
americanteacher
· 5 months ago
Interesting... all the rethuglicans who are clamoring for Obama's birth certificate didn't show any concern over the missing documentation proving George W. Bush actually showed up to finish his service in the National Guard. All those unanswered questions, with no real proof. No one could claim they saw him on duty, no documentation ever presented. In this case - there IS documentation.
joike
· 5 months ago
GOP and right wingers, please spend as much time and energy on this ridiculous subject as you want. While the rest of us are trying to address issues like global climate change, social justice, energy independence and universal health care, you can fritter away your time chasing shadows.
The idea that Obama conspired from an early age to hide his place of birth in the hopes that he would one day be President is absurd on its face.
It's a fund raising ploy used to soak up money from the dim and the angry (an upcoming soap opera on Fox).
If you want to hang on to your irrational anger, do not click on this link. Warning!!!
Knock yourselves out. At least this will keep the yahoos busy for a while.
sinking
· 5 months ago
Uh, chuckj. I was born in Columbus, Ohio and the certified copy of my birth certificate that was accepted to provide my passport, says across the top "Certificate of Live Birth". No person that has a birth certificate on file can get the original. What does yours say?
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Oh, one more thing. To get my children in school, I had to show thier birth certificate to. Now did he show the Barry or Obama, or can I call it DUAL CITIZEN? OOOPS!
LawGirl
· 5 months ago
You are wrong. You will never be able to get your actual birth certificate or your kids'. You got a certified copy. Not only that - but many citizens prove their birth by using the family bible. Can you imagine if the Obama family did that...
Oh, the richness that would ensue.
flray
· 5 months ago
Maj. Stefan F. Cook is a coward as is Hannity and Rush. In all faIrness Hannity could not get in to the service because of his mental condition and Rush dodged the draft and is now a drug addict.
Not that the facts matter. There are many bright republicans. After reading the comments on this board I'd state as fact that those intelligent republicans are not posting here.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Again, that is a certificate of live birth. Not a birth certificate.
The law suits are not going away. They will continue. All he has to do is show his birth certificate and all this stuff ends. Why is that so hard?
thornecompton
· 5 months ago
What is the difference between a birth certificate and a certificate of birth?
rebopine
· 5 months ago
Here are the REAL facts, not the far-reaching rhetoric being spewed:
"The Department of Hawaiian Home Lands accepts both Certificates of Live Birth (original birth certificate) and Certifications of Live Birth because they are official government records documenting an individual’s birth. The Certificate of Live Birth generally has more information which is useful for genealogical purposes as compared to the Certification of Live Birth which is a computer-generated printout that provides specific details of a person’s birth. Although original birth certificates (Certificates of Live Birth) are preferred for their greater detail, the State Department of Health (DOH) no longer issues Certificates of Live Birth. When a request is made for a copy of a birth certificate, the DOH issues a Certification of Live Birth"
slimslowslider
· 5 months ago
i hope you and all birfers are donating like mad to all the folks like Phil Berg and Orly Taitz that are fighting this out in court! they need your money, all of it, to save America!
rebopine
· 5 months ago
Um, I checked my Birth Certificate, I was born in Washington State and am a legal citizen of the USA capable of running for and service as the President of the United States of America.
And guess what? Mine says "Certificate of Live Birth", not "Birth Certificate", does this make me an illegal alien?
I really do have to hand it to the Republicans, though - they manage to convince their base that Obama isn't a natural-born citizen, that their taxes are going up, that they should be afraid of the illegal immigrants next door...and the base eats it up like coney island hotdogs on July 4.
The things you should be outraged at - lack of manufacturing jobs in the US, our economy in shambles after deregulation of the financial industry, lack of health insurance, lack of healthy and affordable food choices...the base doesn't even care about or blames on someone who has been in office 6 months as opposed to 8 years.
Seriously, read a book sometime.
willhen50
· 5 months ago
Hate to break it to you, but your taxes are going to go up. After the Bush tax cuts expire we will go back to 35%. Then I can't itemize a lot of thing like I use to. I can tell you this is going to have an impact on the economy, because I am going to lay off some employees to offset my tax losses. I am outraged, the fact that this man is suppose to be defending the Constitution and he and his ilk are creating a crisis of historic proportion. I don't understand why you liberals are defending this man and his lies.
I am sure if Bush had even brought up the notion of the government taking over the car industry there would be riots in the street, and I am also sure, they would try to find even the slightest bit of information that would discredit (see CBS news military record) him (see past DUI arrests). The left was livid when the supreme court intervened and declared that what Gore was doing was illegal and stopped the re-re-re-recounts in only 4 counties that voted democrat; obviously didn't use Minnesota Al's tactics, using dead people.
The fact is, obama is covering up a lot more information that is very questionable and the liberal media is keeping the truth from us. He is not even taken to task over the lies and promises that have been broken. Where is the outrage over this? Bush was constantly scrutinized over every word he said and they even made fun of the way he said them.
This forum seems to have a lot of people that think that name calling tends to give them the win in debates, but all it does is reinforce the opposing view point.
All I can say about that is, they can osulate my posterior erogenous zone.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
No Maj. Stefan is not a coward. He has the same question all the birthers have. I would do the same thing. So can all of our military. Oh my, then would he show and tell?
LawGirl
· 5 months ago
Former Maj. Stefan was a reservist who volunteered to go to Afghanistan just so he would have standing to sue the US Government by claiming that the Commander in Chief isn't legit.
He's an embarrassment to every man and woman who is currently serving in the military, not to mention the ones who served and died on foreign soil.
There were PLENTY of progressive soldiers who could have challenged Bush as our legitimate CoC from 2000 to 2004 because of what the Supreme Court did. Did they? No.
You call him a patriot. I call it treasonous and cowardice. We agree to disagree.
swat68
· 5 months ago
The was a political move by the Major who is a Reservist. He volunteered to for active duty service in April (after Obama was sworn in); he then received his orders in June and then filed his lawsuit in July. This was done to make a political statement on the behalf of the Major and other "birthers". The Major should be ashamed of himself for using the U.S. Army in this way. He should be court marshalled.
Donald
· 5 months ago
No!
Your are death wrong. Maj Stefan is a RACIST and a COWARD. The order to deploy comes from his military leadership. His military leadership eventually gets its order from the branch Sec. The Branch Sec gets direction from the Sec. of Defense. The Sec. of Defense get his objectives from the President. The President does not order any military member. He establishes his intent after consulting with his national defense support staff. Each military branch leader determines which unit goes where, when, and for how long. Therefore, Maj "RACIST/COWARD" Stefan is failing to follow lawful orders established by his commanders.
I hope they put his A$$ away for many years.
brendand
· 5 months ago
You're right; we do not have evidence that Maj. Stefan is a coward. He is, however, a conspiracy-theorist, a fringe lunatic, and completely unpatriotic for his comments regarding the sitting president of the United States. If someone -- anyone -- had refused to go to war under President Bush, that person would have been figuratively, if not literally, killed by the right.
Our military personnel have the right to disobey orders, and the military has the right to try them and/or dismiss them. Maj. Stefan will never actually serve this country. You know why? Because he is a threat to unit cohesion. If he doesn't like the president, he can claim anything. That is a threat to every other person in a unit with him. Therefore, he is an unreliable soldier, and an unreliable soldier isn't really a soldier at all.
If you would do the same thing, dude, then why don't you? Please. Sign up for the military, and then refuse your deployment orders. See what happens. I dare ya.
Claudia
· 5 months ago
When is this BULLSHIT going to end? These people can not accept the fact that a person not of their pedigree is the President of the United States. They can not accept the fact that they are no longer in charge. They refuse to work with the President and want NOTHING TO DO WITH HIM and will find ANY ridiculous nonsense to fight him with. They would prefer to live a delusional existence instead of acknowledging the TRUE facts that are readily available.
Obama was in a campaign for TWO YEARS!!! You are waiting TWO YEARS TO BRING THIS CR@P UP? If you hated this man so much, why didn't you DISprove his citizenship TWO YEARS AGO! WHY NOW?
Those who refuse to accept the Presidents' legitimacy of citizenship are disgraceful human beings, disprectful to the position and to the man, and are on the verge of starting a civil unrest through their UGLY, SPITEFULE, HATEFUL BIGOTRY!
If you don't post this, I'll know why.
icemonkey
· 5 months ago
Hey, in a country where you have creationist museums and a sizeable minority ( or is it now a small majority) of citizens who believe the earth is only 6,000 years old and that humans have always looked the way they look today, and that they coexisted with dinosaurs to boot, (not to mention that you could probably find a number of people who still believe the sun revolves around the earth), is this kind of nonsense really all that surprising??
cheryllm
· 5 months ago
To Name and Chuckj. He did show it and you all still don't believe it. Who do you people think you are that he has to prove anything to. I am sure the CIA or FBI knows the truth. You all are so funny to me. About the law. It does not matter that his mom was born in the US. Hawaii is part of the US! Obama was born there. I suggest that since having a black president bothers so many of you. GO BACK TO WHERE YOU CAME FROM!!!
Peace4Universe
· 5 months ago
PLEASE, Republicans, the election is over! It is time to be gracious losers and give YOUR new President a chance to lead us out of the mess the last President brought on. Ouch, I know it must hurt to hear this... The new President needs YOUR support, not a party of "no," if we are to be a strong nation again. The sad realization is that those who believe in such trash will not change their mind by reading my comment. Those who believe that Pres. Obama was not born here because he hasn't shown his "original" birth certificate are fools. All he can produce is a certification copy. You try getting an original for yourself! The original is filed securely, not to be filed in your $10 Office Depot filing box! Shall we doubt your citizenship because you can't show us your original certification of your birth? Maybe you shouldn't have voted? This is crazy making, birthers. Let's focus on economy, healthcare and education, not this trash. I repeat -- The President needs your positive support!
lmt5501
· 5 months ago
You see the problem here is not that Democrats believe Obama is the Messiah. The problem here is most Republicans believe that he is, and it's scaring the daylights out of most of them. I wonder why? He's not interested in overthrowing the government, or hurting a soul. It's these crazy non-thinking reactionaries who hate this man because he is different from them in skin color, and obviously in heart and soul. They should be afraid of the ones who are spewing the poison over the conservative AM airwaves because these millionaires could care less about their so called constituents.
mikeG56
· 5 months ago
Chuck for the purposes of the discussion please provide proof your birth in the United States. Hopefully it will be believable.
judith
· 5 months ago
Some on the political right and among lobbyists long have utilized the concept that if you just repeat something often enough as if it were fact, many relatively unintelligent people will come to accept it AS fact, even in the face of evidence to the contrary. You can pull people around that way and herd them like sheep. I think the phenomenon is enhanced if the targeted non-thinkers HOPE the floated notion IS fact. We've seen this kind of infuriating ploy used numerous times in recent decades in attempts to herd our thought and votes. It incites and feeds on hatreds, fears and prejudices. It's made ever more effective by vastly improved communications that allow those lacking proper ethics to spread and repeat rumors - such as the notion that Obama is not a U.S. citizen - and to keep them going even after they have been debunked. The best way for people to inoculate themselves individually against such deliberate attempts to poison rational thought is to be aware the phenomenon exists and to be able to detect it when it is used. Better education with improved emphasis on critical thinking skills is the long-term antidote.
kimk
· 5 months ago
This is so stupid. When the question of Obama's birth certificate came out before the elections, I was able to see the certificate for myself just by googling it. If I could see it online, so could everyone else. If the Director of the Hawaiian Health Department says it is the REAL BIRTH CERTIFICATE and its verified before being issued, then who are these right wing nut jobs to question it? Do they work in that department? NO.The rethugliCONZ are only wanting to make more smokescreen to hide their hidden agendas ooh say like HIPOCRI-CSTREET. Mhmm.
Eyepublius
· 5 months ago
Just an observation, but the birth certificate shows B. H. OBAMA, II... and his father as just B. H. OBAMA.
Shouldn't he have been Jr and not the Second (II) - second (II) would mean the name goes from father, jumps his son, and the Grandson of his son is named B. H. OBAMA, II.
Am I right or wrong? I believe I am correct.
swat68
· 5 months ago
You are incorrect; the II mean just that -- he is the second person with the name, if he had a son, he would be B.H. Obama III. The name does not have to skip in order to be II. Junior or II are both interchangeable and acceptable.
mikeG56
· 5 months ago
Wher did Chuck go. I guess he's out looking for his real Birth Cert.
mikeG56
· 5 months ago
With all the crap these "Birthers" are spewing there're more like "AfterrBirthers"
muggsy
· 5 months ago
good one.
grf67
· 5 months ago
How long does the country have to endure this band of republican racists? A few more elections and they will be a distinct minority without the votes to do anything but whine.
martyr
· 5 months ago
A few more elections like this .. the USA will be the same as living in Mexico just a much bigger scumland .. Viva the change ..
Personally I hope by that time I find a nice private abandoned Oil rig .. because we all know I won't be able to avoid an island by this Bummers 2nd year in office.. actually not too many of us will unless we are acorn whitemen type crooks.. anyway far enough offshore not to be thugged, mugged and robbed of my last dime by the bums who voted O bummer in ,, Count me far away from the future Amexico..
Oh and yes.. please anyone who claims the GOP is this or that.. get a real life, out on your own, outside Mom and Dads.. talk about losers.. If I had a bum kid living off me I would.. well I wouldn't and they definitely would not sound like so many possers ..like 8 year olds B****ching over sucking at HALO!
Most politicians are in it for themselves period. So tell me what has O done for you personally has anything in your life changed for the better.. Unless of course this chorus damning white men is O bummers cabinet zombies.. or even better is this what the 31 + Czars do post like little drones.
Real cert or not this Dunce is the WORST Elected official in history with his mentor and resident freak Pelosi, 2nd brain dead Reid,3rd, and the creep Sanford, 4th,
tkdcal
· 5 months ago
>> You could not get a certificate saying you were born in Honolulu. The state has to verify a fact like that for it to appear on the certificate. <<
Ok, so why let this issue continue to fester? If the state of Hawaii in fact verifed the facts, then why not just show everyone and be done with it? Why not hold the facts up to the light of day and demonstrate what a bunch of kooks the conspiracy theorists are?
Frankly, I have no dog in the fight. I think the requirement to be a natural born citizen is a crock, an anachronism from the time of the revolution.
It does seem odd though, don't you think, why hide when there is nothing to hide?
Tyke
· 5 months ago
"why not just show everyone and be done with it? "
They have, and it has been independently verified.
Maybe the Birthers' tinfoil hats are on so tight their eyes have been pulled shut?
I done seen it on the internet. It must be true. Why can't the Hawaii officials simply produce a certified copy. 'Cause O won't let them. What's he hiding?
Tyke
· 5 months ago
Yo idiot. the copy he has is certified! The Governor of Hawaii personally verified that it is 100% legitimate and is the ONLY type of birth certificate Hawaii issues to individuals. That's the REPUBLICAN governor of Hawaii by the way.
smidget
· 5 months ago
How do you propose they had a copy to scan if Hawaii didn't give them one?
Could it be because you are the type of genius who says things like "I done seen it"???
muggsy
· 5 months ago
Hey dufus, go to factcheck.org, hardly a left wing site, and see not only the birth certificate, but their testimony of having seen, handled and photographed it. Conclusion: Born in the USA. Ignorance is bliss.
smidget
· 5 months ago
My god, even the people on the right side of the argument are too ignorant to argue the point properly. Let me say this as politely as possible:
THEY PUBLISHED THE DAMN BIRTH CERTIFICATE. PROOF GIVEN. NOW SHUT UP!!!!!!!!!!
EdinNJ
· 5 months ago
Is this a spoof? You can't be this dense.
How many times and in how many ways can this be proven? Birth certificates, birth announcements, all readily available at any time.
The only things festering are the brains of the birthers. And the best part is that as the "controversy" enters the mainstream, it makes the Republican look worse and worse, meaning even more time in the wilderness for the do-nothing, ruin everything party.
Again, Congress held hearings for McCain to determain his eligibility, why are they giving Obama a pass?
brendand
· 5 months ago
Because John McCain was born on a military base in a foreign country, and Barack Obama was born in one of the fifty states. Not hard.
blvr
· 5 months ago
Since McCain was born in a U. S. Territory (Canal Zone) and his parents were U. S. citizens, he was a U. S. on both counts. Just another example of Congress wasting time and money.
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
Because no reasonable person doubts it, dipstick.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
I have proof that President Obama isn't a citizen. He was born in Nigeria. I can send anyone the ORGINAL birth certificate but the transaction requires maxiimum confidence. I'm getting it from a top offical of the federal government of Nigeria. I'm solicating your help because the documents are in the possession of the last military regime. Please note that the transaction is 100% safe. Yours Faithfully, Dr. Clement Okon
brendand
· 5 months ago
Ha!
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Just do me this favor, jimpa. Put a third of whatever money the birthers give you into a pot for reelecting President Obama.
Put another third into an envelope and mail it to the IRS with a letter explaining that you know some concerned citizens who wanted to reduce the impact of the federal bailouts.
You can keep the final third as a finder's fee for a job well done.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
;)
tdpubs
· 5 months ago
Oh please, I'm willing to pay all sorts of money to obtain the real birth certificate. I'll email my bank card info and pin number so that you can reclaim if from their vaults. Thank you for your courage in working on this issue. God bless you.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
You are right on the name of the second or third. I named my son after his Father as JR. Then the Father comes in as SR. The son will or could name his son the first and is carried on from the second and so on. SR, then JR, then first, second and so on.
Keith
· 5 months ago
14th Amendment, Section 1. "All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside." No requirement regarding standing of the mother or any other prerequisite. The alleged collusion that is being advocated here regarding hiding or distortion/fraud of birth certificates is laughable on multiple levels. How is it possible that so many, of both parties, would have allowed this alleged miscarriage to have continued from the moment Obama announced his candidacy all the way through the electoral process? Frivolous lawsuits and pundit pronouncements notwithstanding, the current President was elected legally and as citizens, deserves our support.
albert14151
· 5 months ago
“You bet I’d sign it,” said Brodgon. “I know I’d have no problem showing my birth certificate.”
Yeah, but it's a forgery.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Ok on proof of certificate??? Put it on the net for FREE???
brendand
· 5 months ago
Hey, check any of the number of links posted here. Or Google it. Go on, check it out. Or are you just here to whine and complain because you didn't get your way in the election?
Lordy, you're worse than the Dems who attacked the Supreme Court for Bush v. Gore. This isn't a conspiracy!
Susan Sherman
· 5 months ago
It's already on there - da -- has been for quite some time
DaleR
· 5 months ago
Hey Chuckj and the rest of the 'Obama is not a citizen' crowd:
The certificate of live birth proves that Obama was born in the United States. He meets all requirements of a US Citizen. You and others like you continue to argue this irrelevant position. Obama is a US Citizen, therefore qualifies to run for President of the US and as result qualifies to handily defeat the nonviable republican candidate and the unqualified vp nominee.
I assume you will respond to this and other post with additional repetitive posts about Live Birth Cert vs Birth Cert but the fact is you are arguing a position that has no relevancy to proving Obama's US Citizenship or lack thereof.
mikeG56
· 5 months ago
Jimpa, are you tha same guy that say I'll send you money and you cash the check and send me back $$. What a scam. Nice try.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
You didn't get your 21, 320,000.00? Much sorry. i will look into that.
kimk
· 5 months ago
Em the only people hiding are the ones who believe this Rehashed swill feed to them from the Repub rumor mill tough. They are hiding from using their BRAINS to view fact from fiction. The fact is Obama is a U.S. citizen. There is no way he would have been given oath of office if that was not the case. The issue of his Birth Certificate was settled over 6 months ago. I guess some people just like the taste of regurgitated bunk.
blvr
· 5 months ago
These guys need to either read the U.S. Constitution, or get another job! Anyone born in the U. S. (and Hawaii is part of the U. S.) or who is born of a parent of U. S. citizenship (and the President's mother was a U. S. citizen), is a U. S. citizen. Period.
Name
· 5 months ago
Wrong. The law states:
If only one parent is a U.S. Citizen at the time of ones birth, that parent must have resided in the United States for minimum ten years, five of which must be after the age of 16.
O's mother doesn't pass this test as she was 18 when he was born. Thanks for playing.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Oh, and although you say "the law states" you do not bother to cite any law. I am a lawyer, but you wouldn't need to be one to see that you're completely full of sh*t.
More to the point, please explain how, under your bizarre made-up nonexistent law, ANY teenaged mother could satisfy that requirement? Women can have babies at 16, you know.
So if you are claiming a sixteen year old American woman would have to reside in the US a further 5 years before any of her kids count as citizens, I would say that you shouldn't waste your time on this birth certificate stuff. You're better off just sleeping until it's time to give you your next dosage.
Go away.
wineprincess
· 5 months ago
Thank you
smidget
· 5 months ago
Accept he was born in the US.
Thanks for proving people who believe this garbage are complete morons.
Name
· 5 months ago
All O has to do is make the call and tell the officials in Hawaii to provide a certified copy. Just one little call and everyone shuts up. What's he hiding.
Tyke
· 5 months ago
He has - the certified copy allowed by law is the one he has produced and put up on his website. It was independently reviewed and verified and the Governor of Hawaii, who is a Republican, has declared it 100% legit.
But I think the theory that he traveled back in time to put the birth announcement about him being born in Hawaii into their local newspaper at the time of his birth has real legs!
tdpubs
· 5 months ago
I asked VP Richard Cheney the same question; "What are you hiding sir?" Where were all you guys when we needed you after 911? I say let's solve that mystery first then tackle the birth certificate conundrum.
redmjoel
· 5 months ago
He did. It's on scopes.
Marty
· 5 months ago
He did provide a certified copy. Over a year ago. It evens states in this article. Here it is on snopes (an urban legend sight that clearly calls this false):
Two facts for people: Obama was born in Hawaii, as the birth certificate clearly shows. Hawaii became a state in 1959, Obama was born in 1961.
This means that he's a citizen, pure and simple. If you're born on American soil, regardless of your parents, you're a natural born American. The 14th Amendment states this.
Get over it and find holes about the economy or healthcare or Wall Street or something because this is asinine.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Please stop making up nonsense.
tdpubs
· 5 months ago
I think we found the person who knows the answer to the question "how many angels can dance on the head of a pin?" Please illuminate me sir. I await your answer.
murray19
· 5 months ago
why can't you accept that obama's certificate of live birth is proof of his citizenship? it states the time and place of his birth and was provided by the Hawaii Dept of Health.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
President George W Bush was born in Canada. I ask someone to prove me wrong. I need to see the orginal birth certificate and not some forgery.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
Why do the birthers jump on the nonsense that president Obama wasn't born in the USA but won't bite on president George W Bush was born in Canada? What could the difference be??
suzyku
· 5 months ago
Will these idiots ever stop this nonsense?! They are apparently desperate and don't seem to realize how very very stupid they look and sound.
mikeG56
· 5 months ago
Chuck has left the building. Chase them away with logic.
bdog1
· 5 months ago
The rabid right wingers and birthers love the attention. Kinda like your 2 yr old. Election's over, you lost, he's in, he's black, you can't get over. If Hillary had won, the'yd have a CT out about her. Lie and smear, that's what the G-No-P do best. And they call Dems evil----look in the mirror I say.
Cook--a traitor and should be court-martialed.
conanoharrow
· 5 months ago
Politicians who waste their constituent’s time & money on this issue should be voted out of office.
brendand
· 5 months ago
I think they should be asked why they hate America. "Libruls" were attacked just for disagreeing with President Bush. This is out-and-out saying that Barack Obama's presidency is illegitimate.
left_leaning_independant
· 5 months ago
Amen to that!
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
What's next? Are the wingnuts going to argue that President Obama is not the legitimate President because voters in the voting booth confused his name with that of his opponent? Their names are very similar. Well, they're actually nothing at all alike, but you know what? THAT kind of conspiracy theory is actually A LOT MORE LIKELY to be true than any of the crap you birthers have come up with thus far.
And that's only because there's a 1 in 20 quintillion chance that you'd be right about the candidate confusion thing. But there's absolutely no chance that President Obama is Constitutionally ineligible to be elected.
Keep trying; we Democrats need more free advertisements for our party.
Aaron
· 5 months ago
Yeah, there is some question of whether he is eligable to be president based on his birth location, fortunately having a US citizen for a parent makes you a natural citizen, so being born in Panama isn't an issue-oh wait, are we talking about how McCain wasn't born in the US?
Name
· 5 months ago
Wrong. The laws says
If only one parent is a U.S. Citizen at the time of ones birth, that parent must have resided in the United States for minimum ten years, five of which must be after the age of 16.
O's father is not a citizen and O's mother was only 18 so she fails that test.
McCain's parents were both U.S. citizens. Thanks for playing.
LawGirl
· 5 months ago
You know who wasn't born in the United States? George Washington.
brendand
· 5 months ago
He was born in the Colony of Virginia. You know why he wasn't born, technically, in the United States? BECAUSE HE INVENTED THE DAMNED THING!
(Okay, that's a bit of an over-statement, but honestly, that's a ridiculous comment. George Washington was born in Virginia. Barack Obama was born in Hawaii. The end.)
LawGirl
· 5 months ago
Not really...the Colony of Virginia was a British Colony until after GW was born. Hawai'i was a part of the United States before President Obama was born.
My point is that the whole "where he was born" nonsense is just that - nonsense.
Tyke
· 5 months ago
That one has been debunked and re-debunked.
How about you give an honest to goodness legal citation for that "law".
... and no, right wings blogs are not legitimate citations. You need to link to the actual, nonexistent, statute.
lesforo
· 5 months ago
What is your point exactly?
notsonuts
· 5 months ago
My birth certificate says across the top "Certificate of Live Birth". It is a copy that I have used to obtain a passport and establish residency in two foreign countries. I called the nice people at my state's Vital Statistics office and politely requested if I could get ahold of my "vault original" birth certificate. Apparently "vault original" is a made up phrase because they did not know what I was talking about. After I pushed a little bit they politely informed me that I was asking a nutty question and to please stop calling. CIA, Secret Service, FBI, State Department and the State of Hawaii step aside! Orly Taitz to the rescue! Repubs, please keep up your bizarre show. You are showing the world that you accept fantasy instead of truth, lies instead of veracity and conspiracy instead of logic. I know if I were in your position I would believe the conspiracies too. It is much easier to believe in a massive, leak-proof, decades long conspiracy to elect Barack Obama president than to believe that white people in your country would turn out in droves to vote for a black guy right?
brendand
· 5 months ago
What sucks is that for a lot of people, it still boils down to race and "other"-ness. Oh, they'll deny it, for certain, citing Alan Keyes' support for an investigation as proof, or talking about their black or Latino or Asian friend, or some other crap like that. But I seriously doubt we'd be having this conversation even if Sec. Clinton had been elected, because even though she's not who they'd want, at least she looks like them. No, they'd find some other reason why Hillary was illegitimate.
Look, people need to cut the crap and start having a little more respect for the office. Nobody's asking y'all to respect Barack Obama the man, just as no one can make me respect George W. Bush as a man. But you know something? George W. Bush was my president, and Barack Obama is my president. He's yours too. You may not like him, but you should, as an American citizen, at least respect the office.
Phoenix Justice
· 5 months ago
They would have gone after any Democrat and especially Senator Clinton if she had been elected President.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Well said. Respect the uniform.
Lord knows I did not respect George W. Bush but I always referred to him as the President, and I never questioned his right to represent us around the world. I was actually pleased that he went to the Olympics. I thought it was a good sign for the world that our President was there. If Obama had gone, the Republicans would just make insults about whether he's going to play for the Dream Team or waste taxpayers' money by flying Air Force One ALL THE WAY TO CHINA. And back!
calijohn
· 5 months ago
I recall reading things that were often critical of Pres. Bush. His supporters would more often than not retort with - "If you don't like it get out!" The proverbial shoe has switched locations. So to all of Pres. Obama's detractors - if you don't like it get out!
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
What a lot of folks don't understand is that THESE PROTOCOLS VARY BY STATE. Some keep the originals and provide photocopies of them. Others keep the originals, and for security reasons do not allow public access to them, and issue Certificates reiterating what the original says, which is embossed and witnessed; this is more secure than a photocopy. That's what Hawaii does. All require a foreign-born naturalized citizen's certificate to list place of birth. If Obama was born overseas, his certificate would say so.
Obama was born in Hawaii. Get over it.
truthbetold111
· 5 months ago
All these conspiracy theorists should be lined up against a wall and sh*t. They are un-American, immoral and frankly should leave the country-forcibly.
tdpubs
· 5 months ago
How do these folks accept the fact that John Sidney McCain was born in Panama and not on U.S. soil without blinking but Barack Hussein Obama who was born in Hawaii is questioned even when proof of birth is offered? I don't think this has anything to do with logic or facts.
pghpuma
· 5 months ago
McCain was born the child of active military service man and his wife, both American citizens and presented his birth certificate as requested. Obama, on the other hand, admits that his father was Kenyan, not an American citizen. His mother had been born and reared in Kansas prior to relocating to Hawaii, and is a citizen. At the age of two, Obama was adopted by an Indonesian citizen, taking on that citizenship as well as the Muslim religion, and was enrolled in a Jakarta School as such. He never documented that he renounced his Indonesian citizen status after turning 18. He tavelled to Pakistan on something other than a United States passport at the age of 23, long after his citizenship status should have been formally reclaimed. Applying to college, registering for the draft and travel all require that such documentation be provided. Likewise, dual citizenship compromises the concept of natural born... We as American Citizens have much to learn with regard to the interpretation of this clause in the Constitution, and as a former Professor of Constitutional Law, Obama should be able and prepared to clarify how he does so. On another point, it is bizarre to hear a US President, in his speeches around the world, pointing out that he sees things differently from typical Americans because his father is Kenyan, not American. I believe that is the POINT. Not only has he takin issue with our Judeo-Christian founding concepts, he has issue with our American bred Patriotism. It is my belief that, when the deepest instinct is challenged, only a natural born citizen of the United States can or would be unwavering in orientation, which, arguably, Obama is not. Companies engaged in selling life insurance cite a study that claims that we are the result of what we experienced at age ten.
Jill
· 5 months ago
I didn't have to read past the word "Kansas" to know what kind of nut job we're dealing with.
In case you missed it, 24Ahead has refused to confirm the shape of the earth. He's only seen pictures, and the earth won't answer his calls.
dirowe
· 5 months ago
These people can't believe we have a black president. They are losing what's left of their minds.
shirleywikander
· 5 months ago
Desperate people will do anything, true or false, to further their cause. It only proves that either people have too much time on their hands or, like sheep being led to slaughter, they will "follow the leader." Pitiful, but true.
Jeff West
· 5 months ago
This is how the Republican Party will continue to diminish its once-proud standing, with its most ignorant members grabbing all the headlines by running around in circles chasing imaginary grails. They, along with the "family values" candidates who clearly have no family values of their own, are making the word "Republican" synonymous with "fool".
Phoenix Justice
· 5 months ago
This is all reminiscent of the "Clinton Chronicles" that the Melon-Scaife groups flooded the "community access" airwaves with during the Clinton years. Its all meant to distract and call into question the credibility of a Democrat as President. I guess the fascist right doesn't care that Saint Ronny was a traitor to his country while president of the Screen Actors Guild, by turning in members of the guild to be black listed for being "communists".
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
Wow. Well, I may have to re-think my earlier assertion that I am (or was) a "good American". After reading all of this drivel today, I am totally convinced that it's all a lost cause. What a bunch of TV inspired SMARTA$$ES. American is done. At least 52% doomed. The monkey majority is now running the zoo. What made the US a great nation is gone. What has always been it's main weakness now is a dominant force. You're all (or at least 52%) brain-washed main-stream-media zombies. All you can see is your stupid little Demican/Republicrat world. You are all (DEMS and REPUBS) controlled by forces you can't see and don't understand. Just a bunch of stupid Goyim. You really don't deserve a country any more. Go ahead. Self destruct. Whatever. There's no way to fix it. You're fat. You're stupid. You're ugly. You're misbegotten and badly bred. You have no morals. You have no courage. You have no work ethic. Your kids can't read. And if they could, they'd read garbage. They don't know math. They don't know science. They know no real history. They only know how to dress like "gangsta" and talk jive. They are filled with "political correctness" though. Great. Fine. The end.
Rome took a couple of centuries to go from a world super power to a decadent, powerless, mish-mash shithole. We (or you rather) will accomplish the same feat in a couple of decades. I secede. I don't want anything to do with you mongrel, perverts. Just keep printing up that funny money and throwing it around like idiots. More national debt will only hasten the decline. You all deserve the lying, crooked and evil government you have allowed to be created here. And now you can just sink into the $hit with it. If you listen very closely, you can hear the Gods, and the rest of the world laughing. Disgusting monkeys.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Please be sure to return your unemployment checks. Uncashed, of course.
Thanks.
brendand
· 5 months ago
I hate to sound like a hick, but if you don't like America, you're welcome to leave.
Was there a point to this rant? You go on and on but don't say a damned thing.
I am pretty certain I am not fat. Nor, I am reasonably certain, am I stupid. I might be ugly, but that's far more of a personal preference thing than a verifiable fact. I was born of two married parents, so I'm certainly not misbegotten; I'm of pretty hearty Irish stock, so I don't think I'm badly bred. I've got pretty good morals, and I try to have the courage to back them up, though I sometimes fail at this. I work very hard, a work ethic passed on to me by my immigrant father and his immigrant family. I have no kids, but if I did, I'm reasonably sure they'd be able to read, as I study English Literature; and what they'd read would, hopefully, be of artistic and literary value, preferably the works of Ken Kesey and James Joyce, but also of Jane Austen and Plato and Murakami. I'd also work with them to ensure that they'd know math and science. As for history, I'm not sure what "real history" means to you, but as I study metafiction, I'm certain we could have a debate on what "real history" actually is. And they sure as hell wouldn't "dress like 'gangsta,' though whether or not they "talk[ed] jive" would be up to them. So too would be their feelings on political correctness, though I would always encourage them to speak their minds.
Look, the next time you want to echo Alan Keyes, please post to your blog. But until then, stop bitching about America, get up off your ass, and do something to fix it. Volunteer in your community. Tutor an orphan. Learn a new language and volunteer to teach new legal immigrants English. Paint an elderly neighbor's fence without asking for pay. Assist a youth group. Become a teacher for the inner city. Do something, don't just say something.
RoadScholar
· 5 months ago
Well. After your 'monkeys' and 'goyim' rant, I retract my retraction.
You're an asshole.
Randwulf
· 5 months ago
Well I'm just all broken up about your "retraction". And as far as being an "asshole", you ain't seen nothing yet! I don't need your f@cking approval. I've EARNED my right to say what I think. I was a part of your sick system for years. I want nothing more than to see it all fall and burn now. It's like living in a ghetto. The best thing that could happen is for a bulldozer to just scrape it up and bury it in a landfill, detox the land and start over again with something useful. You all like to say that if we don't like Obama, it is just because he is Black. You never talk about the percentage of Black voters that voted for him being 95%. I'm pretty sure they voted for him in those numbers entirely BECAUSE he is Black and not so much for any other reason. Sounds pretty "racist" to me. The only reason no judge has yet ordered his records produced in one of these lawsuits is that none of them have wanted to be the one who initiates the race war that will surely ensue once that is done. I don't give a $hit! I say LET ER RIP! It will be more fun that fishing with dynamite!
LawGirl
· 5 months ago
You know - I had a guy call in to my law office once who was convinced that the government was trying to take away his Vitamin D. I'm so glad to see you back!
Kate
· 5 months ago
Goodness sakes, SOMEONE got up on the wrong side of the bed. And isn't he cute when he's all feisty like that?
Billy
· 5 months ago
Really?
Calling a black man "Mr. President" hurts that bad?
freemanmike
· 5 months ago
Awesome! While I'm against cynicism, how can one not be when all Americans can do is attack each other? While there are some HUGE generalizations in what you say, the essence is absolutely correct. I can't live in the States anymore because no one -ABSOLUTELY NO ONE can get their sh#t together! I've unfortunately become a nihilist -the sooner the US falls apart completely the better for the rest of the world. My biggest fear? China being the next world leader.
bluto392
· 5 months ago
Wow, this is good evidence of the racist backbone of this movement.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Why do you people keep lying and say he put his Birth Certificate up for all to see? He never did. He put up a Certificate of Live Birth. That is NOT a Birth Certificate. There is a difference.
Again, ALL HE HAS TO DO IS SHOW HIS ACTUAL BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND ALL THIS GOES AWAY!! Why are you fighting this Obama?
Sara_W
· 5 months ago
I just went and looked at both my and my husbands birth certificate. Mine is from Kansas and I got my copy from 1982. It says across the top. Certificate of Live Birth. My husband was born in Oklahoma and we got his copy in 2006, It also says Certificate of Live Birth.
Your statement just went out the window. They are called Certificate of Live Birth.
willhen50
· 5 months ago
That's great Sara, but tell me, does your "Certificate of Live Birth" have the doctor and hospital where you were born? Or is it the generic variety "Certification of Live Birth", that just says you were born.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
You know, every time you say "if he would just show his birth certificate then all this goes away," it's just further evidence that you're full of shit.
No matter WHAT, you and the idiots who make your argument will just keep saying "nope, that's part of the conspiracy too."
I usually try not to make ad hominem attacks. You deserve it. You're a completely worthless piece of shit. Go crawl back into the shithole you swam out of.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Chuck, what's the difference among the following? A Driver's License, a Driving License, and Motor Vehicle Operator’s Permit. The differences, sir, are the words used. Nothing more.
Once again, President Obama has provided evidence of his birthplace and his citizenship. Can you provide evidence of the contrary? The burden of proof, sir, is on the accuser.
obamasafricanmidwife
· 5 months ago
WHY WOULD HE WANT THIS ALL TO GO AWAY?? It just highlights what a bunch of radical, paranoid wing-nuts the right wing is comprised of!
Please, take to the streets with torches and pitch forks! Have a million man march on Washington! Refuse to serve in the military! Refuse to pay taxes or fill out a census questionnaire! Try to secede! Y'all are awesome!
Doc3
· 5 months ago
Actually you have missed the identity of the right wing whacko that started this. Here is an example but if you Google you will find the Hillary blogs filled with this as far back as December 2007:
Then there is the cleansing of Obama's passport file that was never covered in the press and I have heard that one of the individuals that was involved that was cooperating with the investigation was found shot to death in a car. You should also look at who owned the company of these employees and the connection to Obama:
By the way, McCain did take steps to show he was a natural born citizen. Obama posted a photograph of a Certification of Live Birth to a pro-Obama website. Try applying for a passport or a Federal job and send them a photograph of your birth certificate posted on a website. Also, when did factcheck and these other organizations take over the vetting function of the Democratic party?
So David Weigel, you are a reporting here is a challenge for you. Go out and find a statement from either the Democratic National Committee or the Federal Election Committee that states that they have personally reviewed Obama's records and have deemed him to be a natural born citizen. Keep looking because it is conspicuous by its absence. All of the American People rely on the parties to vet their candidates that when the parties place the names on the ballot they have been fully vetted. Obama and his team found a loop hole in the election laws. Apparently there is no one responsible for this.
Look at the Hillary blogs from December 2007. The Democratic National Committee had months of notice on this issue and all that was done was Obama posting a photograph of a birth certificate to a website?
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
"Try applying for a passport or a Federal job and send them a photograph of your birth certificate posted on a website."
Hmmm. A passport, like the one President Obama has and used this month to travel abroad? A Federal job, like being U.S. Senator, which President Obama was? Or U.S. President, which he is? That's a Federal job.
Dumbass. Epic fail!
strangely_enough
· 5 months ago
"While “birthers” claim that the president’s lawyers have spent “hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of dollars” fighting their lawsuits, they’ve never provided evidence for that claim." Nice. Some times the jokes just write themselves...
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
I still have my birth certificare that has a gold seal, my feet prints and my doctors name, place and county, and much more. I am not now young person and it was My Mother that gave me my oringnal birth certificate. I will carry this birth rights through out my life time. I did have to get a copy of it at one time in my life and it came back with out my gold seal but did have my feet prints and all the other goodies that come with the certificate. I just happen to be born here in the USA.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
It's not worth being civil to people who refuse to see reason and instead hang on to their racism.
Tell me this.... If you really believed that the President was not legitimately eligible, then why do you believe the Republican party took NO action to keep him from being on the general election ballot? Why did Sarah Palin not say that he's not eligible to serve? She said he pals around with terrorists, so clearly she wasn't afraid of hurting anyone's delicate sensibilities.
Do you believe that the ENTIRE GOP just decided that they didn't really mind who's President, after all? Even a black guy named Barack Obama whose intelligence and utter cool factor puts them all to shame? The ENTIRE GOP somehow did not mind handing over the keys to the White House to a black guy when there was something realllllllly obvious they could have done to keep him out? (They could have sued, for example.)
John McCain called his own wife a cunt. Excuse me, his second wife. He divorced his first wife after she was in a car accident and became horribly disfigured. He was 72 years old and running for President for the last time. He hugged George W. Bush when he got the nomination. Bush is responsible for push polling in the 2000 South Carolina primary that slandered McCain's adopted Bangladeshi daughter as somehow being a black illegitimate child. McCain put up with THAT in order to run for office with Bush's blessing in 2008, but he somehow lacked the guts to say "Senator Obama, you weren't born here and haven't produced any evidence of that, and until you do, I do not consider you a legitimate opponent?" They did have 3 debates, you know.
So what was McCain waiting for? Jeff Sessions or Lindsay Graham to do it for him?
Your conspiracy theories suggest nothing factual. But to the extent they say anything, they say you should really fault THE ENTIRE REPUBLICAN PARTY for somehow failing to see what is so obvious to you. They just let the keys to White America slip through their fingers, right? The same people who fall all over themselves insulting Judge Sotomayor?
God, you'd have to be a dumbass or a very hateful person to keep saying what you say in light of ALL evidence to the contrary. At this point I'm willing to be charitable and say you're not hateful, just a dumbass.
But
Alan
· 5 months ago
"then why do you believe the Republican party took NO action to keep him from being on the general election ballot?"
Stephen I would like to add if Barack Obama was not eligible, wouldn't Senator Hillary Clinton have done every possible to expose this so Senator Obama would not steal the Democratic nomination away from her?
martyr
· 5 months ago
You start your post with something about hanging on to racism.. Wow does any O bummer supporter possess the facilities to form an original thought?? As to why a REP did not call anything into question..
1. Hilary's people were the ones who initiated this whole thing.. sheesh the whole lot of you are like trying to tell .. a democrat something in plain English hard to grasp anything not spoon fed by the dimwitted Dems you support so....weirdly ..
2. Why not a Prominent Rep running for the office.. Do you think at all pea brain? Probably because.. had a Republican dared call his eleigbility into question .. do you think there is a chance in hell he or she would not have been labeld a RACIST.. ..just much more vehemently then Bill or Hillary Clinton.. wow don't you think ..
oh I forgot your don't have to think, you let others THINK for you.. I hope you all at the very least repay mom and dad for that free room and board.. such ignorance must be your public education...
But honestly I don't think anyone that is crying racists here is anything more than one the the thousands on O bummers payroll..
stephenperry
· 4 months ago
The thousands on Obama's payroll are soldiers fighting in our overseas wars.
You're a total dumbass.
Your points do not address my post. Saying it's the Demmycrats' fault does not explain why the Republicans wouldn't have acted in their own self interest. But I know you're programmed to blame the Democrats no matter what.
Racists made racist attacks on Obama during the election. Prominent GOP elected officials said and wrote racist things. Yet they'd be afraid of being called racist for pointing out a Constitutional ineligibility?
Keep swinging, tiger. You'll hit one of these pitches eventually.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
As for my childrens birth certificates they to have the same as mine. I had to have them when I registered them both in school as well as there shot records.
drbpdc
· 5 months ago
NUTTBALLS Nothing more than a bunch of right wing NUTTBALLS. There are none worse than Hannity, Rush or World Net Daily. They don't care about facts, they care about political rhetoric which divides... even if it's false.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
The copy of obamas is out of the health department not a hospital
LawGirl
· 5 months ago
Why are you all here? There's a Creation Museum just beckoning to your family...forget Disney World...celebrate ignorance! Go...fly, be free!
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Freedom is not free
brendand
· 5 months ago
Actually, it's one of the basic human rights declared by Amnesty International and adopted by the United Nations. The first one, in fact. According to that, if you're human, you have the inherent right to be free.
This was also declared by a little thing called... hmm... The Declaration of Independence. Assuming, of course, that you believe liberty and freedom are roughly the same thing. Do you indeed hold the rights to life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness as fundamental? If so, then freedom, that most basic of human rights, is free.
LawGirl
· 5 months ago
Yeah, really...thank God we have someone who volunteers to serve his country just so he can get standing to sue the Government and claim the President of the United States isn't legitimate.
I'm sure all of those parents of Marines who died in battle are a little prouder today.
LawGirl
· 5 months ago
Yeah, really...thank God we have someone who volunteers to serve his country just so he can get standing to sue the Government and claim the President of the United States isn't legitimate.
I'm sure all of those parents of Marines who died in battle are a little prouder today.
Billy
· 5 months ago
...and yet you've never served in our armed forces.
LawGirl
· 5 months ago
Yeah, really...thank God we have someone who volunteers to serve his country just so he can get standing to sue the Government and claim the President of the United States isn't legitimate.
I'm sure all of those parents of Marines who died in battle are a little prouder today.
LawGirl
· 5 months ago
Yeah, really...thank God we have someone who volunteers to serve his country just so he can get standing to sue the Government and claim the President of the United States isn't legitimate.
I'm sure all of those parents of Marines who died in battle are a little prouder today.
1SGUSA
· 5 months ago
I for one cannot believe the lack of national security awareness that the Bush administration had in order to allow a non-resident to become President of the United States. There should be an investigation as to how this was allowed to happen and the entire Bush administration should be tried for allowing the greatest security breach in American history. Now turn off your AM radios and back away!
drbpdc
· 5 months ago
You are a nuttball pal If you really believe this crap.. you need help
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Take a second look at 1SGUSA's post, especially the last line.
Did you see the sarcasm this time? Good. It's ok. The seargeant is one of us.
Marty
· 5 months ago
It was very overt sarcasm... they're merely restating the Republican talking points in order to show how ridiculous they sound
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Well-put. I have a similar comment below. How in the world could the Republicans have fallen asleep at the switch? Not just a non-resident, but a BLACK coke-snorting MUSLIM with the name Barack HUSSEIN Obama somehow slipped through the cracks, right under their noses. Hundreds of GOP politicians somehow missed this fundamental issue, even though it was raised every day for six months.
When do the Congressional hearings start????
maribelle
· 5 months ago
Um...am I the only progressive Obama-supporter that thinks requiring candidates to submit eligibility requirements would be a GOOD thing? That it will stop all future "birther" movements in the future?
I was just looking up a job at the US Census. You are required to submit evidence of eligibility for the job (as with all federal jobs and most jobs.)
Why not with POTUS?
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
If you're actually an Obama supporter then think this through. He already did submit eligibility requirements. The question is what, and to whom. Anyone who runs for President already goes through the most intensive background check that any individual in the country has to undergo. They of course inspect all records pertaining to citizenship. So this is already done. It just is not handed over to your political opponents. The FBI does the checking. You may remember the closed session on day 3 of the Sotomayor hearings. That is when the FBI and the Senators met with Sotomayor to go over her FBI background investigation. There are many such meetings for any Presidential candidate.
The point is that no matter what Obama shows these people, they will not be satisfied. They will just say, as they have, that the documents are fakes and that everyone who looked at them is just part of the conspiracy. It's lunacy.
But you cannot give in to these dolts or they will just hijack the agenda and nothing will get done because you'll spend all your time trying to satisfy them that President Obama is not a _________. And when you debunk one thing they'll invent another.
brendand
· 5 months ago
I don't disagree, Maribelle, but that's not really the issue here. The issue is people claiming that Obama IS NOT a United States citizen, and that he has provided no evidence of his citizenship. It is this persistent lie circulated among the nuttiest of wingnuts, and it devalues the Office of the President.
Look, I despised George W. Bush's presidency, but I also couldn't stand it when I heard fellow libs say, "He's not MY president." If you are a citizen of this country, THE president is YOUR president. To say something to the contrary is, to me, unpatriotic and insulting to our country. So too is it with the birthers.
I don't think you're completely wrong about the eligibility requirements. But that's not why they don't like Barack Hussein Obama II. I mean, just look at that name. Look at what circulated during the campaign. Look what CONTINUES to circulate. It is an intrinsic feeling of bigotry, plain and simple, and it makes my country, and me, look like less than we are when such a position is furthered.
I said this before, but I'll say it again: They wouldn't like Hillary, either, but they'd never question whether or not she's a natural-born American citizen. Why? Because, despite their loathing of her, at least she's got the same skin color.
Billy
· 5 months ago
Uh POTUS has to submit evidence of eligibility too.
So Obama did.
He passed.
Thanks for playing.
G_M
· 5 months ago
“I did not volunteer with the intent of becoming a conscientious objector,” Stefan F. Cook told TWI in an email.
No, but he did volunteer with the intent of remaining a coward.
LawGirl
· 5 months ago
Interesting note: conscientious objectors are those who refuse to be drafted into the military. Former Major Stefan signed up, volunteered to fight and then when asked to go, refused. That's cowardice, not CO.
G_M
· 5 months ago
Ah, I didn't realize the distinction. Interesting!
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Bush was no angel either. I also felt strongly that both Mc Cain and Obama are not worthy for the house. Great choices. I wouldnt care what he or she looked like. I just wanted someone in office that knew what and how to run our country. To stop cheating many of us out of the money we make. The change I wanted was not to put my guns up. But to help the USA and to have a better life. I wanted change but not this crap-o-la
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Fuck off. Don't you dare say anything about wanting to "help the USA and to have a better life."
And don't ever say anything about putting your guns up. The Red Raiders would have nothing to do with you. Texas Tech is not Harvard but it is American through and through. You are not. Racism has no place in America. Neither does using a pretext of stupidity to further one's racist cause.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Then it's time you got out and did something about it. If you don't like it, that's fine, but, just as I'd say to my leftist brethren, protests are only a tiny piece of the puzzle. And sitting here complaining about it isn't helping anything.
You want change YOU can believe in? Be that change. Seek out people, specifically candidates, who believe what you believe. Write letters. Participate in the protests, but go beyond them. Discuss your issues with as many people as you can. Tell them what your solutions are.
Don't just TALK about change -- LIVE change.
Wizz
· 5 months ago
This is exactly why we will give Obama the full 8 years he needs to fix Bush's mess. This next case will be thrown out like all of the others, the Supreme Court already ruled. Like they said in the article it has simply become an 'urban legend.' I think the Republicans forget they are being ran out of office and don't have nearly enough votes to do anything, this is another reason why we have all decided to give Obama 8 full years to do his job.
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
We will stop when we see the original certificate and not a minute sooner. Name calling wll not work.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
President George W Bush or President Obama?
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
I promise to call you a lot of really colorful names if you'll promise to keep this nonsense up. It's the surest way I can think of for the Democrats to increase their majority in the Senate, increase their stranglehold in the House, and put a second coat of BLACK paint on the White House. (Did I scare you with that? Sorry!)
LawGirl
· 5 months ago
How about reason and logic? Will that work? Likely no.
Once again - for the slow kids...you will never...I repeat, never...see anyone's real birth certificate. Any birth certificate you see is always a certified copy. Always. Period. End of Story.
Somehow I think that if President Obama personally went to Hawai'i, got the real certificate, autographed it and sent it to kelleyye in Crazy Town...that you a) wouldn't believe it, and b) hate him because he doesn't look like you.
Oh...if you only put this much energy into getting a good education. The places you would go!!
lesforo
· 5 months ago
First of all, who is "we"? Am I to assume your speaking of the entire repulsive party? Second, why don't you, since your so hell bent about it, take your ass to the hospital in which the man was born, and get the certificate your damn self. Why does "we" have to do it for you? Don't waste another minute, go, get the job done so you can put yourself and all the other racists little pigs in this country to rest. That is what this is about anyway. This has been debunked several times over and it is a lost cause. BO doesn't have to show you are your ilk a damn thing. Well, off to another blogg, I feel like dumping on Sara Palin today. If your stupid and you know it, quit your job....if your stupid and you know it quit your job...la la la la la la la la.......
judith
· 5 months ago
Then fly yourself to Hawaii, walk into the appropriate building, and look at it.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Well I see you are very good with words and I must say. I do agree with you stephenperry. Congrads to you. I am not a repub nor a dem. I just want what is right for all and will continue to speak my mind and fight for my rights as well as others. I will never give up!!
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
You agree with me? What? You mean we both think that every breath you take is just a waste of oxygen that could have been better spent air-drying a convicted felon's scrotum after he showers?
Wow. I didn't know we were on the same page. There's still no hope for you. But at least now you're starting to see reason.
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
Black liberation theology will not fix the economy, a president who has business experience might.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Right, because business is just BOOMING in the US right now.
Wizz
· 5 months ago
Thanks to George Bush for this economy Obama was handed down. We all knew it would take Obama 8 FULL years to fix Bush's mess, and that's what we've all decided to give him, Democrats have united into one power. Republicans statistically don't even have close to the amount of votes needed to say other wise.
martyr
· 5 months ago
Hmmm, a problem with YOUR theory .. numbers don't add up.
EVEN with your million acorn mickey's and the students jumping around states registering and early voting all over.. even with your pawned translated ballots for don't ask don't tell illegal votes..
Allot of Democrats will not vote him in.. Allot of Libertarians will not vote him in.. ALLOT off Republicans who WILL NOT vote for him AGAIN..
then you are left trying to get the Independent voters.. who like so many people world wide like the man.. But he is not a world stage leader.. maybe a UN leader but not a World leader especially from the US Capital.. Man is in above his pay grade.. for sure..
So sorry to burst your bubble youngin .. but its not gonna happen..
Wizz
· 5 months ago
It's all fact, each one of the last three elections have been worse for Republicans and all three the Republicans said they were going to win. They must of bought into to much of Drudge's skewed polls and punditing. Our family was born and raised here in the south and we have traditionally voted Republican and we even jumped ship, many of our friends from College are teachers now...not even going to tell you what's going on in school's ;)
LawGirl
· 5 months ago
Oh, you mean like the guy who couldn't find oil in Texas in the 70's and 80's?
*snicker*
bradleyhogan
· 5 months ago
Obama should put it to rest and give his "real" birth certificate. problem solved,
JimPA
· 5 months ago
But we'll just say it is a fake and keep posting nonsense. Dude - He did. Why did Chief Justice Roberts deliver President Obama the oath of POTUS? Why didn't he refuse. Any SC justice can deliver the oath. Do you think he is in on it? And who is the cigarette man?
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Jimpa, I'm surprised you were not able to figure this out. It's SO obvious.
Bush was in on the conspiracy. So he nominated Roberts, who is also in on the conspiracy. Roberts's job was to cover his tracks by making a lot of rulings that NO Democrat could ever stomach, so that no one would suspect him. It worked beautifully so far. Roberts has come down against the individual in favor of the corporation, against the accused in favor of the State, against the injured medical malpractice plaintiff and in favor of the health services provider, and basically against anything Democrats prize.
This way, Roberts can now operate without scrutiny. Did you see how Roberts slyly replaced the Bible with a copy of the Qur'an that had been personally inscribed by Bin Laden? No? Oh you must have been watching the inauguration on MSNBC. Fox showed the whole thing, including the part when Obama knelt down and started washing his feet before praying toward Mecca.
So yeah. Bush. Roberts. Obama. One seamless direct line between them and whoever the hell else we need to include in this farcical conspiracy theory. Let's play Six Degrees of Separation; we can probably prove that we're ALL in on it!
JimPA
· 5 months ago
Don't be surprise. I was just seeing if anyone figure it all out. Nice play stephenperry. Now answer your door.
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
Come on Obama, lets see the $12 original, then we will leave you alone, but Not a minute sooner.
brendand
· 5 months ago
He's provided evidence. Do you have contrary evidence?
One more time, everybody, sing along! "The burden of proof is on the accuser."
JimPA
· 5 months ago
Do you think we really walked on the moon?
billyray
· 5 months ago
If I were on the Republican side I'd shut up...simply because if Obama has to step out Joe Bidden steps in. Let it go girls!
brendand
· 5 months ago
Frankly, that'd be my dream. I <3 Joe.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
You're scary if you wish Biden was President. Please someone take away your voter registration card.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
You dream about Biden?
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Name calling never will work. Proof is proof. I dont think that is to much to ask for. I wanted Obama to be the best he could be, no mater if he was a leftest or righty. I didnt know we would loose our rights as fast as he has accomplished. I again will never give up my weapons and will kill anyone who tries. I will go with the consitution. Its the AMERICAN WAY.
smidget
· 5 months ago
Prove that he's trying to take your guns.
That's right, you can't, because he isn't. Thanks for yet more proof that birthers are morons. The pile of evidence is getting really tall.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Who is trying to take your weapons away?
And why do you have weapons in the first place?
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Proof is proof. Except when it proves you wrong. Then you just lie some more.
If you will go with the Constitution, then tell us why you keep ignoring everything it says.
I would spit in your face if you tried to tell me jack shit about the American Way. You have no fucking clue what that phrase means. Crawl back under your rock. We have a proud and decent country to participate in.
theodosa
· 5 months ago
Kwiley9711 - you are ass deep in the GOP kool-aid fountain. Do youself a favor, come up for air.
murray19
· 5 months ago
what's wrong with the certificate provided by the hawaii dept of health?
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
It doesn't say what the birthers want it to say. Namely, that a nigg*r cannot be President of the United States.
Other than that, nothing at all. Thanks for asking.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Well said, dude.
theodosa
· 5 months ago
You got it 100% right as rain. They want to call this President a n*gger and discredit him every step of the way. By the time 2010 rolls around the GOP should be officially pushin' up daisies bigtime.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Whats wrong with it is that its not a Birth Certificate. A certificate of live birth is NOT a birth certificate. There is a difference
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
You are righ. Joe would step in. It would be worse. We all need to stand united and work and vote for the things you, me and everyone else that is reading these words. This is our rights. We will vote tell we cant vote no more. I wont let it go girl!! I will continue to speak freely and express my thoughts to everyone who reads this. I simply want my country back. I want with is right. I will never just simply let it go as you say. No.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Okay, first of all, I'm happy that you want to work to get what you want, but for the love of God, please stop mangling the English language.
Express your thoughts all you want, but it would help your cause a hell of a lot more if you would get up off your butt, get out from behind the computer screen, and go out into the world.
I'm just sayin'...
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
You want your country back? Hmmm, 1956 is gone and it's not coming back. Mayberry only exists on DVD now.
OUR country is right here. We finally took it back on January 20. What, were you out taking a whizz or something? It was a pretty big day. You can probably find some YouTube clips. Look for the black guy putting his hand on the Bible and swearing to uphold the Constitution. There's a lot of armed uniformed police around him and yet he's not under arrest. Shouldn't be hard to find.
theodosa
· 5 months ago
Exactly, thank you. We got our country back from the criminals in the last administration who shredded the Constitution. If Reagan was alive today he would agree with me.
vonbismark
· 5 months ago
These lunatics better find something more useful for their precious time.Before coming to America Obama's father was already married with children and so couldn't have taken his mother to Kenya for the delivery of Obama.If this had happened Obama's mother upon return to America would have denounced him.But there is no record of this. The likes of Alan Keyes will never get over their defeat by Obama.Especially so with Alan Keyes 'cause he has the keys to hell.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Come on von. Why dont any of you understand that all Obama has to do is show his Birth Certificate (not his Certificate of Live Birth) and all this goes away. ITS THAT SIMPLE!
brendand
· 5 months ago
I'll ask you again, Chucky: What is the difference? A Certificate of Live Birth IS a Birth Certificate. Are you confused with the "Certification" of live birth? There is a difference between a Certification and a Certificate, but a "Certification" is, essentially, a short-form Birth Certificate.
Do you even know what you're talking about?
theodosa
· 5 months ago
He already has you crazy loons....LOLOLOL. Keep it up though, it will only make the GOP look even more ridiculous come 2010.
vonbismark
· 5 months ago
You doubt the authencity of the Certificate of Birth either because you're not American yourself or you're simply ignorant. In your wild and dilusional belief in the superioty of the white race,you could not believe in the evolution of time until this rude awakening of a black President. Get a life,man.
________________________________ De : Disqus <> À : gforlah@yahoo.fr Envoyé le : Vendredi, 17 Juillet 2009, 22h57mn 47s Objet : [washingtonindependent] Re: birther movement continues
chuckj wrote, in response to vonbismark: Come on von. Why dont any of you understand that all Obama has to do is show his Birth Certificate (not his Certificate of Live Birth) and all this goes away. ITS THAT SIMPLE! Link to comment: http://washingtonindependent.com/?p=51489#comme... -- You may reply to this email to post your response. To turn off notifications, go to your Disqus settings at: http://disqus.com/settings/notifications/
murray19
· 5 months ago
and when has he said he was taking away people's guns?
Wizz
· 5 months ago
Exactly, both Pelosi and Reid said they are not interested in adding more gun control laws...just enforcing the ones they have now, sounds fair enough to an NRA member like myself.
petewg
· 5 months ago
By his own statements, Obama has said he is “native citizen” and not a “natural born citizen”. baed on his "dual citizenship", and therefore - he is NOT eligible to legally hold the office of President. We cannot dismiss this fundamental fact.
OBAMA IS NOT ABOVE OUR CONSTITUTION.
brendand
· 5 months ago
How DARE you insult dual citizens of this country! I was born in Chicago. I have lived in the US all my life. But my father was born in Ireland. Through him, I have dual Irish and American citizenship.
Guess what? I could still be inaugurated as President were I to win enough electoral votes.
Shut your damned mouth and learn something!
JimPA
· 5 months ago
He would supply a link to this ground breaking fact but Rush didn't give him one.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
There was to many items that was tested on this on from the department of health. As a matter of fact I to made one for me and it does look so very real. I now question it. I wish I was smarter to figure out who did this to Obama, and why? I feel so strongly that some one some where has made this out to be very damaging to us all. Like I said, I dont care who runs for office, just please take care of the Americans first, then help who ever needs help. I was shocked to see his place of birth. I was shocked to see how poorly the certificate was put together.
Belle1
· 5 months ago
Actually, I am quite puzzled why President Obama would rather pay attorneys in LA over $1 Million dollars to seal his birth certificate, his college records, his doctor's records....yet he blasted McCain for not releasing his complete medical history.
Seems a smart business man would pay $50 to the state of Hawaii for a Certificate of Live Birth vs. paying $1 Million to try and keep everything withheld.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
I hear it was 1 billion dollars.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
Ok, let say the birthers are right. What's President Obama's end game?
Wizz
· 5 months ago
A second term...which he will get as the Dems have superior voting numbers.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
You birther suck at conspiracy theory. Come one what is President Obama's end game.
FuzzyandBlue
· 5 months ago
chuckj claims: "Why do you people keep lying and say he put his Birth Certificate up for all to see? He never did. He put up a Certificate of Live Birth. That is NOT a Birth Certificate. There is a difference. "
Really? I just retrieved the birth certificates of myself, my husband, and our 2 children from our safe. Guess what, ya nutbag? They all say in capital letters this: CERTIFICATE OF LIVE BIRTH. I called my county's Office of Vital Statistics to verify that in fact the certifcates I am in possession of are 100% legal Ohio birth certificates. Guess what again, ya nutbag? These documents, with the words CERTIFICATE OF LIVE BIRTH, are 100% our legal birth certificates according to the state of Ohio and they are THE only birth certificates that the state of Ohio administers to the natural-born citizens of Ohio. Ever think for 1 second that perhaps your birth certificate might look different from Barack Obama's b/c it is from a different state? Of course not. That would require actual thought and cognition. Are you intricately aware of the appearance of legal birth certificates of every single state of the Union? Of course not. Soooo .... in addition to being a nutbag you are also a mouthbreathing idiot. Now go play in traffic, bright boy.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
That is not the Long Form Birth Certificate. There is a difference.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
Educate me. post a link to your Long Form Birth Certificate.
JimPA
· 5 months ago
You birther suck at conspiracy theory. Come one what is President Obama's end game.
brendand
· 5 months ago
A "Long Form Birth Certificate" is not necessary to become president. Proof of natural birth is. He has provided this already.
murray19
· 5 months ago
Okubo, who said that she gets weekly questions from Obama ‘Birthers’ that are “more like threats,” explained that the certificate of live birth reproduced by Obama’s campaign should have debunked the conspiracy theories. “If you were born in Bali, for example,” Okubo explained, “you could get a certificate from the state of Hawaii saying you were born in Bali. You could not get a certificate saying you were born in Honolulu. The state has to verify a fact like that for it to appear on the certificate. But it’s become very clear that it doesn’t matter what I say. The people who are questioning this bring up all these implausible scenarios. What if the physician lied? What if the state lied? It’s just become an urban legend at this point.”
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Aside from the level of detail differentiating the documents (hospital of record, doctor, height, weight, etc) - in the state of Hawaii, one authenticates natural born citizenship, and the other doesn't. This part is important, and again - it has nothing to do with tin foil hats. Per the State of Hawaii's Department of Health, "Amended certificates of birth may be prepared and filed with the Department of Health, as provided by law, for 1) a person born in Hawaii who already has a birth certificate filed with the Department of Health or 2) a person born in a foreign country." (For citation purposes, please feel free to visit their site: http://hawaii.gov/health/vital-records/vital-re... ).
murray19
· 5 months ago
feel free to read this debunking “It’s crazy,” said Janice Okubo, director of communications for the Hawaii Department of Health. “I don’t think anything is ever going to satisfy them.”
Okubo, who said that she gets weekly questions from Obama ‘Birthers’ that are “more like threats,” explained that the certificate of live birth reproduced by Obama’s campaign should have debunked the conspiracy theories. “If you were born in Bali, for example,” Okubo explained, “you could get a certificate from the state of Hawaii saying you were born in Bali. You could not get a certificate saying you were born in Honolulu. The state has to verify a fact like that for it to appear on the certificate. But it’s become very clear that it doesn’t matter what I say. The people who are questioning this bring up all these implausible scenarios. What if the physician lied? What if the state lied? It’s just become an urban legend at this point.”
murray19
· 5 months ago
there is in some states a long form and a short form. Either one proves that he was born in Hawaii. I know that in illinois they give you a copy not the original
judith
· 5 months ago
Of COURSE they give you a copy. If they gave you the original, the state would no longer have the official record of your birth. Certificates of live birth certify that the infant was born alive. I assume another certificate is used when the infant is stillborn.
Obama has long since produced his birth certificate. He has to produce a copy, just as these people only can produce copies of their own birth certificates. What actually is he supposed to do to satisfy these people? They look right at it and they say he won't produce it. The proper officials in Hawaii say it exists and they won't believe it. They are people who can look at direct evidence of a thing and still claim that thing doesn't exist. They must have a very hard time getting by at all in this world, where for them no evidence exists of anything except what they choose to believe, and what they choose to believe is true, even in the face of all evidence to the contrary.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Yes having a DUAL if this is so true he is not eligible for his seat. yes you are also right on that. If this is true he needs to step down and allow good old Joe to take his seat.
brendand
· 5 months ago
HOW DARE YOU!
I am a natural-born American citizen. I have dual citizenship with Ireland through my father. And yet I still would qualify to become President of the United States.
You are either a liar or an ignoramus. Either way, you've now lost any dwindling respect I had for your intellect. Shut your mouth and learn something.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Some you people just amaze me. I cant help but laugh yet be disappointed at the same time.
First off, Obama never showed his birth certificate. He showed a certificate of live birth, which is different than a birth certificate. People who have been born outside the US have been able to get a Certificate of Live Birth. Second, Congress held hearings to determine McCains eligibility. I bet none of you had issues with that. Yet now you want to spew your usual hate for anyone other than a liberal who want to know if Obama indeed has a birth certificate.
Last, and most important. All he has to do is show the damn thing and all this is over with. Instead of bashing those that want to see it, why cant you question why Obama keeps fighting all this? It doesnt make any sense if he indeed has a Birth Certificate, why he doesnt just show it.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Are you learning-impaired? A birth certificate is NOT NECESSARY to become president! Only proof of natural birth is. He has provided that.
Could it be fake? Sure. But guess what? George W. Bush's could've been faked, too. So could Ronald Reagan's. So could FDR's. So could ANY president's!
The point is, you're not going to be happy even if he provides it. Or, if you are, others of your ilk will not. It's a neverending battle. You're just pissy that your side lost the election. Get over it!
Sara_W
· 5 months ago
My Certificate of Live Birth is from Kansas. That is what is says. I got this copy in 1982. My husband's says the same thing Certificate of Live Birth and his is from Oklahoma and we got his copy in 2006.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
SEE Even Fuzzy and Blue has the same thing on there birth records. Explain to my why all american born birth records have this but not Obama's?
just john
· 5 months ago
Me, I'm wondering what nation Sarah Palin was born in. A minute of listening to her speak makes it obvious that American English is not her native tongue. So what is? Afrikaans?
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
That would be an insult even to the people whose entire language is nothing but a series of clicks and whistles. Who would ever want to be associated with Sarah Palin? Oh wait, I forgot. Birthers. My bad.
Still, the clicks and whistles point remains. I think I can understand those people better than I can understand Palin anyway. She just always sounds like a third grader trying to give an oral report on particle physics without having done any of the reading first.
just john
· 5 months ago
(FYI: Afrikaans is rooted in Dutch.)
captainsteve
· 5 months ago
Dogs Republicans? I think not. I'm a libertarian, but it's to the Republicans credit if they pursue this. If there's nothing to hide, why is Obama spending millions to hide?
OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE!!!!!
AGAIN WHERE IS YOUR PROOF THAT HE IS SPENDING MILLIONS? PROOF???
brendand
· 5 months ago
What law says a Long Form Birth Certificate is necessary to become president? The Constitution certainly doesn't. You know why? Because when the Constitution was written, Long Form Birth Certificates didn't exist!
Why do you hate the Constitution?
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Captain, only in your delusional mind has Obama spent "millions" to "hide" anything. It has not cost millions or hundreds of thousands or even tens of thousands to deal with this nonsense. Obama has not yet even had to defend himself; the suits were tossed as frivolous, which they clearly are.
The judges who have heard this nonsense have thus far thrown out the cases sua sponte. That means on their own motion, without requiring the President to have to brief the matter. The one exception is where a judge just agreed to hear the birthers' claims "on the merits" instead of throwing them out on a procedural motion.
That is good news for people who care about truth and honesty and who want to get this nonsense behind us. Because once the case has been heard on the merits, the judge will then throw it out. And if it has been heard on the merits, it can no longer be re-filed, under the doctrine of res judicata ("the thing has been decided"). No one else will be allowed to bring the same or similar claims. Before it has been heard on the merits, people could just keep re-filing and starting over.
Wizz
· 5 months ago
Thanks John, some of these people never went to College and are just plain ignorant. And for their ignorance we'll reward Obama with a second term...we just have one more election to go to make this a one party system, Republicans are a dying breed...welcome to the modern generation of College Grads and Professionals people.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Here is what's funny about Liberals. Check out this video of Ma'am Barbara Boxer being a bigot.
I don't hate you. Why do you hate me, just because of my political leanings?
Pyak
· 5 months ago
Birthers are deranged and need to get a life. Speak to a real issue. This one just shows how low the educational level in the US is.
rcwblessed
· 5 months ago
They're undereducated and proud of it!
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
What could of slipped thru the channels was what we have seen. All of Obama;s records are sealed including his medical records. Birth and medical, and his schooling. Why? Whats there to hide?
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
PROOF?? JUST MORE LIES?? WHERE IS YOUR PROOF THAT THEY ARE SEALED?
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Nice name....loser. Grow up.
Look it up, we dont have to do all you research for you. But we could show it to you and you still wouldnt believe it.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
IN OTHER WORDS YOU HAVE NONE JUST RUNNING YOUR UNEDUCATED MOUTH STFU ASSHOLE
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Why dont you go back to school and get some education. Also, try to learn some manners. Loser.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
WHY DON'T YOU TRY EDUCATION BOBBY BOUCHER IT'S NOT THE DEVIL P**CK!
suu
· 5 months ago
you are rude. I have to go and do something important like write congress and senate not to vote of cap and rate and government withholding medical coverage.
brendand
· 5 months ago
So show it. Please.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Exactly. Some of these liberals seem to forget just how much of his past and records got put on lock down. Mr. Transparency. LOL
We all told you he lied about being transparent during the campaign. The proof was there. All he did was try to hide his past or excuse it. Now here we are, and its a FACT that he has NOT been transparent.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
AGAIN ALL WE SEE IS YOU RUNNING YOUR UNEDUCATED MOUTH WHERE IS YOUR PROOF?
suu
· 5 months ago
where you your proof? If you TRY to research Obama, you will NOT find anything. So asking for proof is impossible to obtain because he has locked it away.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
PROOF??
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Very well put wizz
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
I really don't think you understood any of what wizz was saying. You seem not to understand that wizz means the Democratic party when referring to a "one party system."
But don't worry about little things like reading comprehension. It's not like you needed to understand how to read your own child's birth certificate, which you obviously failed to understand (or are just lying about); why bother trying to understand what some fact-oriented liberal named wizz is trying to say?
Facts, you will find, often get right smack dab in the way of a good racist rant.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Thank you Captainsteve. And I though I was alone here. LOL
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Its a fact that congress and Obama has sealed all of his records. This is one reason why so many people out here will continue to ask where's the proof. WHERE IS THE PROOF AND WHY HIDE
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
WHERE IS THE PROOF THAT HE IS HIDING IT?? THE BURDON OF PROOF IS ON YOU JETHRO
brendand
· 5 months ago
BurdEn, Stupidity. There's an E. The other one is a reference to the former lead singer of the Animals.
cecile
· 5 months ago
fail, brendand. that would be eric burton.
JLW
· 5 months ago
No, it IS Burdon. Look it up.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
Reall? Where is the proof or is that something else besides the vibarator that you pull out of your butt??
suu
· 5 months ago
THE DEMOS AND SUPPORTS ARE JUST LIKE THOSE IN THE DAY OF HITLER. SITTING BACK AND WONDERING HOW THIS COULD BE HAPPENING, OH WELL HE IS A GOOD SPEAKER AND MAKES US HAVE HOPE. YOU ARE BLINDED FROM THE TRUTH, YOU CANNOT SEE THE EVIL THAT IS BEING CONDUCTED. AND HE HAS NOT PROVIDED ANY DOCUMENTATION THAT PROVES WHERE HE WAS BORN, WHY DO YOU THINK HE IS HIDING IT? HOW DID HE TRAVEL OVERSEAS IN HIS EARLY DAYS WHEN NO ONE WAS ALLOWED TO TRAVEL TO WHERE HE WENT. WHY DOES HE HAVE A CREATED LIFE AND NOT A LIFE THAT CAN BE DOCUMENTED. DONT YOU SEE, YOU CANNOT FIND HANYWHERE IN HISTORY, NO RECORDS, ETC. HE IS A CREATED SOCIALIST OF BILL AYRES, REV WRIGHT, ETC. THE ACORN THREADS ARE SO DEEP INTANGLED WITH HIM, THE LIES BEING TOLD MY POLOSI, THE SNEAKY WAY THEY PUTTING HATE CRIME LEGISLATION INTO DEFENSE BILLS. HOW CAN YOU NOT SEE THE DECEIPT IN ALL THIS.
just john
· 5 months ago
Wow, it's in all caps and with no paragraph breaks!
It MUST be true!
brendand
· 5 months ago
lolz.
slimslowslider
· 5 months ago
Best CAPZ LOCK POSSE post yet!!!
Wizz
· 5 months ago
lol, isn't Bush the one that started a war over WMDs that never existed...."show me the WMDs!" It's always Republicans that want to start some type of war as soon as they get in office, and they lose that war (Korea,Vietnam, Iraq)...so you tell me who the real Hitler wanna be's are??
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Granny? Is that you? Didn't we tell you not to post weird rants after you have your medication? And turn off the caps lock key.
Hitler? Really? You're comparing President Obama with Hitler? So then who's George Bush? Emporer Nero? Pharoah? Is Cheney Beelzebub?
Hiding it? I guess President Obama was hiding his birth certificate during the campaign by posting it online. That is the last place Republicans would think to look. Sort of the way I stash cash in my library of books in my living room. I know no thief will look in my books.
So yeah, that sneaky Obama, hiding things from us by showing them to us. Shiftless, lazy, and sneaky, That One is....
AdmiralJ
· 5 months ago
"Birther's" the only person dumber than this group of morons is their leaders. G.W.Bush, Hanity, and anyone on the Fox "newless" channel. Quit spreading lies and show proof that Obama was NOT born in Hawaii. If you can't do that then shut your F***** mouths. You lost the last election because of the very crap your spreading. This will not bring you back to the throne of power. But you can still sit on the white porcelin throne in the morning and get your repbulican on and wipe you Limbaugh.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Angry much. Typical liberal post. I usually know when a liberal is posting when they sound angry, call people names, blame Bush for rain, etc, etc ,etc
You need to lighten up, get some fresh air, and try to be happy.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Whubbout you, Chucky? Are you happy?
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
YOU NEED TO MOVE OUT OF YOUR MAMAS BASEMENT AND WASH YOUR ASS YOU STINK
lesforo
· 5 months ago
Sounds like great advise! Fresh air, like..... watch Glen beck doom and gloom comedy hour, or hey, how bout i watch lou dobbs bitch because the entire country can't be white and southern baptists.
ralphconner
· 5 months ago
'Oh sure, we'll just put Mcain in because you don't accept any documents'. 'This will work - no need to formulate credible policies or win elections.' Just question every basic fact of life. What will you do when this leads to even less credibility, pout? ROFL, - keep it up!
murray19
· 5 months ago
Okubo, who said that she gets weekly questions from Obama ‘Birthers’ that are “more like threats,” explained that the certificate of live birth reproduced by Obama’s campaign should have debunked the conspiracy theories. “If you were born in Bali, for example,” Okubo explained, “you could get a certificate from the state of Hawaii saying you were born in Bali. You could not get a certificate saying you were born in Honolulu. The state has to verify a fact like that for it to appear on the certificate. But it’s become very clear that it doesn’t matter what I say. The people who are questioning this bring up all these implausible scenarios. What if the physician lied? What if the state lied? It’s just become an urban legend at this point.”
chuckj
· 5 months ago
TO break up the tense tone of some of these posts, here is some humor. Ms. "Dont Call Me Ma'am if you are military" Barbara Boxer (Dem) shows that she is a condescending bigot.
BET YOU GET A GOOD LAUGH EVERYTIME YOU SIT TO PEE HUH???
chuckj
· 5 months ago
You obsessed with me? Should I report you for stalking? lol
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
YOUR TRIFFLING ASS IS FUNNY!! I LOVE LAUGHING AT RETARDS STRAIGHT OFF THE SHORT BUS
brendand
· 5 months ago
Well, you could probably hear him/her coming. I mean, that's a helluva lot of shouting...
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
BECAUSE YOU CLOWNS ARE HARD OF HEARING
brendand
· 5 months ago
Wait, wait, wait, now I'm a clown? I'm on your side, you fool. I just think you should learn how to have a civilized argument rather than posting insults in all-caps. Let's try to be adults about this, huh?
Alan Smithee
· 5 months ago
Brendand- Would it be insane in the ol' membrane to theorize that RepubStupidity might be a neo-conservative troller posing as a dem? The all-caps thing is a dead giveaway.
brendand
· 5 months ago
God, I hope not. 'Cause that's just sad.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
We must vote OUT congress to change what has happened to our beloved country. WOW! Now what do you think would happen to Obama? hehehe
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
YOPU BET NOT ONE REPUBLICAN WILL BE RELECTED THAT YOUR DUMBASS CAN COUNT ON
craig spar
· 5 months ago
I'm sure sorry , that at this point in the decline of the USA's economy, the republicans, who have not one single clue, how to stop the downward slide, turn to this kind of crapp as a distraction from their flaccid, ineptness. But are we surprised? No. This is all the republicans have left.. no good ideas,no solutions, just anger and ranting and hissy fits. Luckily,the intelligent majority of Americans, also know this and the republicans will be marginalized for decades if not forever. Good Riddance!
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Did you just wake up? Where have you been the past few months. The economy is getting worse under Obama. He either doesnt have a clue on what hes doing or he does. Either way, its scary. This birth certificate thing isnt a GOP thing. This is an American thing. He either has the real certificate or he doesnt. If he does, quit fighting it and show it. Then all of us will shut up about it. As long as he continues to fight it, the law suits will come.
brendand
· 5 months ago
The thing I can't figure out, having been on this forum for a good long while, is why this is even an issue. We've got a tanked economy that, quite frankly, isn't looking like it's going to get much better under President Obama. We've got two wars still raging in the Middle East, with one significantly ramped-up since the president took office. Our schools are still sucking massively. Our environment is going buh-bye. Our banks and states are going broke. And Democrats are in control of every non-judicial aspect of the federal government.
Why, then, make THIS an issue? Not only are there more important things to focus on, but there are also more important issues that can be won by the side currently engaged in this idiotic warfare.
Seriously, conservatives, why waste your time on this issue that quite frankly will get you nowhere when there are REAL issues out there on which you can actually win?
ibwilliamsi
· 5 months ago
They waste time on this because they have nothing real to add to real life issues. It's like that old Cool Whip Commercial where the husband and wife dine al fresco at night, and the husband says "Look! It's Haley's Comet!" While the wife looks away, the husband steals some of her Cool Whip. These people have nothing real to add to the conversation.
What saddens me the most, is how divisive this all is. Terrorists couldn't ask for anything better than to have us wasting time hating each other about silly lies. The conservative "Birthers" an their ilk are terrorist tools, trying their best to rip the USA to shreds.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
By the way. Did you guys go to the new recovery.gov? Hmmmm? Now how much money was spent on there site for TRANSPARENCY? WHEW! Yep we are bankrupt.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Wiley, on what do we spend most of the money in the Federal Budget?
(I know, but I'm testing you.)
lesforo
· 5 months ago
Wiley has signed off all the sudden. You can't get news from Fox and sound like you know what the hell your talking about, much less sound smart about it.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
PROOF?? OR YOU USING THAT VULCAN MIND MELD AGAIN?
brendand
· 5 months ago
Well, money DID have to be spent on recovery.gov. I mean, we can't deny the facts.
The question is, what do we spend the GREATEST amount on? Because it's important to know.
lesforo
· 5 months ago
You are stupid.
martyr
· 5 months ago
Wait!! Why would O have to post a copy of his cert I mean I am way old and you know what I have my Original.. from New haven a small half the size of a postcard Birth cert.. why being younger by a few years did he not have the ORIGINAL to post albeit the number blanked out.
What I see by all this is the matter is not EVER going to be settled unless this Mr transparent O bummer shines allot of light on all his records.. ALL of them.. till then yep ..
He is in my humble opinion ... drumroll the Antichrist .. prove me wrong? He sure fits THAT description to a "T"
Finally do you race baiters even have a black or Hispanic friend or is this the best you can do? act like you give a darn..
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
POST IT AND PROVE IT TO US ALL. I SEE YOU ARE FUUL OF S**T
brendand
· 5 months ago
Brother, I have NO idea what your post is saying. Is that sarcasm, or is that how you actually feel?
And for God's sake, learn how to use some punctuation once in awhile!
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
WHERE IS YOURS?? OR DID MAMA JUST PULL YOU OUT OF THE HOLE IN THE OUTHOUSE?
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Atternies have tried to get his records and so have some of the senators. the brotherhood of congress sealed what ever Obama wanted. They seem to work hand in hand on what they wantto pass. Such as late last night congress passed the 500 billion dollars for um what? No one was in on that one either. Now why would they do this at night time and no repubs in on it? Got me? Yeah right. There's that fillabuster number again.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
PROOF?? PLEASE PROVIDE THE PROOF
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Hmmmm, HOW DARE ME? Read the constitution, over and over and over and over.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
YOU CAN READ?? WHO HELPED YOU WITH THE BIG WORDS?
just john
· 5 months ago
How dare you what? Half of your replies seem to be to people who the rest of us can't see.
Maybe you should ask THEM for proper documentation.
brendand
· 5 months ago
You're not very bright, are you?
Article II of the United States Constitution says, "No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States."
Where in there do you see anything having to do with being a dual citizen?
Wiley, I have read the Constitution, "over and over and over and over." Have you even read it once?
janet
· 5 months ago
You have go0t to be kidding Hannity after we all saw you lose it talking to someone that diagreed with you,This did not mean anything about the armay why would they want someone whom they could not trust in battle who just migh shoot his own people.Seems to me that makes more sense thaen what Hannity thinks.not many soldiers would like this man in their troops afraid he would back shoot them is the more likely story
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
I haven't listened to anything Hannity said. But the ex-Major was a volunteer. He volunteered for service in Afghanistan. When you volunteer you can change you mind any time up until the day you're supposed to ship out.
That's what the Major did. When he sued to get out of going, the military quite reasonably read that as an indication that he had changed his mind about his volunteer service and told him not to show up. And then his DoD contractor employer fired his worthless ass.
He only volunteered so that paperwork could be generated telling him to ship out. Once he had those orders, he met the prerequisite for filing suit (unless you are presently under orders to leave, your suit is not yet "ripe" so the orders have to be issued first).
In other words, the whole thing was a political stunt cooked up by his lawyer, who filed similarly frivolous claims about Obama's birth certificate on behalf of other tools like the ex-Major. She will soon be disbarred for violating Federal Rule of Civil Procedure 5, which indicates that every pleading filed by a lawyer must be filed in good faith for a proper purpose. Political stunts clearly do not count.
I wish he HAD gone overseas. I am sure that he would not have come back home except in a box with a flag over it. No one likes cowards. He would have deserved to get fragged for the disrespect he showed to our military, our judicial system, and our President. Piece of shit coward.
cigi
· 5 months ago
I would also like to recommend legislation that requires ALL Rethugs to have their DNA tested to verify that they are "even human". This "birther crap" is just that...crap...go read Fact Check if you want to argue further. They have seen, felt the seal and verified the legitimacy of the document. Rethugs are poor losers and they never can do anything with class or grace, unlike our truly intelligent, classy President, Barack Obama. So all your Rethugs keep on your cattervwalling and whining...you lost, get used to it!
painbodyII
· 5 months ago
I wonder about many of your comments. I wonder where you learned English, supposedly the "official language of the United States of America. I suppose it could be the same place where you learned "logic", where you learned common decency, where you learned to love thy neighbor as thyself, etc. I get that you are angry. I get that you hate 24/7. I get that you teach hate to your children and to your family. I get that you have nothing but your skins and that you are sooooo afraid the real world is going to leave you in the dirt where you think you shouldn't be.
Wayoutwest
· 5 months ago
Hey Chuck,are you a real person or a computer generated virus? You repeat the same mantra over and over and are clogging up the interweb. If you are real please state your real intentions. Do you really want Biden running the country? Are your intentions more radical, throw the goverment into chaos so the religous right can take control and install carabou barbie as our leader. Please let us know so we can prepare for this glorious future. I am easily swayed and am ready to PRAISE THE LEADER.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
You voted for Biden, not me.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Anyone want to hear a joke? So Joe Biden recently said that "We have to spend money to keep from going bankrupt"
LOL oh wait....that isnt a joke? He actually said that? Wow.
Now this is the second guy in command. And in his economic class, he learned to get out of bankruptcy, you need to spend more money...that you dont have. Wow, talk about clueless.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Stop. It was bad enough when you were just a racist prick. Now you're an economic doofus too?
Deficit spending is how you get out of a recession. Economic cycles have been going on since well before Egyptians and Romans fought over who had to keep Mark Antony. When your economy is in recession, people stop buying things. So producers cut down on how much they make. And prices rise. Which is bad. Since people have no money. Since it's a recession.
So the government spends. Whether it has the money or not. And that money that the government spends goes into the economy. Roads get built. Bridges get repaired. School books get printed. People get hired. People get paid. People pay taxes. The government gets paid back. But more importantly, the economy pulls itself out of the ditch.
So STFU since you clearly have not the foggiest idea what you're talking about.
"Wow, talk about clueless."
Keep 'em coming, genius. I have all day.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
All may be well on that Lillbet2nd but for some odd reason some of the numbers dont add up. I wish it would help. I was surprised when Maya couldnt remember what the name of the hospital he was born in. And there is his GrandMother in Kenya that watched the birth of her Grandson right there in Kenya
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
LOL ANOTHER IDIOT THAT HAS NO CLUE WHAT THE HELL THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT......POST PROOF IDIOT!!
slimslowslider
· 5 months ago
Can you provide some proof for this part: And there is his GrandMother in Kenya that watched the birth of her Grandson right there in Kenya
I mean, this has been debunked so many times... good lord. If you are so obsessed with this issue, wouldn't you at least keep the debunked talking points off the page? It makes you look even dumber. Then again, go right ahead. This is hilarious. Go Birfers, Go!
cathy
· 5 months ago
No she didn't. She was being interviewed via an interpreter. The interviewer asked if she'd seen the birth of her grandson. The interpreter mangled the translation and Obama's grandmother, not understanding the question, said, "Yes" then realizing she'd misunderstood the question, corrected herself and said," No."
As for Maya not knowing the name of the hospital her father was born in, I haven't the faintest idea of the name of the hospital my father was born in. I just know that he was born in Kalamazoo, period.
AdmiralJ
· 5 months ago
I just finished reading all the comments by readers here. Now more than ever we need health care. I didn't realize that we have so many citizens that need to be committed to mental institutions. Please vote for health care so we can get these people treatment.
joyce
· 5 months ago
best to remember that the antichrist you all refer to is said to come with a bi9ble and carring a cross that should tell you who might be what and it sure isn't Obama You forget he comes from a republican state and I am sure the republican governor would have looked at records You conspercy theroist are just plain crazy like Rush L Beck and Hannity if you want to see antichrist look to these kinds of people to stir up violence3
Alan Smithee
· 5 months ago
Brendand- Would it be insane in the ol' membrane to theorize that RepubStupidity might be a neo-conservative troller posing as a dem? The all-caps thing is a dead giveaway.
Thats the difference between what Obama showed, and what proof people are asking to see.
brendand
· 5 months ago
And yet, that doesn't explain why a Certificate (as you call it) of Live Birth (not a Certification, which is what they show here) is not worthy.
Either way, I will reiterate -- AGAIN -- that the United States Constitution does NOT specify that the President produce something called a Birth Certificate. Why, Chuck, do you think that your demands are more important than the Constitution's?
and that means what?? guess what retard people in america can say whatever they want it does not make it true! You really need to stop with the meth
brendand
· 5 months ago
@ chuckj:
Chuck, you wrote, "You're scary if you wish Biden was President. Please someone take away your voter registration card."
You are un-American as they come, sir. In everything that we have debated on this board so far, I have never once insinuated or said outright that you should be barred from voting for your beliefs.
You, sir, have just gone from legitimate debater to supporter of Stalin-esque tyranny. Congratulations.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
Look, if someone out there really believes Biden should be President, that is down right scary. A joked about taking away their registration card, but to be serious anyone who has heard what good ole Biden has to say, should NEVER want him to be President.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Well, now, I don't think it's scary at all. I think Biden is brilliant, and I agree with a lot (though not all) of what he has to say (though he's no Jesse Ventura, that's for sure).
I don't ask that you agree with me, and I'm pretty sure I won't agree with you. Frankly, I think it's pretty scary that anyone would want Mike Huckabee to be president when his #1 issue is abortion, and it seriously freaks me out that anybody believes Sarah Palin is even remotely qualified to be dogcatcher (to paraphrase "good ole Biden"). But that's just a political disagreement. We have a different worldview.
I get that you were joking, dude, but seriously... with all the shit that has been thrown at people on the left for the last few, um, decades, all the smears of un-Americanism and whatnot, I just get a very bad taste in my mouth when those kinds of things are said, even as jokes.
24AheadDotCom
· 5 months ago
Here's a question for everyone: after reading the statements from Janice Okubo, are you left with the impression that HI has verified that what's shown on BHO's site matches what HI has on file?
Dude, if I may call you dude: my linked website has been online since 9/02 and I'm not about to jeopardize my credibility by making something like that up.
If you dispute anything I'm saying, the burden of proof is on you. Otherwise, you're just trying to throw up dust.
Wowohwow
· 5 months ago
You're right, she's just the PR person, but this statement is from the Director of Health of Hawaii.
Dude-I think you could get the vault copy and STILL not believe!!! I hope you have a good therapist, you need it!
birfers'r'dumb
· 5 months ago
So, you don't have audio then.
If that's your game: I just spoke to the FBI, and they couldn't confirm that 24AheadDotCom isn't a pedophile.
If you dispute anything I'm saying, the burden of proof is on you. Otherwise, you're just trying to throw up dust.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
WHY SHOULD WE BELIEVE YOU? WHO ARE YOU? WHY SHOULD WE TAKE YOUR WORD OVER THE STATE OF HAWAII? WHERE IS YOUR PROOF? ALL YOU HAVE IS BS!! WHERE IS YOURS? HOW DO WE KNOW THAT YOU ARE NOT PAID BY THE GOP TO SPREAD THIS BS?? WHAT ARE YOUR CREDENTAILS? WHATS YOUR EDUCATION? WHY WOULD ANYONE FROM THE STATE OF HAWAII TALK TO YOU? DID YOU RECORD THE CONVERSATION? WHERE IS YOUR PROOF?
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Yes stephenperry I do want my country back and I will keep on buying my bulletts even if Obama tried to stop those sales to. I do admit it was harder to get my bullets but it can be done. Soon I wont have to go thru other means to keep me in pratice. I should be able to go to the gun store and buy what I want, and not what Obama wants. Just like I use to 6 months ago. Not in 1959
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
HAHAHA LIKE YOU SMALL PENIS RETARDS ARE THE ONLY ONE WITH A GUN.. PLEASE YOUR RETARED ASS WILL BE THE FIRST ONE TO DROP LIKE RHE COWARD YOU ARE POS
brendand
· 5 months ago
Where do you draw the line, Wiley? Should I be able to drive at whatever speed I want? Should I be able to get as intoxicated as I want and get behind the wheel? Should I be able to buy whatever I want from a drugstore, including, say, heroin and ketamine? Should the government just stay the eff out of my personal business so I can discipline my kids the way I choose, even if that means beating the absolute shit out of them?
Lines have to be drawn in civilized society. I'm not saying people should take all your guns, or whatever your weapons are, away. But for what could you possibly need, say, a Kalishnikov? If we should be able to get whatever from the local Gun Hut, shouldn't I be able to buy grenades if I want to? And then, if we're going forward with this doing what we want, shouldn't I be able to use them anytime, anywhere I want to?
brendand
· 5 months ago
@ Cecile:
Cecile, due respect, it's Eric Burdon who was the lead singer of the Animals, not Eric Burton.
(I realize this is OT, but I don't like disinformation of any kind getting out there.)
rhondadavis28
· 5 months ago
this is a game by the in-same republican right wing group that still fester on racial hatred.
just watch Rachel Maddows show from last night to see what the truth is
pat b. showed the world what that part of the party is all about/
shame shame shame
akarmenia1
· 5 months ago
Just can't have a political debate without calling the evil Republicans racists, can we? Please explain to me what about demaning a birth certificate is racist? The debate was just as fierce about John McCain, who was born in the Panama Canal Territory, and he is white as can be.
Let's have intelligent conversation and not just boil everything down to race.
slimslowslider
· 5 months ago
I googled "obama birth certificate" and got 1,780,000 results
I googled "john mccain birth certificate" and got 220,000 results.
so I don't think it was "just as fierce."
Ricardo
· 5 months ago
Intelligent conversation about Obama's birth certificate = oxyMORON.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Ok stephenperry, I do hope I am proved wrong.
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
How this all came about: Please take the time to read and understand whats going on.
It is said by Kenyan sources that Barack Obama was born in the coastal resort town of Mobassa, Kenya while his mother and father were on summer holiday from college, his mother went into labor in the hot sun while at the beach, she returns home with her baby and registers him born in HI with no proof needed besides herself as a witness, he is issued a COLB and his grandfather Stanley informs the newspapers of the birth which is then printed.
Obama for his entire life uses this COLB as his only american citizenship proof. Obama uses his Indonesian citizenship granted to him from his adoption by his Indonesian stepfather Lolo Soetoro for college grants and other foreign programs. Obama never registered for selective service as proven his Sel Service paperwork is fraudulent. In early '08 his passports were illegaly accessed along with 2 other candidates and on March 21 2008, Obama calls for the state dept to investigate (pls google: "Obama wants Congress to probe passport breach") Five days later, one of those witnesses of the breach, Lt. Quarles Harris Jr. was found shot dead in his car.
In his first day in office, Jan 21, Obama signs off on Executive Order 13489 sealing all records and leaving Attorney General Eric Holder in command of any document release.
July 14, Stefan Frederick Cook a reservist, who had previously filed a restraining order preventing his deployment to Afghanistan, was fired from his civilian job for questioning the elgibility of the Pres.
Look this stuff up, its all online, dont believe me, do your own research, this is not a conspracy theory, it is indeed a conspiracy.
If somehow proven: Biden becomes temporary president, a new election will be called for, democratic party fails and ceases to exist, Libertarians and Republicans become the 2 main parties, MSNBC Olberman and Maddow are done, Jackson and Sharpton cry foul, marches in the streets, marches turn to riots. From this point we can only hope for the best.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
PROOF? AND WORLDNUTDAILY IS NOT PROOF
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
No, here try this for starters. This is real, and these Obama drones are denying it.
You act like he cares about you, why do you defend him? Its his power, not yours, one day you will learn.
brendand
· 5 months ago
First of all, I'm no Obama drone. There's a difference between supporting a candidate and being all goopy for him/her.
But more than that, I'm with Stupidity -- what does your article about the passport breaches prove?
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
Well, its damn fishy. We can just let the people decide for themselves.
just john
· 5 months ago
We did, last November.
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
LOL, good job with that!
just john
· 5 months ago
Re: "what does your article about the passport breaches prove?"
When I was a little kid, I saw people playing chess. Until I actually learned the game, I would "play chess" by moving pieces and saying "Check!" (I was four or five years old.)
So I recognize the same process among kooks. They see somebody hold up a sheaf of papers and say, "This proves it!" and they think those are the two elements of proving things, a bunch of documents and a declaration.
They never seem to catch on to the idea that the documents have to actually contain stuff that has relevence to their assertions.
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
That your just a gullible Obamabot. LOL!
LittleSanityLeft
· 5 months ago
It proves absolutely nothing. Nothing at all. I think this whole Obama is a secret Muslim/not a natural born citizen stuff should be a litmus test for chemical sterilization.
I've seen Obama's birth certificate, it was given many months ago in hopes of shutting up the conspiracy theorists but alas these folks are morons and just can't let this one go.
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Everyone who read a single word past "it is said by Kenyan sources" raise your hand.
Everyone who read a word past that, get up and leave the room. Go get some fresh air. Come back when you're thinking straight. No one in their right mind would believe that any Obama-trashing troll on this website has the foggiest idea where Kenya is, let alone what anyone in Kenya said about jack shit.
Next.
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
I actually liked Obama as a person, but I quickly have learned there is far more to him than most people are willing to research.
ITS A $12 BIRTH CERTIFICATE!!!!!!!!! SHOW IT TO US!
donnabella77
· 5 months ago
tell me kelleyye, do you BELIEVE EVERYTHING YOU READ ON THE INTERNET as the gospel truth???
geez, give me a break! just because somebody posts a story on the internet doesn't make it the truth! pull your head out of the sand and join us in the real world. . .
he DID show his birth certificate...but does it really matter to you? He could show each and every citizen the document in person and you crazy conspiracy theorists would just say it was a fake...get a life! He's an American, so start being American and question your government about thing that matter (like health care, the economy, etc) not this frivolous nonsense.
cathy
· 5 months ago
It is said by Kenyan sources? What sources? And where is the proof of what they say?
In fact, where is the proof of any of this garbage?
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
admitedly you have done little research or you would know where its at.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Do YOU know "where its [sic] at?"
Also, do you know how to use contractions?
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
See, people, they will attack you for common punctuation errors when they have nothing else. Your just young and gullible, its ok, we all go through it.
slimslowslider
· 5 months ago
This is so typical of birfers... ask them for proof or a cite and they get all huffy and tell you to "do your own research" and such.
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
No, I think you should totally rely on Rachel Maddow and Kieth Olberman. DORK!
Name
· 5 months ago
Quite the namecaller, eh?
slimslowslider
· 5 months ago
No, I think you can't remember what goofball website you read something on.
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
k.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Why do you presume to know anything about me?
And yes, I will attack you for common punctuation errors. If it's common, then that means it's probably pretty easy to avoid, too.
And even if I am, "young and gullible," it's better than being obtuse, and it's a heckuva lot better than being ignorant of the rules of grammar.
But I ask again, since you didn't answer my question: Where are the Kenyan sources? Can you provide them? Because the burden of proof is on you, since you made the assertion. I don't have to provide anything; President Obama has already made my argument for me.
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
Since your so good with the english language, do you know what Executive Order 13489 says? Yea, didnt think so.
brendand
· 5 months ago
In fact, I do. Don't presume I don't know things, or that I can't do a simple frakking Google search.
More importantly, do you actually know what it means? And do you know the difference between PRESIDENTIAL records and PERSONAL records?
Yeesh.
kgvanderhoff
· 5 months ago
Time to take off your foil hat now. I love the "It is said by Kenyan sources". Now that is definate proof.
brendand
· 5 months ago
If it IS somehow proven, dude, Biden doesn't become a "temporary president," he becomes THE PRESIDENT. A new election can be called for all y'all want, but it won't happen. Presidential elections happen every four years. If a president dies, is impeached, or invokes the 25th Amendment, the vice-president takes over. That's why we have an order of succession.
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
Its an invalid election, man, like a bunch of 4th graders got political all the sudden.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Um, no. In the unlikely event that your crazy-ass conspiracy theory could be proven to be true, that wouldn't change the order of succession. There wouldn't be a special election. The election also could not be shown to be invalid because the Electoral College has already validated President Obama's victory.
kellyeyeisretarded
· 5 months ago
I'm sure your dumbass cracker version of "the best" involves the death of millions of African-American. Fucking retard.
Name
· 5 months ago
I don't know about anyone else but this was my favorite paragraph. The post is funny. The last paragraph hysterical. I'm still laughing.
"Biden becomes temporary president, a new election will be called for, democratic party fails and ceases to exist, Libertarians and Republicans become the 2 main parties, MSNBC Olberman and Maddow are done, Jackson and Sharpton cry foul, marches in the streets, marches turn to riots. From this point we can only hope for the best."
ben guthrie
· 5 months ago
it doesn't matter. his mother is a US citizen, therefoe he is a natural born citizen. end of discussion.
Pyak
· 5 months ago
Birthers just demonstrate what dire straits our educational system is in.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
AMEN!!
just john
· 5 months ago
Hey, "9/11 truth"-ers and furries need somebody to look down on.
Brendand........NO ONE IS TRYING TO TAKE MY WEAPONS AWAY
Thru the back door people now are having a hard time getting amo. Guns you can buy. Amo is harder to find and cost way to much for one bullet. Now 6 months ago I was able to go to the gun store and get what i wanted in the way of amo. Now it not only cost tons to get my amo, but I just cant go to any gun store to buy what I need for my guns.
just john
· 5 months ago
You think you might have an easier time if you tried spelling "ammo" correctly?
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
This is an obvious liberal attack, a young liberal attacking someone over mispelling. Lame
just john
· 5 months ago
I'm young?
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
No teeth rednecks, thats what you got? Man your a hateful little SOB. Even your name is hateful. Most people dont act like you do.
just john
· 5 months ago
Pssst ... He's over there. I've made no assertion concerning anybody's dental situation.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
YEAH WE HAVE A WAR ON STUPID NO TEETH REDNECKS AND THE LINE STARTS WITH YOUR DUMBA**
brendand
· 5 months ago
See, I'm fine with bullet control. If you have to pay a lot for your bullets, maybe you'll use them more wisely and not waste them.
You said earlier that you just want to be able to provide for your family. So why waste your money on bullets and guns and other weapons? I, personally, would want to ensure that there was a roof over my family's head, plenty of food for them to eat, a car to commute for both them and me, plenty of gifts at Christmas and birthdays, etc. Isn't that more important than hitting up the gun store and spending loads of money there?
Ken D
· 5 months ago
Could that be because all the wacko's are buying up all the ammo because they think Obama is gonna take their guns away. Form a circular firing squad morons.
Wayoutwest
· 5 months ago
You didn't answer my question Chuck, what do you really want?
bob915
· 5 months ago
...what is it with Kansas? The home of the Westboro Baptist church, home of Tiahart, who claims the President's late mother woulda had an abortion if it had been 'free', now we have this asshat Kobach. WHo are you people? I agree with the poster about McCain---not born within the 50, but the crickets are chirping on that side---ya'll just keep on keeping on and wait until the 20%Southern White Party shrinks to nuttin, and the world can then rejoice.
arvid
· 5 months ago
John McCain was born in a territory -- so he can't be a citizen. Sen Tom Coburn -- of Ricky Ricardo slur fame ---- shouldn't be a citizen. Oklahoma was a territory . Stefan Cook -- PS was also fired from his job a s a govt defense contractor.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Yes brendand, I plan to do something about it. I have called and called and called, faxed used snail mail. I get nothing. No one wants to hear me. No one on the hill is listening. The tea party's, remember those? Closed ears on the tea party's. So guess what. I have gotton off my butt and no to the drugs or pills that I dont need to take. I am now doing more. I watch Glenn Beck, and all the others. I found out the white house or the people on the hill dont want to hear from me. So I have joined many others and will do my best to VOTE out congress.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
HAHAHAHAHA YEAH OK HAHAHA HEY NURSE NURSE TIME TO CHANGE HIS DIAPER AND GIVE HIM HIS MEDS HAHAHAHA GLEN BECK HAHAHAHAHAH DAMN HE DOSE ATTRACT THE DUMB ONES DON'T HE HAHAHAHAHA
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
Try and turn your caps off you dumb drone.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Wait a tic, Wiley... How does watching Glenn Beck help your cause?
It doesn't -- any more than watching Keith Olbermann helps a gasbag liberal's. Watching one guy on TV (or many guys on TV) is just one thing you're doing. How about listening to the other side?
You know what I do, Wiley? I read. A lot. I mean, a LOT a lot. I read progressive sites. I read conservative sites. I read middle-of-the-road sites. I read magazines. I read journals. I read published accounts from think-tanks. And you know what? It confuses the hell out of me. But at least I keep informed. If you're watching Glenn Beck, and that's what you believe to be your contribution, you're further gone than I'd feared.
And so far as sending mail and making calls... dude, that doesn't prove diddly shit. Anybody with half a brain can send an e-mail (as this board itself proves). If you want something to change, organize it yourself!
You say, "Guess what. I have gotten off my butt and no to the drugs or pills that I dont need to take." We'll set aside your brazen misuse of the rules of grammar there and get to the main point: What the hell does that prove? You say, "I have joined many others and will do my best to VOTE out congress." Well, you can't "vote out congress," though you can vote out your representative and help GOTV efforts in other districts. But what good will that do? Democrats and Republicans in the House and Senate are really not extraordinarily far apart. Oh, sure, you get your wingnuts on either side, and sometimes it seems like they're way far apart. But frankly, most of them are just posturing (hello, Eric Cantor).
So in summation, I ask you again: What are you doing to change this country?
painbodyII
· 5 months ago
Again, you need to stop hating and stop having apoplexy that an African-American, Barak Obama is the president of the USA. Look in your mirror if you have one please and smile and acknowledge that the majority of your fellow Americans voted in someone who can read and write and speak his native language. You are dunces of the 1st order and you are bound with ancient hate. You are deceitful and lie to yourself everyday. God bless you and keep you safe and secure in his love.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Well I have recieved so much email from so many of you guy's its going to take me some time to do catch up. I will delete the ones who do the name calling and sift thru what I can.
GEEEZZZZZ
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
No I have not served in the military. My Father, Unckes, brother's and both my children have. I hope I raised good kids and they vote there way to.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
that splains it Lucy PU**Y
Edward Baum
· 5 months ago
The 'birthers' are just trash consumed by hate, smugness, and deep ignorance.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
This seems to be in question. I am not a repub and I am not a dem.. I refuse to vote for the people on the hill to shut dont or slow down me. I want growth, and a job. I want to be able to pay my bills and put food on the table. i am not a dem or a repub
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
YEAH OK HAHAHAHA WHAT A PUTZ AHAHAHA
brendand
· 5 months ago
"i am not a dem or a repub"
Neither are a lot of us. What's your point?
kevinschmidt
· 5 months ago
It doesn't matter if Obama is or is not a U.S. citizen. WE THE PEOPLE have spoken. Collectively and in general consensus, WE THE PEOPLE are the supreme sovereign legal and legislative authority in the U.S.
It is true that the U.S. Constitution is the Supreme Law of the U.S. However, WE THE PEOPLE, collectively and in general consensus have the power to over rule the Constitution any time we want. In fact, there are at least five incidences in our history when men were elected to Congress and were sworn into Congress before they reached the legal age set forth in the Constitution, which is 25 for the House, 30 for the Senate, and 35 for the presidency.
How was this possible? As I said before, WE THE PEOPLE, collectively and in general consensus are the supreme sovereignty in the U.S. and therefore have the legal right to elect anyone we want into office, regardless of their age, and in the case of the presidency, regardless of their citizenship.
WE don't need the permission from the White House, Congress or the Supreme Court because we are the boss of them. They are not the boss of us. We can do anything we want, collectively. They have to do everything we say, if only WE THE PEOPLE would stop being wee the sheeple.
Either way, don't get any bright ideas, Ahnold. You'll never be president.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
In that case, YOU take responsibility for the continuing decline in our economy. YOU take responsibility with socialism. YOU take responsibility for government expanding its hand into our lives. YOU must be so proud of yourself.
Oh and YOU put Joe Gaffe Biden as second in command. Nice job YOU
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
REALLY WHN ALL INDICATORS ARE SHOWING THAT THE ECONOMY ARE COMING BACK AFTER THE REPUBLICANS PUT US AT THE BRINK!! YOU REALLY ARE A DUMBASS
strangely_enough
· 5 months ago
Are you taking responsibility for Bush and Cheney?
kevinschmidt
· 5 months ago
You must be illiterate.
Let me repeat myself.
WE THE PEOPLE collectively and in general consensus are the supreme sovereign legal and legislative authority in the U.S.
How in the world can you possibly interpret that as being me singularly (YOU)?
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
We the people will drag his ass out of that office also.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
GO FOR IT!!! PLEASE GO!! MAKE SURE THAT YOU YELL TO THE TOP OF YOUR LUNGS AND LET EVERONE KNOW YOU ARE COMING!!!!! HAHAHAHAHAH ALL MOUTH NO BRAINS HAHAHAHAHA
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
Man, you need to chill.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
YOU THE ONE THATS RUNNING YOUR MOUTH PUNK BACK IT UP!! SHOW US HOW BIG YOUR BALLS ARE OR YOU JUST A BIG MOUTH PU**Y??
strangely_enough
· 5 months ago
Secret Service beat down addled Birther at White House. Film at eleven.
I need popcorn for this one.
bswebsite
· 5 months ago
Typical, ignorant coward.
kevinschmidt
· 5 months ago
The Secret Service reads these comments.
You could be arrested for making threats of violence against the president.
Legally, they could drag your ass out of your house and haul you off to jail.
If you want to replace the president, there is a right way and a wrong way of doing it.
You want to do it the wrong way.
There's a difference between a mob of angry people and WE THE PEOPLE collectively throughout the entire country.
If WE did to decide to kick the president out of office before the next election and without Congress doing so through the impeachment process, WE would have to march on Washington, peaceably of course, completely surround the White House, and then just sit down and stay there and wait for however long it would take for Obama to resign and leave on his own accord.
That's what was wrong with the peace marches that happened when Bush was president. On at least three occasions WE had over 100,000 people protest the war. But at the end of the day, everyone went home.
Once again, WE THE PEOPLE turned back into wee the sheeple.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
brendad, now you have no common sense. You should be an adlut and I am sure you can use common sense?
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
WHERE IS YOURS JETHRO? WHAT ARE YOU A DOUBLE NAUGHT SPY NOW??
brendand
· 5 months ago
Wiley, to what are you refering?
hoolaboo
· 5 months ago
I am so glad I don't belong to the same party as these loons. With so many legitimate issues that they could have focused on, they pick a fantasy conspiracy theory to waste their energy on.
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
Obama will be removed by this fall.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
YEAH OF WANNA EXPLAIN HOW?
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
Not a lot different that waht happened to President Manuel Zelaya of Honduras.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Are you saying that you believe there will be a military coup in this country?
Because if there is, I absolutely, 100% guarantee you that anyone who participates in such a coup will be tried for -- and convicted of -- treason.
I sincerely hope you aren't actively ADVOCATING a coup.
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
No, i just want to see the Original BC first, then I will totally support the pres within reason.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
ALREADY HAS VERIFIED BY HAWAII CASE CLOSED....NEXT
brendand
· 5 months ago
Hang on a second. You invoked Zelaya specifically. Why do you think that if your expansive demands are not met, President Obama will meet with the same fate?
And I will again remind you that the United States Constitution says NOTHING about providing an "original birth certificate," or a birth certificate of any kind. All it says is that one must be a natural-born citizen.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
SO WHAT ARE YOU SAYING BILLY BAD ASS?
just john
· 5 months ago
What fall? You're threatening to jump out of a plane onto him?
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
that joke was so bad
just john
· 5 months ago
Well, you provide so many straight lines, and I'm just not into all-caps yelling, so I go with what I know.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
ALL MOUTH NO BALLS
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
Wheres the original BC?
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
WHERE IS YOUR DEPENDS?
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
fail
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
YEAH THATS WHAT YOUR MAMA SAID
brendand
· 5 months ago
Dude, I'm really not sure that makes any sense.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
YEAH JUST LIKE YOUR STUPID ASS PUNK
brendand
· 5 months ago
Y'know, it'd be awfully nice if we could be civilized and not resort to this kind of crap. Do you have anything legitimate to say? If not, that's cool, but then please do us all a favor and shut the hell up. If you DO have something to contribute, then we'd all love to hear it. Swear to God we would.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Last I heard, in Hawaii. Why don't you go over and check? I'm sure you could do some sweet sightseeing while you're there. Maybe you could even learn to surf.
strangely_enough
· 5 months ago
If only you all had shown this much interest in Bush TANG records and Cheney's Energy Task Force and maybe some of the laws broken the last eight years you might not have to deal with "the horror" of an Obama presidency. Unintended consequences are a bitch, ain't they?
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
Yea, if Bush did somthing illegal I say get his ass and throw him in jail with Obama, this is my country also.
brendand
· 5 months ago
What did Obama do that was illegal, again?
zonnadcowell
· 5 months ago
My unedited comments would not be fit to print. This is the absolutely most wasteful, ridiculous, stupid, idiotic bunch of bull*&^* that I have ever heard. What is wrong with those people. I say get a life, give it up, you are totally and completely crazy. You are so transparent in your racism and your prejudice against our president. I have no doubt that Obama is a US citizen. How crazy would anyone have to be to try to become president if they were not. I can't believe that some of the people pushing this issue are well educated people. The rest of them are either crazy, uneducated or just plain stupid!!!! PLEASE just shutup.
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
You obviously dont understand the mindset of a typical politician, it's a power grabbing f*** fest for these people. The guy is killing the economy for the purpose of more control. It has happened many times before. Google " October Revolution". USSR, its almost identical to what is happening right now. Dont fool yourself.
brendand
· 5 months ago
So are you an anarchist then?
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
yea man, you got me. good job for a drone.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Wait, I'm a drone? I think it's a perfectly legitimate question. (By the way, I don't begrudge you if you are an anarchist, so long you're not violent about it.) You said, "You obviously dont understand the mindset of a typical politician, it's a power grabbing f*** fest for these people." So if that's the case, I can only presume you don't trust any politician. Is that true? If it is, then I would make the logical leap to say what I said. If it's not true, then how can you vote for any politician, since they're all so power-hungry?
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
YOU NEED A EDUCATION
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
please explain you genious
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
WHAT THE HELL IS GENIOUS?? THAT MEAN THAT YOU ARE FU**ING STUPID. THAT MEANS YOU MAKE NO SENSE THAT MEANS YOU NEED TO SEE SOMEONE BECAUSE YOU ARE EASILY MIND SCREWED. NEED HELP WITH THE BIG WORDS BOBBY BOUCHER?
Name
· 5 months ago
"please explain you genious"????
English as a second language, perhaps?
brendand
· 5 months ago
Apparently so do you, dude. "An." "AN education."
If you're going to insult somebody's education, please don't show the deficiencies in your own. It sets us all back.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
TYPING FAST AND DROPPED THE N
zonnadcowell
· 5 months ago
Oh my God!! I have better things to do then respond to trash. If you have something really valuable to say I would be surprised. So Long.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
I use weapons on my job. I have to make sure I hit the target and I keep up with this matter. I live by my guns and my job. I dont waste any bullets as you say I do. I protect me and others that could be in harms way.
brendand
· 5 months ago
I didn't say you waste bullets. But you do realize that if you use bullets in your job, if your job itself doesn't pay for it (meaning you have to pay for it yourself), then you get any and all taxes you spend on them back, right? I don't really understand your point, then.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
HAHAHA YEAH LIKE YOU ARE THE ONE AND ONLY AHAHAHAHA KEEP THINKING THAT OK????
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
Folks, this guy above me is a typical liberal f***tard drone, most likely in his/her early 20's. As you can see, typically, they think they are smarter than most people, and anyon who questions the Kenyan Pres is just a total idiot. Make up your own minds, and make sure you have plenty of ammo.
just john
· 5 months ago
Re: "Folks, this guy above me ..."
Great. Now you've treated us to the mental image of you two having sex.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
WHERES YOUR PROOF? ALL I SEE IS YOU RUNNING YOUR MOUTH JETHRO
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
WHAT YOU GONNA DO WITH IT EXCEPT BLEED IN THE STREET?
just john
· 5 months ago
You use weapons on your job, but you can't spell "ammo"?
just john
· 5 months ago
The quality of kook conspiracy theories has really deteriorated over the years. Back when I was a kid, we had "Paul is dead!" THAT was a fun one, and impossible to disprove (the claim was that the "Paul" we were seeing was an imposter.)
The "birther" theory requires the ability to be shown a document, and then to immediately deny the document exists.
That's way too much work!
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
Damn, your way too old for this then.
just john
· 5 months ago
Sometimes a grownup is bound to drop by, if only to point and laugh.
Yea, get some teeth and show us the real original BC.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
ALREADY HAVE...NEXT
austex_lightbeam
· 5 months ago
Your paranoia is exceeded only by your disinformed perspective.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Why, again? I still don't understand why you need to see it.
I'm not being facetious. The Constitution does not require a birth certificate be shown. In fact, it doesn't require "proof" of any kind. To say that it does imbues implied powers into the Constitution. Usually, conservatives are against that, maintaining that one must do a strict reading of the Constitution and not imply any kind of extraordinary power to it.
So which is it?
redx2_wine
· 5 months ago
Have you seen McCain's or Bush's original BC. This is ridiculous. When I got my first passport it required a birth certificate as ID, the president has a passport if he used anything other than the his birth certificate the records should show it as well. And by the way did McCain produce an authenticated copy of his birth certificate. Have you birthers actually seen his. Is it posted somewhere. Surely you can provide me with that.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
I do get a kick back on my schooling of what ever it is. Most of my supplies are paid for. I go every 4 months to school or classes. I am paid for most.
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
GUESS IT'S NOT HELPING MUCH HUH?
brendand
· 5 months ago
So then why are you complaining about the cost of guns/ammo? You're not the one paying for it.
Or did I misunderstand you?
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
the word amo is ammo, so you did get the point, right?
AlcheMiss
· 5 months ago
When o when will someone tell these ... people ... that EVEN IF President Obama WAS born in Kenya, HE WOULD STILL BE AN AMERICAN CITIZEN!!!!!!!! BECAUSE HIS MOTHER is an American???? If he WAS born in Kenya, he would be every bit as American as JOHN McCAIN - who was BORN IN PANAMA!!!!!!!!!
Jeese. What is WRONG with these folks????
brendand
· 5 months ago
.
kelleyye
· 5 months ago
FAIL, thats just wrong. See; Dred Scott v. Sandford, 60 U.S. 393 (1857)
brendand
· 5 months ago
Uhhhhhh... what does Dred Scott have to do with anything? Obama's mother was from Kansas. Where do you think she gave birth to him?
And if it wasn't Hawaii, that still wouldn't necessarily matter. The qualifications are that one parent was a U.S. citizen when he was born; and that the parent lived in the US for at least five years, at least two of which had to be after her fourteenth birthday.
The Dred Scott decision has nothing to do with it. Besides, most of it was annulled by the Fourteenth Amendment anyways.
backroads26
· 5 months ago
Um...no. Scott was born in the United States. The Court denied his citizenship on the basis that he was born a slave, and at that time, slaves were considered property. Not that the case is even relevant - it was invalidated by the 13th (prohibited slavery) and 14th (privilege and immunities, due process, equal protection) Ammendments.
AlcheMiss is right. The Consitution gives Congress the authority to create a uniform nationality law. They did so via the Immigration and Naturalization Act of 1952. If President Obama was born out of the country (which he was not), the Act provides that a child born abroad between 1952 and1986 to 1 parent posessing US citizenship is a citizen if that parent had been present in the US for at least 10 years, 5 after the age of 14.
Name
· 5 months ago
A round of applause for AlcheMiss!!! Thanks for great post.
Name
· 5 months ago
Wrong. The law states:
If only one parent is a U.S. Citizen at the time of ones birth, that parent must have resided in the United States for minimum ten years, five of which must be after the age of 16
O's mother was only 18 and could NOT pass US citizenship on to him. Thanks for playing.
kb345
· 5 months ago
Wrong! Read the Constitution!
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
I am not complaining, I was telling you it is so much harder to get amo, yes AMO. got it?
brendand
· 5 months ago
Well, no, I don't. I still don't understand why it's so much harder. Is it economically harder? If not, considering no laws have been changed with regards to weapons since the new Congress (since the Executive does not have the power to make laws) took session, I don't really understand why it would be any harder for you to get ammunition for your weapons, particularly if you're using them for your work.
dlane001
· 5 months ago
Wait wait. Don't say it! Let me guess: Obama is stealing your ammo? Obama introduced legislation to raise taxes on ammo? Obama introduced a tax on all weapons?
Something like that, right?
Let's forget for a moment that no such legislation exists (the emails you're getting about it are false), Obama didn't introduce any such legislation, and no such tax exists. Read FactCheck before you believe all these nutjob emails you get. Whew!
just john
· 5 months ago
But life without unfounded rumors is so BORING!
And you can believe that, because you just read it on the Internet!
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
brendand, I have literally no idea what novel and disjointed explanation kwiley will give you.
but I can tell you what the Republican talking point is. they're going around saying that "since everyone is so afraid that Obama is gonna take away their guns and rip up the Second Amendment, there's been a run on ammunition in gun stores as gun owners try to buy all that they can while it's still legally available."
It's not true at all. You can, if for some indecipherable reason you feel you need to, legally and rather easily purchase more than enough ammunition to meet any need you have for it.
There is no shortage.
It's just a talking point to get the gun-toting constituency of the right wing (and, to the extent they can, the left wing) scared into voting Republican, and more to the point, to get the political chattering class to say things like "Does the run on ammunition mean Obama is losing touch with working-class white voters, who are clinging to their guns and ammunition?" and other such nonsense.
I am sure kwiley has heard it. I would bet that kwiley has not been affected by it. I doubt kwiley owns any guns. Any gun owner I've ever met knows that "amo" is a meaningless bit of gibberish while "ammo" is what you put in a gun.
I have yet to find one credible statement from kwiley but she is attacking our President in vile ways, while pretending to be seeking what's good for America.
What is good for America is for you to acknowledge the truth when it is publicly-available. What part of "certified as authentic by the State of Hawaii" or "he is a citizen if his mother is a citizen" do you not understand, you know?
The whole birther thing just divides the country and creates needless rancor and hard feelings at a time when large issues need to be worked out and in fact are hanging delicately in the balance. I have a lot of older relatives and a lot of friends. I don't want to see them have inadequate health care for a day longer than they have to, and certainly not because some racist jerks filed bogus lawsuits to challenge the President's citizenship just as a means of trying to throw his Administration off stride so that it cannot achieve anything positive FOR AMERICA.
That is not a concern for truth. That is not patriotism. That is not defensible. That is madness. So every time someone spews that nonsense I will shut it down as best I can by pointing out its inherent absurdity.
just john
· 5 months ago
Abbott Medical Optics? American Maritime Officers? American Motors Owners Association?
Those are its English usages, as acronyms.
Then there's: Bosnian
Adverb
amo
1. hither, here 2. this way
Synonyms
* amoder * ovamo
Catalan
Noun
amo m. (plural amos)
1. owner (of a piece of land or real estate, a business, etc.) 2. master
Chickasaw
Verb
amo
1. to mow
Classical Nahuatl
Particle
amo
1. Alternative spelling of ahmo.
Croatian
Adverb
amo
1. hither, here 2. this way
Synonyms
* amoder, ovamo, simo
Esperanto
Noun
amo (plural amoj, accusative singular amon, accusative plural amojn)
1. love
Galician
Verb
amo
1. first-person singular present indicative of amar.
Hawaiian
Verb
amo
1. carry (on the shoulders)
Italian
Etymology 1
Latin hāmus
Noun
amo m. (plural ami)
1. hook
Etymology 2
Latin amō
Verb form
amo
1. first person singular present tense of amare
Latin
Etymology
Probably from a lost nursery-word of the papa-type. Cf. amita (“‘aunt’”), Old High German amme (“‘nurse’”).
Pronunciation
* (Classical) IPA: /ˈa.moː/
Verb
present active amō, present infinitive amāre, perfect active amāvī, supine amātum.
1. I love. * Plautus
Tu me amas, ego te amo.
You love me and I love you.
2. I am fond of. 3. I am under obligation to; I am obliged to. 4. (with infinitive) To enjoy, be accustomed.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Dude, I enjoy pointing out grammatical and linguistic errors with the best of 'em... but this one's just a dick move.
just john
· 5 months ago
Well I get worried when an armed man can't even spell a basic colloquial abbreviation of the tools of his job. If his claims are correct, he sees this word EVERY DAY.
And yet he's allowed to carry a gun.
(I'm making the assumption that he's male.)
brendand
· 5 months ago
Hey, I don't completely disagree. But seriously, that thing is long as hell.
(Yeah, yeah, I know she said that, but she sure wasn't talking to me -- self-deprecation five!)
just john
· 5 months ago
I confess to excess length in that. I wish there was something along the lines of an LJ cut, in which most of it could be hid under a "There's More" tag.
I'll try not to do it again.
brendand
· 5 months ago
That's what she said.
(Sorry, I'm an ass, and I've been procrastinating on this site way too long.)
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
You seriously do not know that the abbreviation for ammunition is "ammo?" kwiley, please go back to the shootin' range or the readin' book. Take your time.
wiig
· 5 months ago
There is another difference between Obama and God, God is not an American!
dlane001
· 5 months ago
Can somebody explain to me why the birthers are clamoring for the president's birth certificate when he's already produced it, and when the state of birth has verified it is accurate and authentic? Is it because they refuse to accept the word of the lawfully appointed State of Hawaii official in charge of birth records?
This confuses me. Not sure I understand the rationale behind these repeated requests.
24AheadDotCom
· 5 months ago
The state of HI has never once verified that what's shown on BHO's site matches what they have on file. Seriously, do yourself a favor and read their actual statement.
dlane001
· 5 months ago
I have read the statement of Hawaii's Dept of Health director, Dr. Chiyome Fukino. She confirms that she has seen and verified that they possess the President's original birth certificate.
She has confirmed, on Oct 31, 2008, that Barack Obama was born in Honolulu, Hawaii.
In addition, the copy the Obama campaign released as been seen, touch, felt and confirmed to be an official copy of that original birth certificate. Photographs exist. Independent, third party confirmation exists.
What evidence will you believe, what spokesperson will you believe, if not the person directly responsible for managing such records, who has access to such records, who has seen the records?
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
YOU NEED TO READ IT...CALL IF YOU NEED HELP WITH THE BIG WORDS MORON
Name
· 5 months ago
It's because an electronic copy was released over the internet by an Obama campaign official. Hawaiian officials refuse to release an original hardcopy because O won't authorize it. All O has to do is to tell Hawaiian officials to open all records and this issue goes away. Unless there is something damaging in those records which, it is speculated, is why O won't authorize them being released.
redmjoel
· 5 months ago
Actually regardless of what Obama does, they can't release it. State law and all.
Name
· 5 months ago
An individual can release any records he wants to. He just has to authorize it.
Like John Kerry never authorized the release of his military records but we do have the results from Bush's dental exam (medical records) in 1972.
ScottPruden
· 5 months ago
Seriously, when Obama opens his records "this issue goes away"? When your leader, George W. Bush, releases his National Guard records, then all my issues with his being a drug-addled, draft-dodging coward (just like Rush Limbaugh and Dick Cheney) will "just go away" as well.
alwaysforhillary
· 5 months ago
You know all these so called conspiracy theories could go away in a second. All Obama would have to do is show is REAL BIRTH CERTIFICATE. THe one where the doctor's name is listed, weight of baby, etc. WHY has Obama fought all these lawsuits? Why not show his birth certificate? Also, WHY are his school records, passport records, and medical records all SEALED? There is very little we KNOW about Obama except what he tells us. In his book, he says he was born in one hospital, but then he writes a letter to another hospital saying he was born there. The thing is when you tell the TRUTH, you don't have to worry about remembering the lies!!!
fields4ever
· 5 months ago
how old are you and where were you born? birth certificates vary by state, county and hospital. the days of personalized onion skin birth certificates with little inked baby feet is long gone for many of us. my kids, born at a Kaiser Permanente hospital in Los Angeles in the 1980s and 90s, got the County birth certificate that says nothing about the doctor, the baby's weight, or even the hospital where they were born. and that is acceptable documentation to get a passport and a security clearance, so get over it.
murray19
· 5 months ago
"Therefore, I as Director of Health for the State of Hawai‘i, along with the Registrar of Vital Statistics who has statutory authority to oversee and maintain these type of vital records, have personally seen and verified that the Hawai‘i State Department of Health has Sen. Obama’s original birth certificate on record in accordance with state policies and procedures," Fukino said.
Fukino said that no state official, including Gov. Linda Lingle, ever instructed that Obama's certificate be handled differently from any other.
Some Obama critics claim he was not born in the United States
Since when does hammity ever go weith the truth? You know, all these idiots are the sames one who defended the SC decision to illegally stop the Fla. vote count and made bush president. These are the same one who decry judicial activism, except when it fits their cause. Losers, one and all.
24AheadDotCom
· 5 months ago
Where are all (?) of you coming from? Seriously, most TWI articles get two or three comments at most; this current has 1122. Did DailyKos tell you to come here? MoveOn? The Great Xenu? I'd really like to know.
Meanwhile, I spoke to Weigel's quote source, and if you haven't already read about what she said, click here.
fields4ever
· 5 months ago
this article was posted at Huffington Post - that's how I got here; curious about the headline
wiig
· 5 months ago
Yes, it was The Huffington Post that brought me here too.
birfers'r'dumb
· 5 months ago
Why should we believe anything you say, birfer-in-chief?
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
I go thru 100 to 500 rounds for my test. In some cases i have had to buy my own amo. In other cases its paid for. I dont carry company issued. I carry what I want to carry. 6 months ago I was going to the gun store for my bullets. It is just simply harder to find bullets. Now why is that? We have the right to carry. I live in a open carry state. I can buy what ever gun I want to but it is just harder for some odd reason to get the bullets to match my guns. I use my gun for work and another gun for back up. The two different guns I use for my job, I am having a harder time finding bullets. It seems like the control on weapons is slipping thru the back door.
just john
· 5 months ago
Re: "In some cases i have had to buy my own amo"
Love is seldom free.
So, what do you think the magazine "Guns & Ammo" is about, anyway?
brendand
· 5 months ago
Perhaps you should talk to your local government, Wiley, about the bullets, or maybe ask somebody at your local gun shop. The federal government hasn't done a thing to restrict and/or prohibit your right to bear arms; it must be either a state or local issue. Or maybe it has something to do with the economy, I don't know. Please keep in mind that the economy has worsened over the last six months, so maybe the reason you can't find bullets is because your local supplier can't afford them anymore.
If you have to buy your own ammo in ANY case, I'd suggest you talk to your employer and see why that is. And besides that, you can still write off the taxes.
Ann Hedonic
· 5 months ago
These individuals are traitors. They are openly rebelling against the legally-elected president.
just john
· 5 months ago
Yeah, technically. But they're doing so in such an ineffectual manner, they're not worth prosecuting.
They're just free entertainment.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Oh c'mon, Ann. They're not traitors, at least not any more than people were traitors for saying that President Bush was illegitimate. They're just pushing nonsense issues because they can't raise any legitimate ones; plus, they're being preyed upon by power-hungry imbeciles within the conservative media establishment, folks who're doing amazingly well in a shitty economy because, well, they can still sell books and get advertising money when doted on by angry white males.
It's a bit much for me to call them traitors, though, until they start advocating for or participating in acts of terror against our country.
chuckj
· 5 months ago
What? Um, there are plenty of legitimate issues to raise with this administration. Perhaps you should start paying attetntion. Obama has already spent more than any other president, he has and is pursuing an expansion of government into our personal lives, the economy is worse not better, we continue to lose jobs, he lied about transparency, he appointed lobbyists when he said he wouldnt, he appointed numerous tax cheats, he signed to close Gitmo with NO plan whatsoever on what to do with the prisoners, etc, etc, etc
The list goes on. So yes, there are PLENTY of legitimate things to gripe about with this administration. Oh, I left out, his Vice President continues to say the dumbest things imaginable. I know, i know. He is a democrat so the media lets him get away with it. But it doesnt change the fact that he says the idiotic things he does say.
brendand
· 5 months ago
You can have those legitimate issues, Chuck. Those are legitimate political disagreements. But the birth certificate controversy is NOT among them, and that's what I thought this whole discussion was all about. Sorry if I was mistaken.
My point was that people are raising the birthright issue (which isn't really an issue at all) in lieu of actual issues. I raised this point before.
Amazingly (I know, this is going to blow your mind) I don't agree with everything President Obama has done. But I also feel the need to defend against this claim of otherness, this malarkey about where he was born, because it simply is not an issue, and it angers me that this type of crap is starting to seep into mainstream political discourse. This type of bullshit has NO PLACE in the House of Representatives (neither, by the way, do Biden's verbal gaffes, any more than President Bush's did). But some (though by no means all) of your issues SHOULD be. Those are the debates that SHOULD be taking place. But instead, we get nonsense issues like this, as well as the crap about Judge Sotomayor being a racist. It's sickening, and it's being perpetuated by one ideological viewpoint in an effort to score cheap political points with a bunch of chickenshit white folk who get knobby-kneed when a black guy in a sideways cap walks next to them on the sidewalk but who claim they believe in equality.
I'm no race-baiting Jesse Jackson (I've had to live my entire life with that asshole in my city), but I'm sick to death of the complexes of persecuted-feeling white males. I'm a white male, and I know from personal experience that I've had it a helluva lot easier than most people of color. That doesn't make affirmative action right (as CJ Cregg once said on The West Wing, I'm the wrong liberal to talk to about affirmative action), but neither does it mean that we shouldn't see things the way they really are. And what this crappy-ass manufactured controversy is based in is the worst kind of race-baiting from media moguls too busy lining their pockets to actually give a damn about the average working-class person.
kb345
· 5 months ago
I have a hard time seeing where you're coming from when you talk about the VICE president saying dumb things, Not so long ago our PRESIDENT was the biggest idiot walking on 2 legs, and I'm not talking about Obama! You worry about the government expanding into our lives.... how quickly they forget the Patriot Act and the trillion dollar war that was begun on a pack of lies! Obama started off with a pile of crap left over from the worst president alive and in 6 months you expect miracles? What do you think John McCain would have done differently? Stop complaining and put on your reality goggles, what did you EXPECT to happen in 6 MONTHS????
socks22
· 5 months ago
"his Vice President continues to say the dumbest things imaginable." Are you kidding me? Nobody has said more dumb things than Bush. Ever. "he has and is pursuing an expansion of government into our personal lives." Yeah, right. You never noticed that Bush and his minions broke all the laws by illegally spying on American citizens. Also, the fact that the Repugs are constantly trying to reverse the right to legal abortion in this country. Also, they continuously deny gays the right to get married. These are all huge expansions into people's personal lives. And there are a lot more. All you have to do is pull your head out of your ass and pay attention.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
The bullets I use are not on the shelves of many gun stores.
brendand
· 5 months ago
You're on the interwebs now... didja try purchasing them online? You might be able to find them for a cheaper rate, too.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Sometimes i pay up front and sometimes i dont. I do get my right offs for taxes at the end of the year.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
yes its ammo. I will use amo with your blessing or without.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Guns and amo is a good book, ooops there I go again. i hope i didnt blow your mind again. hmm a-m-o
brendand
· 5 months ago
Te amo tambien, Wiley.
kb345
· 5 months ago
The 14th Amendment defines citizenship this way: "All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside." But even this does not get specific enough. As usual, the Constitution provides the framework for the law, but it is the law that fills in the gaps.
Currently, Title 8 of the U.S. Code fills in those gaps. Section 1401 defines the following as people who are "citizens of the United States at birth:"
* Anyone born inside the United States * * Any Indian or Eskimo born in the United States, provided being a citizen of the U.S. does not impair the person's status as a citizen of the tribe * Any one born outside the United States, both of whose parents are citizens of the U.S., as long as one parent has lived in the U.S. * Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is a citizen and lived in the U.S. for at least one year and the other parent is a U.S. national * Any one born in a U.S. possession, if one parent is a citizen and lived in the U.S. for at least one year * Any one found in the U.S. under the age of five, whose parentage cannot be determined, as long as proof of non-citizenship is not provided by age 21 * Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is an alien and as long as the other parent is a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years (with military and diplomatic service included in this time) * A final, historical condition: a person born before 5/24/1934 of an alien father and a U.S. citizen mother who has lived in the U.S.
* There is an exception in the law — the person must be "subject to the jurisdiction" of the United States. This would exempt the child of a diplomat, for example, from this provision.
kevinschmidt
· 5 months ago
Better read my comment from an hour ago.
It doesn't matter if he is a U.S. citizen or not, or if he is under 35. The election is final. WE THE PEOPLE have spoken. Congress has confirmed it. The Supreme Court has sworn him in.
U.S. citizen or not, Obama is our legal U.S. President for the next three and a half years, unless impeached, or removed from office, collectively by WE THE PEOPLE.
Name
· 5 months ago
Not if he's not eligible. Just illustrates that O supporters don't care about the rule of law.
kb345
· 5 months ago
But, he IS, as you can see from above! Even if he WASN'T born in Hawaii (which all proof points to that he WAS), you can see in the 7th asterisk: * Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is an alien and as long as the other parent is a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years (with military and diplomatic service included in this time) IS a "Natural Born citizen"
wiig
· 5 months ago
Bingo!
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
What part of "Congress has confirmed it" and "The Supreme Court has sworn him in" did you mistake as somehow being something other than the RULE OF LAW? Just illustrates that the birthers don't believe their own agonizingly insipid argument.
You expect us to believe that a "center-right nation" run by a Republican White House in a time of war would have a federal government just totally gloss over any detail, no matter how slight, that might have kept:
a BLACK man;
named Barack HUSSEIN Obama (a few years after Saddam was captured, no less);
whose pastor said God Damn America on endlessly-played loops;
OUT OF THE WHITE HOUSE?
Come on. The FBI spied on MLK for crying out loud. If there was ANY shred of LEGAL basis to keep Barack Obama out of the White House based on the legitimacy of his birth certificate, then the Bush Justice Department would have checked the birth certificate EXTREMELY thoroughly during the FBI background check that all Presidential candidates undergo.
And news about the whole investigation would have leaked to Fox News in perfect time for the Sean Hannity hilarity hour.
If you say otherwise, you know that all you're doing is pretending.
And that is just one of the unfathomable logical leaps we are asked to take if we are to accept the premise of the Birthers' argument.
A bigger, even sillier one is that you have to assume, to take their view, that the State of Hawaii is not only involved in a massive conspiracy, but has been involved in that conspiracy since the day Barack Hussein Obama was born.
And to believe that, you have to believe that when he was born, the white and Pacific Islander staff at the hospital or City Hall had to see a black baby named Barack Hussein Obama being claimed by a white woman named Stanley and thought "let's risk our careers and our freedom from jail by making up a story about this kid's birth. We just know that little baby Barack is gonna be the first black President!" Let's fake a birth certificate for the little change-bringer!
And if you believe that, well, let's be honest, if you believe that then you're so f*cking dumb that I cannot be bothered to spend much time caring what else you believe.
MaryanneAZ
· 5 months ago
The other thing birthers ignore is the fact that BHO defeated HRC in the primary. If there had been ANY shred of evidence on the birth issue, then the HRC campaign would have jumped on it with all fours. Remembering how viciously HRC fought to win that primary, no one reasonably believes that such a huge issue would have been left uninvestigated by her team.
kb345
· 5 months ago
WE THE PEOPLE actually have very little to say about it. Our representatives, who we voted into the Senate and the House are the ones who act on our behalf. If "we" don't like something, the only thing "we" can do about it is let them know, and if you've ever tried to do that, it's pretty worthless!
wiig
· 5 months ago
Given that Obama was born in Hawaii, any discussion is moot; however, Obama's mother was a US citizen who lived in the US for at least 5 years. Therefore, even if Obama had been born in another nation his mother's citizenship is sufficient to establish his citizenship. It is kind of funning putting all these nails in the coffin of a debate; however, this post clearly states how ludicrous this whole discussion is.
What are people trying to say, that his mother is not really his mother. I don’t think anyone is contending that she is not a US citizen. Therefore, it kind of makes me foolish even participating in a debate like this as there is nothing to debate.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
All of us and the local government is having the same issue. We all are getting our amo from different places and can not go to our local gun stores for our needs. If I dont stay on top of it, i can run out of amo easy. I have to keep plenty on hand for this reason.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Well, um, welcome to having a job, dude. That's one of the pratfalls of having a job, having to plan in advance. If you can't find the right ammunition for the right weapon, though, you really ought to talk to your supervisor about perhaps changing the weapon to one which has more readily-accessible ammunition.
But really, this is all common sense stuff, I think. I still don't understand why any of this has a political implication.
brighteyez
· 5 months ago
I think it is absolutely hilarious that all the "wacko gun nuts" are spending big buck buying up guns and ammo.... Hilarious!!!! They could spend their money on education, schooling, and any number of other things that would help them be more informed, successful citizens and contributors to society, but they are huddled down in their bunkers scared to death. HILARIOUS!!!! And the guns and ammo dealers are raking in the $$$$$$$$ and continuing to spread the rumors and publicize that there is some sort of awful DANGER!!!!!!! There's a sucker born every day.... And buckets of them are being bilked........ HA!! HA!! HA!! HA!! HA!! HA!! HA!! My sides are aching I'm laughing so...... HA!! HA!! HA!! HA!!
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Yes I do buy on line and thru books and have some on BO, back order.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Well, then it's probably not that your guns and ammo are "disappearing," per se. It's probably just the shitty economy that's negatively affecting your local retailer.
The state of Georgia has refused to recognize my birth certificate from Virginia because it does not have a "raised" seal. I guess after 50+ years of considering myself an American citizen, the birther's would say it is suspect. By the way, it is only a "reproduction" of my birth certificate, because, like most states, they keep the original in it's storage facitlities. This prevents "birther" idiots from making changes to the original.
Name
· 5 months ago
And all that's needed is for someone to be able to go in and view that very same document for Obama.
brendstarr
· 5 months ago
And again it becomes more evident that you just can't fix stupid....
Jacob Wong
· 5 months ago
I live in Hawaii and have for over fifty years. The real reason that Obama does not want to release his original birth certificate is because he doesn't have one. A few enlightened Hawaiins are aware of the truth as we have heard our elders tell it. On the night and early morning Obama was supposedly born, Hickam Field airbase early warning technicians reported unidentified flying objects breaking into the atmosphere at over 10,000 mph. heading straight for the oahu. The objects slowed and were lost from radar on the northwest section of the island and were presumed to have hit the ground. Military units were dispatched, but did not arrive untill after the local village had rescued a man and an infant from the inferno which at the time was a sugar cane field. Both the man and the infant were described by the villagers as "Negroes" and were handed over to the military,but not before the man gave his name to the villagers. His name? Hombama.
It's the truth as unbeleivable as it sounds. Our President is a REAL alien.
brendand
· 5 months ago
Jacob, I applaud you. That is outstanding. ::claps, cheers::
republicanstupidity
· 5 months ago
DAMN YOU ARE FU**ING STUPID! WHY SHOULD ANYONE BELIEVE YOU?
Saddemos
· 5 months ago
Very entertaining. Jacob Wong has the imagination of George Lucas but with the intelligence of Sponge Bob square pants
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
I said I can buy any gun that is in any gun store. The gun stores have guns. Lots of guns. Its the amo that is going away fast. I use to be able to go to any gun store and buy amo. Now I cant buy my amo at many gun stores.
brendand
· 5 months ago
As I said before, "It's probably just the shitty economy that's negatively affecting your local retailer."
Once more I ask, what exactly does this issue have to do with politics? Or are you just venting?
josh525
· 5 months ago
the birther would not recognize my New york birth certificate it is old and the seal really weak florida won't take. i not a us citizen now can't get my licence to drive.
kwiley9711
· 5 months ago
Wiley is no dude. I am female. all female. no dude here
stephenperry
· 5 months ago
Who, except a pre-op transsexual, would ever feel the need to elaborate by saying that "she" is "all female?"
Wouldn't it have been persuasive enough to say "I'm a woman?"
Denying it multiple times as you did, you may have given away more than you intended.
The lady doth protest too much, methinks.
But, at least, if you are a woman, you could be more easily forgiven for not having the foggiest idea what the word "ammo" looks like on the printed page. Since, you know, you made the entire nonsensical spiel about running out of "amo" up out of whole cloth that you pulled straight out of your ass.
You don't own a gun any more than you own any of the stupid birther talking points you've regurgitated here today.
So whether you're female, all female, or "no dude here," why not just go do some of that reading you keep telling us you do? Since you "like to see all of it," you might start by looking at Obama's birth certificate. Look at it over and over. Especially at the part where it describes his race. Keep looking. It's not going to change magically before your eyes. And then say to yourself... "President...Barack...HUSSEIN...Obama."
Welcome to the next 7 and a half years of your life, doll.
bensil
· 5 months ago
If anyone is interested in the facts, as a reservist who volunteered to be deployed to Afghanistan, it was his choice to rescind that request. He did so, and that is
All Comments
Birther: Please show us proof that Obama was born in the US.
Clerk: Here is the legal form of his birth certificate available to public inquiry.
Birther: Obviously that is a fake. Show us proof that Obama was born in the US.
Clerk: That is the only legal document available... same for every citizen of this state.
Birther: Obviously you are on the take. Show us proof that Obama was born in the US.
Clerk: Here is a certified declaration by the state at our highest levels that this birth certificate is authentic.
Birther: Obviously you are all on the take. Show us proof that Obama was born in the US.
Clerk: There is nothing more I can do for you. Our legal obligation to provide documentation in this matter has been met.
Birther: See! Obama has no proof that he was born in the US. If he did, he could show us a valid document listing where he was born! Show us proof that Obama was born in the US.
It is a simple matter that has already been resolved. It was easy to resolve and it has been. The problem that continues to swirl these accusations is the fact that Birthers ignore all of this. It is like asking a blind person to tell you the color of the sky. He can firmly tell you any color he thinks because he is incapable of determining the truth.
Birthers will not and in some cases do not have the capability (mentally) to see the facts that have been legally certified.
Birther: Show us proof that Obama was born in the US.
Researcher: Here's a birth announcement from the Honolulu Newspaper in 1961.
Birther: You have a time-machine and drink the kool-aid.
Birther: Show US THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE OBAMA and not obvious two fakes posted on your website.
Obama: OK...Here it is!
End of story
But....The story is not over.
Hence the mega bucks spent to assure this is THE most OPAQUE Administration TO DATE!
Insert Jaws background music.
President Obama is black.
He will continue to be black.
And he will continue to be President.
Your money will still be good in our stores.
You can still fight and die in our wars.
You still have the freedom to say anything you want, subject to the limitations on free speech like not shouting "fire" in a crowded theater.
But if you say something stupid, a liberal will catch you, and call you on it. And depending on how stupid what you say is, you might get called a name.
But only if you say something stupid and you say it in bad faith or you say it in an insulting way.
So unless you're a sore-loser racist who is just here to bitch about the President being black, you should have nothing to fear.
Allah Akbar. Oh sorry, thought I was talking to Obama. God is great.
FTW
Glad to see you're still going strong. In fact, I think you may well may be closing in on a new world record in the whack-a-troll marathon. You know this is like the original Dawn of the Dead, though - there are legions of contemptible bigots out there with shit for brains, and you can be damn sure they're never going to stop surfacing no matter how many rounds you pump into them. But please do keep on smoking them out and picking them off - many of us are reading your posts and understand that you're performing an outstanding service on behalf of sane, rational people everywhere. Incidentally, I see that for the time being you're dug in pretty deep and you've got plenty of ammo, but if you ever need some artillery or air support, or even to be airlifted out of there, just give us your coordinates and we'll see what we can do for you, man.
In the meantime, keep on keeping on, man, and just keep in mind that, unlike the vile conspiracy freaks, you're a stable, educated, well adjusted adult with normal friends and (presumably) a peaceful life and and a satisfying career. And you're not alone out there.
Peace,
Chimsect
I still sometimes have to pinch myself to remind myself that the black guy won the election. For a long time I didn't believe it possible. That's the main reason I supported Hillary in the primaries; I just didn't think the black guy would be able to overcome all the nonsense he would face. When Rev. Wright hit the airwaves I said "oh shit that's their excuse. Now they won't vote for him because he's black but they will say it's because his pastor scares them."
So I dug in deeper and prepared for life to get worse.
And then, miracle of miracles, God blessed us with Sarah Palin. All was once again joy. Hilarious, nonsensical-bailout-explanation-providing, Russia-sighting, interview-avoiding joy.
So I figure we got off lucky. And as a result I feel like we all owe a debt of gratitude. I pay mine off by being sarcastic to racists who pretend they have a legitimate uncertainty about the President's eligibility.
But I haven't been here in some marathon session, no matter what the birthers think. I just show up often enough to make them believe I'm omnipotent.
One of the highlights was when one of them, d2i I think, posted a link to some nonsensical rambling bullshit "abstract" compiled by some loser right wing hack named Tonshen or something. I looked at the abstract twice before cutting and pasting a sentence that said the controversy would "definitely not" be resolved even if Obama's original birth certificate conclusively states he was born in Hawaii. I posted that sentence along with an explanation that you don't need to read the rest of the abstract to know the guy's a kook.
So of course, d2i immediately protests, including by saying that I couldn't possibly have read that whole abstract once in 7 minutes. Of course, I didn't. I read it twice. (I just don't trace the line I'm reading with my finger, like Frank Ricci did in the Sotomayor hearing. Anytime you use a test for the first time and a finger-reader gets one of the top scores, you got a shitty test on your hands. But I digress.)
But d2i did not believe that I could have read it. There and then the legend was born. He (claims to be a Democratic she but I'll believe that when I see a voter roll and a birth certificate) from that moment on was convinced that I'm a paid Obama blogger. Hence all the posts saying "please please please do not respond to him" and "he's making a killing today" and all that. That alone made up for all the tortured logic and circular reasoning I've had to endure. I've never been regarded as a supervillain before. The pay sucks but the fringe benefits (scaring racists away from their preferred targets of opportunity) are great.
Plus I got to meet comrades-in-arms like you, phxgwen, JL, gopfail, wayoutwest, and a host of other REAL patriotic Americans. And I got to read a lot of insightful analysis and humorous commentary. None of it by birthers.
Good to know we're not alone. With that, I pass the torch to you. But if kwiley should post here ever again, please be sure to ask about her mythical black husband. She claims she is his "slave." Issues. Some people have issues they should be embarrassed to tell their therapist about.
I'm off to spend my nickels earned from birther responses to my posts.
Cheers, comrade! (What's the word socialists use for each other? I don't have my notes from Re-Education Camp right in front of me.)
There's just something about sticking it to people who try to deceive you that is...cathartic.
great label, plus cudos, AND 2nd the 'you're not alone', stephenperry (not 'THE' stephenperry, or, is he...?)
kennethetucker
card carrying ACLU & NRA member (not mutually exclusives these)
Vietnam (volunteered) Veteran NOT a chickensh*t Chickenhawk like 99% of reich-wing rethugs
PROUD Progressive/liberal
Look at recent history. When Bush was put in power in 2000, people on my side were mad. They (and I) blamed a partisan Supreme Court and partisans in Florida for the outcome. But they, and I, put all that stuff aside whole-heartedly in the days after 9/11. It isn't just other countries around the world that supported America in the days and weeks after 9/11; Americans supported America. We rallied around the flag and we rallied around our leader.
Bush was our President and he had our full support to get the bad guys. Notice I said the bad guys. But anyway, we gave him our votes when he said he needed them for national security purposes. We let him manage the War on Terror in his Constitutional role as The Decider. Liberals and Republicans and everyone in between. Because we were at war.
Which brings me to my point. We're still at war. 2 of them. AND, unlike in the days after 9/11, our economy is shot to pieces and we need help. America needs help from Americans. Think about it. We still have every problem we had on Sept. 12, 2001 plus a whole host of new ones.
And, now that it's their turn, the fringe element of the other party won't rally around the flag as we did. The WHOLE element of the other party, won't for that matter.
And it's just un-American. So even if you guys weren't racist, which you are, you still suck.
In a normal context, liberals more often believe that they are competing in different schools of morals, patriotism and reason. While conservatives tend to believe they are the only ones who are moral, patriotic and reasonable. Obviously if you disagree with them you worship Ba'al, you're unpatriotic etc. You're following false cults of personality, because you're not voting as you ought. There must be some systemic reason for not being like me!
But this little mutiny in the military transcends my normal mode, and I feel it needs be quashed. I'm not willing to go this far or entertain some 'service to country' is behind it. There is something really bad here.
Did you ever notice some so often accuse others of the exact same things that they do? Usurp, divide or my favorite: class war?
I guess it's better to steel an election than to win with a landslide... Not. Just SUCK IT UP.
Nothing will make them happy, because they wouldn't believe this so-called "long-form" was real even if it was shown to them. They will always look for a reason to disqualify Obama even though he is probably the most brilliant man we've ever had as president. At this point in time, we need someone with a calm temperament, able to make logical decisions by consulting a team of experts, not "his God" or his "good old boys" that he has given jobs to in order to raise their income brackets.
These people have been raised in a different way, they don't understand common sense. The more you try, the harder they defy you. This story is coming up on almost 2500 posts and they still want to see "the birth certificate" for a man who clearly knows that there is no need to go through this crap, his worst critics know there is no need to go through this crap, yet mental midgets think that because a case goes to court, it makes it true. Every other case prior to it has been thrown out and they JUST DON'T GET IT. Why wouldn't a lawyer take a case? Money in her pocket and her name in the news? It is hard to stay away from this site, though, isn't it? It's like driving past a car wreck, you don't want to look, but....
I don’t agree with all of President Obama’s decisions. If I did I would be happy for about 30 seconds till I realized if he is making all the decisions I would then he isn’t any smarter than I am. I’ll give our President the benefit of the doubt. Heck who long has he been in office, 6 months?
I agree lots of Republicans think this stinks. I can appreciate the frustration there too, it wasn't so long ago I felt it in reverse. But we had Howard Dean that just went out and built a 50 state network, they have Showboat Steele. They are being disserved, but a small portion are chanelling it the wrong way.
But history shows it was the right decision. Opened the west up at the right time. So I’m OK with our President not doing what I would do. I’m extremely happy when Rush disagrees with our President. ;)
My writings here aren't against conservatives, just a small band of thugs that are easy to provoke with a little prodding. When the mask comes off the birtha, we see it was never about a birth certificate.
My writings here aren't against conservatives, for sure. I see conservative as quite distinct from Republican. Republicans have perverted and violated conservative values. You need look no further than Bush's bloated budgets, new government departments, spying on citizens, and needless war to see that.
Pete
I figured that if I just brushed aside the pretexts, eventually the real reason for all this hostility and stubbornness would come out. And it always did. Like when Navigator7 finally explained his theory about why Obama was propped up by whites and how blacks need to explain to whites their collective failure to launch.
It's sad, really, that with all the problems facing us collectively, some people choose to try to throw a wrench into the whole process... cutting off their noses to spite their faces.
And to be honest, at first I just found it all kind of amusing because they can't argue. But then it sort of sunk in how un-American they are. And when I wrote that post about how we rallied around the flag for Bush but they won't rally around the flag for Obama, it kind of left me with an empty feeling. I think your post on that subject hit the nail on the head. And so now that every birther argument has been debunked, I don't feel like talking to them. But I'd still be interested in exchanging ideas with folks like you.
Good luck and keep your head UP! I'm sure I'll see you around. By the way, I always enjoyed the sight of the Manzanos growing up. I grew up looking at the Sandias, of course. But I traveled throughout NM and will always miss the purple mountains.
Cheers.
Lincoln's 'palte': Civil War + Railroad Act + Land Grant Colleges* +oversaw the 3X of US telegraph system among other 'things' on a VERY full plate.
"The story of Abraham Lincoln and the telegraph is perhaps the greatest untold story about this great man. Through these messages it is possible to watch Lincoln’s confidence grow and in turn to observe his growth as a leader. What is most remarkable, however, is that Abraham Lincoln applied the new telegraph technology in an absence of precedent. Without the guidance of text, tutor, or training Lincoln instinctively discerned the transformational nature of the new technology and applied its dots and dashes as an essential tool for winning the Civil War."
http://hnn.us/articles/30860.html
The Land-Grant College: When Was It Created?
* "Morrill first introduced a land-grant bill in Congress in 1857, which after much struggle was passed in 1859 only to be vetoed by President James Buchanan. In 1861 Morrill introduced another land-grant bill that increased to 30,000 acres the grant for each senator and representative and added a requirement that recipient institutions teach military tactics. The newly felt need for trained military officers to fight in the Civil War, along with the absence of Southern legislators who had opposed the earlier bill, helped the Morrill Act through Congress in just six months. President Abraham Lincoln signed it into law on July 2, 1862."
http://www.wvu.edu/~exten/about/land.htm
If you want to read an excellent book that would put this in context, The Great Bridge: The Epic Story of the Building of the Brooklyn Bridge. It was built in the 1870s. To build a bridge you had to get to bedrock. The transcontinental railroad was a great feat.
1. Barack Obama's birth certificate which was created, validated, and released by the governance of the state of Hawaii is valid and in proper order and therefore confirms that he is a natural born citizen of the United States of America.
2 Barack Obama's birth certificate which was created, validated, and released by the governance of the state of Hawaii is a fake because a. the governance of the state of Hawaii and all of the people who work in the Department of Health and in the Vital Records Department are lying and they made up a fake birth certificate and then lied and said it was valid because b. he was actually born in another country and c. his mother is not an actual citizen of the United States of American.either, and d.Obama knows he is not a natural born citizen and decided to run for President knowing he wasn't and he is lying to all of the 306,935,543 people in the United States and all of the 6,771,696,605 people on Earth.
If you chose #1, then good for you! You are correct and this is the proper explanation for solving this problem.
If you chose #2, then DING thanks for playing, but you are a total idiot. Explanation #2 is not only illogical and ridiculous, it is downright amusing and so are you.
I can't plant trees fast enough to replace the amount of oxygen these people are wasting.
Assuming he was born in Hawaii, he gets his citizenship on the basis of "jus soli." Someone should look up the case of US v Wong Kim Ark. Wong was born in the US while his parent, who were Chinese citizen, were resident in the US conducting business. The Supreme Court ruled on the basis f "jus soli" that Wong was a native born American citien, because as stated in the 14th Amendment, "All persons born or naturalized in the United States, subject to the jusisdiction of the United States, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside."
Thus Obama's citizenship is determined by place of birth(jus soli) and by virtue that his mother was American(jus sanguinis).
I doubt that this will end this stupid controversy, but there it is.
article on Wong Kim Ark v US in which the principle of jus sanguinis is
discussed. The United States uses both jus soli and jus sanguinis as
determinants of citizenship. As I mentioned in my conspiracy post, if your
mother was traveling in Spain, France or any country, and gave birth to you,
the US would consider you a natural born citizen via jus sanguinis. It
would not matter to the US that France or Spain might consider you a native
French or Spanish citizen also. Dual citizenship does not negate American
citizenship.
If you check the Wikipedia article and click on jus sanguinis, it takes you
to a discussion of jus sanguinis as a principle in multiple countries.
I should mention that in 1964 a faction argued that, since Barry Goldwater
was born in Arizona BEFORE became a state, he was not a natural born citizen
and thus ineligible to run for the presidency. This argument was as
specious, albeit for different reasons, as the current debate on President
Obama's citizenship.
J. D. Bryce
the US, subject to the laws of the US (non-diplomats) are citizens of the
US. Jus sanguinis means "right of blood," and refers to people born out of
a the US whose parent(s) are citizens of the US are citizens of the US.
Jus sanguinis has its roots in English Common Law. There has never been a
case of an person born overseas of American parents being denied natural
born citizenship status. The jus sanguinis principle is totally established
and would never be challenged.
2. Barry Goldwater was born in Arizona when it was a "territory" as
opposed to a state. People born in US territories (Puerto Rico, Guam and
Arizona before 1912) are natural born American Citrizens. The Goldwater
case was never litigated because it was a preposterous claim. Goldwater
never had to apply for citizenship. Was was native born!
3. The Romney case involved his "residency" in Massachussetts, not his
birth. Romney's opponents opposed his candidacy for Governor on the basis
that he supposedly had not sufficiently established is legal residency in
the state. It had nothing to do with his national citizenship.
I cannot imagine where you are getting your information from.
4. You need to take courses in Constitutional Law to intelligently write
about these issues. As regards your paper, narrow the scope. You're
developing "scope creep," which means you're expanding the subject of the
papaer as you research it. The central issues of President Obama's natural
born citizenship controversy involves his birth in Hawaii and the supposed
inauthenticity of his birth certificate. The birth certificate debate is
irrevevant because even if he wasn't born in Hawaii, his mother was an
American citizen and thus he is a natural born citizen by virtue of jus
soli. Research jus soli as the focus of your paper.
the United States are natural born citizens. You might want to research US
territorial policy beginning in 1898, when we acquired The Philippines,
Guam, and Puerto Rico as territories.
George Romney was born in Mexico of parents with were living in Mexico
conducting business. He also was a natural born American citizen by virtue
of jus sanguinis.
Jus sanguinis, as a determinant of citizenship, is a principle so old that
no one until recently has opted to challenge it. The Wong kim Ark
established jus soli as an additional determinant of natural born
citizenship. Since the 1890s, Jus soli and jus sanguinis have been the dual
principles on which native-born American citizenship is determined. Period.
That's the answer!
My irritation with your questions is that I answered them, but you simply
ignored what I wrote and asked the same questions again.
Philippines or anywhere in the world are natural born American citizens by
virtue of jus sanguinis. There is no question or debate on this issue. In
addition, children born in any US territory (except Samoa) are natural born
American citizens. That is the law!
There is a Wikipedia article on point:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birthright_citizen...
You seem upset. This is supposed to be an intellectual debate, if indeed
debating "conspiracies" like can be called intellectual. Fro myself, I
believe that emotions are like underwear: They are necessary, but it is
tacky when they're shown. Emotions are to be controlled, not displayed.
J. D. Bryce
child of an American military officer while he was stationed in Peru. This
person, in order to establish citizenship would have had to apply to the
Department of State and furnish proof of her birth situation. The State
Department would then issue proof of citizenship. This person is simply
asking the State Department to confirm her status as a citizen. That is not
the same as a resident alien applying for citizenship.
In addition, the affirmation by the State Department would not make her a
naturalized citizen, but a natural born citizen based upon her father's
citizenship, or on the basis of jus sanguinis. I should add that Peru,
might consider her a Peruvian citizen, but that it irrelevant to her status
as a natural born American citizen.
I hope Obama never shows you people anything! He has nothing to prove!!!
Rock on Mr. President!!!
May I humbly remind all concerned that the birther freakazoids are nothing more than a bunch of sick, demented bigots who cannot hold a candle to President Barack Hussein Obama when it comes to both personal achievement and true concern for the future of our country. That's what kills them, really. They've been duped into trumpeting "personal responsibility" as a cause for all societal ills (only when it applies to "others", of course), but now the dire economic circumstances that they helped to create through their complicity in murder and war profiteering have given them a visceral understanding that they have been broken down shotgun-style and plugged from behind with their own dumbed-down ideology. And yet they can't bring themselves to admit that it's their own fault - they brought it on themseleves.
May they rot.
good-bye party of Lincoln and abolition - and - hello parties of (after)'birther' wack jobsplinter factions, primarily regional fly over 'pockets' of ignorance and (still treasonous after all these years) johnny rebs.
and, good riddance. the trashman cometh in 2014 to haul away the remainder of the GOP
Hawaii's officials, including the Republican Governor, declared that Obama was born in the United States. If you can't deal with America and her states having established institutions, then neither Cook nor you understand this country very well.
If you were trying to perfect these institutions, I might even believe that any of you are actually sincere.
Obama is an American. Obama Won. If you don't like it get active and perfect the message that you have for the voters.
He is a USURPER IN CHIEF
This sordid affair should have ended when Obama posted his birth certificate on his website.
Instead....it was a fake. Actually it was two fakes.
And is anybody following the story about the two hospitals Obama was born in?
So here we are.
Wait. Sarah Palin quit her job as Governor to become my housekeeper? Weird. Well, I guess Sonia Sotomayor is about to get promoted, so I DO need a new housekeeper.
But I'm not willing to pay employment taxes for Sarah, so she'll have to work under the table. Won't be the first time, I'm sure. Don't you wonder just what Sarah said or did to old man McCain when they had their ONE and ONLY ten-minute meeting prior to his selection of her as VP candidate? They were on his Sedona, Arizona ranch, which is in the middle of butt fuck Egypt and private as any multi-millionaire white couple would need to be... but even so, they went off together to a PRIVATE spot by a creek, where they talked for a grand total of 10 minutes.
Sounds like just enough time to get the zipper up [when he noticed his fly was open], down, and up again, and then re-apply the make-up.
I don't know if I can hire her as my maid. I have a strict no-drug-selling policy at my house. So that would mean none of her in-laws could ever come over to pick her up when her shift is finished.
You are a machine.
Joe
Eh, I make this look harder than it is. I spend most of my time chortling and saying "you gotta be kidding me," if you want to know the truth. I don't exactly have to compose and edit to be able to respond to the likes of kwiley, dti, JT casey123, Navigator7, and their ilk.
And I multi-task. I've got dual monitors and I'm busy doing other stuff at the same time. So it may seem like I've never left, but in fact I went out to dinner and I just came back and thought I'd see what I missed. Just had to post a couple of the most ridiculous ones that were buried down deep. I wanted them up front for the new arrivals to see. Especially that absurdity about "you can have the country back when I'm done protecting it." Rambo was 1985, dude. You know?
Anyway, morning!
boy scout merit badge count = not released
captain marvel secret decoder ring = not released
bong water recycling permit = not available
membership in Star Trek fan club - sealed by court order
What is this man trying to hide?
I was chewing at the time. Enjoy the visual.
Thanks!
But they didn't identify and disclose those disorders before they started saying hateful petulant child b.s. So I'm really undecided about whether to continue. I just decided. I'll continue.
Cheers!
This site is apparently liberal. Judging from the stories the Washington Independent publishes, not by the comments (the latter would be an illogical basis on which to judge).
Why would Obama need to pay bloggers to post comments on liberal sites? Particularly as to an issue about which NO liberal needs persuading - the birther thing. No reasonable person (and no liberal, no matter how unreasonable) believes any of that crap for a second.
So why would the President risk a HUGE scandal by having it exposed that he paid people to say things in a silly little-read liberal newspaper three and a half years before he's facing re-election?
ALL that says to me is that you birthers really fear Obama. He'd have to have more money than God to be able to afford to do that. Because he's pragmatic. If he's paying X people Y dollars per hour or whatever to post here, he's gotta pay 100 X people 10 Y dollars to post at the NYT or Huffington Post, just based on the viewership. And then he's got to do a print campaign. And then he's got to get people on TV. It just goes on and on.
I'm starting to see how this conspiracy theory thing works. Nifty. Not true. But nifty.
Now any one that is white and inclusive is painted as a liberal or left, there are good white folks that are calm, reasonable, sane, LOVING, people, some even DISAGREE with the president. They do not spew the racism that I see in these fringe group.
You know zealots are people consume by the INFECTOUS cancer of hate and rage, like mad dogs reaching out your hand in kindness will only get it bit. Zealots are an ugly thing to behold whether they wear muslim garbs, or a southern confederate flag, or camouflage fatigues.
So in the absence of substantive issues to hide the hate in, these people are reveal themselves for the hate and fear mongers they are. They defend the GOP elite, as if they were part of that that privileged power structure. Reminds me of the civil war as poor southern whites died to defend the "rights" of rich southern plantation and slave owners. Those poor white families might think they were part of the rich white franchised power structure but only in their minds, and to reassure themselves they will go and find some powerless black person to lynch to affirm that they too are a powerful white person.
Now today they like rabid pack of mad dogs are trying to lynch and pull down the most powerful black person they see, President OBAMA, and like a baying pack of dogs, trying to pull them off the scent is pointless. They must in their minds eye take down a black person(black or Mexican in arizona) so they can again reassure themselves they are part of the powerful white structure.
You cannot reason with insanity.
Why is this issue so important to American citizens who were privileged to gain an education before 1960? Because we know our history, not pop culture.
How many times in your life do you need to show legitimate proof of USA residency? Why don't you require it of your president? How many names has the pretender used in his life? Which name is on any documentation of election and inauguration? Why has he been spending hundreds of thousands, perhaps a million by now, of dollars on attorneys to seal his history? Why did he go hiking to the birth records department in Hawaii when seeing his ailing white grandmother? That long CofD published is so farcical that Ronald McDonald would see through it. What passport did he use to visit Pakistan at a time when Americans were banned? Does he have a Social Security account? At least one of his fanciful tomes has been claimed by Bill Ayers as the author. What makes an adult with a bigamous father who abandoned him write such pompous books about such a scoundrel? Why would he never acknowledge a man who adopted him and gave him his Muslim education?
His outright scorn and hatred of America, as well as his wife's open hatred of America, makes one wonder why he would want to be the nation's leader? That, unfortunately, is being revealed in breathtaking speed. Under his illegitimate rule, our sovereignty, culture, society, economy and our very national being has been destroyed.
Please note that the opposition to this man by myself and other conservatives is NOT racial. Race is a liberal issue, so please don't waste your time with inane protestation.
This pretender has been groomed to force us into a new world order. We're already there. Some of us have to be eliminated to meet control numbers, and any one of you could suffer that fate as I.
Ridicule, scathe, scourge, vilify as you will. You change nothing, because you prefer your vacuous existence.
For example, there was no ban on travel to Pakistan. That was apparently just made up by some dude on the Internet, and repeated by the type of people who uncritically believe some dude on the Internet.
Also, I have been required to show proof of citizenship and residence many times, but I've never had to show more than a passport, social security card, or maybe a reprint of my birth certificate. At no point have I ever had to show someone the original paper document sitting in a government building in Springfield, IL. I'm pretty sure that neither have you.
We already know the answer to that question because the Obama campaign released a reprint of his birth certificate. The conspiracy theorists simply said it isn't enough and now they demand the original. If that is released they will then demand hospital records.
That's the way a denial movement works, you continually pretend that you only want one piece of evidence that you don't have yet, and try to make the government look like it's hiding something because they won't meet your demands.
First, stop the controversy by providing the Long Form Birth Certificate and not the Certificate of Live Birth which is not a Birth Certificate.
Second, on the Certificate of Live Birth it states that the Father’s race is ‘AFRICAN’. In the 1960’s information it would state for race ‘NEGRO’. To use the term ‘AFRICAN’ someone wants to be politically correct and creating a bogus document.
Provide the long form Birth Certificate and end this.
Because of that ironic slander, and the lies I mentioned above, I wonder how persuasive you expect to be. I doubt that persuasion is your goal. You just wanted to vent.
Hence the "so farcical that Ronald McDonald [and no one else including the State of Hawaii] would see through it"; "fanciful tomes"; "bigamous father"; "pompous books"; "scoundrel"; "outright scorn and hatred of America"; "his wife's open hatred of America"; "illegitimate rule"; and "eliminated to meet control numbers" nonsense. I repeat. Nonsense.
You could have eliminated ALL of that invective from your post and still made some sort of argument for why we should need to examine the President's birth certificate AGAIN. And at least then you would deserve respect, and you would receive it.
But when you put all that crap in your post, it loses any pretense of legitimacy. You are not motivated by some patriotic desire. You just want to slam the President. And it's not because he's a Democrat. It's because he is black. So make up whatever nonsensical strawman you want about race being a liberal issue. We all see the truth.
And then you have to go and lie.
No government attorney, and no private attorney, has racked up "hundreds of thousands, perhaps a million by now, of dollars" "to seal his history." The cases that have been filed thus far, save one that is pending, have been thrown out as frivolous by a judge acting on his or her own motion (sua sponte). That means hardly any, if any, defense costs have been incurred. Obama has not had to spend any time dealing with this.
There is a pending case in which a judge finally agreed to hear the merits of this bogus issue. Once that case is tossed out, as it will be, after the merits have been heard, then it will have preclusive res judicata effect on all litigation about this stupid issue. That is, no one else will be able to bring suit challenging the legitimacy of the President to serve, because the merits have been heard.
That case may, but has not yet, require the President (through the appropriate office representing him, certainly not the President himself) to appear in the suit and offer testimony or evidence. Legal fees, in the form of government staff time, may then become generated. But in all likelihood, the judge in that case will simply allow the plaintiff in the case to have a hearing, where the burden of proof will be on the plaintiff as moving party, and the President's office will say nothing at all, since they do not have to. The moving party will be unable to establish anything that will controvert the public record before the Court.
That is, the Court can look at the documents referenced in the previous cases, including the certified copy of the birth certificate and the words of the officials from Hawaii attesting to its authenticity. When the moving party has nothing admissible that would refute that, the case is over. Without the President doing anything. And certainly without the President racking up a million in legal fees. I just told you the whole thing in five minutes.
Notice that I said the moving party (birthers) will have nothing admissible. None of the nonsensical far-right-wing preacher/lunatic "abstracts" or "articles" are admissible as evidence.
So that's lie 1. I think I'll do at least one more just to drive it home.
Lie 2 - "Why did he go hiking to the birth records department in Hawaii when seeing his ailing white grandmother?"
When did you stop beating your wife? The only one who went hiking is Mark Sanford. Quit making things up.
Okay that was too easy. Let's do one more.
Lie 3 - visiting Pakistan "at a time when Americans were banned" -- that one was covered ably by a worthy colleague. Skip to lie 4.
Lie 4 - "At least one of his fanciful tomes has been claimed by Bill Ayers as the author." That's ridiculous. Ayers never said that he wrote either of Obama's books. A far-right-wing kook said that Ayers wrote Obama's book. There's a vast difference between those two things. Which is why that's lie 4.
Okay I guess that's enough. Thanks for the lesson in civility and truth-telling.
Nobody is saying that proof of citizenship isn't required for many things, we're saying that it was already duly provided until a judge says otherwise. The 'show us the long form' argument presupposes something required has been withheld, I disagree that this is the case. For the present, Hawaii has the last word.
And characterizing everyone that disagrees with you as wild, vulgar, insipid, arrogant and intellectually challenged, does not constitute civil debate either. There's lots of anti-philosophers to go around, so why generalize?
As for all the other complaints, elections have consequences and I remember feeling as you not so long ago. Since you're slightly older than I am, I guess you've already learned times changed ever and anon?
As for new world order, don't depress yourself with that stuff. Even if were true, you give them more power and due than they would deserve. This world has seen many greedy ages come and go, and the sun still comes up, the birds still sing and babies still smile.
Joe
Hawaii has never officially stated that they verified anything about the image posted on the internet. Never. People keep coming up with things like Lingle said this or Okubo said that, but none of this is official. Refer to my post. Why did Obama not bring it to the people who issued it, in order to legitimize it and verify it? Instead they show it to 2 people from a website, Jess Hennig and Joe Miller? Who the f*ck are they?
I appoligize for missing your question until I checked my email. I'm going to go with the Republican govenor of Hawaii and the board that say its official. When the highest officials in a state say official, its official util proven in court otherwise.
Joe
Just saying. No offense meant. Except toward Republicans.
These "birther" comments do for progress what Amy Winehouse does for erections.
“Major Cook and his lawyer expressed joy at this outcome,” said Hannity. “And they took it as an admission on the part of the military that the president is not in fact a legitimate citizen by birth.”
****************************************************************************************************
I don't think it is news to anybody that so-called conservatives only support the part of the troops and military that happen to agree with them.
Isn't Sean Hannity a high school drop out anyway? Maybe he should be excused for not understanding that Hawaii is one of the 50 United States.
Perpetration and perpetuation of lies is a very strong tool. In this case, recently we already see a soldier refusing deployment orders, because he claims the Commander in Chief is illegitimate, because of the claim that he is not really a citizen. Needless to say, if there are a lot of wingnuts in the military like that, it could be very disruptive.
Recall that the 'Swifboat' lies in the 2004 election were certainly enough to swing the entire election. It didn't matter that they were lies. The perpetration and perpetuation of those lies has certainly (and adversely) had a profound effect on the course of our nation, and, indeed, on world history.
Also note that such paralysis of publc discourse was a prime goal of the Nazis before they came to power. The Nazis used every technique they could to discredit democracy, in general, and the Weimar Republic, in particular, during their grab for power in the 20's-30's. This behavior is destructive of democracy, and it appears to be getting worse here.
I'm not sure that this is a sign of desperation. Unfortunately, it may signal a shift of strategy by the right wing core of the Republican party and its adherents to further weaken our democracy to the temptations of authoritarianism - simple answers for simple people.
The leaders of this effort know that this particular uproar is a lie. They also know that their followers believe it. Unfortunately, even if it is debunked, as it already has been, a great number of these followers will STILL believe it, and still cause an uproar. This sort of lie-followed-by-uproar can be used over and over, based on all sorts of lies and accusations to cause public chaos. Expect a lot more of it.
Obama Won. get over it.
WHERE IS IT? WHERE IS IT? WHERE IS IT?
If you are annoyed, go listen to your Beetles albums some more and STFU! Stay out of the debate! Stick your head in the sand! OR learn to debate facts. Don't just be personally abusive. That is the way spoiled brats argue. Notice I didn't say debate.
Obama is a f@cking liar. Get over it.
Holy cognitive dissonance Batman!!! How does one debate "facts" with someone who won't acknowledge reality?
O Bummer is nothing more than an ORGANIZER. One who is surrounded by thugs. Fom Chicago no less.
America under him is becoming the New Mexico, or worst yet, Venezuela. Poor and poorer and elites such as he.
Business and industry will no longer be viable in this Socialist Society created by this Communist Community Organizer.
Especially Small business. I have seen more small Mom and Pop businesses go bust in the past year then I have ever noticed ever.
How anyone can still stand in step in your full brown shirt attire is beyond comprehension to the average person possessing plain old Common sense. Remove your blinders, open your eyes and minds if possible, and really see what is happening here in America. The World sees America today very Clearly, and China is warning us and this Organizer that this country is going to hell in a hand basket.
This Emperor has no clothes and you fools still follow..
Save your shit response about my typos .. you want to talk points. Talk points. But I could gave a damn how its spelled he is an ass and so are his ass followers..
He bullied people in the primaries when Hillary was winning. He cried racism when the Clintons were still garnering the Black Vote.
He won the primaries by flooding the Caucus rooms with his minions and thugs.
Oh and maybe seeing as we can have Black Panthers with billy clubs paid workers at Polling places. Just asking, who knows, but does that mean white hoods and sheets carrying rope can work poll places too? I mean if voter intimidation is good for the goose what about the gander?
I am from Connecticut where the torture and murder of Bobby Seal took place.
Black Panthers are militant in case you didn't know.
The Panthers equate to the same scum in sheets they possess the same mentality. Hate and be hated.
But your dear leader uses the panthers at polling places.. wow A-con people look too timid and un-intimidating ?
Actually Obummer is a rather wimpy looking thing to begin with.. he probably dated all white chicks back in the 70's. Then on to politics and being black, for that ticket.
He is worst then Carter and he is a mulatto, and possibly not even a Black American, at least not one with roots in this country who really rose beyond all his struggles.. He nor Michele struggled.
He backed out of transparency
He backed out on Public Funding
He actually got a pass on being audited for all those fraud charges being used to fund his campaign.
The list goes on.
Presidente of the Census
Presidente of the auto industry
Presidente of the banks
Presidente of the insurer AIG, on and on.. yep he is a Communist Community Organizer.
Presidente of Service to AMERICA
One website for a few million. Can't any of his freaks, maybe one of you reading this with free time VOLUNTEER for America and do the website for free. I would do it just for the FREE advertising of my skills.
But then again I don't live home with M&D. I have a family to raise. So I am a very concerned Citizen. One of those that gagged at the thought of voting for McCain. Being open minded, I even thought once, for a fleeting moment, to give this Leader a chance..
He has had it , and its a little over 7 months now.. No energy independence. Government Dependence for all.
Who questions him? Who digs and sees that he is Organizing America to third world sub standards.
The media all of it are his doormats. Helen Thomas Asked what are you pulling with your phony town halls. Now the Left thinks she is senile?? There is no objection to anything he says or does because he is a black man .. give me a break.
He is a man using his blackness to get where he is. He is no different then Jesse and Al pushing till the door opens OR ELSE.
So that is my opinion of the man, his administration, his campaign..
Tell me what you see that he is planning, or already done, that is good for America?
For the UN maybe. For Mexico yes, but not to the rest of the World that took the blinders off. Unless you count the dictators who approve of your Communist Community Organizer. You know his buddy Chavez, and his and hollywood Loonies cozy pal Castro those who see this menace for what he is, a Dictator the same as them.
The real world sees that he is not even near the pay grade of a McDonalds store manager, let alone the President of the United States. The free world leader.
The Third world dictatorship he is creating fits him to a "T".
Actually I regress, its your turn.
You tell me what he HAS done, that you are so approving of?
Anyone?
What do I like that he has done?
Well, for starters, he did something to make you write all that pathetic bullshit.
More to the point, he didn't do anything. You just wrote all that because you're a pathetic bullshitter.
Care to tell us some more horror stories of what you've seen happen in this past year? Obama has been President for six months. We never tire of hearing about shit that Bush did wrong. Surely you blame Bush, and not Obama, if indeed you blame the President, for what happened during 8 years of Bush's watch?
No? You'd rather blame the guy trying to turn the aircraft carrier around after warning us that it'd take 2 years...
than the one who drove it drunk to Iraq and took a picture of himself under the Mission Accomplished banner?
Gee, that makes sense and is awfully fair of you.
Cry me a river.
Glad you understand that Obama is the President.
Beyond that your opinions are your own and you're entitled to them.
Except for that bullshit about Black Panthers at polling places. Absolutely false.
The line for whiny infantile know-nothing ranting is already long. Get in line behind franknowzad and naturalborn.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=neGbKHyGuHU
But here's the rub. The lady's children were born on the 5th August 1961, at Kapolami. The birth cert's number is 151-61-10637. Obama was allegedly born on the 4th August 1961 -at various hospitals!?!- the number of his alldged birth cert? 151-1961- 010641. One day before, but 4 birth certs after the honest cert? It's a sad day when communists can't even lie properly.
The fact that those two birth certificates have numbers that close in sequence is further proof of the authenticity of Obama's certificate. There's no reason to suppose that the documents arrived in any particular order. Obama was born at 7:24 p.m. on August 4. No government clerical worker is on duty until 8 am the next day. Documents get processed in the order in which they get processed. Unless you could show that there was some deliberate funny business here, all you have is more paranoid racist speculation.
And you cite WND for this? You make it seem as if your link takes you to a specific story. It does not; it's just a link to WND dot com.
And, of course, WND confirmed almost a year ago that the COLB is authentic. I posted about it on this very thread. You're just a disingenuous Brit, frank. Go read up on Walter Annenberg like I told you to.
Here's the WND post:
______________________________
Even World Net Daily has reported that the COLB presented by President Obama is authentic.
Read that again.
Here's the link:
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageI...
Here's what you need to read when you get there:
"However, FactChecker.org says it obtained Obama's actual certification of live birth and that the document was indeed real. The site discredited some of the claims of Internet bloggers, such as that the certificate as viewed in a scanned copy released by Obama's campaign lacked a raised seal. FactChecker.org also established that many of the alleged flaws in the document noted by bloggers were caused by the scanning of the document.
A separate WND investigation into Obama's certification of live birth utilizing forgery experts also found the document to be authentic. The investigation also revealed methods used by some of the bloggers to determine the document was fake involved forgeries, in that a few bloggers added text and images to the certificate scan that weren't originally there."
Wow. Got that? Authentic. Got that? People claiming otherwise added stuff that wasn't there before.
No reasonable person has any doubt, and no unreasonable person has any evidence. So no stink, fat person in a disco or otherwise.
WND doesn't confuse me. It's a wacko fringe site. But even they saw that the COLB is authentic. See, I know that confuses you. It's ok. I never said you were intelligent.
The COLB was SO last week. Are you a secret Birther spy?
What does determine eligibility is where you are born, a fact that is listed on the COLB. Indeed, that is why it is listed on the COLB. If the COLB was not sufficient to prove you were born in the state, there would be no point in issuing it.
Dont even bother responding to franks post, chances are no such lady even exists.
They just make stuff up out of thin air.
Braindead peasants.
The Republican governor of Hawaii says he was born there. Get over it.
And when did any thinking person take a politician's word for granted? Trust but Verify.
What "thinking person" has a functional government and also a figurehead "Queen" who does nothing but soak up the wealth of the "peasants" and claim all wild geese and swans as Royal property? Oh, whoops, I already said Englishmen, didn't I?
What "thinking person" cannot tell the difference between Dear Leader Kim Jong Il and anyone else? No one at all. Oops, no one besides YOU, frank. So I guess we have to go with Englishmen again.
What "thinking person" accuses anyone of being "commies" after 1971? No one but you. The paranoid buzzword of the day is "socialism." Try to keep up.
Trust but Verify, indeed. Verification in the form of authentication from Hawai'ian state officials. Verification in the form of factcheck.org. Verification in the form of a system of laws.
Oh you mean verification as in "keep asking asinine questions that have no relevance in reality, in hopes of being taken seriously by grown-ups?"
Good luck with that, frank.
Your questions are loaded. When did you stop beating your wife? I'm glad you did. But you need to find something else to do now that your silly conspiracy theory has been conclusively and thoroughly and repeatedly exposed as being nothing but a fig leaf for xenophobic racists to hide behind.
Read that again.
Here's the link:
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageI...
Here's what you need to read when you get there:
"However, FactChecker.org says it obtained Obama's actual certification of live birth and that the document was indeed real. The site discredited some of the claims of Internet bloggers, such as that the certificate as viewed in a scanned copy released by Obama's campaign lacked a raised seal. FactChecker.org also established that many of the alleged flaws in the document noted by bloggers were caused by the scanning of the document.
A separate WND investigation into Obama's certification of live birth utilizing forgery experts also found the document to be authentic. The investigation also revealed methods used by some of the bloggers to determine the document was fake involved forgeries, in that a few bloggers added text and images to the certificate scan that weren't originally there."
Wow. Got that? Authentic. Got that? People claiming otherwise added stuff that wasn't there before.
As if that wasn't enough, here's a point about the claim that Obama supposedly lost his citizenship as a boy in Indonesia:
"In short, the suit claims Obama was not born an American citizen; lost any hypothetical American citizenship he had as a child (Editor's note: This point is not supported by U.S. citizenship law); may not now be an American citizen and even if he is, may hold dual citizenships with other countries."
So how about it, birthers? You ready to call it quits now that even World Net Daily has given up?
Oh, wait, that World Net Daily article was published August 23, 2008, ELEVEN MONTHS ago. That can only mean that 24 ahead dot com and every other loser who cited WND in reliance on this stupid conspiracy was never serious to begin with!
Oh well, I can't say I didn't already know THAT!
There's a good article today. The point was raised, "if Hawaii did go paperless in 2001 (destroying all original copies) how come Factcheck, and all the other commies, get to touch, hold, feel, smell,etc the sacred Original Obama birth cert?
If the originals have been inputed onto a computer then why not just release the damn thing.
Obama is now officially more crap, and less liked, than Jimmy Carter. The news outlets supporting him are making themselves look like secretive fascists by their self censorship and horrible witch hunts of investigating reporters.
It may be time to just release the Birth Certificate and be damned.
Post a link to the "good article." Where'd you get it from? Guaranteed no legitimate site, not even WND, said anything about commies. Nor did anyone claim to have fondled or otherwise handled the original birth certificate. Factcheck and others, including Hawai'ian officials from the state's Dept. of Health, have viewed the hard copy of the COLB.
The original vital records are maintained electronically and state law prevents those from being released to anyone. Tenth Amendment. Americans have Amendments. Englishmen have jealousy and a figurehead Queen. We understand. That's why we left.
Oh, about that source I asked you to provide... I got it from "two inches up my own ass" is not a credible source on this side of the pond, frank.
"Yeah I guess you Obama people are right about birthers being crazy, racist, stupid, sorelosers. Just look at who some of them are: Pat Boone, Alan Keyes, Michael Savage, Rush Limbaugh, best-selling author Jerome Corsi, numerous attorneys, numerous military officers, Lou Dobbs, at least eight percent of voters, the 400,000 Americans who signed the petitition for Obama to show his original Birth Certificate, Ron Paul & many other legislators."
Let me say just 1 thing:
1.: After reading through the list of names: I REST OUR CASE!
And I'm unanimous in that.
He went on a Journey to the Center of the Earth and fought dinosaurs and got blown out of a volcanoe and everything so show some respect!
Because, of course, by doing so he is violating the agreement he reached with the black community when we allowed him to get famous by covering black songs for white audiences without letting on that he wasn't the first one to do the songs. He learned that from Elvis.
You can't understand the Boone...
He may be loonie, but you cant withstand the man.
Or perhaps you're just a dimwitted goon?
Your visions of tropical sand, not withstand.
We all understand.
(sorry. but as you may have guessed i am irish, and it is friday)
Apollo Creed: If you stand toe-to-toe with this bum, he'll kill you. It doesn't take a man to stand there and get your head beat off...! He's just a man, Rock, so be MORE man than him! Go get him; Eye Of the Tiger!
http://www.mooviees.com/645/quotes
Night jjfitz
Florida Christian is the hero this blog deserves, not the hero this blog wants.
Makes me wish Heath Ledger was around to do another Batman.
And wish that Florida Christian would come out of hiding. But it won't happen. See above.
This is red command, go phase III.
Authentication Query: “the frogs jump high”
Authentication Answer: “but only in the spring”
Repeat: we are go phase III
After that we'll take superfluous industrial sugar and preservatives out of the food.
Muahhhaaa..
But have a care, 'renewable' is the duress code, but since I forgot to mention that, this will not be considered a breach. Stand down.
My daily paidObamablogger twitter message just informed me that the Barack Obama 2012 Presidential campaign theme song will be "Born in the U.S.A."
How ya like them apples, birthers? Hey, he IS "the Boss."
The first kick he took because his skin brown
He could'a acted like a dog that's been beat too much
But he kept his head up, and became The POTUS
[chorus:]
Born in the U.S.A.
Born in the U.S.A.
Born in the U.S.A.
Born in the U.S.A
(Edited for English... again)
To quote a madman, "this could all be laid to rest so easily." Just blast those two songs at Obama when he tries to do a press conference. If he remains stoic, he's an alien life form. If he starts rockin' he's American.
America Rocks! Whoo-hoo!
Perfect!
Born in God-knows-where
He's a dirty stinking commie from God-knows-where.
' 9 ' man HK Team is the next 'step'.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunter-killer
"A hunter-killer team's primary mission is to seek out and destroy the enemy, particularly in contexts where the enemy is attempting to evade detection rather than seek engagement."
These (after)'birthers' (and worse) need to be 'monitored' & tracked and 'nullified', whenever and wherever they 'pop up'. The only way to nullify the force of their 'argument' (soreloserman tantrums as it were) is to meet them with an equal/superior opposing 'force'.
basic algebra. - 3 + 9 = +6, -1 + 3 = +2
-6 +3 = -3 > can't let that 'happen' cuz that's when the inmates take 'control' (like the Castle (R-Idiot) of the conversation and/or worse, the situation. email addys in 'here', just hit the 'tat' and 'browser search' 'gmail'. there are, will be PLENTY of opportunities to set the record straight and/or 'ID' for authorities the REALLY 'broken' ones. a guy's gotta have a 'hobby', AND the President and the Republic need a hand, so...
form up on my '6', safetys 'off'...
mallets up...
And who needs a hunter when David Weigel can round them up for us?
:)
Kenneth, I'm in. 5 man, surgical teams. In and out. You're too valuable to take point. I'm the new guy. I got it.
"Infantry must move forward to close with the enemy. It must shoot in order to move…. To halt under fire is folly. To halt under fire and not fire back is suicide. Officers must set the example" - General George Patton Jr "War as I knew it" 1947
and
"Lead me, follow me, or get out of my way." - General George Patton Jr
bottom line you lead from the front
When we all go out to dinner to award one of us the Mole-Whacking Mallet of Justice for 2009, I'm going on record saying Florida Christian buys the first round in the bar beforehand. R@t bastard is the only one of us who has never known the eye-stabbing pain of trying to RESPOND to a birther argument.
The green-eyed monster strikes again. Still can't believe he's on the latest thread angering non-birthers into a frenzy.
is EXACTLY what they 'signed onto' when they let the heavily medicated McSame pull the Palin 'rabbit' outta his ass. And, they deserve every defeat they're going to suffer until the 'after'(birthers' and/or sovereignist and/or secessionists and/or tea baggers all form independent parties PERMANENTLY fracturing the once proud party of Lincoln, founded on an abolitionist platform in in 1854 tears itself apart over the policies of the first black man in the white house. how ironic.
R.I.P GOP 1854 - 2014 [est.
very profound
We ain't smart, we're CUTE!
Count ME in! I'd recommend ALL early primary state Dems to pull a Rush 'Limp'Balls' maneuver and contribute AND 'vote' for this pairing so Obama-Biden can go 50-0 on their vacuous asses.
Too bad you can't think, just name-call. Sorry you don't or can't use your brain.
I read posts on a recent weekend where every third of fourth post was typed in bold caps with explanation points and about this issue. I assumed that a new class of summer interns "brown shirts" had been unleashed by the Republicans.
My reaction was that I'll never vote Republican again. These people are crazy. I may actually vote Republican at some point in the future if I live long enough, but it won't be anytime soon.
http://www.ledger-enquirer.com/news/story/77985...
“You have bad information,” the e-mail says. “I have not joined the lawsuit brought by Maj. Cook. Please retract that information and do not print it again.”
http://www.ledger-enquirer.com/news/story/77985...
“You have bad information,” the e-mail says. “I have not joined the lawsuit brought by Maj. Cook. Please retract that information and do not print it again.”
http://www.ledger-enquirer.com/news/story/77985...
“You have bad information,” the e-mail says. “I have not joined the lawsuit brought by Maj. Cook. Please retract that information and do not print it again.”
http://www.ledger-enquirer.com/news/story/77985...
“You have bad information,” the e-mail says. “I have not joined the lawsuit brought by Maj. Cook. Please retract that information and do not print it again.”
No one said that. Particularly because we're not in England and thus we don't say "offence." And no one on our side would have left out the word "on" between "cheating" and "your."
But the substantive problem is this: the penalties Giethner would otherwise have had to pay for failing to pay certain Medicare and related taxes were waived because the IRS usually waives such penalties where the failure to pay tax is the result of a good faith mistake or oversight. He still had to pay the taxes and back interest thereon.
So calm down and stop looking for clean underwear. The end of the world's not coming.
That may be one of the most effective policy ideas to come out of this thread. It can be funded by the money Sarah Palin will return for the Bridge to Nowhere that she said "thanks but no thanks but I'll keep the money" for. And Sarah will be the conductor. Well not really, her husband is the one who knows how to drive, but she'll be there. She'll find a way to slip her family's cable bill into her expense reimbursement form, but she'll be there.
Any incidental expenses can be paid for by funds fleeced from birthers who pay a fee to sign their name (or make their mark with an "X" as appropriate) on an intimate part of Sarah Palin's body at each tour stop.
Really, gomer? "cavernous behind?" Man up. You're challenging the legitimacy of the leader of the free world, remember? You're mad as hell. I know you are or you wouldn't be here. Just say "ass." My delicate sensibilities can take it.
If anyone has been had because their people didn't vet their own candidate, it's the people who signed on with John McCain and SARAH PALIN. One ten-minute "private" meeting by a creek on a private ranch is not a vetting process I would recommend for anything except perhaps the audition process for an oral sex contest.
Which may be hitting a little too close to what happened there, when you get down to it, Gomer.
Still, you go on and curse. You'll feel better. It's not as good as having actual, demonstrable evidence or coherent argument, but it's better than calling for revolution and saying "behind" at the same time.
Key Birther Lawyer Was Disbarred … In 2004 By David Weigel 7/20/09 11:02 AM
http://washingtonindependent.com/51798/key-birt...
"One of the more amusing quirks of the “birther” movement is the quality of the legal minds in whom Obama birth certificate obsessives are placing their trust — and their occasional donations. Phil Berg, the original “birther” lawyer, has been forced to pay out sanctions for legal malpractice. Orly Taitz, famously, got her law degree from an online correspondence school. And it turns out that Charles Lincoln, who has been assisting Taitz — he provided judges with amended complaints in Keyes et al v. Obama et al last week and he showed up at the last hearing on the case— has been disbarred in California, as well as Florida and Texas.
At the July 12 hearing on the Keyes complaint, Lincoln identified himself as a “law clerk.” The eyewitness report of that hearing is worth reading, since it contradicts with Taitz’s original, hilarious report of a judge who took her seriously. Actually, Judge David Carter spent a lot of time trying to get Taitz to stop wasting the court’s time with antics such as reading her complaint into the record."
How's that for quality representation, folks? The best of the best in legal minds. If this was so believable, don't you think that there might be some hot shot republican legal eagle trying to get the prez out of office?
and, coming soon to GA, another disbarment for Lincoln to go along with FL, CA, and TX?? must be a poker player, going for two pair or maybe... a full house, if they go back to SCOTUS (for another DISmissal). putzes.
that's where orly's filed HER latest, i believe.
nothing like surrounding yourself with the worst and the dumbest to really SCREAM:
I'M A TOTAL TOOL & DESERVE NEITHER YOUR PITY NOR YOUR TIME !!
now why am i NOT (the least bit) surprised?
OC Weekly has a deep/wide article on Orly:
http://www.ocweekly.com/2009-06-18/news/orly-taitz
If any "birther" actually took the time to read any of the numerous links to the Constitution about the definition of "natural born citizen", they would see that a birth certificate is a moot point because Obama's mother is a US citizen who has lived in the USA for more than 5 yrs. Any REAL lawyer would know that! Even if Obama was born in Kenya, he would still be considered a "natural born citizen" because his mother was! No birth certificate is necessary! What is so hard to understand about that? The English language on the US Constitution website is quite easy to understand, you don't need to be a lawyer to understand it, I'm not an attorney.
So if Obama is a natural born citizen regardless of where he was born, WHY all this fuss? He is just trying to do his job, whether you like him or not. We liberals had to put up with 8 yrs. of that dumb-ass Bush, you have to give an intelligent man a chance!
If by self-destructed you mean:
Presided over unprecedented economic growth including the longest uninterrupted period of economic expansion (12 million jobs created while in office) in history;
Left a 1.2 trillion dollar surplus to some guy named Dubya;
Didn't start wars with people who had nothing to do with 9/11; and
Left office, even with all the Republican slime attacks to the tune of $80 million in tax-payer funds, with an approval rating of 61%. That's right, an approval rating more than DOUBLE that of your outgoing war-time President Decider.
So if you mean he will do what President Clinton did, I would say you're even more optimistic than I am, but I like the way you think! Well, not really. You don't think, judging by the rest of what you write. But this one was a rare unpolished gem of honesty. Thanks, buddy.
How else to explain the 17 references to such a shitty example of why his economic plan would be better?
(notso)franknowsad
so, what is it w/all you 'dumbass' (after)'birthers'? really, i gotta know. NOW i remember, 'aggressively ignorant', that's it! it amazes me when you INSIST on demonstrating that not only don't you 'know' anything, but, that you don't even 'get' how the old 'google machine' works. putz!
YOUR latest 'gem':
(not so)frank: "1 Panama is pretty much a US colony..."
WRONG!
Panama is an independent nation (has been since 1903) and a constitutional democracy, but, given what you bat sh*t (after)'birthers' don't know about OUR own constitution i didn't expect much. Dumbass.
"...especially the huge US military bases."
2X WRONG > as part of handing over the 10mile/x50mile Canal Zone in 1999 we closed ALL our facilities, in 1999. remember? oh, wait. i know. how COULD you 'remember'/know that was the year you and your (after)'birther' ankle-biting comrades were FREAKING out/stockpiling food, guns, weapons over 'Y2K'.
Do tell, does going through life, scared AND stupid SUCK as much as i can only imagine it does?
(not so)frank: "Ask Gen Norriega (sic) if you doubt this."
You mean the General Noriega we took down in operation 'Just cause' in DEC 1989, and imprisoned in US Federal prison for drug trafficing until 2007 and are holding for extradition for the French, THAT 'Norriega' (sic)? Another 'good' (after)'birther' 'source'.
do NOT drink from whatever 'source' (not so)frank and the rest of his treasonous Obama hating ankle-biting (after)birther' comrades are drinking from. it not only makes you STUPID, it makes you want to tell the world you are stupid!!
dumbass (credit to stephenperry)
By structure I mean the following format I generally use.
1. I set forth my argument (e.g., a birther is a dumbass) by stating "Dumbass" at the beginning of the post.
2. I present the birther's words, which generally disprove themselves because of internal inconsistency with hilarious results.
3. I present the corresponding correction of the birther's errors.
4. I re-state my argument (that the birther is a dumbass) by ending the post with "dumbass."
I could end with QED but then birthers would just ask me what a shopping network has to do with it. Eh, I guess it seems persuasive enough, since I see that you incorporated a lot of my structure, kenne.
That's yet another telling Freudian slip. Take out "Hawaii" and replace it with "the world" and obviously fix Gomer's typo. Gomer means 1960's, in context.
What the birthers want is to go back to the world of the 1960's, before liberals got civil rights for everyone who wasn't the "default" in other words everyone who wasn't a privileged white male.
And Obama as President is the most jarring and undeniable worldwide symbol I can think of to say that "those days are over." And this, I submit, drives the birthers. Well, this and yammering stupidity.
Any disagreement from non-birthers? Show your work.
Once again this is the link to a picture of Obama's birth certificate, we understand that you don't like it. It was released on the Internet before an awaiting planet, not one Hawaiian Official has said it's false. Which to the rest of the planet, seems the more correct flow of logic. Which means you own the burden of proof.
What a terrifying world you live in. Poor right-winger, held en thrall by great a terrible forces that can deceive the entire planet, except for poor, poor, poor lonely you. You can believe it all you want, the rest of the planet looks at the scale of the conspiracy you are suggesting, and simply doesn't agree.
I'm sorry that the entire planet disagrees with you, but they do.
/pat /pat
And, regarding your source: Snopes, Wikipedia and even Obama himself can't get their stories straight on which hospital he was born in. You'd think those who claim to know for a fact that he was born in HI would be able to keep their stories straight on which hospital it was.
I'm still waiting for Weigel to answer my challenge. Since the 10/31 statement is only three paragraphs, you'd think he would have found the specific portion by now.
Obama is an Usurper.
As soon as you don't get your way, 200 years of American democracy is cast aside.
Tell it to the judge
Tell us all just WHY is it he refuses to do so?
Come on now... admit it, you CAN'T.
255 years of Democracy got thrown out the door with the election of a President who is not a Natural Born Citizen, one that REFUSES to prove otherwise, because he CAN'T prove it. That is the only logical reason why he can't.
If Obama is Legit, then he CAN prove it, and it would make ZERO sense to continue to obfuscate the whole Long Form Birth Certificate issue!
If he is Legit, then the burden of proving it is on him, and he refuses. Therefore he is GUILTY.
Go tilt at windmills sonny, your baller boy is a fraud.
Come on now... admit it, you CAN'T. "
I can think of several reasons why.
Reason number 1: there's no point, because birthers didn't believe the last document and they won't believe the next one.
Reason number 2: if I was the Prez I'd purposely blow these dudes off in a vaguely evasive manner, feeding these paranoid beliefs until the birther conspiracy theories completely take over right wing media sources.
Only then, after Rush, Lou Dobbs and the rest have completely committed themselves to the lunatic fringe would I take a camera crew into the HI dept of health, to show everyone the original and make all of my opponents look like xenophobic tools.
Then we watch as the opposition takes a huge credibility hit, their numbers drop as nobody wants to be associated with a bunch of conspiracy nuts, and then the remaining conservatives disown the birthers for ruining everything.
A circuitous list of badly-written, poorly-constructed fringe hate sights- deriving their inbred authority from links to other hate sites, will not hide from the majority (same problem as above) of the people, what this whole birther charade is really about.
This, is the reality in real America, until judges stop laughing this garbage out of court.
if i were YOU, i'd be spend some time worrying about what Obama's gonna do with the left over illegal spying tools/power grab that BushCo left behind. given your low opinion of President Obama and the fact that the BUSH/Cheney FBI/DOJ had QUAKERS on a 'list', you gotta think that it wouldn't be much of a 'leap' for YOU to get on a 'list', now would it?
as a matter of FACT, i KNOW there are 'hunters' out there looking for treasonous types. as a matter of FACT I am 'one', and, i've 'bagged' (with an assist from the ATF and the Secret Service, of cousre) a FL freeper and a WI '912' wack job so...
so, rant and rave and bitch and moan and babble 'away' but you might want to reign in any border line vitriol cuz the ATF & the SS aren't 'fans', neither is this patriot.
http://www.usconstitution.net/consttop_citi.html
wow, this repetitive thing is fun!
SUCKS to be you, 'you betcha'!!
jj, I have to tell you, I'm impressed with your manners and ability to be polite. You also are pushing the "willing suspension of disbelief" thing a bit far, in my view.
If you read the whole thing nav7 wrote in his little dissertation on black America, it's fairly obvious from the "sorrow and guilt" language, as well as from the overall thrust of the screed, which is that white-guilt-ridden liberals somehow propped up a black guy for President who didn't deserve it and we blacks should work hard on our own to get a guy who's worthy.
In other words, whites have done enough for blacks. Blacks need to explain why they haven't "taken off," which is what I think he meant by launch.
Can anyone seriously dispute that?
Hmmm. There are many problems here.
1) He's not literally a servant, pal. Not at your beck and call. Doesn't have to fly to Hawaii and show you his papers.
In the slave-holding South, blacks had to have "traveling papers" on their person at all times when, you guessed it, traveling. Otherwise they'd be thrown into slavery if they encountered any white man. Who am I kidding otherwise? "Boy, lemme see your papers." [illiterate grown black man hands over papers, which illiterate white man cumples and throws into ditch] "Slave, get in the wagon."
But those days are over.
2) He did provide specifics. So did authorized representatives of the State of Hawaii. Moreover, his Administration doesn't have to satisfy crackpots. They just have to do what the law requires, which they have more than done.
And all the birther arguments avoid that. They talk about what the law SHOULD require, or what the guy SHOULD do "just to get this over with."
3) It's a waste of time and resources. Because you know what, that's not what ANY government official, no matter how lowly, should be tasked with doing. They all work for the American people in the sense that we elected them to get things done and to govern. Even those who didn't vote for Obama are entitled to expect him to do his job, which is run the free world.
So if they DID waste time trying to satisfy you crackpots, everyone else in the country could legitimately be pissed off at the Administration for taking its eye off the Big Board of Real Issues. Like 2 wars, craptacular economy inherited from guy who ran it into the ground with tax cuts during 2 wars, health care reform that's critical to pass because last time we had a Democrat in office the right wing distracted us and spent $80 million to prove Clinton's heterosexual and unlike any other married man thus far discovered, and things of that stature.
4) I wanna know everything about every Republican Senator then. If your logic holds and if even one person has a question about a public official who represents them, then I have a whole list of questions I want to ask John Ensign about the $96,000 his mom and dad paid his mistress in chunks of $12,000 paid to the mistress, her husband and 2 of their 3 kids. First question is, "what did the third kid do wrong so as to get left out in the cold?" Second question is, "why are you still breathing?" And it goes on.
And so does your endless stream of nonsense. I don't write what I write so I can read it. I could re-read things I've written in years past. I write it so that it's abundantly clear to everyone that you birthers are transparently not credible as anything other than racist slime who do not even believe what they say.
You bring up nonsense like the nut who allegedly claims to have had homosexual sex with Obama in a drug-filled limo ride. Right... like that hasn't been dealt with. Like that ever needed to be dealt with in the first place. When you do things like that you show us that credibility is not one of your concerns.
So, care to elaborate on that military service of yours, country-protector?
Can anyone explain how I got dragged into a threesome with country-protector and his imaginary friend? Seriously.
Now I'm "gifted with the ability" to "know the unknown?" Yesterday I was accused of being "very, very, very, very, very VERY intelligent" and coming up with a "strategy of genius." Man I should really cash in before the streak ends. Maybe I can debate Bill O'Reilly. With a sock full of quarters in my hand.
Really, you birthers should get a grip. I'm not your Arch-Nemesis. I'm just a guy. One of many here who doesn't have any trouble understanding that the birth certificate issue is just a smokescreen for racist sore-losers. Hence, free rein to whack you with the very words that come out of your posts. You'll notice I rarely even have to make my own argument; I just show what's absurd about yours.
Get over it. The man won. He won fairly. And if you keep doing this, he will be certain to win again, because you look like total jerks.
I can mock you and be profane and still be called a "hero" compared to you birthers. And you know that this is true; you've seen it. So get over it. Really.
And then I and my cohort of superhero crimefighting Obama paid bloggers will disappear into the liberal mist.
Yes. The man won.
Ok...he one fairly.
Fine...if he wins again us birthers will look like total jerks.
Our bad.
But 'cha know what?
Obama is a servant of the American people.
If even one person wants to know the specifics about Obama....it should be right there!
Particularly now that this is the most transparent administration in the universe!
Obama has filled rail cars with so much baggage he ain't even being "green" anymore.
Those loco's burn diesel! An American product Obama doesn't want produced anymore.
Never mind coal.
We birthers are just mice. Why is Obama acting like an elephant and running scared?
http://www.upali.ch/bilder1/elemaufus.jpg
The longer this goes on.....we will find Obama is scared of the mice for good reason.
Then, Even the liberal mist will become rarified air incapable of supporting life.
Proof there is a God!
I don't think you wrote racist crap. You wrote racist crap. You failed to understand the difference? One is opinion, like "water's too hot." The other is fact, like "water's wet."
Your point about black on black slavery is a red herring and it's false anyway. I could just say white slave ring and we're right back where we started...with your racism.
But it's a red herring. The point I made is that blacks wouldn't have been enslaved by whites for a DAY if anyone had asked the blacks, so it's not like there's some inherent moral superiority in whites.
Moreover, whites would have kept on enslaving blacks longer if they hadn't been engaged in a 5 year war that killed almost half the breeding population before they finally surrendered. They weren't swayed over a three-day discussion with Lincoln at Camp David. Let's be clear.
They weren't even swayed when General Sherman treated Atlanta like one big frat house and then set it on fire on his way out. It took them literally running out of bodies to throw into the fight before they gave up. You kind of have to admire their bravery while holding your nose from the stench of racism.
And I'm talking on the whole here; there are obviously many many Confederate soldiers who died for their homeland and didn't see it as slavery vs. non-slavery. But the ones in power did. And they were the ones sending the younger ones off to die.
Anyway you say ridiculous things. I don't want to make this about race. I want to make it about making the birther argument go the way of slavery in this country.
Speaking of which, you asked where I lived and guessed east coast. As usual, you're 3,000 miles off. I've said where I live. California, in the Bay Area.
(piffffiitttt)
"Not that there is anything wrong with that!" ~ Jerry Seinfeld
http://idannyb.files.wordpress.com/2008/08/jerr...
I assure you....the black on black slave trade is alive and well.
It's not a red herring ... it's just uncomfortable for you.
Yak yak yak ...if whites only did this, if blacks had only been asked, if the 5 year war...dying for slavery...blah blah blah.
It's called history. Stop trying to rewrite and re-read it.
You say I say ridiculous things!
From where I sit your logic has me gagging.
.... But I'll accpet the compliment!
I'm inspired by the ridiculous antics of our new POTUS.
Even his TOTUS (Teleprompter Of The United States) committed suicide over Obama's bizarre ideas.
BREAKING NEWS: Obama inherited broken teleprompter from George W Bush!
Frankly, I can't wait what the forces at work against Obama are going to bring forth.
It's like smelling a Thanksgiving Day turkey...that first wisp of cooking fleah.
(Or in your case...tofu)
The mounting pressure must be enormous.
It was much more embarrassing last year, when they were trying to shout "redistributionerist."
Or just this last month as they tried to warn us of the horrible evils of "empathy." And what does empathy mean, exactly? "Um, it means like, when you're choosing a decision and it, um, minorities, ... you know, I'm not going to tell you 'cuz yer in the tank."
Socialism is when the government owns ALL the means of production. Not a stake in a few banks. ALL means of production.
Socialism is not simply taking money from some people and giving it to other people.
Too bad Sarah Palin's not going to be around as Gov. of Alaska, because she could have actually helped educate us. Alaska is the closest thing to socialism we have here. The residents each receive a check from the government just for being residents. They get the money for it by taxing oil companies. In fact Palin doubled the amount of money each resident receives, making it over $3,000 per resident.
I don't see how she got away with crying "Socialist" at every rally. Except, of course, that she never held a press conference. And no one brought it up in the "liberal media." Go figure.
But if she ever runs for office again, she'll hear about socialism. No one will notice, because they'll all be screaming "QUITTER."
Still, it would be nice if the right wing would educate itself before spouting buzzwords.
By whom? The Bush Justice Dept. when he became a Senate candidate?
The Bush Justice Dept. when he became a Presidential candidate?
Somehow, someway, the Republican White House that spies on American citizens failed to dig up sufficient dirt on a Muslim foreigner who pals around with domestic terrorists? You keep working that angle. Sounds promising to me.
Oh, you said "vetted" and may have been talking about candidates' opposition research, as opposed to the background checks that the Justice Dept. and FBI do for all federal officeholders and certainly the President.
So you're saying McCain and Clinton are to blame for failing to dig up enough bullshit about Obama? You didn't get enough vetting of Obama from them? Hell, they not only vetted HIM, they vetted Wright, Ayers, Alinsky, Pfleger, Soros, and some guy named Joe the Unlicensed Tax-Dodging Plumber Who's Really Named Samuel.
Get a grip!
I can picture our laid back president sitting at his desk, being told about another lawsuit, knowing that he is Constitutionally a "natural born citizen", and telling his legal team to go ahead and let the judges handle it, he's too busy with REAL problems. REALLY..... why SHOULD he show a birth certificate when his mother was born in AMERICA! Read your Constitution and amendments! If you don't like it, why don't you all move to Texas and secede the union?
1. Show Us The Birth Certificate
2. Give us our country back
3. Birther Czar Rafiki says:
http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j18/Navigator...
2. It's a democracy, when you lose the other side executes a different agenda.
very simple
http://www.usconstitution.net/consttop_citi.html
Why the big fuss over the birth certificate?? Obama's mother was "a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years" and even though his father "an alien", currently, Title 8 of the U.S. Code fills in those gaps. Section 1401 defines the following as people who are "citizens of the United States at birth" says any one born outside the United States still is eligible to run for President or Vice President. Read it and weep! It doesn't matter WHAT his birth certificate says, he is a "natural born citizen."
With all of the lawyers that ran for president, don't you think this would have been discovered sooner? Especially Hillary, who wanted the presidency more than life! Pleeeeasse GIVE IT UP!
So what is the big deal?
So which hospital was it in Hawaii or Kenya?
There must be finality in all this.
If things were as simple as you say....we wouldn't be having this chat.
I think Obama has described who his father is inaccurately.
Frank Marshall Davis perhaps?.
That would make him an American citizen.
It would put Obama in a rough spot.
We could all put our weapons down is only the president would do the
right thing???
But he won't.
Let MilliJoolz stand as a shining example to the birthers of what they could be like if they'd apply themselves.
The ironic thing is that while a sane, rational, non-frothing-at-the-mouth person like MilliJoolz was not allowed to vote, plenty of birthers were.
No justice, no peace.... Oh wait, our side won the election. Carry on.
Of course it stands for Body Odor as used by the wingnuts. So they are trying to show disrespect.
The key is to think of the world in terms like jujitsu and water. Things are going to happen (water will flow), people will take actions, and you cannot stop them. So what do you do? Use jujitsu and use their momentum against them. Water finds a way to its destination and goes around any and all obstacles without hesitation. Water is soft but given time, it goes right through stone.
Micro: what ordinary people like you and me can do.
If anyone refers to the sitting President in such a juvenile way, it immediately identifies them as someone not to be taken seriously. Which saves me a lot of time I'd otherwise have to spend listening to them or reading their opinions about real issues.
So it is sort of an intellectual water-witch.
Macro: how it may affect national politics.
I think it's just one more distasteful thing that ordinary people will want to steer away from, especially as the election fervor goes (went) away. No one wants to be the guy who's still acting like a drunken fool the day AFTER the big party. And few people want to vote the way that guy votes.
So when ordinary people, who have little intersection with politics in daily life, see such things maybe on the news or online somewhere, it will hopefully turn them off. And they will hopefully notice that everyone saying such things about President Obama just happens to be a Republican.
And maybe that will help some Independents become Democrats. I'm not saying it will drive Republicans to become Democrats, but I do think it could and does make Republicans become Independent. Every Republican who wanted to be a Democrat switched before Obama became President. But some may be finding that they no longer want to be Republican.
Sorry that took so long for me to see.
I've noticed a strange phenomenon about these birthers and people on the right . They try to project their character flaws and prejudices onto anyone that disagrees with them. We are the racists, we are destroying the constitution, we hate freedom, etc. They do this with a straight face and no sense of irony. Are they trained to do this or is it natural for unaware people to behave this way?
While protecting/insulating their own 'transgressors' . See Rachel Maddow's continuing series re: 'The Family' for more on their '"appointed by god" sense of privilege.
Can't do any wrong, cuz (their 'sky) god says it's 'ok'.
These are the same folks who denigrate[d] the native american and tribal cultures of the world as simple and backward while forcing the baby jesus down their throats OR just killing them if they didn't 'sign on'.
“When facism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross.” Sinclair Lewis
“Religion is an insult to human dignity. With or without it, you'd have good people doing good things and evil people doing bad things, but for good people to do bad things, it takes religion.” Stephen Weinberg
“All religions are founded on the fear of the many and the cleverness of the few.” Stendhal
“For seventeen hundred years the Christian sect has done nothing but harm” Voltaire
'an so on' (Kurt Vonnegut)
In every country and in every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot, abetting his abuses in return for protection to his own.
-Thomas Jefferson, letter to Horatio G. Spafford, March 17, 1814
They [the clergy] believe that any portion of power confided to me, will be exerted in opposition to their schemes. And they believe rightly; for I have sworn upon the altar of god, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man. But this is all they have to fear from me: and enough, too, in their opinion.
-Thomas Jefferson to Dr. Benjamin Rush, Sept. 23, 1800
History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of ignorance of which their civil as well as religious leaders will always avail themselves for their own purposes.
-Thomas Jefferson to Alexander von Humboldt, Dec. 6, 1813.
a couple of additional favs:
"A cult is a religion with no political power." — Tom Wolfe. -- "A religion is a cult that succeeded."
"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich." — Napoleon.
and my all time fav:
"Mankind will only really be free, once the last king was strangled with the entrails of the last priest." — Buy at Amazon.comJean Meslier ( -1729), French priest, in a letter he left after his death.
Welcome back, if StephenPerry wasn't a machine, he'd pass the baton. But at the moment he can continue posting from his blackberry whilst water skiing AND preparing a legal brief to be argued before the Supreme Court tomorrow, and if there's time, he's also address the UN with a workable plan for world peace. ;)
Joe
I don't have any spoken-word Grammys and I am not going to be photographed shirtless in Hawaii.
Nor do I plan on giving any anti-war speeches.
I'm just a guy. A guy who scares birthers into thinking he's lurking behind every lamppost, waiting to zap lying doofuses with my "are you sure you wanted to write THAT" Liberal Elitist Ray Gun.
Pete.
--That's the guy at Euro Itchy & Scratchy Land. "Who are you to resist, eh?" I knew there was something good about you, wayout. this makes up for the lack of reparations.
Recap:
Shock stage: Initial paralysis at hearing the bad news.
Denial stage: Trying to avoid the inevitable.
Anger stage: Frustrated outpouring of bottled-up emotion.
Bargaining stage: Seeking in vain for a way out.
Depression stage: Final realization of the inevitable.
Testing stage: Seeking realistic solutions.
Acceptance stage: Finally finding the way forward
(src http://changingminds.org/disciplines/change_man...)
Please birthers, we are not trying to destroy you or the country. Elections have consequences. You're getting bogged in the Denial Stage. Obama is an American. Obama won.
Just get active and produce useful arguments, you're wasting valuable time.
Seriously, does your mother know you wear her pearls when she's at work? You've got to be the biggest queen on this board. I thought it was superpat. But all he did is swear an oath to oppose all that President Obama stands for. You've got him beat by a country mile.
PLEASE GOD tell me how you're protecting this country. If you say that it is by shining your big Truth Ray into the darkness of these comment boards I will be disappointed.
I know it has to be more than that.
Are you one of those "vigilante" people who has taken it upon themselves to spend Sunday afternoons shot-gunning Coors Lights while pretending to defend the U.S. - Mexico border?
Are you a Jedi Knight regardless of whether you're attending a Star Wars or Star Trek convention?
Do you belong to your local neighborhood watch?
Do you serve food to members of the Coast Guard when they're off-duty and wander into your employer's restaurant?
I know it's got to be a doozy. Please do tell.
stephenperry...you're fellow minions seem to have high regard for your mental disease but I simply see you as just another swept up by the Obama persona.
Your types are all cookie cutter molds gifted at insulting the opposition without providing any sound logic to why Obama's Stimulus is not working.
It was never supposed to work. It's is a failed ideology. It is only gleans the party with power and makes the people indebted to the state.
Your ideology is high on color. You are the true racists. You see a black man and it's over.
Never mind the words and the meanings behind the words.
Throwing a country under the bus you are.
All glitz and no substance.
ALL his ideals are counter to the American way...except guns and ammo..which despite his best efforts his ideology has caused records sales of both.
Libs consistently makes this out to be a black issue.
IT'S NOT!!
It is ideological. Obama wants to take from the wealthy and give to the poor.
He wants to redistribute wealth. He wants nationalized health care.
This is terror.
Basically, he wants to lower the human condition to that found in slaves.
We become Obama's chattel
How ironic.
I don't want his safety net.
I don't want the wealthy to pay more than their fair share.
I want an across the board tax rate of 8% of sales. No more...regardless of income.
I don't want the poor to benefit from the sweat of another's brow.
I want an opportunity to succeed or fail in life...not a guarantee.
I don't want the poor to get handouts without effort.
I don't want the illegals to have opportunity in America.
I don't want an Appeaser in Chief.
I don't want Government Motors
I don't want Acorn telling home lenders what they will do.
I don't want Community Reinvestment Act and all the liberal pork attached to it to survive another day.
I want a free country.
Limited government.
I don't want the government to help with things beyond the constitution. Healthcare is way off base.
Shovel Ready Projects create slaves not prosperity.
I want the rule of law enforced in a timely fashion.
I want spending bills read and understood before a vote
I want people to be able to use their property as they see fit and not stolen by the government for the next crazy idea coming down from on high.
I want life in the womb respected.
Marriage is between a man and a woman.
Freedom is not free and musty be defended every single day.
Liberalism is The Enemy Within. You and your liberal socialistic friends are an enemy of the state and an enemy of mine. But unlike the foe of America you people can't make up your mind about....I'm not interested in slitting your throats or inflicting pain.
It a war of ideas.
Our nation is dying under Obama's stewardship.
You are part of the problem.
I can accept it for now.
This just in this morning:
"""A controversial suit brought by a U.S. Army reservist has been joined by a retired Army two-star general and an active reserve Air Force lieutenant colonel."""
Despite all your name calling, jabs and holier than thou attitude....you have hitched a ride on the coat tails of a Usurper.
He will bring America only pain.
Your liberal ideology broth America to Obama.
Obama was an entity of corruption and would not have been elected were it not for thre corruption of liberalism...a mental disease attacking our nation.
WHERE'S THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE, OBAMA?
And I'm not responding to anything at all that you say until you explain how EXACTLY you are "protecting" the entire nation as referenced in the quote I took from your post.
But I will say two things that are really meant for other readers:
1 - Bitching about why the stimulus isn't working is asinine. First, it IS working. There's money flowing out and money being spent and jobs being created. Second, it's a 2 year plan and you're only a few months into it. So just concentrate on taking care of you and yours, and if the stimulus doesn't work in 2 years, bitch and complain THEN.
2 - Neither I nor Navigator want the wealthy to pay "more than their fair share." I just don't think most people are realistic about what that means. And I have no idea why he would even say that. For what it's worth, I would bet my dogs and cats that I make more money than Navigator7. In fact I bet I made more than him in every year since 2000, when I graduated from law school. But I'm not the one bitching about taxes. It's like when Joe the Unlicensed Tax Dodging Plumber started all that socialist nonsense even though he would have been much better off under Obama's tax plan than McCain's. All these Republicans bitch about paying higher taxes but hardly any of them make six figures, let alone a quarter of a million.
Taxes pay for infrastructure and other things that EVERYONE needs. Soldiers. Nurses. Teachers. Clean water. War. Oh wait. Only Republicans need that. And they try to slip the cost through in a supplemental bill instead of including it in the actual budget, as Obama correctly did. But yeah, Republicans act like they can just fight two wars and cut taxes at the same time. No. You can't. Because it ruins the economy. As it did. A trillion dollars got sucked out of a giant hole. So yeah, the rich have to pay their fair share too.
So, what's a rich person's fair share? Considering how the rich make their money (hint: it's not via a paycheck; it's through collecting rents and selling stock), taxing income from labor isn't merely going to cut it, but that's a good place to start. I understand tax law fairly well. It is incredibly easy to shield income earned from investment from taxes. But it is difficult to shield income earned from labor. So that means the rich get away with not paying taxes and the poor and middle class, whose money comes from a paycheck, hold the bag and look foolish.
Looking at real purchasing power, the poor and middle class pay a much higher percentage of their income in taxes than the rich do. If EVERYONE paid 20%, for example, then we'd have more than enough money to bomb bomb bomb, bomb bomb Iran like McCain wanted, AND give health care to all the Iranians we maimed, let alone every American.
But I don't need to answer the "fair share" question, just to throw the concept out there as something non-asinine that Navigator7 said. Of course, if you asked Navigator what HE thinks the rich should pay, I'm sure I would not agree. Even though, as stated, I doubt seriously that the guy makes squat.
Because how could he? He's protecting the entire country. And soldiers make something like $20,000/year. Which is a NATIONAL SHAME. Speaking of national shame, wouldn't you expect a guy who is protecting the entire country to be too busy to post those long-ass whiny lists of Ways America Has Changed That Make Me Uncomfortable? That's pretty much what all of Navigator7's posts are. Where the hell does he have the time? I mean, I'm just an understimulated liberal lawyer with some weekend free time. I don't need to protect anything but my own house.
I like the part where you are not responding to my childish protests but responded anyway.
1 - "Bitching" in general is what now.....Anti-American?
There is no way on God's green Earth Obama "plan" will succeed.
It's outright THEFT of the fruit of productive Americans.
And you betcha...I want his p[plan to fail like now other because it is criminal and cancer for our country.
2. More textbook liberal playlist. Attack me with no substance. You haven't a clue about me or my history, my work ethic, my morals or my values system yet you attack me personal with insults to what end???. I love it. It shows you are MT.
"2 - Neither I nor Navigator want the wealthy to pay "more than their fair share." I just don't think most people are realistic about what that means. And I have no idea why he would even say that. For what it's worth, I would bet my dogs and cats that I make more money than Navigator7." ~ Stephenperry
Only a liberal would not understand fair share.
3. "So, what's a rich person's fair share? Considering how the rich make their money (hint: it's not via a paycheck; it's through collecting rents and selling stock), taxing income from labor isn't merely going to cut it, but that's a good place to start.""" Stephenberry
Spoken like a true tax and spender. Regardless of how anyone earns a living, a quick witted liberal will confident conclude how another's money should be spent paying taxes. And in the process will somehow add the impression a rich person's wealth is ill-gotten gains from the poor sheeple.
4. "Taxes pay for infrastructure and other things that EVERYONE needs."
"Steph The Liberal" makes the jump and implies Nav thinks no taxes is a goal.
Yet has no problem with Obama spending more of American's dough than all the other presidents combined who came before him.
And you have the Audacity to blame Bush.
How are you going to communicate when the "Blame Bush" is no longer part of your arsenal?
5. ""'Looking at real purchasing power, the poor and middle class pay a much higher percentage of their income in taxes than the rich do.""" ~ Stephenberry
Uhmmmmmm? Errrrr...is this another way to suggest the wealthy do not deserve the money they have earned? Attacking the wealthy is absolutely most punishing on the poor and middle class who you "portend" to help.
I do not believe for one second liberal ideas help American citizens. Rather, liberalism assures a ready supply of "downtrodded" helpless at the hands of rich and wealthy business owners. Our public school system, a vast oasis awash in the liberal mindset assures this as well. You attack the very strength of our country and punish exactly that what puts people to work: The success of others. American Exceptionalism, rugged individualism, American ingenuity puts people to work...Not a president or a party. Lower the tax rates on the wealthy to 8% and government coffers will over flow.
6. """Of course, if you asked Navigator what HE thinks the rich should pay, I'm sure I would not agree. Even though, as stated, I doubt seriously that the guy makes squat.""" ~Stephenberry
More proof of the disease affecting the liberal mind.
Stephenberry seriously doubt I make squat. So this must mean the values of my words are based upon my income?
The more money I make the more value my words carry. The less I make...well you get the idea.
How profound Stephenberry!! So....Does that mean the soldier questioning Obama's qualifications has no right as his reasoning ability is hampered buy his income?
How much money should a soldier earn before they have the right to question whether their Commander in Chief is really a USURPER IN CHIEF???
7. """ I mean, I'm just an understimulated liberal lawyer with some weekend free time. I don't need to protect anything but my own house.""" ~ Stephenberry
Locks exist because you guys do a piss poor job. Want to ruin a civilization? Deny justice to the common man.
SHOW US THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE!
I've endured a lifetime of groaners watching the outcome ...or should I say byproduct of court proceedings.
The NJ Fire Fighters and Sotomayor for example.
Just another minor area where we disagree.
Everything is at stake. Obama has no faith in the average American because the average American is a victim. Destroying wealth and the wealthy along with individualism gains party strength.
It's right down Saul Alinsky and Bill Ayers playbook.
And I just love how you trouble yourself with how much time I have on my hands.
On the bright side, when America goes socialist at least there won't be any calls for lawyers. Justice will be dispensed as the state sees fit.
Perfect harmony!
When we go socialist
The only thing you said in your whole post that was remotely true was when you referred to me as a "quick-witted liberal."
Whoever can point out something else that is factually true in that diatribe gets a pink jelly bean.
See, people, this is why I showed you his stupid long-ass whiny post.
He bitched and moaned through about 600 words of nonsense but never once addressed the only issue anyone gives a shit about when it comes to him:
WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY SAYING "YOU CAN HAVE THE COUNTRY BACK WHEN I'M DONE PROTECTING IT", doofus?
What...have you guys banned me now????
ROTFLMAO
"guns and ammo..which despite his best efforts his ideology has caused records sales of both."
the uptick in guns and ammo sales is DIRECTLY attributable to a very small minority of VERY frightened little people retreating into what they (mistakenly) perceive as a 'defensive stonghold', weaponized reich-wing rhetoric.
I beg to differ, buddy.
Your response is fear incarnate.
Fleet Admiral Isoroku Yamamoto, advised the military junta that ruled Japan that attacking America by a landing force was an impossible task because "there would be a rifleman behind every blade of grass."
The fact that our citizens are armed has saved our bacon three times now:
The Revolutionary War - won on these soils
The War of 1812 - Won on these soils
World War Two - Won on foreign soils, thanks to the "riflemen behind every blade of grass".
The fact is American are simply not going to put up with this socialistic BS assaulting us nearly every single day.
Most of us are quiet.
There will be an activating incident.
Our Obamanation has just about touched the last nerve.
Peace is not going to last.
And you know what...It's going to go apeshit right in the heart of Bluesville because the very people you expect to pay for Faith Hope and Change are leaving!
I'll give Obama his due. he's doing what he said he would do. What I don't accept and challenge is the ideology of those such as the posters here who support Obama and his ideology.
Yours is a cancer to our nation.
Sorry, I can't produce the type of fluent individual personal attacks the rest of you are so adept at due to the fact I am a conservative, bible toting, gun clinging neocon who feels pity for your baal worshipping liberal disease.
Thanks in advance for all the personal insults directed my way.
'I'll be here all week!'
Sounds like a thinly veiled threat of armed insurrection to me. This assumes you 'American(s)' are going to grow a pair, instead of just 'sounding off' like you had a pair.
"Most of us are quiet."
Agreed! Anonymous, Chickensh*t ChickenHawks to be totally accurate.
"There will be an activating incident."
Do tell! Any plans? Or, just more bible-totting, gun-clingling chickensh*t chickenhawk 'squawking'. We (and when I mean 'we' I mean the me and the Secret Service/ATF) are 'detail' lovers. Do share. or, are you just saving that for your 'secret' communications (ha ha ha, not since BushCo changed the rules AND Obama isn't in ANY rush to change them) with your freeper/912/nazi buds?
baal huh ? cool old testament reference.
"The land of Canaan was devoted to the worship of Baal. The Semitic word Baal means "lord" or "master" and the Canaanites believed that Baal was in absolute control over nature and over people. They believed that the only god who was superior to Baal was his father El, but Baal was the principal deity of the land. It was he who was in charge of the rain and the weather, and man's survival was dependent upon Baal's provision."
a) i don't worship any of your/their 'sky gods' , i'll leave that to you little-brain (after)'birthers'. whatever keeps you simple fu*kers busy for an extra hour or so 1x week and maybe helps keep you little-brains from stealing, raping, pillaging, and murdering is fine with me. if all it takes is the 'promise' of a 'hell' and/or eternal damnation. good.
b) as old testament gods go, a rain and weather deity seems like a pretty good choice to worship given the move to a grain based agricultural society, given the knowledge base at the time, YOUR ancestors (assuming they aren't all No European/Nazis) probably worshiped him too.
You ChickenSh*t ChickenHawks buckbuckbuckBUCKAW aren't the only ones (supposedly) armed to the teeth, trained in weapons and tactics and keeping a watchful eye. Difference is, I/we volunteered for service, have combat cred, and, will not be just 'talking the talk'.
btw, I've already 'tagged' a FL freeper and a WI wack job for overt threats to Obama (May and June), but, I'm o'fer July, wanna make it a hat trick ?
I'd rather be declared batshit crazy by a bunch of anemic liberals than be welcomed into the fold via the content of my posts.
Insults coming from individuals who helped elect a president that is making Jimmy Carter look great means a lot to me.
"""I contend that for a nation to try to tax itself into prosperity
is like a man standing in a bucket and trying to lift himself up by
the handle. -----Winston Churchill"""
http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j18/Navigator...
a) there is no (sky) god
so
b) him and his 'soul'? fu*k him, and the rest of his treasonous batsh*t crazy, shallow end of the gene pool, fly over comrades.
Now, who was it that was accusing liberals of playing the race card?
If I let you get out of here and only call you a "dumbass," then you should consider that you got off lucky. Because I didn't even quote your ridiculously stupid post in its entirety. But the part I did post is more than sufficient to call you a dumbass.
And a racist.
And I didn't make casy123 say that stupid shit. I certainly didn't make Navigator7 say that he's defending the fucking country.
My god you people are comical.
I went out for a while and thought I'd come back and see if I missed anything. I didn't. You're still stupid. And yet you're simultaneously ridiculously arrogant. Arrogance and stupidity do not mix well. See, e.g., Bush, George W.
FTW
http://buzznewsroom.com/politics/obama-1961-bir...
Would have been a real back-to-the-future thing for someone back in 1961 to put that announcement in the paper, somehow knowing this baby would be running for president of the U.S. some day.
Also here and other places
http://wikileaks.org/wiki/Obama_1961_birth_anno...
And here and other places
http://thebruceblog.wordpress.com/2008/12/04/vi...
And yet he's hiding something?
The only thing he's hiding is his disdain for stupid people like you. He does a better job than I do. But then, I'm not running for election. You're really stupid. Or at least you say really stupid things.
Let me lay it out for you, Obama was born in Kenya. Immediately after he was born, his mother took a Virgin Airlines flight directly to Hawaii with money given to her by George Soros and Saul Alinsky. Because it was obvious that this small black child would someday run for President, it was important that she bribe the Hawaii state department of health into filing a birth certificate listing his birth in Honolulu. She also got ACORN agents who were working undercover at two different local newspapers to run phony birth announcements.
corrrrecct, hmmmmmmmmm, korect oh well. big bucks huh?
Besides there are actually only 49 states since Hawaiis admission into the union was never ratified.
There is an affidavit published on the highly credible web site World Nut er Net Daily by Reverend Kweli Shuhubia (real name withheld to protect him from Obama nijas) that Berrys grandmother said in a phone interview that Obama was born in Kenya. (ignore the you tube video of the complete conversation, it is as fake as the moon landing)
Besides techdude (not his real name) studied the birth certificate and stated that if he was an expert he would conclude the document was fake. As sood as he gets his GED he plans to reexamine the document.
It made kids want to go to school and learn things. Made them think they could be something special.
Damn fake moon landing! You ruined Real America!
It should be quite apparent that if he did NOT fall under this classification, there would have been many constitutional scholars, especially those who are Republicans, that would have written about it and made it public knowledge WELL BEFORE the election. After all, it has been known for quite some time that President Obama's father was from Kenya.
His mother, an American, gave birth to him on August 4, 1961 in Honolulu, Hawaii, which is in the United States of America, thereby giving him what LIKELY falls under the classification of a NATURAL BORN citizen status.
The problem is, no clear-cut definition of that term exists. What the founders meant by "natural born" has been interpreted to mean "anyone who acquires citizenship by any means other than naturalization," but there have been other interpretations as well.
*+*+*+*+*
"The term "natural born Citizen" has never been defined by the Courts in the course of a Presidential qualification challenge."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural-born_citizen
*+*+*+*+*
What many people either don't know, or have overlooked, is the fact that CONGRESS ITSELF is not clear on what the definition is. There is at least one bill introduced that was sponsored by Senator Don Nickles seeking clarification of the term "Natural Born Citizen." The last hearing on it was held on October 5, 2004:
*+*+*+*+*
"A bill to define the term "natural born Citizen" as used in the Constitution of the United States to establish eligibility for the Office of President." (See #79. S.2128)
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/?&Db=d108...))
*+*+*+*+*
But if there was a REAL PROBLEM with President Obama having one parent who was not an American citizen, don't you think John McCain and Hillary Clinton would have been all over that? And if not them, surely there would have been scholars, and educators, and other politicians who were opposed to Candidate Obama and his proposed policies that would have proclaimed LOUDLY and PUBLICLY that he was ineligible to seek the office of President of the United States of America.
There have been lawsuits brought by individuals questioning his legitimacy that have not only been dismissed, but their claims have been discredited as well... one of them spotlighted by none other than WND.com itself, a site that supports the "Birthers":
http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.printable&...
(notice that claims of the Obama Camp putting out a bogus birth certificate are also disproven there)
Another point of contention is whether or not President Obama lost his citizenship if he was adopted by Lolo Soetoro. Being adopted by a foreign national does not make one lose their American citizenship, though I've not had the time to locate the proper governmental link that supports this. If you read the article at the link above, though, there is verification of this from undisclosed "citizenship experts."
Here is what it states (from link above):
"Also, consulting citizenship experts contend that if Obama indeed obtained Indonesian citizenship, it simply would not have been recognized by the U.S., but the presidential candidate would retain his American citizenship."
If anyone has another link to an Authority Site that confirms this (government, not news media, blogs, or personal sites), please post it here.
Hope this helps some people to gain a bit more clarity on this issue.
Unfortunately, given the impassioned comments in several sites that have written about this "Grand Conspiracy" (and that's what it would have to be), it's unlikely those who have made up their mind will be inclined to embrace the facts.
But there is still hope.
Seriously, femmekat, thanks for providing facts. Unfortunately, as with all conspiracy theories, all facts that disprove the conspiracy theory are instead taken by the conspiracy theorist to be nothing more than evidence that the conspiracy is bigger and more complex than previously suspected.
All the same, those of us who are not conspiracy theorists appreciate having the primary source material so readily available. Thanks.
The barricades they've constructed in their minds to protect them from seeing anything other than what they want to see are like impenetrable fortresses.
Too bad. Their distortions, delusions, and toxic emotions are not healthy for them, or for the rest of the country.
But thanks for checking out what I posted. You are probably one of the few who actually read it. Everyone else is too busy looking for posts that verify their Big 'Ole Conspiracy Theories.
"...the only plausible definition of an undeniable U.S. citizen is the birthers' definition of "natural born citizen" -- a U.S.-born individual whose parents are both U.S. citizens,"
and...
"According to the birthers' understanding of history and law, if his father was not a U.S. citizen, President Obama cannot be a Constitutional natural born citizen, regardless of where he might have been born."
and...
"Mr. President, you are being asked to show, beyond reasonable doubt, that you are eligible to hold the office that you are currently holding..."
and...
"If you cannot or will not show the Court, beyond reasonable doubt, that you are eligible to be President, this Court has the power and the authority to remove you from office."
So the birthers believe their interpretation of the Constitution enables them to take legal action and enforce their version of the law?
It is sad, and a bit scary to see so many frantic people deluding themselves into believing they can remove from office our LEGALLY ELECTED PRESIDENT.
They are blinded by their hatred and their perception of righteousness.
Very sad.
I hope they will be able to channel their disappointment and negative emotions into more productive activities, because there is no way in hell that President Obama will be removed from office, unless he is voted out in 2012, or reaches the end of his second term in 2016.
If you're still going strong, then flip to ANY REPUTABLE ONLINE SITE and read about the stupidity of the birther argument.
That would be quite a day's work.
but they are doing something a bit new. Femme downstairs came onto the blog with a post that obviously took some time to put together. So, she earns trust but then the paid bloggers gently bash and they giggle, and then she's in. Poof! Starts bashing everyone else just like the other paid bloggers do. Watch out for Femme. She's still questionable.
WHERE IS THE LONG FORM BIRTH CiRTIFICAoeTE? OOOPS!
You didn't forget how to use your computer. Never learning how to think isn't the same thing as forgetting how to type.
Anyone that does not agree the Obama is a space alien in a paid blogger. The get paid in russian dollars by the ICC. (International Commusist Conspiracy)
Also the entire Hawaii Department of Health Records and the Governor of Hawaii are on Obamas payroll. Al Gore is working with ACORN to undermine the internet so that you cant get the truth about the aliens.
While I don't regard them as misguided, I do regard them as stupid.
I believe they know what they are doing, so they are not misguided. This is why I often tell them "you don't believe the nonsense you are spewing" or something like that. I believe they say these things without believing them with an ulterior purpose.
Most often that purpose is purely to vent the frustrations of their hurt inner racist children.
But sometimes they actually intend for their actions to have consequences.
Most often they just want to take up time and space that will (they hope) draw resources away from liberal causes, while drawing a spotlight on the issue, so that they can feel powerful. They may actually hope this will become some sort of distraction for President Obama and his administration as they try to accomplish things on their agenda, but I find that unlikely.
The Congressmen who signed this stupid bill are the only ones who could plausibly have that motive, but it is far more likely that the Congressmen just want to get their names in the paper without having to pay for it. There's a lot of money to be made by appeasing the far-right-wing and pandering to the base, and there are a lot of fund-raising dollars to be raised on a lot of rubber chicken circuits. They run in safe districts, thanks to Tom DeLay's re-districting, so the absurdity of their position won't actually cost them anything electorally, though it may hinder their long-term prospects for higher office in any race against the Democrats.
But I think all of them, from the Congressmen down to the people who are so cowardly that they won't even give you a FAKE name on this comment section, are stupid. Make that stoop-id. You'd have to be. You can be stupid and malevolent at the same time.
Actually it's better that you are stupid, if you are malevolent. It would be far worse to go up against these people if THEY were the ones who were Editor-in-Chief at Harvard Law and Obama was the one who went to five colleges in six years to get a journalism degree but still doesn't know what "gotcha" journalism is.
As it is, I think the Prez has it covered just fine. They are, as I've said, good advertising for his re-election campaign. Would you rather vote for the guy who's taking responsibility for everyone else's problems, and perhaps not fixing it as fast as you'd like, or the guy who said nothing and did nothing except blame all of society's problems (even the ones we had before he was born, let alone took office) on THAT guy?
Pretty easy choice.
Otherwise, like I said, spot-on.
STATE OF HAWAII DERTMENT OF HEALTH
HONOLULU HAWAII USA
CERTIFICATE NO. 151 1961-010641
CHILD'S NAME:
BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA ll
DATE OF BIRTH: HOUR OF BIRTH:
August 4, 1961 7:24 PM
CITY, TOWN, OR LOCATION OF BIRTH ISLAND OF BIRTH
HONOLULU OAHU
MOTHER'S MAIDEN NAME:
STANLEY ANN DUNHAM
MOTHER'S RACE:
CAUCASIAN
FATHER'S NAME:
BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA
FATHER'S RACE
AFRICAN
DATE FILED BY REGISTRAR
AUGUST 8, 1961
Did you forget that Obama is the Commander in Chief? He's one of them. They take that shit seriously. Soldiers live by a code of honor. Our brave men and women are out there in harm's way and every single one of them knows exactly who our President is. He came out and swished a three pointer on one trip and repaired America's standing with the Muslim world on the other. And those men and women are going into combat zones and chasing terrorists on his Presidential orders. Get it straight.
Taco Bell and KFC are owned by the same company. If you sue Taco Bell, KFC will not hire you. I don't see what's surprising about that.
"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."
You don't have a black husband. Or a Negro husband. At this point I'm willing to pretend you have a husband.
Even if you did, though, it wouldn't prove the point. Obama's father is not a "Negro" since that term only applies to blacks in America. I would tell you to study the etymology, but then you would just get confused by the word "etymology" so there's no point.
So, even if your mythical husband has a birth certificate, and even if his pretend birth certificate said "Negro" for race, that does not mean Obama's father's race (as opposed to Obama himself, who, being born in America is American and thus Negro) should be listed as anything other than "AFRICAN" given that they did not get into what specific African tribe he was from, et cetera.
But you lie. Racist isn't the first name you were called. Liar was. Yet another lie!
And where's your birth certificate? I have been asking you since yesterday.
I don't work for Obama or anyone else by posting what I do. I certainly don't get paid for doing it.
But if I did, what's it to YOU? I mean, why should you be so personally concerned? You're shrieking "please please please don't respond" in multiple posts! Are you worried that Obama will tax you, and you alone, the $5 dollars or something that a person could make sitting on his ass writing blog comments?
You'd think that you would want Obama to bleed his purse dry paying people to write on his behalf. You'd want him to run out of money and fail. Because you don't want him to be President. I get that part, at least.
But what I don't get is why you're hitching up your petticoats and running around begging people not to respond to me. It's hilarious, but puzzling. I await your response, or re-post or whatever the hell you're going to do. Loser.
If Barry wants to avoid a complete rebellion in the military he should have a MRI done live on Fox News and monitored by netural impartial medical experts like Glen Beck and Sean Hannity!
Hmm. And yet looking back through history the country seems to do better under Democratic Presidents rule then Republicans. Odd.
Looking at recent history as an immediate example.
Did a liberal or democratic president allow 9/11 to happen on their watch while they spent the majority of their time as President clearing brush off their ranch, playing golf, fishing and repeatedly ignoring information that claimed an attack on the states was imminent and might involve planes and high profile buildings?
Did a liberal or democratic president declare war on a country that they had taken great care to claim previously had no WMD but suddenly after 9/11 inexplicably must be invaded immediately becuase they SUDDENLY had WMD yet had not made a legitimate threat against us that has ended up costing the American tax payers 665 billion and 5,000 brave American soldiers lives? When we should have been concentrating on the war in Afghanistan (you know the place the terrorists that masterminded 9/11 are or were actually hiding).
Did a liberal or democratic president take a $236 billion surplus and turn it into the biggest deficit in American history?
Did a liberal or democratic president turn his back on an American city hit by a natural disaster and allow people to die, starve, suffer for days without a proper response and even years after the fact fail to properly address or right the situation? And instead pat the inexperience unqualified for the job friend he appointed to the organization in charge of the emergency response on the back who had previously been in charge or a horse association for the bang up job he did?
Did a liberal or Democratic President reverse the Clinton tax changes (which had raised taxes on the wealthy and lowered them for middle and lower class Americans and resulted in producing one of the longest sustained economic expansion in American history) by giving over the top tax cuts to the richest in America while cutting programs to help middle and lower class families and letting financial institutions pillage without any oversight until the economy collapsed under its own out of control debt and corrupt practices.
Hey.. but the rich are still rich. So its all good. By the way.. were there fewer rich people in the 90's?Were the rich unhappy during the Clinton years? Did they not make money in the 90's, were they declaring bankruptcy and threatening to refuse to make a dime over 250,000 just to avoid that extra little bit of taxes that Clinton imposed on them? Or did they just get way to comfortable with the freebies that buddy Bush was handing out. Isn't there a name republicans like to use for lazy people who enjoy freebies?
"Oh yeah? Well, the liberal guy is black. So that means we need to see more proof that he's not black before this Constitutional crisis can be averted."
Sorry for any correct spellings in the quoted part.
Democratic rule. It has a nice ring don't you think?
Can you describe what it is?
As it stands today democratic rule is a seething cesspool of political leaders who only want one thing: Political power and are willing to work harder than an attorney to get votes.
Lies, deception, corruption and an innate ability to bite the hand that feeds it.
Democrats threw America under the bus during the Iraq war. You are a treasonous bunch.
A $236 billion surplus only existed because of the 104th Congress led by Gingrich.. It's just like a liberal to twist history or ignore history.
And you still use Katrina as a fulcrum to blame Bush and his god-like attack of the poor people of New Orleans living below sea level on the Gulf Coast? New Orleans should be a landfill. Katrina was proof what an idiot nation we have become. Electing Obama underscored it.
Have you stopped using Bush' speech characteristics as a sword against him ever since it was discovered Obama can't talk without a Teleprompter? Did you hear one of Obama's own Teleprompters committed suicide in disgust last week?
Liberals attack on the wealthy and prosperity better stop soon. You are born from the something for nothing crowd. That is why socialism is so appealing to your species.....something for nothing?
If there is one thing that needs to occur is everybody pay their fair share which includes raising the taxes for lower and middle class...as they don't pay squat now!
Wealth Redistribution is not the panacea it's made out to be.
Obama's stimulus is only going to stimulate a much longer recovery ...or riots.
I'll never understand the bassackwards mentality that heaps with contempt our nations problems on the backs of the wealthy.
Liberal's attack on prosperity and the American Way is a mental disease.
It has got to stop!
""""Isn't there a name republicans like to use for lazy people who enjoy freebies?"""" ~Phxgwen
What are lazy people to you? Rich people?
Omama's ideology is wholesale theft of the producers and creators in this nation.
In order to promote his lame agenda he must fist "TAKE" from those who have earned in order to "GIVE" to those......ingrates we believe they are owed something for nothing.
You should be ashamed.
Please, please, please tell me what role YOU believe Republicans played. Including without limitation what role you think the Republican White House, which endlessly beat the war drum and lied at every opportunity (including by having Cheney create his own separate "intelligence agency" when the CIA wouldn't confirm that Iraq had WMD or had any ties to Al-Qaeda.... and whaddaya know? Cheney's intelligence agency found what it needed. Saddam was trying to buy yellowcake from Nigeria. Saddam was trying to buy high-strength aluminum tubes. Who says so? Dick Cheney. Who else says so? Who cares?
But I digress. Please set forth the role of the Republican party in getting us into the Iraq war.
And then don't say anything else. Nothing you say has any relationship to the truth. And if you are still doubting that Bush's Justice Dept. did background checks on Obama, just let me know. I'll send you links to that self-evident information as soon as you provide me the opinion I've requested of you here.
I have developed a Turing test to determine if casey123 is actually a black guy or a dittohead droid. It consists of four questions.
1.The album Hot Buttered Soul was written by ?
2. What is the song on that album with the longest title?
3.What would Bush have been called by black kids in the 1960's ?
4.What would Cheney have been called by black kids in the 1960's ?
If he can answer these questions you will have to cut him some slack.
He believed that the Hillary Clinton primary voters (like myself) would be swayed to the Republican ticket just because he picked a woman. The insult in that assumption was very hard to miss.
And I like your test, but I will be the one to decide whether to cut casey123 some slack. I will only do so if casey123 shows me his or her long form birth certificate. The original.
That's why you have to pay attention to what the slimy underbelly of the Republican Party is up to. That is why I believe in free speech and a marketplace of ideas. I really want to know the unvarnished opinion of the people I have extreme disagreements with politically. Not because I really think they can be persuaded, but so that I will know what they really think. And when one of them says something truly alarming, as they often do, we can be aware of it and hopefully take protective measures if necessary to avert any more needless harm.
damajah,
a) well, there IS a black man and his family in the WH and that IS pissing them off BIG time
and
b) that's your limbic mind' you are referring to (gut instinct) and, interestingly enough, it's the same part of the mind (limbic center) that is driving the (after)'birhters' mad.
Jenine Garofalo was the first I heard mention it and it 'tracks'. This shoe 'fits' these (after)'birthers'.
Fiction: Prove you were born in the US.
Truth: Ok, here is a certified copy of the birth certificate.
Fiction: That doesn't look like my birth certificate so I don't believe you and you blocked some things out before you posted it on the internet . Prove it again.
Truth: Ok, we will bring some people in from a fact check organziation and let them review the document first hand and investigate it with the state of Hawaii.
Fact Check people: It appears by all accounts to be an actual valid birth certificate and our research with the state of Hawaii supports that as well. We deem it valid and authentic.
Fiction: Sorry but that's not good enough for us. We want to hear it from an official.
Truth: Ok.. here is someone in charge of vital records in the state that produced the document.
Truth State Offical: We can verify (since that is our job) that it is an official and authentic copy of a Hawaiian birth certificate and is a valid legal document showing he was born in Hawaii.
Fiction: Sorry that is not good enough prove it more. What about the long form or the "real" certificate on file? Prove its real.
Truth Official: Ok, even though it is not available to the public I can verify that we have reviewed the original live birth certificate on record and we can verify with 100% certainty that the document on file is valid, authentic and clearly states that Obama was born in the state of Hawaii.
Fiction: Sorry that is not enough proof.. because it is simply not what we want to hear and we will not believe you until you tell us what we want to hear.. that it is a fake..cause we just know deep down in our fear driven hearts that he is not American enough to be our President.
Truth Official: Ok, can you stop calling us now in the middle of the night and making veiled threats against us cause we don't know how many times we can tell you the truth and make official statements regarding the validity of a document before you accept the fact that it is a real and valid document. How many times do you need to hear the truth? Security!!!
Fiction: Until this is settled we may be in a constitutional crisis that could end in a civil war!
Truth: Then why don't you just accept all the evidence?
But it's just a ploy: if you give them that one document they'll just toss it on the pile of things they don't care about anymore, and ask for something else. If you launch an investigation they'll call it a whitewash and ask for a real one. If you show them a photo they'll call it counterfeit. That's how conspiracy theories work.
It's all a song and dance to make them look like the good guys and keep repeating their false claims forever.
Remember McCain's rally in Minnesota where that confused-sounding old woman said she couldn't trust Obama because he's an "Arab?" McCain knew that was so bad that he had to take the mic away from her and say "No ma'am. He's not. He's a good Christian family man." (Does that in fact mean that no Arabs are good family men?)
That incident was replayed over and over on tv and it made a lot of independent voters take a hard look at just what the Republican party is about. Most people decided they wanted nothing to do with that kind of ugly racism. And then a few months later, Minnesota voted for the black guy, as did a whole lot of swing states. All of them, in fact.
So while it is tempting to wait for these people to inbreed themselves out of the population, we have to remember to harness the power of their idiocy and use it to generate a light that shines on the ugliness of their views. Can you see how many seats they will lose in 2010 after all the racism and condescension toward Sotomayor? No reasonable person, and certainly no reasonable Hispanic American, could have thought that what they did to her was fair or respectful -- especially considering Democrats have always had the votes to confirm her, so all that stuff was just for show and never had any chance of de-railing her nomination.
So just as with the birthers themselves, the Republican Party writ large has shown that all it cares about, even during this time of national economic and military crisis, is wasting time and trying to embarrass the sitting President and Commander in Chief.
The rest of us have to decide what we will do. Nothing? Point out idiocy wherever it lies? Or some third option that is not clear to me. I choose the second option.
Just so you know I'm Jane Q Birther and a Dem. I loathe all things GWB.
This is not a minor matter by any means. It is a significant Constitutional matter in which this Dem finds extremely important to the safety and freedom of my country.
May I ask you if you've done any research on this matter? Have you read the countless factual articles written by investigators, journalists and countless other informed citizens. Do you really think these individuals would go on the public record and state such claims knowing they can be sued for it? Give me a break!
Why do you wish to continue to divide us as a people? Just b/c we know for a fact that he is ineligible does not give you any permission to retort with such lame spittle (your word not mine). Do me a favor and educate yourself on this matter before you stick your uninformed opinion NOT FACTs into the middle of such a serious matter.
You aren't a Democrat. No Democrat would say anything remotely as stupid as what you said.
You haven't done any "research into this matter." Care to cite any of the "countless factual articles written by investigators, journalists, and other informed citizens?" No? Would that be because there are NO FACTUAL articles written by ANYONE on this subject? Instead, the right-wing lunatic fringe (who I take you to be describing as "other informed citizens") is the only set of people who write about this. No one cites to them, because they're lunatics.
Put it this way. When birthers call right-wing talk radio, the radio hosts SHOUT THEM DOWN and cut them off. Because they know it's stupid. When Fox freakin' News even says "there is no truth whatsoever, zero" to the birthers' claims, (Shep Smith, the beacon of light in the Faux Noise wilderness) you know it's time to pack it in.
"Why do you wish to divide us as a people?" Wow, that's the best example of irony I've seen since my college English seminars. You're over here trying to argue that the President is not the President, during a time of war. You want to ask yourself the question you asked us?
Go back to the shithole you swam out of this morning.
First, see my post upstairs to your taunt and I provide you with the best site on the web that has chronicled the eligibility issue with FACTS since last summer. Read it all. Everything you ever wanted to know about this issue is there.
Btw, it's Democrats like you that gives Democrats like me a bad friggin name. Don't you dare doubt my lifelong work to forward the Democrats plank! How dare you! Who the hell do you think you are? I've managed, volunteered, given money, housed operatives and so much more to support my Party. And for a yahoo like you to insult and degrade my work over 40+ years shows your lack of civility.
Yes, you and your ilk are and have divided us. Do you know why? Because of the way you address people, their thoughts and their opinions. Because they somehow differ from yours they are insulted and bullied by bloggers like you. I didn't work my a$$ off for Dems like you to be so negative and hateful. Grow up! You're destroying MY Party!
Heaps of right-wing propaganda money to perpetuate baseless doubt? What's so hard to believe about that? Seems to be a lot simpler to believe than a grand international conspiracy.
Factual? We're talking about the legitimacy of the State of Hawaii to say who was born there or not. I keep reading 'Constitution this' and 'Constitution that', none of it challenges the legitimacy of the legitimacy that we have set up. If this fraud had the intentions that it says it does, it would be arguing entirely within that framework if only to perfect it for posterity.
Have you read the SCOTUS DISmissal of Phol Berg's (after)birther suit?
First, stop the controversy by providing the Long Form Birth Certificate and not the Certificate of Live Birth which is not a Birth Certificate.
Second, on the Certificate of Live Birth it states that the Father’s race is ‘AFRICAN’. In the 1960’s information it would state for race ‘NEGRO’. To use the term ‘AFRICAN’ someone wants to be politically correct and creating a bogus document.
Provide the long form Birth Certificate and end this.
I have never listened to rush. I make my own conculsion.
He can make all these people shut up about it if he would just show the long form. And do you think he is being diverted? He has had his legal team dealing with this. He isnt doing anything.
Dont start on his school years either. He never showed college records or anything else for that matter. You are talking about a very secretive man who put many of his records under lock and key. Who can blame anyone for wanting to know more? He makes things worse by being so secretive like he is trying to hide something.
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in...
http://www.factcheck.org/about/
About FactCheck.org
Our Mission
We are a nonpartisan, nonprofit "consumer advocate" for voters that aims to reduce the level of deception and confusion in U.S. politics. We monitor the factual accuracy of what is said by major U.S. political players in the form of TV ads, debates, speeches, interviews and news releases. Our goal is to apply the best practices of both journalism and scholarship, and to increase public knowledge and understanding.
The Annenberg Political Fact Check is a project of the Annenberg Public Policy Center of the University of Pennsylvania. The APPC was established by publisher and philanthropist Walter Annenberg in 1994 to create a community of scholars within the University of Pennsylvania that would address public policy issues at the local, state and federal levels.
The APPC accepts NO funding from business corporations, labor unions, political parties, lobbying organizations or individuals. It is funded primarily by the Annenberg Foundation.
Brooks Jackson
Director, Annenberg Political Fact Check
Brooks Jackson is a journalist who covered Washington and national politics for 34 years, reporting in turn for The Associated Press, the Wall Street Journal and CNN. At CNN he pioneered the "adwatch" and "factcheck" form of stories debunking false and misleading political statements starting with the presidential election of 1992. His investigative reporting for The AP and the Journal won several national awards. He is the author of three books: "Honest Graft: Big Money and the American Political Process" (Knopf, 1988); "Broken Promise: Why the Federal Election Commission Failed" (Twentieth Century Fund, 1990); and "unSpun: Finding Facts in a World of Disinformation" with Kathleen Hall Jamieson (Random House, 2007).
Viveca Novak
Deputy Director, Annenberg Political Fact Check
Viveca Novak is a journalist who covered politics and government in Washington for nearly 20 years, reporting in turn for Common Cause Magazine, National Journal, the Wall Street Journal and Time magazine. At Time she was a co-winner of Harvard University's Goldsmith Prize as well as the Clarion Award for investigative reporting into the campaign finance scandals of President Clinton's 1996 re-election campaign. She is co-author of "Inside the Wire" about the Guantanamo Bay detention center (Penguin Press, 2005). She holds an M.S. in journalism from Columbia University and an M.S.L. from Yale Law School.
Idiot!
Why is that no one insisted on birth records, college records, etc when Obama ran for the Senate?? Funny.
I guess that some folks just had to get used to an actual black person in Congress, since there were already a "few" already.
And, pray tell, why did the birth certificate gang morph into the college records gang, etc.?
Do you all want his dental records as well? And I guess that you dismiss school records as being unimportant because they, along with shot records, etc. are necessary to enroll a child in a public school. Lame! Now, to really dignify your efforts, why don't you ask for everyone in Congress to show their birth records, etc. Fair enough?
I am a natural born citizen of the great state of Texas. I grew up during segregation as an Anglo, and witnessed the injustices abound. I was not raised to be prejudiced, but I was taught that it was wrong, and I raised my children to know that prejudice (racism) is for the small minded brain.
But sir, I know a prejudiced mind when I encounter one. In this era, the modern racist has got to think on his/her feet, and deciding that Barack Obama is not a natural born citizen is a very cleaver way to rouse up the typical hatred necessary to stir other "scaries".
There always have and always will be scattered groups of loonies who bestir themselves whenever a "cause" raises its ugly head. Don't you think that President Obama and his advisers know this? Do you think that the President is going to halt his important agendas to dignify the likes of you? You take yourselves as being far too important!
Why don't you decide to actually contribute to society, by joining a community organizing group, helping to improve neighborhoods, like Habitat for Humanity has been doing. Your fellow citizens need you today--right now. Help the homeless, among them so many children who need you. Charities are running out of food donations--why not start a food drive. Spend your spare time volunteering to help the elderly, and the sick.
I spent my entire career in public service, as an educator and counselor. I have seen, first hand the lives that can be turned around, or saved from gangs and drugs. There is nothing more fulfilling than to help your fellow man. We are all our brothers keepers, even our black brothers.
Jackie
1.Show it to, and Post it with the three major news agencies and not some mom n pop web blog site that none had heard of.
2. Not go around spouting that the jpeg is a birth certificate when it is actually a certificate of live birth (big difference between the two). Bound to make people suspicious when you mis categorize the only document you want to show as your proof of your eligibility,
3. Not alter or black out an area on the document when the bottom of the document tells you if you do that it invalidates the said document.Makes people think your hiding something again.
4. Use at least 72dpi when posting a jpeg to the internet(creating such a small scan screams I dont want you to see any details!)
4.(MOST IMPORTANT WAY TO PROVE VALIDITY OF AN ONLINE INTERNET BASED DOCUMENT) Use government protocols for validating an official document via computer generated image. So it will stand up to scrutiny if examined(like he knew it would be).Gee, I would think a Sitting Senator and his staff would know about government protocols for documents and things like that...hmmmm
I have to show 3 proofs of id in person when applying for some government documents,my daughter needed her original BC to play AYSO soccer this year.And the best a candidate for the highest office in the land can produce to prove he meets the eligibility clause in the constitution is that jpeg? My Mom posts better images of the grandkids on the web than that, and she is 73.
So, if all you have to show that Mr. obama meets the qualifications set forth in the Constitution to be President of the United States of America is a fuzzy, unofficial, non government protocol, nebulous jpeg posted on a couple of obscure websites and his say so, I say I want a bit more proof of the man I am entrusting with the nuclear football and my kids future for gosh sakes!!!
Like, oh I dont know, some corroborating evidence to prove where he was born, when did he return and regain citizenship after living abroad, when and how did he obtain a passport to travel to foreign countries in the 1980's, Has he went by more names than barry and barack (he didn't list the name barry on his bar exam as an alias)What is the definition of "Natural born citizen" is it just being born here? If that is the only criteria, why did the founders say you have to be a NBC or citizen at the time of adoption of the constitution if there is no difference between the two,Can you be a NBC if your father was Kenyan and never a citizen and you were a dual citizen at birth as Barack has said... you know those type things...proof other than.... Cause he said so and cause he is smart and good looking and cool. And no other president needed to show anything...bla bla bla. Oh and the racist bs... maybe a few KKK members have joined in but most of us really want to get past race in this country...If Condi Rice or Colon P. would have won (both natural born citizens) I would be as proud as a peacock. Too bad you only could find a good looking, Clean, well spoken (Mr. Bidens words) 1 year senator, with questionable friends( W Aires, the guy who barack launched his senate race with) Rev. Wright, the minister he never in 20 years heard say a racist remark, and a guy with an almost unknown background. He seemed to be able to fly all around the world while in college with no means of support or income. Did he ever have a real job? How did he pay for some of the most expensive colleges in the US when His grades were mediocre and not full scholarship worthy. These are the things that would backup his COLB and prove or disprove his NBC status.
There has been only one person that has come forward and said they were present at barack obamas birth, his Grand mother who said she was there when he was born in Kenya.. and two witnesses have sworn that that statement is true.Not one person has come forward to negate that claim and said they witnessed him being born in the US, NOT ONE!
I believe all recent presidents have shown their medical records and other documents when asked. Mr. Mccain showed his BC and other docs when he revealed he was born abroad( I dont believe he was eligible either by the way, no matter what congress said.)
So Some of us wont blindly follow this man because he said he was eligible and showed us a blurry Jpeg on the internet...that is what freedom is all about....Being able to question our government and not worry about being threatened or called names. Just as the left did with GWB. Look at what happened to the peeps in China that peacefully protested their government. Do you want our country to be like that?
When did the conspiracy begin?
I mean, when did the acts of deception you claim to happened start?
Were these nefarious forces aligned before he was born? And, if so, what made them sure he was Whitehouse-bound?
Please elaborate. We know you're here. Silence will be construed as an admission of defeat.
Please, get some common sense. The media might not want to tell you about everything in those bills, but the conservatives will. Because unlike your politicians, some of us actually read that stuff. And yeah, its kinda scary to see the stuff in the bills so far. Bigger government, more money being taken away from YOU, etc, etc
Again, why would a conservative want to distract anyone from what Obama and Congress are doing? We are the only ones trying to shed light on it.
Who cares who has more money? Does it really matter? Its probably equal anyways. Either way, it will be more than just the rich who will pay for Health Care and Cap n Trade. Common sense tells you that the rich people who give people jobs, will pass their extra taxes and such along to the consumer as well as cut costs further by laying people off and moving even more jobs over seas.
All a result of Obama's agenda. We are in enough hurt not economically, why they want to pass the other garbage down our throats is beyond me.
You just proved that you cannot discern sarcasm.
Now you are proving that you do not understand Reaganomics. See, we tried what you're talking about. Starting in 1980. Even though in the primary debates that year, George H. W. Bush said to Reagan that his plan was "voodoo economics." Poppy Bush is a POS for the Willie Horton ads (and for continuing to follow Reagan's voodoo economics when in office) but he was right about trickle-down economics being a total scam for the rich.
You should be banned from ever trying to discuss what "common sense tells you." Because you have no common sense.
But before you go back into hiding under your bridge (well, the government's bridge), tell us, chuck, just for shits and giggles, what do YOU think the President should do, short of resign from office because you don't like him? DO you have any sort of coherent economic philosophy that has actual application to this generation? Or do you just have a poorly-pieced-together grasp of discarded Republican talking-points from 1980 that haven't been tried out since McCain left the campaign trail?
I bet I know which of those two it is.
Try looking in your mirror and saying 3 times each morning, I love you "kelleyye", I love you "kelleyye", I love you "kelleyye". You'll start liking yourself and stop hating people you believe in your deepest heart are "superior" to you. Try it before you burst into flames and ashes.
When will the racist line end with you libs? Ever? And what exactly have YOU done for minorities? The Dems seem to be the party that minorities like but sadly not all of them have figured out that the liberal agenda isnt to help them, its to make them continue to think they need the government to survive. Continue to think they are victims. Liberals havent dont a damn thing to help minorities over the past couple decades. better watch out, sooner or later they just might figure it out. Then youll be in trouble because their vote, which is all the liberal politicians want, want be guaranteed anymore.
Give it up, you lost.
I mean, come on! Just drop the bag of chips, get out of mom's basement and ACT. Christ on a crutch!
Okubo, who said that she gets weekly questions from Obama ‘Birthers’ that are “more like threats,” explained that the certificate of live birth reproduced by Obama’s campaign should have debunked the conspiracy theories. “If you were born in Bali, for example,” Okubo explained, “you could get a certificate from the state of Hawaii saying you were born in Bali. You could not get a certificate saying you were born in Honolulu. The state has to verify a fact like that for it to appear on the certificate. But it’s become very clear that it doesn’t matter what I say. The people who are questioning this bring up all these implausible scenarios. What if the physician lied? What if the state lied? It’s just become an urban legend at this point.”
“It’s crazy,” said Janice Okubo, director of communications for the Hawaii Department of Health. “I don’t think anything is ever going to satisfy them.”
Okubo, who said that she gets weekly questions from Obama ‘Birthers’ that are “more like threats,” explained that the certificate of live birth reproduced by Obama’s campaign should have debunked the conspiracy theories. “If you were born in Bali, for example,” Okubo explained, “you could get a certificate from the state of Hawaii saying you were born in Bali. You could not get a certificate saying you were born in Honolulu. The state has to verify a fact like that for it to appear on the certificate. But it’s become very clear that it doesn’t matter what I say. The people who are questioning this bring up all these implausible scenarios. What if the physician lied? What if the state lied? It’s just become an urban legend at this point.”
Hawaii is a state. It's not a foreign counrty. Any one of these birthers could travel to Honolulu, drive up to the DHHS offices and obtain a copy of the birth certificate. Of course, it would look just like the one everyone has seen.
Best post of the year:
"Try applying for a passport or a Federal job and send them a photograph of your birth certificate posted on a website."
Hmmm. A passport, like the one President Obama has and used this month to travel abroad? A Federal job, like being U.S. Senator, which President Obama was? Or U.S. President, which he is? That's a Federal job.
Dumbass. Epic fail!"
Oops, that's not a silly rumor, its true. Guess it doesn't qualify after all.
Mahalia?
Wait, wait, that can't be right...
That's what the people need to know. Never mind how much it cost to wire the entire town of Crawford and turn a ranch into a Presidential fortress with secure broadband connections. I'm sure that was just a few dozen million dollars. Chump change.
I wanna know how much the Broadway show tickets cost! Never mind how much we're going to be paying for the next 20 years for Bush's war of choice in Iraq, fought purely to finish what Poppy Bush started.
No sir. Americans should not sit idly by and watch a President spend any money trying to date his own wife. There are plenty of Other Women around. Mark Sanford and John Ensign can only handle so much traffic between them.
Not an American state like Hawaii, but a U.S. territory that was only technically U.S. soil at the time and has sense been returned to Panama. In other words, he was born in a place that we were leasing from another country.
Why no cries of "not a citizen" on this? Yes, his father was in the military, but a much stronger case could be made that this does not qualify him as "natural born" then all the crazy legalities pitched by the anti-Obama birthers.
As for that birth certificate.....these people would cry "fake" if Moses went to Mt. Sinai and brought back a copy of Obama's birth certificate carved on a stone tablet.
There wouldnt be anymore lawsuits if he showed the proof he needs to show. He hasnt. And if you has any clue, you would know McCain was born on a military base, his family was in the military. Oh and guess what Cathy? Congress held hearings to determine his eligibility. But NOOOOO, cant do that to Obama.
I don't have any problem with McCain's eligibility, I just want to know what the hell you people would accept as proof? Not a birth certificate issued by the state of Hawaii, obviously. What would you accept as proof? The answer, of course, is nothing!
"Ok on proof of certificate??? Put it on the net for FREE???"
It's been there for more than a year, cracker. "Buh-buh-buh it's a fake/forgery/etc." Yeah sure cracker.
It's the best advertising Democrats could buy. Republicans are 20% of the country, and less than 5% of Republicans believe any of this birther nonsense.
NONE of the rest of the country believes it. They instead see it as the death throes of racists who cannot accept that the President is black.
It would be very difficult, and very expensive, for Democrats to make political ads that trash the opposing party's stupidest-yet-most-vocal element. But the birthers are doing it for free.
More to the point, every day one of these clowns is on television, every day that Ensign/Sanford/Vitter do not step down for adultery even though they all demanded that Clinton step down, is a day when Republicans cannot claim to be the party of morals, family values, decency, or respect.
And aren't Republicans always up in arms about showing deference to the Commander in Chief during a time of war? Haven't we been at war since before President Obama took office? Doesn't that mean that these birthers and the Congressmen who enable them are showing an inexcusable lack of respect for our supreme commander at wartime, when hundreds of thousands of our best soldiers are in harm's way?
I really want to see these dolts insult our President to his face, or in front of the military that is HONORED to serve under his command.
You know, I really despised President Bush. I could not think of one policy he had that I liked. But once the Supreme Court installed him in office, I never doubted that he's our President or that as such he is entitled to a generous measure of my respect. I was taught that you respect the uniform if not the man wearing it.
The right-wing crowd is always so gung-ho about the rule of law and respect for the military and unitary executive this and that. Turns out it's all just hot air from them. Big surprise.
Is it possible that some of the conspiracy theorists don't know that President Obama is named after his dad, and they are getting the two confused? In other words, are they crazy paranoids, or are they just stupid?
Let's face facts; if Obama were O'bama the Irish President we wouldn’t be having this conversation. The fact that he’s Black scares the hell out of these racists, and make no mistake about it, that is exactly what they are.
During the campaign there was some question as to McCain’s citizenship giving the fact he was born in Panama. Yet know one asked to see his proof of citizenship. The state of Hawaii has provided proof and there is no reason to believe there is a conspiracy on the part of the Hawaiian government. If you thought there was such a conspiracy then you would have to believe that they new that Obama would run for President some day and concealed his real birth place to further that cause. GIVE ME A BREAK!
The bottom line is you’re never going to satisfy the folks, so the best thing to do is ignore them. No news reports, no newspaper articles just simply ignore them. There is noting to prove and they will never prove their theory. They have noting to say that is fact based.
My challenge to these folks is to produce proof of their citizenship. And no matter how many times they show me the document(s), I won’t believe them. I just don’t believe any of them are true citizens. After all they’ve told us time and time again, document can be forged by anyone.
Goering and Limbaugh have the same body styles...obese. Both smoked cigars....both share Fascist views.
Find something real to worry about...
… Shays argued that had more members of Congress, including Republicans, gone to Iraq and visited Abu Ghraib, prisoner abuses would have come to light sooner.
"That would have alerted the administration to what was happening, the command authority to what was happening and it probably would have saved a 1,000 lives," Shays said.
Shays said the Bush White House abused its powers in a way that resulted in many of the domestic and international problems that have unfolded recently.
"This past Republican Congress hurt this administration by not having some hearings," said the Connecticut Republican. "Had we had hearings it would have nipped those problems in the bud."
Mickey Edwards (R-Okla.) was even more critical.
He mocked members of Congress when it came to flexing their constitutional oversight authority.
In particular, he lamented the House Republican lawmakers' unified opposition to holding hearings to investigate the firing of U.S. Attorneys by the Bush White House.
"One of the most shocking things was when the House voted to hold [Counsel Harriet] Miers and [Chief of Staff Josh] Bolten in contempt because they refused to obey a congressional subpoena," said Edwards.
"Every single member of my party, except for three, walked out. Members of Congress walked out of the chamber rather than stand up as members of Congress so that congressional subpoena (would) be obeyed. Party trumped Constitution."
It is more strange that it IS an known fact that John McCain was NOT born in America. Why weren't the birthers up-in-arms about his birth?
Answer: RACISM plain and simple racism. One way or another, we are going to get that n****r out of office.
And, for the record johndk7, the fact of the matter is that the Health Department of the state of Hawaii stands by the assertion that Obama was born in Hawaii... that's good enough for me. Not that I was concerned to begin with, but their spokeperson is right... she could drive to your house with 53 pieces of documentation proving it, take you out to lunch to convince you, and you would still throw on your tinfoil hat and claim it was all a scam.
Constitution of the United States, Article II, Section 1, Clause 5:
No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.
Black's Law Dictionary, Sixth Edition: "Natural born citizen. Persons who are born within the jurisdiction of a national government, i.e. in its territorial limits, or those born of citizens temporarily residing abroad."
George Romney presedential candidate in 1968, born in Chihuahua, Mexico; parents were U.S. citizens so he was a natural born citizen.
John McCain presedential candidate in 2000 and 2008 born in Panama; his father was stationed in the service, also "natural born"
What do you have left? An international conspiracy 40 years in the making?
How much time did you waste on this issue?
What will you complain about now?
1) The original document as released is acceptable evidence in a federal court of law.
2) 'Birthers' do not accept document as evidence.
One must either conclude that 'Birthers' do not accept the more common legal, ethical, or intellectual processes/outcomes, or that their goal is to create an atmosphere that makes political discourse impossible.
Why do you assume these people will absorb information and alter their views?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linda_Lingle
When is he going to give us the proof that he isn't? His word doesn't mean anything nor does the fact that he's married. I want written proof from a reliable source in the government that he isn't gay.
Can you prove he's not?
Did you also know that Cheney's maternal grandmother was black? It is hushed up for the conservatives. Can you prove me wrong? And do you think I will believe you?
This isn't a conspiracy theory. It is looking like cover-up at very high levels. Really, it is just a widely asked and simple question that needs an answer. And if it is so obviously frivolous, ridiculous and silly, well then why not prove it so and produce the long form BC? We aren't trying to get him to release proof of the existence of Big Foot. We are asking for a copy of the original hospital generated piece of paper that Hawaiian officials claim to have in their vault. Isn't this the very reason why "all 57 states" of the union have adopted a policy of keeping birth records?
Apparently the State of Hawaii has in the past been pretty loose and sloppy with issuing birth records, with little follow-up investigation and even less dedication to accuracy or certifications that their silly rules were followed. Since this COLB of Obama's was allegedly provided by Hawaii to his campaign just last year, he must have been using another copy of it or some other birth record in the past, to get into school, get a passport, get a driver's license, pass a security background check for being a US senator etc. (As the anti-birther's have repeatedly pointed out.) So I'm wondering WHAT DOCUMENT he has been using all this time, what is on it and WHERE it is. It couldn't be this one they have "produced" on the web. It would have to be something much older. So, where do you suppose IT is? Why didn't he just show a copy of that one on his websites? Doesn't anybody else wonder about that? And where is the actual paper copy of this alleged COLB that is repeatedly touted as his proof now? I mean, the one that was supposed to have been scanned, and photographed and posted on his sites. Will any third party document experts ever bee allowed to analyze that one. I doubt it. Very fishy smelling.
Never bothered any of you to check up on Bush Jr who might not have been born in the US or McCain who was definitely not born in the US (Panama). If you're white, you're A-OK!
Psst randwulf...your racism is showing.
By your logic, if you can call him black because he's half black, I can call him white because he's half white.
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in...
I supposed you dont like the outcome of elections. If you were so concerned about election rigging you should have been up in arms about Bush and Florida in 2000 and the Voting Machine Fraud in 2004.
Please stay away from electrical outlets in the future
All you need to know is that EVERY COURT THAT HAS EXAMINED ANY OF THIS HORSESHIT HAS COME TO THE SAME CONCLUSION: It's sheer, utter hogwash, and our President needs to do nothing more about it... no school records, no photo of the 'vault copy' of his birth records, NADA.
The Supreme Court of this nation, the same court that decided that Bush won the 2000 election, REFUSED TO EVEN HEAR THE CASE. That means they believed it had no merit whatsoever. Get it? The Chief Justice, a lifelong conservative, swore Mr. Obama in. There's nothing being hidden. No conspiracy. Swamp gas; that's all.
Either accept the hard, provable fact that the President was born in Hawaii, and remain the above-delineated pinhead, or join the sane, law-abiding world.
At that time I would be glad to personally, publicly declare you a non-pinhead, and fully retract my statement.
And as for ad hominem attacks being a "lefty" thing, consider how many wingnuts attack the fact of global warming by pointing out that Al Gore is a doofus.
The Right Wing doesn't have a TOTAL monopoly on ad hominem fallacies, hate-mongering, racism, hypocrisy, immorality, and corruption... but let's just say they have a 'strong position' in the market.
The question is "WHY DOESN'T OBAMA HIMSELF AUTHORIZE THE RELEASE OF THE LONG FORM TO SHOW HE IS A NATIVE BORN CITIZEN?" Or any kind of a US citizen for that matter.
This reason he won't is because it will show no place of birth in Honolulu, Hawaii, USA!!! Pretty simple. He was born and bred a KENYAN. Alright?
Further, it is only a matter of time before one, single, federal judge, with some B@LLS, somewhere in one of the many lawsuits working this issue will allow discovery to go forward. And then, we shall see, what we shall see. I already know what we will see. We will see what Mr. Obama has prevented and will continue to try to prevent us seeing at all cost. We will see that he is in no way, shape of form a US citizen. He never was. He is an illegal alien. He will be removed from office. Oh, yeah, BTW, McCain produced all of his records on request. Even his dental records were included.
I am saddened by your choice.
I'm an Eagle Scout, university graduate, former USMC officer, holder a master's degree from a major university and a self-employed construction manager for the past 20 years. I have never taken money form the US government for anything other than my scholarship from the Naval ROTC program in which I enrolled to be commissioned upon graduation and the pay I received while on active duty. I don't ask much from government. I expect it to defend our shores, maintain a highway system and leave me and the rest of the citizenry alone. I believe in small government and free enterprise. I do expect my government not to lie or withhold information from me. They are supposed to work for and be responsible to US.
So if that makes me "an American-hating scofflaw conspiracy nut and an official pinhead" well, I plead guilty. I guess I just don't measure up to what the NEW AMERICAN type is supposed to be. But I was saluting the flag and doing my duty, while others were burning and spitting on flags. I was working when others were laying around waiting for their welfare checks. I proudly wore the uniform and followed my orders while others grew out their hair and bad-mouthed their country. Now those people are calling ME "America-hating"? Whatever.
I distinctly remember the Navy requiring me to get them a copy of my original, long-form BC in order to enter my officer training program to become a 2nd Lt. It was a photocopy of the original with a stamp and official's signature on it. Notarized. I still have that in a file with my Honorable Discharge.
I had no misgivings about producing it for the Naval authority since it was required. That is just to be a 2nd Lt. So now I wonder why the Commander in Chief has a problem handing over a copy of his. That should "sadden" you more than my "American-hating" I should think.
Since mine was good enough for DOD, I guess Obama's is good enough, too! From what I just read, the US Supreme Court certainly believes it to be good enough since even Scalia and Thomas have tossed appeals from the Birthers out.
Simple truth is, some on the right are literally incapable of accepting that they could honestly lose an election, so when they lose, they have to invent whole mythologies around the idea that evil people have done something. In 1993, an entire cottage industry grew up around the idea the Clintons were criminal masterminds (murders, drug running, rape, fraud, illegal land deals...on and on and on). We ended up with the Starr Persecution, 8 long years, $70 million taxpayer dollars wasted, hundreds of Federal lawyers and FBI agents digging into peoples lives. And other than the crime Starr himself set up, how much criminal activity did he ever find against Bill or Hillary Clinton? ZIP! In fact, his final report essentially absolves them of any of the crimes the CDS affected crowd accused them of committing.
Now, another Democrat beat a Republican. NO! Can't have that! Can't have happened! Must be something evil at work!!! I know! Let's claim he's really a Muslim...No, he's really a Kenyan! YEAH! He's not a "real" American!!!!
Totally false. Total waste of time. But for the GOP, it has the advantage of (a) keeping the whacky part of the base fired up and contributing, and (b) it distracts and diverts from allowing the President to actually do his job, as we elected him to do!
You seem to just ignore the TWO contemporaneous birth announcements in Hawaiian papers, which were NOT placed by Obama's family but (as was normally done back then) from a call from the Dept of Health giving birth info on live births the previous days. Incredible planning to get that in papers 48 years ago!
You ignore the witness interviewed by the Buffalo News in January who clearly recalls Dr West, a now deceased OBG from Honolulu, talking about Obama's birth in 1961.
You seem to belive a 9 months pregnant woman flew from Hawaii to Kenya, had a baby, and returned, all in the space of about 3 days (since witnesses on the street where they lived in Honolulu then have confirmed they remember his very pregnant month leave for the hospital and return just 3 days later with a baby)...
You seem to believe something that would have to involved literally hundreds of participants, a massive coverup, including Obama's political opposition...
Ever hear of Occam's Razor?
All you have are kooky conspiracy theories.
Couple of nights ago on Lou Dobbs' show (hosted by Pilgrem), the host spent literally 3.5 minutes of a 6.5 minute segment detailing all the evidence that exists that Obama was born in Honolulu in 1961, there is that much of it.
She then asks Keyes, "So what do want the President to do?"
Keyes just looks at her and says "Just present some evidence!"
Everyone else on the show can be heard laughing their butts off, he sounds so stupid! Yeah, push Keyes, and we'll just keep replaying a 3.75 minute video...3.5 minutes of proof Obama is an American, followed by Keyes saying "But I want some evidence!"
It makes him look like an idiiot!
Yes it is, moron.
It is looking like cover-up at very high levels.
No, it isn't, moron.
And if it is so obviously frivolous, ridiculous and silly, well then why not prove it so and produce the long form BC?
Because the State of Hawaii doesn't do that. They have laws. The laws allow them to issue a COLB. It is verified. They aren't going to change the law because a bunch of deranged lunatics insist they must.
We are asking for a copy of the original hospital generated piece of paper that Hawaiian officials claim to have in their vault.
Too bad. You can't have it. You can't have it for anyone born in the State of Hawaii. You can look at the COLB. That's the law. Deal with it.
Isn't this the very reason why "all 57 states" of the union have adopted a policy of keeping birth records?
No, the states don't keep records to accommodate insane people. That is not the reason.
That's all fun and stuff but back to the issue. OK?
The question is "WHY DOESN'T OBAMA HIMSELF AUTHORIZE THE RELEASE OF THE LONG FORM TO SHOW HE IS A NATIVE BORN CITIZEN?" Or any kind of a US citizen for that matter.
This reason he won't is because it will show no place of birth in Honolulu, Hawaii, USA!!! Pretty simple. He was born and bred a KENYAN. Alright?
Further, it is only a matter of time before one, single, federal judge, with some B@LLS, somewhere in one of the many lawsuits working this issue will allow discovery to go forward. And then, we shall see, what we shall see. I already know what we will see. We will see what Mr. Obama has prevented and will continue to try to prevent us seeing at all cost. We will see that he is in no way, shape of form a US citizen. He never was. He is an illegal alien. He will be removed from office. Oh, yeah, BTW, McCain produced all of his records on request. Even his dental records were included.
Because he can't. He can get a COLB from the state, and already has. That's all they give out.
Tell you what, birthers. You find a Hawaiian around Obama's age, and get that person to go to the Hawaii Department of Health and request their "long form" birth certificate. If they succeed, I'll join in on the call for Obama to request his. Of course, since Hawaii doesn't do that, he/she won't succeed, but I encourage you to give it a try. You can find at least one birther nut in Hawaii, can't you?
I made a similar challenge, which was a bit less likely to be accepted. I asked the birthers to present a Hawaiian birth certificate, short form, that says exactly what Obama's says except it would have the birther's name instead of Obama's. So it would say the birther was born in Oahu in 1961, his mom is Stanley Ann Durham, etc.
Since they kept saying that "anyone can get that" form of birth certificate, even those who weren't born there," it seemed fair to me.
But your idea is better. Kudos. And I notice that, unsurprisingly, no birther even responded. Because, as I said, your idea is good and it would expose them as lying racist sacks of shit.
I believe if President Obama personally took these Birthers by the hand to Hawaii and actually showed them his actual birth certificate that is on file they still wouldn't believe it because that isn't the real reason they'd like to see him out of office.
The Birthers need to face reality. He is a black man, he was elected and he is our President. Get over it.
face it, at it's base this is a racist argument. Obama does not look like McCain, Bush, Cheney, Gore, Kerry, Clinton, Dole, Bush, Dukakas, Reagan, Carter, Ford, Nixon..., and so he must be a foreigner. Did anyone seriously question the citizenship of any of these candidates? did anyone demand the "long form" "vault copy" or the freaking holy grail? No. Because they where safe looking white guys.
grow the eff up.
As one of the comments suggests, there is no way that you or anyone can make the Birthers accept and believe that our Legally Elected President, Baarak Obama is a NATURAL BORN US CITIZEN.
So I would like to suggest that Maj. Stefan F. Cook, a reservist who volunteered for duty in Afghanistan, and then decided that he would not like to to serve in that capoacity anymore, be Unceremoniously and Dishonourably be Stripped of his rank and casahiered out as just rewards from the Military that he has just disgraced with his action.
it is all a stunt to get into court
I guess he wants to be famous--and he no is famous -- but as one big idiot
Hilarious!
I firmly believe Obama meets this, but get your facts straight.
this is settled law, legal precedent and is in Black's legal dictionary
What do you think it means??? It means he was born the child of at least one citizen of the USA - nothing more, nothing less.
No, the campaign actually produced a CERTIFICATION of Live Birth, which is not the same thing. A real CERTIFICATE of Live Birth has the signature of the physician who delivered the baby and the signature of the person who reported the birth information (baby's name, parents, etc.)
Personally, I believe Obama was born in Hawaii, and there's something embarassing on the full Certificate of Live Birth that he wants to keep private.
This is the only thing that is available from the State of Hawaii. The top officials in Hawaii have stated publicly that the certified copy that Obama provided is the real thing. The so-called "long form" original is a state record and under state law cannot be made available to the public.
In order for the certified copy to be faked, multiple officials in the State of Hawaii would have to be involved in a massive conspiracy.
But the bottom line is this: No matter how much evidence is provided, or how many assurances from Hawaii state officials, the birthers are never going to believe that he is a citizen.
It can't be made available to the public, but an individual person can get a copy of his/her own "long form" birth certificate. I ordered one from the Department of Health where I was born so I could get a passport a few years ago. It has all sorts of information, including both parents' birthdates, etc.
Personally, I believe you are an idiot who hasn't a clue what he/she is talking about. The certificate the state issued is the only one they issue. There are no others to be had. Deal with it.
Oh really? Then I guess the Department of Hawaiian Home Lands is lying when it says:
"The Department of Hawaiian Home Lands accepts both Certificates of Live Birth (original birth certificate) and Certifications of Live Birth because they are official government records documenting an individual’s birth."
not valid for the top secret clearance I had years ago--I had to get the one similar the O has posted to get the security clearance as well as my passport--that is the "real deal" the only valid one you can obtain from the government for legal purposes
now why are we not asking about every other politician's birth certificates? How do we know where they were REALLY born and what THEY are HIDING?
could it be the color of Obam's skin?
No, I am thinking of an official goverment document. Generally it's a scan of the actual paper form filled out by the attending physician at the time of birth. The Department of Hawaiian Home Lands web site refers to the two types:
"The Department of Hawaiian Home Lands accepts both Certificates of Live Birth (original birth certificate) and Certifications of Live Birth because they are official government records documenting an individual’s birth."
Something embarrasing huh... oh, I know, maybe it says that he's black!. Assprobe would be a more approriate screename because you wouldn't know logic if it bit you on your ass!
Actually, that information is on the "short form" which has been widely published. It says, "Father's Race: African".
"Assprobe would be a more approriate screename"
Pretty lame ad hominem. Try again, after some fact checking, okay?
And why is there never any mention of the fact that John McCain was born in Panama?
Either way, the President is a black guy. Hooray!
I've pasted an important section below that you must read to truly understand what the bill intends:
****************************************************************************************
SEC. 102. PROTECTING THE CHOICE TO KEEP CURRENT COVERAGE.
(a) Grandfathered Health Insurance Coverage Defined- Subject to the succeeding provisions of this section, for
purposes of establishing acceptable coverage under this division, the term ‘grandfathered health insurance
coverage’ means individual health insurance coverage that is offered and in force and effect before the first day
of Y1 if the following conditions are met:
(1) LIMITATION ON NEW ENROLLMENT-
5
(A) IN GENERAL- Except as provided in this paragraph, the individual health insurance issuer
offering such coverage does not enroll any individual in such coverage if the first effective date of
coverage is on or after the first day of Y1.
****************************************************************************************
The title in disingeneous and misleading at best. The words matter here. Yes the President did say that you can keep your current coverage, but what he failed to mention is that your current coverage will be the last private coverage you will ever have. What the bill language above actually means when you decypher the legal terminology is: on the day the law goes into effect you cannot enroll in any new private insurance. Sure, you can keep your existing policy (it's grandfathered in), but if you change jobs or want a different policy after the law in in force, your only option will be the government plan, no private options will be legal. Over time, this relegates everyone to the government plan and completely removes your choice of a private plan. It also will eliminate the private insurance sector altogether. How many jobs will that "save"?
So to give some people a government option that don't have insurance now, Obama is willing force everyone (200 million people) into a government run plan. This is not freedom of choice, it's a trojan horse meant only to centralize control. This is not about party, it's about basic freedom of choice.
This is only on page 16, I wonder what we will find after reading the entire bill.
Secondly, no, you do not understand what that means, what that means is that any new private insurance oyu buy will have to be under the rules established by this bill, ie being portable, and all the other new rules for how private insurancce operates.
You are hitting on the grandfather clause saying that no currently existing plan will be changed for those currently on it and then assuming, completely erroneously, that that means that you wont be able to buy a private plan ever again unless you are grandfathered in. That is just stupidly misreading the bill, either out of ignorance of the style of how such legal docs are written, purposeful misrepresentation, or idiocy.
Where is the portabilty clause? I could not find one. I also could not find where accessibility to new private insurance is provided. Please let me know where it is when you find it. As I said before this is not party politics to me. If you can show me the language in the bill, I will defer.
By the way, the grandfather clause only means that you can keep what you have. But even if you have an existing policy, you will not be able to change it later (i.e.: when you change jobs or want a different private policy). The grandfather clause does not allow to get a different private policy just because you have a policy now. That's the point that I am trying to make. Through attrition, private insurance will go away altogether over time, as people change jobs, get laid off, etc.; leaving the government plan as the only available option.
You say that like it's a bad thing not to get ripped off by insurance companies...
Next.
But, this is a standard tactic nowadays: pull a small part out of something and make the entire issue about it, devoid of the rest of the content. It is disingenuous, lazy and intellectually dishonest.
I expect a spike in "moon landing fraud" flat earthers given the attention to the 40 year anniversary of the Apollo 11 on the 19th...
WHY DO YOU NEED TO SEE IT?
It interests me.
I suppose you didn't read THOSE reports EITHER?
Boy, you do tend to ignore evidence all around you!
Why won't 0bama simply do the right thing and provide it? Where there's smoke...
You do realize that Iraq did provide that information, corroborated by UNMOVIC, and that there were inspectors on the ground also confirming that, when Bush told them to get out of the country because he was about to bomb it, right?
Are you seriously saying that there were no inspectors in Iraq? Seriously?
Here is the section to which I am referring. All current issuers (i.e.: all current private insurance companies) will NOT be allowed to write new policies when the law goes into effect. Think it through. What option does that leave for you?
****************************************************************************************
SEC. 102. PROTECTING THE CHOICE TO KEEP CURRENT COVERAGE.
(a) Grandfathered Health Insurance Coverage Defined- Subject to the succeeding provisions of this section, for
purposes of establishing acceptable coverage under this division, the term ‘grandfathered health insurance
coverage’ means individual health insurance coverage that is offered and in force and effect before the first day
of Y1 if the following conditions are met:
(1) LIMITATION ON NEW ENROLLMENT-
5
(A) IN GENERAL- Except as provided in this paragraph, the individual health insurance issuer
offering such coverage does not enroll any individual in such coverage if the first effective date of
coverage is on or after the first day of Y1.
****************************************************************************************
I also posted the link to the entire bill to prove that my excerpt was not doctored or taken out of context. Please read it before you comment.
Look, this is not a matter of party politics for me. It has to do with the freedom of choice that I (and all Americans) should except. If you want to enroll in a government plan, that's your choice. But don't try to force me to enroll too.
Yes I am fully aware, hence the fact that he was born to a US citizen making him quite properly a Natural Born US Citizen and acceptable from a legal standpoint as president without it mattering where on earth he was born. Hence McCain being born in Panama being all a ok, hence the children of US businessmen doing business out of the country still counting as natural born citizens. I was born in london, england, I technically could claim UK citizenship, but as far as any government is concerned I am, and always have been, a US citizen, from birth.
Regarding the digital COLB, an online image is easily altered and is meaningless as real evidence (legally it is hearsay). As far as I know, no court, judge or government official responsible for certifying the candidates or the election has ever actually touched or seen an official State copy of either 0bama's COLB or the original long form BC (which, by the way, he claims in his autobiography to have found while in high school - so why doesn't he show it?).
In the minority of States that even required it at all, 0bama's vetting consisted of Pelosi (as party head) and 0bama signing a statement that the candidate met all necessary qualifications. No state or impartial government official has ever done any actual checking or verification. 0bama, as an employee of We the People, has a responsibility to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that he is a Natural born citizen. Right now, the number of people who are coming to have serious doubts about 0bama's bona fides hovers around 50 percent and is growing by leaps and bounds every day.
If he were to open up his records to the same degree as have prior candidates (for example, McCain), then most people would be satisfied and all this would stop (one way or the other). :)
Of course, since he's been so secretive to date, he would need to be extra transparent about the process (hey, didn't somebody somewhere promise just that?). For example, he could call in impartial neutral experts (perhaps from both sides) such that they could examine and verify his original vault birth certificate, his missing school records, adoption records, passport applications and any other records that may directly relate to his Natural born citizenship status. Further he would probably have to direct the SCOTUS to rule on the definition of Natural born citizen (because he was born with dual allegiance and dual citizenship due to his foreign father).
This list is perhaps a little longer than normal, but he has a background that is more than a little weirder than normal and he has been more than a little more secretive than normal, so this is to be expected.
If he took the bull (so to speak - you 0bama supporters should like that) by the horns and actively and openly faced all these doubts head on AND his qualifications actually survived (like all past Presidents surely would have), then no one could reasonably question his legitimacy again. Anything less, and this cancer of doubt will continue to grow unchecked to the detriment of all.
Think well -- see clearly.
grow up
It isn't likely that any kind of conditions would satisfy the perpetrators of this distraction since most, if not all, don't believe in its substance themselves.
the distinction is between "native born", that is by circumstances of birth, and "naturalized" ( like Arnold )
This is ridiculous.
First of all, the birth certificate IS legitmate if it comes form the STATE of Hawaii's department of statiscs. Many have had to get "copies" of thier birth certificates to get Passports, etc since it IS difficult to keep track of the orignal for MANY people expecially when you move a lot.
Secondly, WHY would his parents have felt the need to do anything when he was born to perpetuate such a "farce". Did they know he would grow up to be a politician.
And, finally, there are copies to be found in TWO NEWSPAPERS announcing his birth! Are THEY are in on all this as well!
Too bad these people didn't care about George Bush's military record (or lack there of) as they are on this nonsense. IF that had been dogged as much, perhaps, we would not be in the mess we are right now in this country.
Obama's will too. IF he has one that lists a hospital, which Iagain, I am betting it DOES NOT.
OWN it, you Democrats didn't vet your Candidate, and now we have a POTUS that may not even be qualified, and is resisting PROVING that he is to the tune of 1 MILLION bucks!!!
Hello! That alone STINKS to high heaven. A Long Form Certificate would be SO much cheaper! Don't you think?
This is a perfect example of just how uninformed and nutty you birthers are. You take one fact (that anyone can get a COLB from Hawaii) and omit the information that would put that fact in the proper context (That the COLB can only state that you were born in Hawaii if you were in fact born in Hawaii).
This is why Obama is ignoring you, you aren't in posession of the facts, and you choose to believe only what you want to believe, and most of what you believe is completely made up.
Do you really think that because dumbya was from Connecticut that he was actually QUALIFIED???
Where did this theory even come from to begin with???
As for OholyO, he should put up the document or RESIGN.
Unless of course, Obama's mother was planning for him to to become President nearly 50 years later, and she thought he would need to prove that he was born somewhere, so she somehow managed to get the Doctors and the hospital in Hawaii as well as the Hawaiian newspapers to record his birth.
Wow, so many people involved in this enormous scheme just so a non-white man could lead the U.S. Imagine?
Well, I guess if they are all they smart and capable then they deserve it. After all, the conservatives have scared off any intelligent Republicons out of their party. I would rather have something that was hatched lead the country than the whacko's who are in charge of the new Republicon party..
Instead he is fighting it in COURT? WHY? Just produce the documentation! Isn't that a WHOLE lot easier? I mean he said in his book he had them right, so why not produce the Long form?
Because he CAN'T. The Army REVOKED Major Cook's orders instead of producing the documents. Such a SIMPLE thing, unless you don't have any, or are honestly NOT a natural Born Citizen.
Pony up the paper Usurper Obama.
Because he was born to a US citizen so this entire discussion is pointless, doesnt matter where on earth (or even if he wasnt born on earth) so long as a parent was a US citizen.
Because the army's officer corps isnt exactly an "unbiased" group of people politically (i think it is 70% republican, last time I heard numbers quoted, compared to the like 19% of the actual general population)
Because the army is allowing his orders to be revoked so the man can have his day in court and therefore is just following proper procedure.
Because you are an idiot who cannot stand the fact that democracy works and your hypocritical, criminal and downright unamerican candidate/party lost. Deal with it, it happens. Now go and try to win an election over this issue. It will make Alf Landon, Barry Goldwater, Walter Mondale and George McGovern look like they were competitive.
Please provide a link that explains where Obama is fighting an order to produce anything in court. Crazy birthers are going to court to try to get the court to make Obama provide something he already has provided.
The army revoked major Cook's order because he is a NATIONAL GUARD VOLUNTEER, and as such, has the right to chose not to be deployed.
"If only one parent is a U.S. Citizen at
the time of ones birth, that parent must have resided in the United States
for minimum ten years, five of which must be after the age of 16"
O's father was not a U.S. citizen. While O's mother was a citizen she does not pass that test since she was 18 when O was born. She CANNOT pass her citizenship on to him.
Therefore it becomes of crucial importance whether or not O was born in the U.S. or outside the U.S. If he was born outside the U.S. he is not a citizen.
The birth certificate would prove the issue once and for all. All O has to do to shut everyone up is the call upon Hawaii to release all his birth records. He has not done that and as a result that leads to suspicion.
Keep ignoring the facts... It is the only way you can sustain your argument.
The long form CAN be gotten. It would be EASY for him to get it, they could have it printed out 2 minutes after getting the request! It would settle EVERYTHING. Why isn't he doing that? Thats by FAR the easiest thing to do. But he refuses. WHY? Everyone should be asking this, and Democrats ought to be pissed as HELL that the party didn't do this for them already! Democrats, more than anyone else, got seriously ripped off, and if I were you guys, I would be demanding it as well! If only because if he isn't Natural Born, then he defrauded all of you and he OWES you on that score!
He's, he's, black I tell you! Black!
The fruit cakes on the right are hereby officially notified that the above was typed in jest - lest you be tempted to cut and paste somewhere.
Is the doctor alive? dead? Did he forge his name? How many calls do you think this doctor would receive from Birthers?
Birthers would ask for records concerning the address... Is there any proof Obama actually LIVED there... on and on...
No producing that document would do nothing to the Birther movement except provide more ways to try and question his legitimacy.
The simple fact is that HE was vetted and is now sworn in. The burden of proof now resides with you Birthers. He does not have to in any way facilitate your investigation. If you have no proof then you have no argument.
Please provide physical evidence that Obama is not a natural born citizen... Until such time that you can... you really have no reason to utter another word on the matter. Everything at this point the Birthers say is conjecture and meaningless.
Obama ONLY needs to provide a long form birth certificate! And its EASY to get! But he refuses? Why on earth refuse something SO SIMPLE?? Because either he can't, or it proves he is not a Natural Born Citizen.
"Obama ONLY needs to provide a long form birth certificate! And its EASY to get! "
No it isnt, because, THE STATE OF HAWAI'I DOES NOT ISSUE SUCH THINGS. The only documents which one can get from said state are presented already. done. End of story. You are just a conspiracy theorist nutjob who cannot accept that elections sometimes dont go your way.
But since you didn't check with "them" you cannot do that. And if you did check with "them" they would tell you what they tell everyone else.
Now go cry yourself back to sleep. When you wake up, the leader of the free world will still be black.
Perhaps he wasn't aware in May when he actually volunteered for the assignment that Obama was President.
Face it, the guy got cold feet and latched onto a hairbrained excuse. I say it is good that the brave soldiers in Afghanistan don't have to rely on a nutcase like him.
If they couldn't be bothered to not participate in an illegal war, somehow I get the feeling you getting the vapors over Obama isn't all that important.
1. Dave Weigel is a liar. Not only that, but after he wrote about me on his personal site, he refused to approve a comment I left showing how he was wrong.
2. Okubo (the Dep't of Health spokeswoman) is either lying or confused. Go take a look. She says there's only the short-form of certificates, yet a simple search will show a long-form certificate at several sites. What she told someone else is easily seen to be false. Whether she was lying or just wrong isn't known.
If you want the truth about this issue - no speculation, no tinfoil hat talk, and no attempts to mislead such as Weigel engages in - see my completely fact-based overview.
This post will probably be followed by a series of comments designed to mislead or just throw up dust. Few of those people will have read or understood the link and will simply use the same old misleading statements debunked at the link above. Their goal is to mislead; don't let them do it.
1) The law you cited was created in 1982 and as such had no precedence at the time Obama was born 21 years earlier. So please cite the laws applicable for the time period that Obama was born.
2) The 1982 provision does not amend a child's records to imply they were born in Hawaii, it only provides a Hawaii birth certificate. That certificate as has already been verified by state officials would show the place of original birth on it. So if Obama was born out of the US, the certificate while issued by Hawaii, would show his original place of birth, not Honolulu.
So in fact you are misleading people with your site. A neutral site without an agenda would have these facts along with the ones that support your position. When it is all taken into context, there would have to be a whole host of individuals at the state level that would actively be participants in a conspiracy to get Obama certified as a natural born citizen. Unless this document was freshly minted they would have to be prognosticators to see into the future that he would become president.
The most likely answer is the simplest one... He was born in Hawaii and has a birth certificate that proves it. He has been sworn into office. At this stage the burden of proof no longer falls on him, but his accusers. Please provide PROOF that he is in fact not a natural born citizen. Everything else is rhetoric and conjecture... nothing more.
How Convenient!
It doesn't matter how many links you put up, or how many "Fact-based overviews" you post, they mean nothing unless you can prove that Mrs. Okubo is lying. and you can't. and you know it.
Sad the republicans will never change to me,they are the face of hatred.
Leave Obama alone.
Ola Paris
No proof will ever be good enough for the lunatics out there.
He is a manufactured puppet mesmerizing us while we are bound up in a National Socialist fascist State.
Impeach.
Depose.
Imprison.
Sic semper tyrannis
we all know who WASN'T ever really President. let's just call him "w". since neither you nor he have sense enough 2 spell out his name. put the am radio down and pick up a book, traitor.
Then, shortly after the orders were generated, he filed his bogus lawsuit. The order requiring him to report for duty is a prerequisite to filing suit. I'm a lawyer. I'll try to say that in english.
He could not sue until he could show that he had received orders to report. So first he had to get the orders generated. It was ALWAYS just a political set-up. His attorney has done the same thing before, with similarly spectacularly miserable results. It's all just to score ridiculous points with the right wing lunatic fringe.
It really goes too far on many levels. Not least of which is the contempt it shows for the military AND the judicial service. You know, we ARE at war. And thousands of our bravest young men and women are fighting and dying in Afghanistan and elsewhere to preserve our freedoms. Having this no-account weasel volunteer for service under false pretenses, just so he could try to grandstand with an obviously bogus legal theory, is really more than any of us should have to sit through.
It's bad enough that the Republicans play the race card from the bottom of the deck for four straight days with Judge Sotomayor, or that the Republicans in Congress cannot do anything except avoid answering questions about Republican sex scandals while keeping their fingers crossed that whatever Obama tries to do fails, so that America will be worse off and the GOP can get re-elected.
But when you have weasels tie up the system with fake lawsuits and make a mockery out of all those people whose tours have been extended, that's just too much.
as per watergate, it's not the offense, it's the cover-up; $10 to release the long form birth certificate (which is not the same as the COLB) would clear this up completely.
Occam's Razor suggests there is something to hide.
All you need to know is that EVERY COURT THAT HAS EXAMINED ANY OF THIS HORSESHIT HAS COME TO THE SAME CONCLUSION: It's sheer, utter hogwash, and our President needs to do nothing more about it... no school records, no photo of the 'vault copy' of his birth records, NADA.
The Supreme Court of this nation, the same court that decided that Bush won the 2000 election, REFUSED TO EVEN HEAR THE CASE. That means they believed it had no merit whatsoever. Get it? The Chief Justice, a lifelong conservative, swore Mr. Obama in. There's nothing being hidden. No conspiracy. Swamp gas; that's all.
If you don't like and/or accept the structure of federal and state laws and the U.S.Constitution which have served us so well, that have found that Obama was born in Hawaii, then PLEASE LEAVE OUR COUNTRY and take all the other "Birfers" with you.
Our national average IQ would shoot up 20 points immediately.
And the document you got for your driver's license was, by your own admission, a CERTIFIED COPY given to you by the state or county, not the original document. So you concede it's OK for the record-keeping authority to issue you a document attesting to your birth record and not a photo of the original? Nope, the state accesses its database and spits out a piece of paper with a stamp to show that this is a reflection of the state's records. Guess what -- that's the kind of document Obama DID order for ten bucks and put on the website.
What I'm trying to get at is... the CERTIFIED COPY you got is good enough for you to become president of the united states. The CERTIFIED COPY that any other person born in Hawaii can order (which would be exactly like Obama's publicly released copy) is good enough for any other Hawaii-born person to run for president?
So why the different level of proof required for Obama?
Before you spew such rubbish, howzabout you LOOK IT UP FIRST? Call a lawyer; every one has studied the laws of citizenship in Law School.
Unless you enjoy exposing yourself as a gullible, incurious, vague-minded dipstick; in which case, pray continue.
You only have to have BOTH parents be citizens if you are born OUTSIDE THE US.
Here, this has links to the actual laws...so stop trying to sell your racist nonsense here.
OBAMA IS AND ALWAYS WILL BE A CITIZEN OF THE UNITED STATES...
http://www.usconstitution.net/consttop_citi.html
Persons born in Hawaii (8 USC 1405)
A person born in Hawaii on or after August 12, 1898, and before April 30, 1900, is declared to be a citizen of the United States as of April 30, 1900. A person born in Hawaii on or after April 30, 1900, is a citizen of the United States at birth. A person who was a citizen of the Republic of Hawaii on August 12, 1898, is declared to be a citizen of the United States as of April 30, 1900.
.
"a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States..."
And with that, poof! Your argument is reduced to smoke.
Title 8 of the U.S. Code is even more specific. Section 1401 defines the following as people who are "citizens of the United States at birth:"
Anyone born inside the United States *
Any Indian or Eskimo born in the United States, provided being a citizen of the U.S. does not impair the person's status as a citizen of the tribe
Any one born outside the United States, both of whose parents are citizens of the U.S., as long as one parent has lived in the U.S.
Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is a citizen and lived in the U.S. for at least one year and the other parent is a U.S. national
Any one born in a U.S. possession, if one parent is a citizen and lived in the U.S. for at least one year
Any one found in the U.S. under the age of five, whose parentage cannot be determined, as long as proof of non-citizenship is not provided by age 21
Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is an alien and as long as the other parent is a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years (with military and diplomatic service included in this time)
A final, historical condition: a person born before 5/24/1934 of an alien father and a U.S. citizen mother who has lived in the U.S.
* There is an exception in the law — the person must be "subject to the jurisdiction" of the United States. This would exempt the child of a diplomat, for example, from this provision.
Obama was born in Hawaii...a state of this union to a Citizen of this nation. You think that secret service does not undertake a serch on people running for president?
Continuing to pretend this is otherwise so your illiterate constuents can disguise racism and hate under this lie of his birth is embarassing and a waste of the time of the 80% of us who aren't racists and have already listened to Hawaii defend this poor man over and over from these ridiculous attacks.
There is not going to be a second Civil War just because a black man has finally entered the front door of the White House. Get over it!
You will NOT be remembered as the heroes who exposed "the truth." How you could ever think that would happen is mind-boggling.
Do yourself a favor and wise up while you still can.
You DO realize that you moonbat radical righties don't have a monopoly on deadly force, don't you?
"Sic semper tyrannis" yourself....
See you at the barricades. :-)
Read about Jackie Robinson and others who broke color barriers, you'll see the similar stupid crap.
When color barriers are broke, those with conscious and sub-consious prejudices get exposed.
2 Obama's mother and her parents were Americans, ergo Obama is American.
3 Don't these people have a real life?
1. The birther movement is comprised of many of the same characters who say 9/11 was a conspiracy by
Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld. Check it out for yourself. Doesn't take much googling.
2. The birther soldier was dismissed by the military. This was touted as a "victory" for the birthers.
3. The next day, he was fired by his employer, who it turns out, has only one client: DOD.
4. Yesterday, the Fed. Ct. dismissed his lawsuit summarily.
Now the guy has no income from the miltary or a civilian job. Good goin!
5. This lawyer got her law degree online. She's completely batsh*t crazy.
Why doesn't BO just release (whatever it is the birthers want him to release) the document?
Because he's rolling on the floor laughing each time he gets to rub these people's noses in their own sh*t.
One lawsuit at a time.
For me, it makes everything he says, even if by chance he has something valid to say, completely irrelevant. I don't believe him.
It's unfortunate that talk show hosts like Hannity don't make some reasonable effort to argue their point of view with some intelligence and insight instead of intentional distortion. His continued insistence that there may be some validity to the Obama birth certification question is only one of many cases in which obvious and intentional distortion of fact is his mainstay argument on his show. Doesn't he have anything valid to argue his conservatism? One has to question his motives.
I hope for the sake of our country that his followers do not take him at face value. Even as a commentator, he's a fraud.
frank nelson
Don't forget that people like the Kennedy's, the Clintons, the white men and women in the Democratic party have all been there during those years where we were criticized incredibly by our family and friends for demanding equal opportunity for all. We are all still here fighting for Obama and Sotomayor and gays etc...
Your generation is my final hope that this discrimination will end...I raised my own two children to know better...they are YOUR generation and I'm beyond proud of you guys!
If Jesus Christ were to show up with the document in hand and hand it to you, you would call JC a liar.
And the Republicans like my ancestors who supported abolition would have nothing whatsoever in common with the Republican party of today. That is why I left it.
The Republicans may have ended slavery, but after LBJ signed civil rights legislation, and Jim Crow began to end, the racist southern Democrats switched to become Republicans. Makes no difference how the GOP started, it's the party of racists now.
He used his Indonesian name of Barry Soetoro so he could travel to Pakistan with his Indonesian Passport.
He got into Harvard and Columbia the same way his Kenyan father got into the University of Hawaii, foreign student aide.
This is why he refuses to show his PP, school records and birth certificate.
The man is a fraud
By the way
Pakistan was under Martial Law in 1981 when Barry went there to visit the two hot spots of muslim unrest
Rumor?
Then what keeps Barry from showing his documents?
The truth scares him is why
But then you Birthers would not take the truth...you are like Christians that blame the devil when caught in a sin.
The supreme court has said that this is not worthy to talk about...the conservative majority court at that.
I have seen his Birth Certificate and read the letter from Linda Lingle (Gov. of Hawaii) and the Director of the Health Department that the original copy of Obama's Birth Certificate is on file, as well as all "long copies" (original copies) of everyone born in Hawaii. Obama's doctor that delivered him was Rodney T. West...2 minutes of research ...at the Children and Womens Medical Center of Honolulu.
His documents have been shown...I have been to North Africa...I lived in Libya...1953. So what?
we like our foreign president
he does not have to show you anything
country first do nothings
The voices in your head are going to have to look for some facts next time.
Let me ask you a question; where are the birth certificates for any of the previous Presidents?
Is it that they don’t need to prove their births because they are WHITE, or President Obama needs to prove his birth because he is BLACK?!
Your lies would be hilarious if not so dangerous.
FRAUD?!? The ONLY reason you find the President of the United States a fraud is because you do not have the b alls to call him what you want to (and what you do in private) a N*G*ER.
Foul and disgusting.
after all they are not only the party of no country first- but also the do-nothing congress
let us not forget that
2000-2006
Nothing!
Problem: Obama DID NOT put a certifiCATE but a certifiCATION which differs much from an ACTUAL certificate. GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT! A birth certificate shows DETAILED info like the Dr. of birth, the actual hospital, etc. But the certification proves only that the guy basically exists. Fact: In 1961 Hawaii issued CERTIFICATIONS of live birth most of the time for FOREIGN born children.
Worldnetdaily.com is just reporting the GLARING facts about this CONTROVERSY -- and I wouldn't call it a theory especially since Obama STILL won't release his actual birth CERTIFICATE, and that's A FACT.
I really encourage all who are opposed to the birthers to PLEASE log on to wnd.com and just read what they have to say and examine their material INSTEAD of just blowing them off because you may just be putting yourselves and this country in great constitutional, financial and moral jeopardy by legitimizing a "president" that might not be president AFTER ALL...
I had to get a copy of my birth certificate from PA a few years ago. It does not list the doctor who delivered me, nor the name of the hospital. Just my name, the names of my parents, the city and county of my birth, and the date and time. It has a raised seal on it from the PA, just like Obama's copy of his birth certificate had a raised seal from Hawaii.
Here's the deal: YOUR TEAM LOST. You people need to get a grip on what's left of your sanity and move on. This whole business is even crazier than those loonies who kept trying to claim that Bill and Hillary Clinton killed Vince Foster. No matter how many times Foster's own wife AND the police AND the coroner confirmed he killed himself, the loonies insisted he was murdered. You people won't take ANY piece of evidence from the state of Hawaii as factual!!
As someone else stated, the burden of PROOF is on you birthers. You have compiled a lot of lies and innuendo, but no PROOF of your claims. The president should not have to prove that you are wrong -- you should have to prove that you are right. PERIOD.
Facts don't matter to you birthers, anyway. You have a conclusion in your schizophrenic mind that your convoluted conspiracy theory is true, and there is no amount of evidence that will deter you from believing it.
Again, there is not ONE SHRED of evidence to support these bizarre claims. No court in this country believes you. NO SANE PERSON believes you. Why? Because YOU HAVE NO EVIDENCE TO SUPPORT YOUR CLAIMS.
I seriously encourage all the Birthers to go get a new official copy of their birth records before they make total fools of themselves, so they can see what has changed since whenever the copies they're used to seeing were issued. Some of this WILL vary by state and juristiction, but Obama's birth certification is pretty typical of what's being issued these days. I'm pretty sure he went and asked for a NEW printing of it from the official sources specifically to try to preempt the "it's a forgery" stuff that the 1960s original would have suffered (since an older document would have been easier to fake, whereas the one he produced, the person who handled stuffing it in an envelope is probably still working there and can verify it's authenticity).
Seriously. It's OVER. You're just making yourself like Tin Hat Fashionistas.
How could Hawaii certify any birth that didn't occur in Hawaii? That in itself would be fraud.
It's amazing how dumb these birthers are. Go back to discussing how there was a breeze blowing the flag in the faked moon landing. Box of rocks.
Really as simple as that.
Get over it, the days of white supremacy in this country are over. Good riddance, too. And I'm white!
The whole movement you believe in is a right wing whack job theory meant to continue the hatred and ignorance of our past, and keep you people distracted while they continue to sabotage our country in the name of "goodness" and "morality" while selling it to you neatly packaged as being "patriotic" so that you crazy bastards will eat it up.
And what about the newspaper birth announcements that are on microfilm in Hawaiin libraries. Are they forged to? Wow, this conspiracy must involve hundreds of people.
You people are frightening.
The numbers they write about being "in the movement" are contradicted from one headline to the next-can't even stay consistent in their lies! Joeseph Farrah is a HACK!!
Prove that John McCain is american!
Second. You demonstrate your ignorance on the issue. I don't have to "Prove that John McCain is american", because congress certified him. They looked into his birth history, had some hearings, and concluded he met the natural born citizen eligibility criteria. No such investigation was done for Obama. He was simply taken at his word. To date, no legal entity, court or congress, has certified Obama as meeting the natural born citizen eligibility criteria. What do we have offered as proof that he meets the criteria? An image on a website offered by the Obama campaign. Basically, we are taking the word of the president on the matter. That is not how a free society operates.
I don't know you, but I do know your kind, having been born and raised in the segregated South.
All you need to know is that EVERY COURT THAT HAS EXAMINED ANY OF THIS HORSESHIT HAS COME TO THE SAME CONCLUSION: It's sheer, utter hogwash, and our President needs to do nothing more about it... no school records, no photo of the 'vault copy' of his birth records, NADA.
Here is one court's written opinion:
The court finds the claims against Mr. Obama’s citizenship “wholly unpersuasive and bordering on the frivolous, especially in light of the complete absence of any first-hand evidence on any critical issue” and further classifies it as “conspiracy theory of the lowest sort, fueled by nothing than internet rumor and those who truly want to believe egging each other on.”
Either accept the hard, provable fact that the President was born in Hawaii, and remain the above-delineated pinhead, or join the sane, law-abiding world. At that time I would be glad to personally, publicly declare you a non-pinhead, and to fully retract my previous statement.
So are you saying that you don't recognize the legal authority of the United States Supreme Court? Independent thought is all well and good. But playing fast and loose with facts to support outrageous claims of fraud takes motivation beyond dogged pursuit of the truth. Ultimately, you're right. Free society operates by having nutcases advance whatever theories they want. Have fun!
When did congress or any other government organization certify any other previous President's birth??
When did congress or any other government organization certify any other previous Presidential candidate's birth??
Have you ever thought that congress did not question then Senator Obama's citizenship because he was and still is a natural born AMERICAN?
This would go in line with the fact that they did not do this for any of the other Presidential candidates either. Sorry, that would make too much sense and go against accepting that the black guy is an American.
You are still picking on PRESIDENT OBAMA because he is black.
So, what does that make you in light of the facts? RACIST!
Yum yum, that's some good irony.
Really as simple as that.
There's only one side: rational truth. And we're all over here, and we're glad you've decided not to join us.
And there's no issue. Our President's name is...say it with me...Barack Hussein Obama. His mother is American. No matter where he was born, he's American. And he was born in Hawaii. So no issue.
Personally, I couldn't be more pleased to have nutjobs like you out there spewing this ludicrous birth certificate nonsense. Like having Sanford and Ensign twisting in the wind, it is the best electoral message a Democrat can hope for.
Because it's like running a very powerful ad that says "Do you want to be on the side of those people who are trying to take the country forward, or those who are obviously trying to hold it back?"
Will you vote for the poseurs and hypocrites who screwed up the economy and yet now have no idea how to fix it except by doing more of what got us into trouble, or the guy who inherited their mess and yet stood up and said "Give it to me; I want that responsibility. It's my job to lead, not to stand on the sidelines and carp and gripe?"
Do you want to be a member of the party that draws in young and old, rich and poor, male and female, college educated and high school dropout, every ethnic group under the sun, or the party that has shown its @ss at every opportunity in the past 20 years? The party that consists almost solely of one age range of one ethnic group of people in one undereducated region of the country? The party that lies to the middle class and foments culture war to distract the people from the issues that actually matter to them? The party that tolerates the insane rantings of racists like you?
Please, please keep it up. And try to get yourself on Fox News while you're at it. Some of our voters are getting complacent and need a reminder that work needs to be done. Particularly in the area of education. You're doing all this public service for free. When Obama gets re-elected, he should really thank the nutjobs like you -- it just makes his path to re-election all the more of a glide.
Go back to talking about what you "fancy" yourself doing, loser.
Get some help. Seriously.
The sad part is that there are so many important issues facing this country and people like you take time away from everyone by keeping up this crap.
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in...
If people understood just a little about Africans and other cultures they would know that Obama could not have been born in Africa. Africans (in all African countries) do not accept marriages to foreigners. So Obama's father could never, never, never have taken home to Africa an American woman as his wife. That's why he left his wife and Obama in America. He went back to Africa where he probably already had a wife, or wives, or had a woman who the family had arranged for him to marry as soon as he got back to Africa. Africans are almost like Indians who will kill their own child if they marry out of the culturally accepted group. Americans, black or white are not a culturally accepted group for Africans to marry into.
I stand by what I say, Africans don't marry an American woman and take her home and she is accepted there. I know 3 women who were left here in America with their children when their African husbands went back home. It happened a lot when I was in college. Some Africans marry here and stay here, but most all Africans eventually go back home without their American wives.
One woman I know was nearly destroyed when her husband left, he tried to take their 2 girls back to Africa but not his wife, the children are accepted, but not the wife. She went there and was sent away. Her husband had another wife, and he was Ghanian, and yes, Africans still have more than one wife. Even if American African wives could go back to Africa they cannot accept the cultural lifestyle. Another reason they are not taken home. Life in the cities is changing though, city dwellers don't as often take more that one wife. However they are often ostracized from their ancestral group because they are changing their life style.
I have met a few Africans who married here and stayed here with their American wives. Primarily because they themselves could not go home. While here in school there was a coup in their country and they were part of the losing group, and so were more or less exiled from their country.
I dated a Nigerian while working on my masters degree and have hung out with many Africans of various cultures, then and now, but some things remain the same. Many of them had a wife sent here from Africa if they had to stay in America several years. Not too long ago, in the Detroit suburbs, there was a story in the news about a Nigerian couple who would not let their daughter go to her prom unless she went with a Nigerian. They imported one for her to go to the prom with. So again, I stand by what I say. American wives don't go home to Africa.
Hopefully every GOP presidential campaign rally in the future will be full of these ridiculous caricatures of informed American voters, the anti-intellectual angle that was intended to misdirect the mainstream has deflected back into your own party base in the vacuum of legitimate ideas, It's wonderful how your own can make clowns of your of party so much better than liberals ever could, from self-righteous vainglorious cheaters, and homebreakers, to right-wing terror-committing extremists, to fringe conspiracy theorists unappeased by rationality or reason, I might send the RNC a few bucks to keep up the great work, P.S. great stuff steele with the the chicken and potatoe salad bribe to blacks, priceless, that a get em'
We are on the threshold of a Constitutional crisis. Obama hopes to ride out the storm by making it very embarrassing for all concerned to depose him.
AND then, even after all that nonsense has to be swallowed, you expect us to believe that President Obama chose to teach Constitutional Law at THE MOST RIGHT-WING top-tier law school in the country? Univ. of Chicago is where Richard Posner is. It's where classic neoconservative thought is centered. It is NOT the place where you'd go as a black man to hide out while you're scheming how to take over the free world right from under the nose of the white men in power.
NONE of what you argue is plausible. I don't even know why I bother trying to refute your absurdities with facts; it isn't as though you have the slightest interest in what is actually true or even POSSIBLE.
You are right. You have brought your paranoia with you from where ever it is you came from. There is no logic to YOUR reasoning, but don't let that stop you.
And it's well-read, by the way. You're right about one thing. "It is very clear that there are irregularities here." But all the irregularities emanate from YOU, not from President Obama.
his Constitutional Law degree and sneak into the White House. President Obama was
elected by a hugh majority of the American people. He did not sneak into the White House. Others on this site have commented on him being a natural born citizen, having a valid passport and going through extensive investigations by the Government agencies prior to becoming President. In addition, President Obama provided a copy of his birth certificate online during the primaries and the general election. The people who continue this conspiracy theory are either racists or nuts!
>Apes don't read philosophy!
>Yes, they do... they just don't UNDERSTAND it.
Keep digging the hole. Just remember it's yours - not his, you've fallen into.
Theirs is a separate reality.
The requirements for citizenship, and its very definition in American statute law, have changed since the Constitution was ratified in 1788. Congress first recognized the citizenship of children born to U.S. parents overseas on March 26, 1790, stating that "the children of citizens of the United States, that may be born beyond sea, or out of the limits of the United States, shall be considered as natural born citizens: Provided, That the right of citizenship shall not descend to persons whose fathers have never been resident in the United States."[10] To date, the Naturalization Act of 1790 has been the only U.S. law explicitly conferring "natural born" citizenship. In 1795, Congress removed the words "natural born" from the law; the Naturalization Act of 1795 says only that foreign-born children of American parents "shall be considered as citizens of the United States."[11]
It doesn't matter whether Obama was born in Hawaii or not. His mother was a U.S. citizen. His father resided in the U.S. when Barack was conceived. He is a natural born citizen. This is nothing more than the wingnuts looking for an excuse to disallow the outcome of the 2008 election.
He's your president now just as Bush was last year when the sane would rather have had just about anyone else in the job.
Get over it.
I went to get my Passport as an adult and because she had been dead for many years, it involved proving that she lived in the U.S. for 4 years after her 14th birthday (which of course she had) and prove her birth in the U.S. and the mariage certs of her parents, etc. - all reasonable stuff).
It was simple process. The citizenship of my Father was never discussed - one of my parents was an Amercian who lived in the U.S. for at least 4 years after the age of 14 - so I am an American AND SO IS OBAMA.
Why can't someone simply put an end to thios racist crap?
I have never seen my birth certificate, although I'm sure I could order a duplicate if I needed one. I know a lot of Americans who don't have their original birth certificate.
Really as simple as that.
and even if he was born her he rescinded his citizenship in Indonesia. so either way it's VOID.
The only VOID is the one between your ears.
Just get used to saying President Barack Hussein Obama. You'll get plenty of chances in the next 7 and a half years.
And on a related note.. where's your original birth certificate?
"5. Mr. Obama did not lose his U.S. Citizenship based on the acts of his parents, including adoption by an Indonesian citizen. The Court held that no action taken by the parents of an American child can strip that child of his citizenship. The court cited the 1952 Immigration & Nationality Act, Title III, Chapter 3, Sections 349 and 355, which was in effect in the late 1960s when Obama went to Indonesia, and which stated that a minor does not lose his US citizenship upon the naturalization of his parents or any other actions of his parents, so long as the minor returns to the US and establishes permanent US residency before the age of 21. Thus the adoption of Obama did not serve to strip him of his U.S. citizenship. Furthermore, the Court held that traveling on a foreign passport does not strip an American of his citizenship. The Court noted first that there was no evidence that Mr. Obama traveled on an Indonesian passport (Mr. Berg and others never provided any evidence of this claim or any other of the claims.) Nonetheless, the court held that such travel does not divest an American of his citizenship."
Suck harder on those Sour Grapes, Birfers.
http://wikileaks.org/wiki/Obama_1961_birth_anno...
Unless someone time-travelled to fake this evidence, then Barack Obama WAS born in Honolulu, Hawaii
Of course, they were actually elaborate microfilm forgeries.
NOT.
Republicans don't seem to know the bible well, they're too busy thumping it.
The Devil is the great accuser who attempts to mislead the children of men, by convincing them that their particular sinfulness is to great to be forgiven, once one gives up on themselves they find it difficult to approach the throne of grace, repent, be forgiven so they can continue on living a enlightened life, unbounded by the sin inherent to the natural human condition.
God doesn't support any killing, he sent his son to die for us all, no more death is necessary for truth and righteousness, only repentance and acceptance through faith.
Only if you so chose however, none of this is binding.
http://www.newshounds.us/2009/07/16/fox_continu...
The fact that neither Hannity nor Fox bothered to look beyond Cook's claims for their reporting also speaks volumes.
Those who question President Obama's birth in Hawaii are desperate for an issue to derail a successful President's agenda, which hopefully will restore the country to the respect it had before George Bush was elected President by the vote of one Supreme Court Justice, and proceeded almost to wreck the country.
Rush Limbaugh is no standard for anything except stupidty, and that applies double to his audience and the entire audience of Fox Noise. No, I am not nice to neocon conservatives. To me the F in "Fox" only stands for ONE word-and you can infer what that word is. Hint-it isn't "F"air.
... Earlier today, Quon said Cook submitted a formal written request to Human Resources Command-St. Louis on May 8, 2009 volunteering to serve one year in Afghanistan with Special Operations Command, U.S. Army Central Command, beginning July 15, 2009. The soldier's orders were issued on June 9, Quon said.
"A reserve soldier who volunteers for an active duty tour may ask for a revocation of orders up until the day he is scheduled to report for active duty," Quon said.
As the "milblog" Mudville Gazette notes:
In short - Cook never had to go in the first place. Unlike most soldiers who deploy as part of a unit, Cook - a reservist - had volunteered to go as an individual augmentee. The Army generally seeks volunteers to fill such assignments first - if no one does so then a non-volunteer is tapped.
... Even without going to court, the Army says - essentially - hey, no problem. You were the one who wanted to go in the first place.
Actually, there is one "Major" problem. Because Cook waited to the last minute to take this action, either someone is going to get a very short notice non-volunteer assignment, or else the unit in Afghanistan will have to get by without one soldier for a while. Since that soldier would be a field grade officer, it's likely that the position will be of some significance.
This is something they cooked up several months ago in order to get some publicity. What a bunch of losers!.
Cook deserve's a nice lawsuit, or some jail time. This was most certainly planned and done so with the intention of defaming Obama's name in an attempts to politicize/legitimize a right-wing conspiracy theory steeped in racism.
o wait. Devry was fresh out o'degrees that day?
and NEWSFLASH. he did. during the damned primaries. Use the interwebs for something oher than porn and fundie sites and you might know this.
:D
and nobody else has released coursework, so what's the point and besides that we known that this President was in the top of his class, and the Editor of the Harvard Law Review where he was well respected by both conservative and progressive contributors alike by the way.
Funny how we harp on Obama's failure to appease your unjust cynicism of his credentials, when we know full well John McCain was kicked out for failing grades, only to be reinstated against policy, likely due to his family's long legacy at the Academy and still ended up at the bottom of his class, but failure on his part is acceptable, and reasonable huh?
I wonder why?
Duh.
indeed
In Virgina the GOP has a woman who says we should make changes via the "bullet box" versus the ballet box, you've got plenty of members continuing to deny any form of climate change, and yesterday I see a poll that says 72% of Republicans think Sarah Palin would be great as a President.
Dr. Sam
HE HAS PROVIDED THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE! YOU'VE SEEN IT!
Hawaiian officials have provided and authenticated it.
Is Hawaii just a pretend state to you or something.
WHAT DO YOU NEED TO UNDERSTAND!
Must he go to each of your homes with it in a manilla envelope and let you touch it!
HE WON...LET IT GO!
But thanks for playing.
http://www.factcheck.org/askfactcheck/has_obama...
We could far more easily challenge everything the executive branch did from 2000-2004 on the basis that the Supreme Court had no jurisdiction to decide that election!
Even if there were an error with President Obama's birth certificate...his mother was still an American citizen when he was born. Period. End of story. So everyone else can collect their tinfoil hats and go back home. If you all hurry, you may be in time to catch the last 2 hours and 45 minutes of Rush's broadcast...
The best part is that Cook's actual job was working for a defense contractor. And of course, the military said that now that he sued the Army, he is not welcome on military property. Instead of getting to look at President Obama's birth certificate, now Cook can spend all the time he wants studying his own pink slip.
President Barack Hussein Obama will be President until the end of his second term.
Your post shows that you have no logical skills. President Obama HAS a passport. That means he has satisfied ALL requirements of proving that he is who he says he is, including without limitation producing a birth certificate.
It HAS been provided, and is easily available online. But you aren't one to let facts get in the way of your argument, are you? Tell me, when John McCain had to take the microphone away from you, just how silly did you feel for saying President Obama is an "Arab?"
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in...
Are you people HIGH? It is a birth certificate issued by the state of Hawaii, it looks almost identical to the one I have that says I was born two years later and in a different state, down to the weird cross hatching background. So let me get this straight, a man whom two years ago hardly anyone would have ever thought would have ascended to to the presidency, PROACTIVELY perpetrated a mass conspiracy involving the State of Hawaii, a doctor, attending nurses, his parents and his grandparents who put an ad of congratulations in a local Hawaiian paper a week later KNOWING that eventually his citizenship would be questioned?
Start passing out the foil hats!
The governer of California could never run for a United States Office because - GUESS WHAT? He is not a U.S. born citizen. So what makes you think they are going to ignore that in order to let the POTUS be in his position? You idiots need to go away.
Traitors and secessionists.
..
Don't Tread On Me! A$$HOLE!!
"Ah. So you've chosen to remain an America-hating scofflaw conspiracy nut and an official pinhead. I am saddened by your choice."
Logged in as Randwulf
Randwulf 2 minutes ago
You know. I'm 54 years old. I registered for the draft when I was 17. I was drafted three days after my 18th birthday. I avoided going into the army by basically joining the Marine Corps. I had in fact already been accepted into one of their commissioning programs prior to being drafted.
I'm an Eagle Scout, university graduate, former USMC officer, holder a master's degree from a major university and a self-employed construction manager for the past 20 years. I have never taken money form the US government for anything other than my scholarship from the Naval ROTC program in which I enrolled to be commissioned upon graduation and the pay I received while on active duty. I don't ask much from government. I expect it to defend our shores, maintain a highway system and leave me and the rest of the citizenry alone. I believe in small government and free enterprise. I do expect my government not to lie or withhold information from me. They are supposed to work for and be responsible to US.
So if that makes me "an American-hating scofflaw conspiracy nut and an official pinhead" well, I plead guilty. I guess I just don't measure up to what the NEW AMERICAN type is supposed to be. But I was saluting the flag and doing my duty, while others were burning and spitting on flags. I was working when others were laying around waiting for their welfare checks. I proudly wore the uniform and followed my orders while others grew out their hair and bad-mouthed their country. Now those people are calling ME "America-hating"? Whatever.
I distinctly remember the Navy requiring me to get them a copy of my original, long-form BC in order to enter my officer training program to become a 2nd Lt. It was a photocopy of the original with a stamp and official's signature on it. Notarized. I still have that in a file with my Honorable Discharge.
I had no misgivings about producing it for the Naval authority since it was required. That is just to be a 2nd Lt. So now I wonder why the Commander in Chief has a problem handing over a copy of his. That should "sadden" you more than my "American-hating" I should think.
Once would be great!
Oh, and we just want to see if it said "negro" which would have been the right term at that time or if it said "African" which is something that has been cooked up by liberals in recent years.
It would be a blotch on your status as a productive, loyal American, however, to refuse to see the facts... as countless Conservative writers, court opinions, official inquiries, etc. have come up with no evidence whatsoever that Obama was not born in Hawaii, or that he ever renounced the citizenship accorded him by birth, and have found no substance to these charges.
Do you really think someone forged the microfilm copies of his birth announcements in Hawaii newspapers? Do you really think the Hawaii Bureau of Records personnel are committing deliberate fraud? Do you understand that even though COLBs can be had for naturalized Hawaiians, they always list place of foreign birth? That every record of his entire life that showed "place of birth," even Indonesian elementary school records, lists Hawaii? That it is illegal to remove an original birth certificate from the vault in HI or photograph it? That every State has its own laws regarding these certificates, negating the arguments that "I had to show mine" and "I got the 'long form' etc.?
In questioning the legitimacy of the office of the President, you have lent your support to a dangerous, wasteful, baseless attack on Mr. Obama, which he does not deserve, and is unworthy of a man of your accomplishments. I urge you to repudiate it.
My calling Birthers "America-haters" is partially tongue-in-cheek. It is a reaction to the many long years those of us who protested Mr. Bush's Iraq war and his trampling on Constitutional Rights had to endure; that for doing so (never once, mind you, advocating violent protest or government overthrow) WE were called "America-haters," and I wanted Birthers to see how it feels.
I have one ancestor who emigrated from Ireland and fought alongside Ethan Allen, and another who was a minor Confederate General. My Great Uncle Adm. Frank Lyon signed the surrender papers with the Japanese aboard the USS Missouri. The notion that I am 'against the USA' is abhorrent to the bottom of my soul, and it was maddening.
But as I said, I absolutely retract my remarks to you, Sir. You may be mistaken, but I have no reason to suspect or accuse you of disloyalty.
May your days be long and prosperous.
Obama has an advantage over me . . . his mother was a lifelong citizen of the US who had not renounced her citizenship. I am satisfied that he was born in Hawaii where his mother and family lived but even if he was born in outerspace, he would be a citizen just like him mom. I'm sure you'd question my documentation since my mother became a US citizen just 30 days before my birth. Further, she was in the hospital for 2 weeks afterward and didn't file the city hall papers until she was released. Hmmm. Sounds suspicious to me.
What is wrong with you people? Just as John McCain, who was born in Panama (unclear if he was born on US base or in hospital off base), is a natural born citizen. Just like the kids of service people and diplomats stationed around the world are citizens. Just like ex-pats working for private global corporations off shore give birth to US citizens. Just like women traveling give birth to US citizens, usually unexpectedly. Look past your obsession with the "original" document and review the circumstances in totality.
I suggest you go to snopes to see certification of his birth. Snopes is a non-partisan fact check site.
Randwulf, with your level of education and achievement, what reason do you have for not taking the time to read Immigration, Naturalization, and Citizenship requirements on the government website and other factual information before adopting your stance? Had you done so, you would not be able to propound this false claim.
Considering the name of your website, your article is not very open-minded. You and the commenters who insult persons who question Obama's eligibility only show your ignorance of the subject matter.
The Constitution requires that the President be a "natural born" U.S. citizen, but does not define natural born. The definition has been addressed only once since the Constitution was written, in Minor v. Happersett. In that case the U.S.Supreme Court wrote that a person born in the U.S. to U.S. citizens was natural born. The court stated that it had doubts about persons born under any other circumstances. Such circumstances would include one parent not being a U.S. citizen, as is the case with Obama. They would also obviously include the birth of a person outside the U.S., which might also apply to Obama. The public has never seen his long form birth certificate, showing the hospital and attending physician. The COLB Obama posted his on FightTheSmears website was first posted on the Daily Kos website. Is that not peculiar?
I would have thought that a top-notch university such as Northwestern would have taught you to do some actual historical research before writing such a confident article about "frivolous" lawsuits. It is not the fault of persons like me that the political and legal systems have failed the
American public on this issue.
"The Constitution requires that the President be a "natural born" U.S. citizen, but does not define natural born."
So you are suggesting that the supreme court do what besides defining "natural born" to facilitate your particular political agenda, isn't that activism.
Oh I forgot you need to be an "other" ruling against the "status quo" to be an activist according to Sen. Grahm, get out of here with the fluff. Your entire point is frivilous as well.
Great Article Weigel
President Obama is my President.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/ar...
Read the comments by all the eminent lawyers talking about how unclear the law is. McCain produced his documentation. Why does the same law not apply to Obama?
Wow. My head hurts. For a minute there it sounded like you were making sense. Because that's the law. President Obama's mother was American. He could have been born on the polar ice cap. He's American.
And let's see, what else did you say? Oh yeah -- "who would dare to question the rights of a black candidate?" Hmmm. I will answer that for you since you seem to have forgotten the entire general election campaign. Answer: The Republican Party.
Or did you forget all those ads about Ayers, the stupid birth certificate lawsuit, and the parade of non-sense the GOP subjected us to? The birth certificate thing was dealt with explicitly during the campaign. Even World Net Daily said the b.c. is legitimate.
You're just embarrassing yourself and scaring Democrats into donating to the President's re-election campaign.
I would imagine the "---who would dare to question the rights of a black candidate?" line was an attempt at sarcasm right
who would illegitimately question the birth state of a black candidate? Well I'll take a swing...
Those who exist in the same ideological echo chamber as the unconfirmed SCOTUS nominee with a history of racist slurs who just happens to head the opposition's assault of a latina Judge with a 17 year history of unbias decisions following the letter of the law.
Ridiculousness, yeah the state of Hawaii knew some 40 years ago that this child would run for the Presidency one day in 2008 right?
Say that in the mirror a few times, and see if Lee Atwater appears as you reflection.
Refute that.
that the Republicans has done, Bill Clinton tried to reform Healthcare and the Repub's were against that and nothing got done.
No President Obama is trying again and all they are thinking about is how much TAX will the RICH have to pay, not thinking
about the Middle Class who has been paying along.
They will find every excuse in the book to keep Healthcare the way it is going up every year for the working and the retired people.
Is Weigel accusing her of breaking that law?
Either that, or Weigel is trying to mislead again. If she didn't break the law, then she didn't verify the certificate that's pictured on Obama's site. In other words, we're back to square one: there's no guarantee that what's shown on Obama's site matches what HI has on file.
If you want the truth about this issue - no speculation, no tinfoil hat talk, and no attempts to mislead such as Weigel engages in - see my completely fact-based overview.
As you and those like you are so sure that President Obama was born elsewhere...go find the THAT PROOF!
As for all the legislative efforts....a waste of taxpayers dollars! But someone is making money off of all this...are you? Who is paying for the lawsuits...as we know that lawyers rarely really work for free.
How dare they try to take our wonderful president away from us!!!!!!!
He is taking himself away from you by refusing to come clean on his own.
He is taking HIMSELF away from you with every deception he continues.
What mainsteam news has it entered. They are all a-hush over it. The last thing they want is for it to spill over into TV land. It has already gone viral on the net and the rest of the world is amazed that nothing has been done to find out the truth in the matter. Oh, and most of the people of Kenya believe Obama was born in Mombasa, just as his step-grandmother Sarah stated.
Me thinks Randwulf and his ilk need to go back to McGuffey's Reader or the tales of Dick & Jane. If they study the text really hard, maybe they will learn how to read.
It's fun watching right wingnut heads explode.
He's a Muslim too.....and the White House is heated with a furnace full of aborted fetuses....but only the white ones....
LOLOLOL
Sigh. It doesn't matter. I know conspiracy theorists only use facts as fuel to further their conspiracies.
All this had somehow gone unnoticed when President Obama was running for prior public office. Don't ask me how. I'm pulling sh*t outta my @ss as fast as I can just to get this far...
Geez, being a conspiracy theorist is easy. Facts that don't support the conspiracy just go to show HOW DEEP AND PERVASIVE the conspiracy really is!!!!
In the end, it all stems from an effort to turn away from the real dangers that society faces. That's my best take on it. And it only serves to further the same purpose: it keeps them - and others - from confronting the real dangers that society faces.
Maybe that's the real danger of it?
Why are they too stupid to get this?
JDC
http://democracyhypocrisy.blogspot.com/
Strangely enough, many of Obama's past record were sealed. Like I said before, if you want this to end, simply show the Birth Certificate. That is all he has to do. I dont know if he has it or not but it sure makes you wonder why he has refused to release it for at least a year now.
I'll wait.
JDC
http://democracyhypocrisy.blogspot.com/
Original documents are NEVER, EVER, EVER released from any Country Registrar's office. Instead, all they can release is what they call a document that "Certifies" that there is on file with the Registrar's office an official birth or death announcement.
Obama would not have a valid passport without that original birth being on record. Idiots. Pure, gullible idiots to believe this stuff when FactCheck.Org (a right-leaning group btw) has dismissed this whole charade.
Fox News, et al has managed to make a whole lot of people paranoid and this paranoia is so close to what certain elements in Germany were doing before WW2.
The truth is that there are plenty of people in this here United States who to this day do not recognize a black man as anything but 3/5's a human being. Case-in-point.... my mother and father-in-law are still caught up with family losses from the Civil War.
I believe the president could probably get a good photocopy released or arrange for the original to be examined by some unbiased third party examiners of several of them, if he weren't afraid to show it. There should be a long form there in the file. Or not.
Many states release photocopies of the original long form on request.
His mother is from Kansas. She is an American citizen. That makes her children American citizens. Are birthers saying that a Mexican woman can come into this country and give birth to an Amercian citizen, but a girl from Kansas cannot?
Are they saying that because his father had British citizenship, that trumps the mother's birthright? Do the birthers know of a little thing called "The Revolutionary War" where we severed ties with England?
And the Constitution reads the same no matter what size it is.
By claiming the Hawaii COLB is not sufficient, Birfers are advocating ignoring Hawaii State law, and accusing their Bureau of Records personnel of fraud.
The claims are nonsense. Here's one Court Opinion:
The court finds the claims against Mr. Obama’s citizenship “wholly unpersuasive and bordering on the frivolous, especially in light of the complete absence of any first-hand evidence on any critical issue” and further classifies it as “conspiracy theory of the lowest sort, fueled by nothing than internet rumor and those who truly want to believe egging each other on.”
The Constitution doesn't get more specific than that. US Laws were written to supplement the Constitution and clarify what being a "natural-born US citizen" is.
Do you have any idea how ironic it is when someone who has NO idea what the Constitution says try to call other people out for the same?
What do Rush Limbaugh and god have in common?
Answer: Neither served in the military in spite of being physically fit.
Oh. Excuse me. There's that little matter of Rush being excused from the draft because of a boil on his a$$. The jury's still out on weather or not Jesus has a similar malady.
With all the problems Americans are struggling with today the Republicans has nothing better to do than question the
Birth Certificate of the President Obama six month into his Presidency, this is some kind of sick what must the World
think of this country.
I see many of you liberals want to pounce on those asking him show it. Excuse me but common sense says end the speculation by showing it. If he does indeed have the stupid thing, then doesnt it make you wonder why he has yet to show it? Why is he fighting it if there is nothing to hide?
Some of you are so damn quick to pounce on anyone who dares question your saviour, you fail to see the common sense in all of this. Let me break it down one more time for you that are apparently really really slow.
IF OBAMA WOULD STOP FIGHTING IT AND JUST SHOW THE BIRTH CERTIFICATE....ALL THIS GOES AWAY.
There, you get it now?!
Show the real certificate and it all goes away. It is that damn simple.
also, please, more CAPZ LOCK!
This is not true. The certificate of live birth, which is Hawaii's name for what is commonly known as a birth certificate, is computer generated from records that the state certifies to be correct.
Now, please stop asking for the same thing over and over again. It just makes you like silly and mean-spirited.
Now please stop! This is really getting old.
Toto: Me, too! I'VE got more brains than this a$$h@t!!
I realize you look to Obama as your King but he's no king and hes no saviour.
Now, please stop saying he hasn't shown it. You have seen it with your own eyes if you clicked on this link. Also, I recommend reading Dreams From My Father. It explains all about his background and was written long before he had decided on a political career.
Shame.
No the other hand being a Gay Muslim he may not have time for all of the above as he is probably tied up (and I don’t mean that in a sexual way) with redecorating the Whitehouse not to mention prayer 5 times a day. It’s all about color.
Did I mention he’s not a citizen.
IF OBAMA WOULD STOP FIGHTING IT AND JUST SHOW THE REAL BIRTH CERTIFICATE....ALL THIS GOES AWAY.
There, you get it now?!
If he has it great, then the people who question it can move on. If he doesnt then there is a problem and it needs to be looked at. I dont know if he has it or not but common sense tells me if he's put a a fight for a year now in refusing to show it or address it, it kinda makes you wonder why.
Tell you what - go down to the county where you were born and ask to see your "real birth certificate". Let us know what happens.
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/.shared/image.h...
The people who think he doesn't have a birth certificate are so blinded by their racism and hatred, that they simply ignore the fact that Obama - certifiably and undeniably - has one. The state of Hawaii has already proven this beyond any reasonable doubt.
Guess what? I strongly believe President Obama's refusal to produce his birth certificate is his way to EF with you ignorant, inbred birthers. He produced a legitimate birth certificate, which you asinine people refuse to accept. Accordingly, Obama is not dealing with this silliness. However, it must be fun from his point of view to sit back and watch so many of you idiots wasting your time and money on law suits. I'm getting a kick out of that too. One thing all of you fail to acknowledge... Obama is an extremely brilliant and shrewd politician. He will have the last laugh in this matter. Deal with it!
I have no theory if he was born in Hawaii or not but the fight and refusal he is putting up makes me wonder.
Do you have dementia? i live in california and all we heard from the retardlicans was that schwarzenegger was the next reagan and your #1 goal, other than to send more americans to die for iraq's oil, was to get rid of the born in the us requirement so you could start parading Arnold for the presidency. so NOW that the dark skinned guy actually won, you are running 180 degrees in the other direction.
stability and consistency is best when raising children and dogs/cats - now to start trying to raise the knee jerk retardlicans the same way and there might be some sanity restored to the world
What's your fricking point?
You rethugs, you bunch of ignorant fat-ass Dopes,. How about bombing some abortion clinics or killing innocent Doctors for fun?
Haven't you done enough damage in the name of religious Christian republican family values such as racism, hate, greed, bigotry and intolerance?
After all it's what Jesus would "never" do.
McCain's family was also in the military and apart of the military when that birth occurred. Oh and the democrats made sure McCain had to prove all that, yet when something simple is asked of your saviour, people like you get offended and angry.
See, I can have a conversation without being hateful and angry. Why cant you? You mustve been among the many liberals that showed nothing but absolute hate for our previous President, yet here you are spewing this garbage.
We have bigger issues ahead of us, and you are content to just sit there and throw stones from the sandbox. Enough already. Admit that you don't like him because he doesn't look like you and be done with it already.
Love how you always roll out the lack of tolerance from the Left right before you spew your ugliness.
Here is one for you - love how you repubs always roll out the family values and sanctity of marriage...
Then your leaders get caught with their dicks in the wrong places.
JDC
http://democracyhypocrisy.blogspot.com/
Why should we suffer fools? You are worthless to society as a whole, useless at making any type of rational argument, and really the only thing you're good for is making us laugh at your ever-increasing stupidity.
Also, why shouldn't we be hateful and angry at how far our society has fallen to create people with such inability to think for themselves, use rational thought, logic, and reason? We should be past angry at the dumbing down of our society. We should be downright hateful that people like you even exist. You should be WAY smarter. It's simply indicative of incredibly poor educating.
Seriously, Jesus did not advocate MURDER and BOMBING and KILLING Dr's - like your group does - so you are, by definition, a complete hypocrit
if they determine who you like or dislike, well then that is your burden not mine.
for how many years has blimpbaugh the druggie, been slinging crap all over the airwaves?
way before clinton took office was this obese man sliming up the airwaves towards
who he hated so don't take no high road on this crap.
lots of entertainers make jokes in bad taste but they aren't making policy nor
do they determine who or whom i vote for.
get real akarmenia1
SO, when those SAME rethuglicans who screamed for Clinton to resign over a marital infidelity are almost ALL shown to be committing marital infidelity, and bribing the mistress' families to shut up, etc etc OF COURSE it needs to be given AT LEAST the same amount of attention that Rethugs gave Clinton - that's just playing fair.
i know you can't handle that - you want Darth and Jr back in office so they can strip more rights away from citizens, allow more massive terror attacks to occur in the us (they were in charge of protecting us on 9/11 and they DID NOT) and all that dictatorial crap we suffered for 8 years.
sorry buddy, can fool all of the people some of the time, & some of the people all of the time, but not all of the people all of the time - oh yeah, you might want to teach Jr that phrase, since as the president and leader of the most powerful country in the world he couldn't even get through the first paranthetical phrase before screwing that up like he did this whole country.
The fact of the matter is that while Republicans were impeaching for purgery, Democrats were yelling at the top of their lungs that what goes on in the bedroom of politicians is none of our business. Now all of the sudden it's a huge deal when GOPers do it. I agree, though, that all politicians who cheat on their spouses should be put on the spotlight. I'm glad that you've come around to understanding that infidelity is a serious offense and ought to be given attention. The next step is to stop complaining when Repubs do it and then praising the Huffington Post when they do it.
Double standard is the name of the liberal game.
But when someone has the nerve to comment on "family values" and rail against people who have affairs claiming they should resign from office, and then they get caught having an affair, it is not the extramarital sex that liberals like to point out, it's the blatant hypocrisy.
I wouldn't expect a con to recognize hypocrisy, or to see the big deal, since it's the only way you know how to function, but you could at least try to figure out what people are actually complaining about instead of making sh!t up as you go along (although I know that's also instinctual for you people).
don't you have anything with substance? have you already finished reading the national
enquirer and have nothing else to whine about? this is a non-issue and the fact that for some reason you wish to evade reality is your issue. so nobody i know regards our president as
anyone other than a man (except you) and as far as most of America? you are just a loser
and have some real profound mental issues...bet you temper is quick to ignite and nobody around you is right but you...
yep...
THERE, YOU GET IT NOW??
you are a loser.
Hey Whigs... I mean Republicans, you lost, your out of touch. Your experiment for the last 30 years failed. This country is in deep crap because of your policies and beliefs.
Go away!! This country has had enough of you!!!
Keep it up. You might get the White House back again in 2112. Maybe.
and all of this 'we're proud to be retarded, just like Jr is' is making any independent with a modicum of a brain run like the wind away from the rep party.
so funny - does anyone remember in 2005/06 when ALL of the Rethugs were trying to tout the english mangling, cocaine fried frat boy Jr as the best American president ever? while eating freedom fries?
how can anyone take any of these guys seriously and not want to put them into a white, strapped jacket?
So she's using propaganda and disinformation to promote a rabid and dishonest hate campaign against the first black president.
Makes complete sense to me.
get over it people, something should be ringing in your ears right now like
"hey...we lost, must be that we have the wrong idea about Americans...
they don't like our principles..."
like, duh...
they will never get it.
There would be no issue here is he showed his BIRTH CERTIFICATE and not a easily attainable Certificate of Live Birth. The matter would have been put to rest by now. Some men in the miliary have refused to take any orders for deployment until a birth certificate is shown. They have every right to do so. So please, Mr. Obama, just show your damn birth certificate! WHy is that so damn hard?
I can tell you this, however, if you ever got a passport or ran for office after 9/11/2001, you were subjected to amazingly stringent background checks. And given that it was the Bush Administration who would have handled those background checks - something tells me that they would have flagged Obama, if there had been a problem.
Really...read a book sometime...stop reinforcing the stereotype.
Soldiers who refuse to serve or take orders because of this should be sent to court. Such soldiers are despicable cowards and very clearly looking for an excuse not to serve our country.
They need to be asked; Do you believe in the United States of America or do you believe in looney conspiracy theories that only serve to hurt America? Would you choose to stand up and defend America or would you cower and use conspiracy theories as an excuse to not fight?
Enough of this b.s.
If you choose to serve America in our military you serve America - not conspiracy theories and [actually] not any one politician. You serve an idea that is America. It goes way way beyond the things you do not like about a sitting president.
"If only one parent is a U.S. Citizen at
the time of ones birth, that parent must have resided in the United States
for minimum ten years, five of which must be after the age of 16."
O's mother was only 18 and does not meet this test. She did not and can not pass her citizenship to her son. Sorry you don't like how the law is written.
here is your MASSIVE mistake - that quoted requirement is for U.S. Citizens that become U.S. Citizens after having moved here from ANOTHER COUNTRY -
if the parent is a U.S. Citizen from birth, born in this country like O's mom was, then that requirement does NOT apply.
but if you want to carry water for it fine - let's deport every and all people born to parents in the US that were under the age of 26 - because in your little mind they are not U.S Citizens so they must be illegal aliens -
and let's start with Trigg Palin ... his parents were both under 18 when he was born so get his illegal alien ass out of the country, right? birthers, here is your next cause!!! DEPORT TRIGG PALIN!
see - following retardlican logic will get you into trouble ...
Oh, that's right. Facts mean nothing to you idiots.
Whats the problem? What is he hiding?
This is a very simple request and Obama still refuses to show us all. Obama can end it by showing the long birth certificate, but wont. This tells me and many others he is lieing.
He was born in Mombasa, Kenya. He used the name of Barry Soetoro to go to school. WHO IS THIS MAN? And by the way, now when did he have his name changed? Every one knew him as Barry tell when?
kwiley9711
You accuse the president of lying about where he was born, and yet you provide no evidence to support your claims. This is not "logic and common sense," as Chuck below asserts; this is just the paranoid delusion of partisanship of the worst kind.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ann_Dunham
Drives them crazy. Literally.
Simple as that.
If some believe he should have to show it, that is their right. This man is the top man in the country. If people want proof of his citizenship so be it. Give them the proof, they shut up, end of story.
Mean while, your saviour is running up debt to disasterous records, continues to lie about transparency, has lobbyists all over DC, etc etc and you come here to complain, hate, and spew your typical garbage. Why all the hate? You control the White House. You control Congress. Why cant you liberals EVER be happy? LOL its sad but funny at the same time how some of you, the only thing you know is how to be angry and hate
He DID produce the stupid birth certificate. The news media covered it. Factcheck.org covered it. Snopes.com covered it. Even freakin' World News Daily covered it. ALL of them say there is no controversy.
"If some believe he should have to show it, that is their right." What? Do you have any notion of what a legal right is? Here's a hint. It has nothing to do with what you believe. President Obama HAS shown his birth certificate to the public, but he has never HAD to do so. And someone else's "belief" to the contrary doesn't mean anything.
For example, it is my "belief" that former President George Bush should have to sit before Congress and testify under oath about every single thing he has done wrong that we do not yet know about, to save us the hassle of looking under all the rocks to see what's hiding under each one. Does my belief have ANYTHING to do with a "right" to make the President do that? Of course not. But then I know what legal rights are and you do not. And more to the point, I care about the truth and you do not.
Do us all a favor. When the subject is something as ludicrous as birthers, just don't post anything. It is better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak up and remove all doubt.
What I, however, don't understand is how these birthers can lambaste the president and "liberals [who] are 100% certain Obama is a born citizen" while decrying the same "liberals" for simply asking questions about Trig Palin's birth. The difference between the two is that President Obama provided the evidence when asked, while former Governor Palin didn't. I'm not saying or insinuating that Trig isn't her baby, or wasn't born in exactly the way she described, or anything of the sort; frankly, I don't care. However, it seems rather odd to me that concrete evidence is not enough for a Democrat, but a complete and utter lack of evidence is more than enough for a Republican.
And I don't have any hate, dude. Isn't it conservatives who always accuse liberals of being tree-hugging hippies? And aren't hippies supposed to be all about peace and love? Heh.
Because he HAS shown his birth certificate. The complaint is with morons like you who refuse to accept any level of evidence. No matter how many times the evidence is presented, it won't be good enough.
As for "spewing your typical garbage".....how dare you accuse others of spewing garbage when you're too stupid to read a g0damn birth certificate and accept that there is no giant, multi-country and multi-state conspiracy that would be required to fake it. The level of idiocy here is astonishing.
The sad thing is, I generally refrain from insulting people by calling them idiots, morons, or stupid, but there is literally no other way to describe birthers. It's amazing you people are capable of tying your own shoes....although that's a huge assumption on my part, I'll admit. I would not be at all surprised to down look at your feet and see velcro.
Now, talk some more about this "birth certificate" thing; and while you're at it, get me some more popcorn and tell me the one about Black Helicopters containing aliens.
Oh, and before I forget, the Founding Fathers were all white. Every last one. Even Thomas Jefferson. He dipped his pen in the plantation ink, but he was white. So, therefore, using Republican reasoning, everything they did is good and nothing they did is bad.
So get over yourself. If you don't like America there are 190 other countries that will take your tax money. Don't forget to write us when you get there.
I'm truely shocked at your incredibly low level of intelligence. How did you even figure out how to post a comment to this site? I can't imagine that you're actually capable of using a mouse and keyboard, what with only two brain cells functioning. You're truely a marvel.
The only reason I began to question it was because for a year now, he has refused to do the simple, easy task of showing it. Now we have some military personnel who want to know if their Commander in Chief is legal. I think it's time he just show it and get it over with.
You KNOW that no government agency will send out an ORIGINAL birth certificate. Go to your safe deposit box and look at yours. I bet you my mortgage that it is a certified copy. You can inspect the original on site, but you cannot take it away, for obvious reasons. You can get a certified copy, or go inspect the original.
You also know that this has been DONE. Every angle has been explored. The original has been inspected. Just look here: http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in...
You also know that there are no military personnel who actually doubt whether President Obama is their legitimate commander in chief. The fact that our heroic men and women are following his orders in ACTUAL COMBAT overseas tells you that. That moron ex-Major Fox or whatever his name is was just pulling a political stunt. He VOLUNTEERED to serve in Afghanistan. He did not need to sue to get out of going, a month later. He is allowed to change his mind, since he's a volunteer. So that's that. No need for a lawsuit. Unless you're a wingnut trying to stir up other wingnuts. His lawyer already filed and LOST several such frivolous lawsuits.
Now go wash out your mouth. You've told enough lies for one day.
The idea that Obama conspired from an early age to hide his place of birth in the hopes that he would one day be President is absurd on its face.
It's a fund raising ploy used to soak up money from the dim and the angry (an upcoming soap opera on Fox).
If you want to hang on to your irrational anger, do not click on this link. Warning!!!
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in...
Knock yourselves out. At least this will keep the yahoos busy for a while.
Oh, the richness that would ensue.
Here is proof that Obama is a US Citizen by definition:
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/citizen.asp
Not that the facts matter. There are many bright republicans. After reading the comments on this board I'd state as fact that those intelligent republicans are not posting here.
The law suits are not going away. They will continue. All he has to do is show his birth certificate and all this stuff ends. Why is that so hard?
"The Department of Hawaiian Home Lands accepts both Certificates of Live Birth (original birth certificate) and Certifications of Live Birth because they are official government records documenting an individual’s birth. The Certificate of Live Birth generally has more information which is useful for genealogical purposes as compared to the Certification of Live Birth which is a computer-generated printout that provides specific details of a person’s birth. Although original birth certificates (Certificates of Live Birth) are preferred for their greater detail, the State Department of Health (DOH) no longer issues Certificates of Live Birth. When a request is made for a copy of a birth certificate, the DOH issues a Certification of Live Birth"
And guess what? Mine says "Certificate of Live Birth", not "Birth Certificate", does this make me an illegal alien?
(Just kidding.)
I just called Janice Okubo (the spokeswoman in the article), and she refused to confirm the impression that Weigel is trying to give.
If you trust Weigel's reporting, see the link.
The things you should be outraged at - lack of manufacturing jobs in the US, our economy in shambles after deregulation of the financial industry, lack of health insurance, lack of healthy and affordable food choices...the base doesn't even care about or blames on someone who has been in office 6 months as opposed to 8 years.
Seriously, read a book sometime.
I am sure if Bush had even brought up the notion of the government taking over the car industry there would be riots in the street, and I am also sure, they would try to find even the slightest bit of information that would discredit (see CBS news military record) him (see past DUI arrests). The left was livid when the supreme court intervened and declared that what Gore was doing was illegal and stopped the re-re-re-recounts in only 4 counties that voted democrat; obviously didn't use Minnesota Al's tactics, using dead people.
The fact is, obama is covering up a lot more information that is very questionable and the liberal media is keeping the truth from us. He is not even taken to task over the lies and promises that have been broken. Where is the outrage over this? Bush was constantly scrutinized over every word he said and they even made fun of the way he said them.
This forum seems to have a lot of people that think that name calling tends to give them the win in debates, but all it does is reinforce the opposing view point.
All I can say about that is, they can osulate my posterior erogenous zone.
He's an embarrassment to every man and woman who is currently serving in the military, not to mention the ones who served and died on foreign soil.
There were PLENTY of progressive soldiers who could have challenged Bush as our legitimate CoC from 2000 to 2004 because of what the Supreme Court did. Did they? No.
You call him a patriot. I call it treasonous and cowardice. We agree to disagree.
Your are death wrong. Maj Stefan is a RACIST and a COWARD. The order to deploy comes from his military leadership. His military leadership eventually gets its order from the branch Sec. The Branch Sec gets direction from the Sec. of Defense. The Sec. of Defense get his objectives from the President. The President does not order any military member. He establishes his intent after consulting with his national defense support staff. Each military branch leader determines which unit goes where, when, and for how long. Therefore, Maj "RACIST/COWARD" Stefan is failing to follow lawful orders established by his commanders.
I hope they put his A$$ away for many years.
Our military personnel have the right to disobey orders, and the military has the right to try them and/or dismiss them. Maj. Stefan will never actually serve this country. You know why? Because he is a threat to unit cohesion. If he doesn't like the president, he can claim anything. That is a threat to every other person in a unit with him. Therefore, he is an unreliable soldier, and an unreliable soldier isn't really a soldier at all.
If you would do the same thing, dude, then why don't you? Please. Sign up for the military, and then refuse your deployment orders. See what happens. I dare ya.
Obama was in a campaign for TWO YEARS!!! You are waiting TWO YEARS TO BRING THIS CR@P UP? If you hated this man so much, why didn't you DISprove his citizenship TWO YEARS AGO! WHY NOW?
Those who refuse to accept the Presidents' legitimacy of citizenship are disgraceful human beings, disprectful to the position and to the man, and are on the verge of starting a civil unrest through their UGLY, SPITEFULE, HATEFUL BIGOTRY!
If you don't post this, I'll know why.
Shouldn't he have been Jr and not the Second (II) - second (II) would mean the name goes from father, jumps his son, and the Grandson of his son is named B. H. OBAMA, II.
Am I right or wrong? I believe I am correct.
Personally I hope by that time I find a nice private abandoned Oil rig .. because we all know I won't be able to avoid an island by this Bummers 2nd year in office.. actually not too many of us will unless we are acorn whitemen type crooks.. anyway far enough offshore not to be thugged, mugged and robbed of my last dime by the bums who voted O bummer in ,, Count me far away from the future Amexico..
Oh and yes.. please anyone who claims the GOP is this or that.. get a real life, out on your own, outside Mom and Dads.. talk about losers.. If I had a bum kid living off me I would.. well I wouldn't and they definitely would not sound like so many possers ..like 8 year olds B****ching over sucking at HALO!
Most politicians are in it for themselves period. So tell me what has O done for you personally has anything in your life changed for the better.. Unless of course this chorus damning white men is O bummers cabinet zombies.. or even better is this what the 31 + Czars do post like little drones.
Real cert or not this Dunce is the WORST Elected official in history with his mentor and resident freak Pelosi, 2nd brain dead Reid,3rd, and the creep Sanford, 4th,
Ok, so why let this issue continue to fester? If the state of Hawaii in fact verifed the facts, then why not just show everyone and be done with it? Why not hold the facts up to the light of day and demonstrate what a bunch of kooks the conspiracy theorists are?
Frankly, I have no dog in the fight. I think the requirement to be a natural born citizen is a crock, an anachronism from the time of the revolution.
It does seem odd though, don't you think, why hide when there is nothing to hide?
They have, and it has been independently verified.
Maybe the Birthers' tinfoil hats are on so tight their eyes have been pulled shut?
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in...
http://www.kitv.com/politics/17860890/detail.html
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthcerti...
Could it be because you are the type of genius who says things like "I done seen it"???
THEY PUBLISHED THE DAMN BIRTH CERTIFICATE. PROOF GIVEN. NOW SHUT UP!!!!!!!!!!
How many times and in how many ways can this be proven? Birth certificates, birth announcements, all readily available at any time.
The only things festering are the brains of the birthers. And the best part is that as the "controversy" enters the mainstream, it makes the Republican look worse and worse, meaning even more time in the wilderness for the do-nothing, ruin everything party.
www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=104163
Again, Congress held hearings for McCain to determain his eligibility, why are they giving Obama a pass?
Yours Faithfully,
Dr. Clement Okon
Put another third into an envelope and mail it to the IRS with a letter explaining that you know some concerned citizens who wanted to reduce the impact of the federal bailouts.
You can keep the final third as a finder's fee for a job well done.
Yeah, but it's a forgery.
Lordy, you're worse than the Dems who attacked the Supreme Court for Bush v. Gore. This isn't a conspiracy!
The certificate of live birth proves that Obama was born in the United States. He meets all requirements of a US Citizen. You and others like you continue to argue this irrelevant position. Obama is a US Citizen, therefore qualifies to run for President of the US and as result qualifies to handily defeat the nonviable republican candidate and the unqualified vp nominee.
I assume you will respond to this and other post with additional repetitive posts about Live Birth Cert vs Birth Cert but the fact is you are arguing a position that has no relevancy to proving Obama's US Citizenship or lack thereof.
If only one parent is a U.S. Citizen at the time of ones birth, that parent must have resided in the United States for minimum ten years, five of which must be after the age of 16.
O's mother doesn't pass this test as she was 18 when he was born. Thanks for playing.
More to the point, please explain how, under your bizarre made-up nonexistent law, ANY teenaged mother could satisfy that requirement? Women can have babies at 16, you know.
So if you are claiming a sixteen year old American woman would have to reside in the US a further 5 years before any of her kids count as citizens, I would say that you shouldn't waste your time on this birth certificate stuff. You're better off just sleeping until it's time to give you your next dosage.
Go away.
Thanks for proving people who believe this garbage are complete morons.
But I think the theory that he traveled back in time to put the birth announcement about him being born in Hawaii into their local newspaper at the time of his birth has real legs!
Where were all you guys when we needed you after 911?
I say let's solve that mystery first then tackle the birth certificate conundrum.
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/citizen.asp
Two facts for people:
Obama was born in Hawaii, as the birth certificate clearly shows.
Hawaii became a state in 1959, Obama was born in 1961.
This means that he's a citizen, pure and simple. If you're born on American soil, regardless of your parents, you're a natural born American. The 14th Amendment states this.
Get over it and find holes about the economy or healthcare or Wall Street or something because this is asinine.
Kinda like your 2 yr old.
Election's over, you lost, he's in, he's black, you can't get over.
If Hillary had won, the'yd have a CT out about her.
Lie and smear, that's what the G-No-P do best.
And they call Dems evil----look in the mirror I say.
Cook--a traitor and should be court-martialed.
And that's only because there's a 1 in 20 quintillion chance that you'd be right about the candidate confusion thing. But there's absolutely no chance that President Obama is Constitutionally ineligible to be elected.
Keep trying; we Democrats need more free advertisements for our party.
If only one parent is a U.S. Citizen at the time of ones birth, that parent must have resided in the United States for minimum ten years, five of which must be after the age of 16.
O's father is not a citizen and O's mother was only 18 so she fails that test.
McCain's parents were both U.S. citizens. Thanks for playing.
(Okay, that's a bit of an over-statement, but honestly, that's a ridiculous comment. George Washington was born in Virginia. Barack Obama was born in Hawaii. The end.)
My point is that the whole "where he was born" nonsense is just that - nonsense.
How about you give an honest to goodness legal citation for that "law".
... and no, right wings blogs are not legitimate citations. You need to link to the actual, nonexistent, statute.
CIA, Secret Service, FBI, State Department and the State of Hawaii step aside! Orly Taitz to the rescue!
Repubs, please keep up your bizarre show. You are showing the world that you accept fantasy instead of truth, lies instead of veracity and conspiracy instead of logic.
I know if I were in your position I would believe the conspiracies too. It is much easier to believe in a massive, leak-proof, decades long conspiracy to elect Barack Obama president than to believe that white people in your country would turn out in droves to vote for a black guy right?
Look, people need to cut the crap and start having a little more respect for the office. Nobody's asking y'all to respect Barack Obama the man, just as no one can make me respect George W. Bush as a man. But you know something? George W. Bush was my president, and Barack Obama is my president. He's yours too. You may not like him, but you should, as an American citizen, at least respect the office.
Lord knows I did not respect George W. Bush but I always referred to him as the President, and I never questioned his right to represent us around the world. I was actually pleased that he went to the Olympics. I thought it was a good sign for the world that our President was there. If Obama had gone, the Republicans would just make insults about whether he's going to play for the Dream Team or waste taxpayers' money by flying Air Force One ALL THE WAY TO CHINA. And back!
His supporters would more often than not retort with - "If you don't like it get out!"
The proverbial shoe has switched locations.
So to all of Pres. Obama's detractors - if you don't like it get out!
Obama was born in Hawaii. Get over it.
They, along with the "family values" candidates who clearly have no family values of their own, are making the word "Republican" synonymous with "fool".
Rome took a couple of centuries to go from a world super power to a decadent, powerless, mish-mash shithole. We (or you rather) will accomplish the same feat in a couple of decades. I secede. I don't want anything to do with you mongrel, perverts. Just keep printing up that funny money and throwing it around like idiots. More national debt will only hasten the decline. You all deserve the lying, crooked and evil government you have allowed to be created here. And now you can just sink into the $hit with it. If you listen very closely, you can hear the Gods, and the rest of the world laughing. Disgusting monkeys.
Thanks.
Was there a point to this rant? You go on and on but don't say a damned thing.
I am pretty certain I am not fat. Nor, I am reasonably certain, am I stupid. I might be ugly, but that's far more of a personal preference thing than a verifiable fact. I was born of two married parents, so I'm certainly not misbegotten; I'm of pretty hearty Irish stock, so I don't think I'm badly bred. I've got pretty good morals, and I try to have the courage to back them up, though I sometimes fail at this. I work very hard, a work ethic passed on to me by my immigrant father and his immigrant family. I have no kids, but if I did, I'm reasonably sure they'd be able to read, as I study English Literature; and what they'd read would, hopefully, be of artistic and literary value, preferably the works of Ken Kesey and James Joyce, but also of Jane Austen and Plato and Murakami. I'd also work with them to ensure that they'd know math and science. As for history, I'm not sure what "real history" means to you, but as I study metafiction, I'm certain we could have a debate on what "real history" actually is. And they sure as hell wouldn't "dress like 'gangsta,' though whether or not they "talk[ed] jive" would be up to them. So too would be their feelings on political correctness, though I would always encourage them to speak their minds.
Look, the next time you want to echo Alan Keyes, please post to your blog. But until then, stop bitching about America, get up off your ass, and do something to fix it. Volunteer in your community. Tutor an orphan. Learn a new language and volunteer to teach new legal immigrants English. Paint an elderly neighbor's fence without asking for pay. Assist a youth group. Become a teacher for the inner city. Do something, don't just say something.
You're an asshole.
Calling a black man "Mr. President" hurts that bad?
Again, ALL HE HAS TO DO IS SHOW HIS ACTUAL BIRTH CERTIFICATE AND ALL THIS GOES AWAY!! Why are you fighting this Obama?
Your statement just went out the window. They are called Certificate of Live Birth.
No matter WHAT, you and the idiots who make your argument will just keep saying "nope, that's part of the conspiracy too."
I usually try not to make ad hominem attacks. You deserve it. You're a completely worthless piece of shit. Go crawl back into the shithole you swam out of.
Once again, President Obama has provided evidence of his birthplace and his citizenship. Can you provide evidence of the contrary? The burden of proof, sir, is on the accuser.
Please, take to the streets with torches and pitch forks! Have a million man march on Washington! Refuse to serve in the military! Refuse to pay taxes or fill out a census questionnaire! Try to secede! Y'all are awesome!
http://blogs.wsj.com/law/2008/04/11/clinton-oba...
Then there is the cleansing of Obama's passport file that was never covered in the press and I have heard that one of the individuals that was involved that was cooperating with the investigation was found shot to death in a car. You should also look at who owned the company of these employees and the connection to Obama:
http://advanceindiana.blogspot.com/2009/01/trut...
By the way, McCain did take steps to show he was a natural born citizen. Obama posted a photograph of a Certification of Live Birth to a pro-Obama website. Try applying for a passport or a Federal job and send them a photograph of your birth certificate posted on a website. Also, when did factcheck and these other organizations take over the vetting function of the Democratic party?
So David Weigel, you are a reporting here is a challenge for you. Go out and find a statement from either the Democratic National Committee or the Federal Election Committee that states that they have personally reviewed Obama's records and have deemed him to be a natural born citizen. Keep looking because it is conspicuous by its absence. All of the American People rely on the parties to vet their candidates that when the parties place the names on the ballot they have been fully vetted. Obama and his team found a loop hole in the election laws. Apparently there is no one responsible for this.
Look at the Hillary blogs from December 2007. The Democratic National Committee had months of notice on this issue and all that was done was Obama posting a photograph of a birth certificate to a website?
Hmmm. A passport, like the one President Obama has and used this month to travel abroad? A Federal job, like being U.S. Senator, which President Obama was? Or U.S. President, which he is? That's a Federal job.
Dumbass. Epic fail!
Nice. Some times the jokes just write themselves...
Tell me this.... If you really believed that the President was not legitimately eligible, then why do you believe the Republican party took NO action to keep him from being on the general election ballot? Why did Sarah Palin not say that he's not eligible to serve? She said he pals around with terrorists, so clearly she wasn't afraid of hurting anyone's delicate sensibilities.
Do you believe that the ENTIRE GOP just decided that they didn't really mind who's President, after all? Even a black guy named Barack Obama whose intelligence and utter cool factor puts them all to shame? The ENTIRE GOP somehow did not mind handing over the keys to the White House to a black guy when there was something realllllllly obvious they could have done to keep him out? (They could have sued, for example.)
John McCain called his own wife a cunt. Excuse me, his second wife. He divorced his first wife after she was in a car accident and became horribly disfigured. He was 72 years old and running for President for the last time. He hugged George W. Bush when he got the nomination. Bush is responsible for push polling in the 2000 South Carolina primary that slandered McCain's adopted Bangladeshi daughter as somehow being a black illegitimate child. McCain put up with THAT in order to run for office with Bush's blessing in 2008, but he somehow lacked the guts to say "Senator Obama, you weren't born here and haven't produced any evidence of that, and until you do, I do not consider you a legitimate opponent?" They did have 3 debates, you know.
So what was McCain waiting for? Jeff Sessions or Lindsay Graham to do it for him?
Your conspiracy theories suggest nothing factual. But to the extent they say anything, they say you should really fault THE ENTIRE REPUBLICAN PARTY for somehow failing to see what is so obvious to you. They just let the keys to White America slip through their fingers, right? The same people who fall all over themselves insulting Judge Sotomayor?
God, you'd have to be a dumbass or a very hateful person to keep saying what you say in light of ALL evidence to the contrary. At this point I'm willing to be charitable and say you're not hateful, just a dumbass.
But
Stephen I would like to add if Barack Obama was not eligible, wouldn't Senator Hillary Clinton have done every possible to expose this so Senator Obama would not steal the Democratic nomination away from her?
As to why a REP did not call anything into question..
1. Hilary's people were the ones who initiated this whole thing.. sheesh the whole lot of you are like trying to tell .. a democrat something in plain English hard to grasp anything not spoon fed by the dimwitted Dems you support so....weirdly ..
2. Why not a Prominent Rep running for the office.. Do you think at all pea brain?
Probably because.. had a Republican dared call his eleigbility into question .. do you think there is a chance in hell he or she would not have been labeld a RACIST.. ..just much more vehemently then Bill or Hillary Clinton.. wow don't you think ..
oh I forgot your don't have to think, you let others THINK for you.. I hope you all at the very least repay mom and dad for that free room and board.. such ignorance must be your public education...
But honestly I don't think anyone that is crying racists here is anything more than one the the thousands on O bummers payroll..
You're a total dumbass.
Your points do not address my post. Saying it's the Demmycrats' fault does not explain why the Republicans wouldn't have acted in their own self interest. But I know you're programmed to blame the Democrats no matter what.
Racists made racist attacks on Obama during the election. Prominent GOP elected officials said and wrote racist things. Yet they'd be afraid of being called racist for pointing out a Constitutional ineligibility?
Keep swinging, tiger. You'll hit one of these pitches eventually.
Nothing more than a bunch of right wing NUTTBALLS.
There are none worse than Hannity, Rush or World Net Daily.
They don't care about facts, they care about political rhetoric which divides... even if it's false.
This was also declared by a little thing called... hmm... The Declaration of Independence. Assuming, of course, that you believe liberty and freedom are roughly the same thing. Do you indeed hold the rights to life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness as fundamental? If so, then freedom, that most basic of human rights, is free.
I'm sure all of those parents of Marines who died in battle are a little prouder today.
I'm sure all of those parents of Marines who died in battle are a little prouder today.
I'm sure all of those parents of Marines who died in battle are a little prouder today.
I'm sure all of those parents of Marines who died in battle are a little prouder today.
If you really believe this crap.. you need help
Did you see the sarcasm this time? Good. It's ok. The seargeant is one of us.
When do the Congressional hearings start????
I was just looking up a job at the US Census. You are required to submit evidence of eligibility for the job (as with all federal jobs and most jobs.)
Why not with POTUS?
The point is that no matter what Obama shows these people, they will not be satisfied. They will just say, as they have, that the documents are fakes and that everyone who looked at them is just part of the conspiracy. It's lunacy.
But you cannot give in to these dolts or they will just hijack the agenda and nothing will get done because you'll spend all your time trying to satisfy them that President Obama is not a _________. And when you debunk one thing they'll invent another.
Look, I despised George W. Bush's presidency, but I also couldn't stand it when I heard fellow libs say, "He's not MY president." If you are a citizen of this country, THE president is YOUR president. To say something to the contrary is, to me, unpatriotic and insulting to our country. So too is it with the birthers.
I don't think you're completely wrong about the eligibility requirements. But that's not why they don't like Barack Hussein Obama II. I mean, just look at that name. Look at what circulated during the campaign. Look what CONTINUES to circulate. It is an intrinsic feeling of bigotry, plain and simple, and it makes my country, and me, look like less than we are when such a position is furthered.
I said this before, but I'll say it again: They wouldn't like Hillary, either, but they'd never question whether or not she's a natural-born American citizen. Why? Because, despite their loathing of her, at least she's got the same skin color.
So Obama did.
He passed.
Thanks for playing.
No, but he did volunteer with the intent of remaining a coward.
And don't ever say anything about putting your guns up. The Red Raiders would have nothing to do with you. Texas Tech is not Harvard but it is American through and through. You are not. Racism has no place in America. Neither does using a pretext of stupidity to further one's racist cause.
You want change YOU can believe in? Be that change. Seek out people, specifically candidates, who believe what you believe. Write letters. Participate in the protests, but go beyond them. Discuss your issues with as many people as you can. Tell them what your solutions are.
Don't just TALK about change -- LIVE change.
Once again - for the slow kids...you will never...I repeat, never...see anyone's real birth certificate. Any birth certificate you see is always a certified copy. Always. Period. End of Story.
Somehow I think that if President Obama personally went to Hawai'i, got the real certificate, autographed it and sent it to kelleyye in Crazy Town...that you a) wouldn't believe it, and b) hate him because he doesn't look like you.
Oh...if you only put this much energy into getting a good education. The places you would go!!
Congrads to you. I am not a repub nor a dem. I just want what is right for all and will continue to speak my mind and fight for my rights as well as others. I will never give up!!
Wow. I didn't know we were on the same page. There's still no hope for you. But at least now you're starting to see reason.
EVEN with your million acorn mickey's and the students jumping around states registering and early voting all over.. even with your pawned translated ballots for don't ask don't tell illegal votes..
Allot of Democrats will not vote him in.. Allot of Libertarians will not vote him in.. ALLOT off Republicans who WILL NOT vote for him AGAIN..
then you are left trying to get the Independent voters.. who like so many people world wide like the man.. But he is not a world stage leader.. maybe a UN leader but not a World leader especially from the US Capital.. Man is in above his pay grade.. for sure..
So sorry to burst your bubble youngin .. but its not gonna happen..
*snicker*
Bush was in on the conspiracy. So he nominated Roberts, who is also in on the conspiracy. Roberts's job was to cover his tracks by making a lot of rulings that NO Democrat could ever stomach, so that no one would suspect him. It worked beautifully so far. Roberts has come down against the individual in favor of the corporation, against the accused in favor of the State, against the injured medical malpractice plaintiff and in favor of the health services provider, and basically against anything Democrats prize.
This way, Roberts can now operate without scrutiny. Did you see how Roberts slyly replaced the Bible with a copy of the Qur'an that had been personally inscribed by Bin Laden? No? Oh you must have been watching the inauguration on MSNBC. Fox showed the whole thing, including the part when Obama knelt down and started washing his feet before praying toward Mecca.
So yeah. Bush. Roberts. Obama. One seamless direct line between them and whoever the hell else we need to include in this farcical conspiracy theory. Let's play Six Degrees of Separation; we can probably prove that we're ALL in on it!
One more time, everybody, sing along! "The burden of proof is on the accuser."
That's right, you can't, because he isn't. Thanks for yet more proof that birthers are morons. The pile of evidence is getting really tall.
And why do you have weapons in the first place?
If you will go with the Constitution, then tell us why you keep ignoring everything it says.
I would spit in your face if you tried to tell me jack shit about the American Way. You have no fucking clue what that phrase means. Crawl back under your rock. We have a proud and decent country to participate in.
Other than that, nothing at all. Thanks for asking.
Express your thoughts all you want, but it would help your cause a hell of a lot more if you would get up off your butt, get out from behind the computer screen, and go out into the world.
I'm just sayin'...
OUR country is right here. We finally took it back on January 20. What, were you out taking a whizz or something? It was a pretty big day. You can probably find some YouTube clips. Look for the black guy putting his hand on the Bible and swearing to uphold the Constitution. There's a lot of armed uniformed police around him and yet he's not under arrest. Shouldn't be hard to find.
The likes of Alan Keyes will never get over their defeat by Obama.Especially so with Alan Keyes 'cause he has the keys to hell.
Do you even know what you're talking about?
Get a life,man.
________________________________
De : Disqus <>
À : gforlah@yahoo.fr
Envoyé le : Vendredi, 17 Juillet 2009, 22h57mn 47s
Objet : [washingtonindependent] Re: birther movement continues
chuckj wrote, in response to vonbismark: Come on von. Why dont any of you understand that all Obama has to do is show his Birth Certificate (not his Certificate of Live Birth) and all this goes away. ITS THAT SIMPLE! Link to comment: http://washingtonindependent.com/?p=51489#comme... -- You may reply to this email to post your response. To turn off notifications, go to your Disqus settings at: http://disqus.com/settings/notifications/
OBAMA IS NOT ABOVE OUR CONSTITUTION.
Guess what? I could still be inaugurated as President were I to win enough electoral votes.
Shut your damned mouth and learn something!
together.
Seems a smart business man would pay $50 to the state of Hawaii for a Certificate of Live Birth vs. paying $1 Million to try and keep everything withheld.
Really? I just retrieved the birth certificates of myself, my husband, and our 2 children from our safe.
Guess what, ya nutbag?
They all say in capital letters this: CERTIFICATE OF LIVE BIRTH.
I called my county's Office of Vital Statistics to verify that in fact the certifcates I am in possession of are 100% legal Ohio birth certificates.
Guess what again, ya nutbag?
These documents, with the words CERTIFICATE OF LIVE BIRTH, are 100% our legal birth certificates according to the state of Ohio and they are THE only birth certificates that the state of Ohio administers to the natural-born citizens of Ohio.
Ever think for 1 second that perhaps your birth certificate might look different from Barack Obama's b/c it is from a different state?
Of course not. That would require actual thought and cognition.
Are you intricately aware of the appearance of legal birth certificates of every single state of the Union?
Of course not. Soooo .... in addition to being a nutbag you are also a mouthbreathing idiot. Now go play in traffic, bright boy.
Okubo, who said that she gets weekly questions from Obama ‘Birthers’ that are “more like threats,” explained that the certificate of live birth reproduced by Obama’s campaign should have debunked the conspiracy theories. “If you were born in Bali, for example,” Okubo explained, “you could get a certificate from the state of Hawaii saying you were born in Bali. You could not get a certificate saying you were born in Honolulu. The state has to verify a fact like that for it to appear on the certificate. But it’s become very clear that it doesn’t matter what I say. The people who are questioning this bring up all these implausible scenarios. What if the physician lied? What if the state lied? It’s just become an urban legend at this point.”
Obama has long since produced his birth certificate. He has to produce a copy, just as these people only can produce copies of their own birth certificates. What actually is he supposed to do to satisfy these people? They look right at it and they say he won't produce it. The proper officials in Hawaii say it exists and they won't believe it. They are people who can look at direct evidence of a thing and still claim that thing doesn't exist. They must have a very hard time getting by at all in this world, where for them no evidence exists of anything except what they choose to believe, and what they choose to believe is true, even in the face of all evidence to the contrary.
I am a natural-born American citizen. I have dual citizenship with Ireland through my father. And yet I still would qualify to become President of the United States.
You are either a liar or an ignoramus. Either way, you've now lost any dwindling respect I had for your intellect. Shut your mouth and learn something.
First off, Obama never showed his birth certificate. He showed a certificate of live birth, which is different than a birth certificate. People who have been born outside the US have been able to get a Certificate of Live Birth.
Second, Congress held hearings to determine McCains eligibility. I bet none of you had issues with that. Yet now you want to spew your usual hate for anyone other than a liberal who want to know if Obama indeed has a birth certificate.
Last, and most important. All he has to do is show the damn thing and all this is over with. Instead of bashing those that want to see it, why cant you question why Obama keeps fighting all this? It doesnt make any sense if he indeed has a Birth Certificate, why he doesnt just show it.
Could it be fake? Sure. But guess what? George W. Bush's could've been faked, too. So could Ronald Reagan's. So could FDR's. So could ANY president's!
The point is, you're not going to be happy even if he provides it. Or, if you are, others of your ilk will not. It's a neverending battle. You're just pissy that your side lost the election. Get over it!
Still, the clicks and whistles point remains. I think I can understand those people better than I can understand Palin anyway. She just always sounds like a third grader trying to give an oral report on particle physics without having done any of the reading first.
OBAMA, STOP HIDING. SHOW US THE LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE!!!!!
http://thesteadydrip.blogspot.com/2009/04/aka-o...
.
Why do you hate the Constitution?
The judges who have heard this nonsense have thus far thrown out the cases sua sponte. That means on their own motion, without requiring the President to have to brief the matter. The one exception is where a judge just agreed to hear the birthers' claims "on the merits" instead of throwing them out on a procedural motion.
That is good news for people who care about truth and honesty and who want to get this nonsense behind us. Because once the case has been heard on the merits, the judge will then throw it out. And if it has been heard on the merits, it can no longer be re-filed, under the doctrine of res judicata ("the thing has been decided"). No one else will be allowed to bring the same or similar claims. Before it has been heard on the merits, people could just keep re-filing and starting over.
www.hotair.com/archives/2009/07/16/video-witnes...
I don't hate you. Why do you hate me, just because of my political leanings?
Look it up, we dont have to do all you research for you. But we could show it to you and you still wouldnt believe it.
We all told you he lied about being transparent during the campaign. The proof was there. All he did was try to hide his past or excuse it. Now here we are, and its a FACT that he has NOT been transparent.
But don't worry about little things like reading comprehension. It's not like you needed to understand how to read your own child's birth certificate, which you obviously failed to understand (or are just lying about); why bother trying to understand what some fact-oriented liberal named wizz is trying to say?
Facts, you will find, often get right smack dab in the way of a good racist rant.
It MUST be true!
Hitler? Really? You're comparing President Obama with Hitler? So then who's George Bush? Emporer Nero? Pharoah? Is Cheney Beelzebub?
Hiding it? I guess President Obama was hiding his birth certificate during the campaign by posting it online. That is the last place Republicans would think to look. Sort of the way I stash cash in my library of books in my living room. I know no thief will look in my books.
So yeah, that sneaky Obama, hiding things from us by showing them to us. Shiftless, lazy, and sneaky, That One is....
Quit spreading lies and show proof that Obama was NOT born in Hawaii. If you can't do that then shut your F***** mouths. You lost the last election because of the very crap your spreading. This will not bring you back to the throne of power. But you can still sit on the white porcelin throne in the morning and get your repbulican on and wipe you Limbaugh.
You need to lighten up, get some fresh air, and try to be happy.
What will you do when this leads to even less credibility, pout? ROFL, - keep it up!
http://hotair.com/archives/2009/07/16/video-wit...
Really good for a laugh, watch it.
not one single clue, how to stop the downward slide, turn to this kind of crapp as a distraction
from their flaccid, ineptness. But are we surprised? No. This is all the republicans have left..
no good ideas,no solutions, just anger and ranting and hissy fits.
Luckily,the intelligent majority of Americans, also know this and the republicans will be marginalized for decades if not forever. Good Riddance!
Why, then, make THIS an issue? Not only are there more important things to focus on, but there are also more important issues that can be won by the side currently engaged in this idiotic warfare.
Seriously, conservatives, why waste your time on this issue that quite frankly will get you nowhere when there are REAL issues out there on which you can actually win?
What saddens me the most, is how divisive this all is. Terrorists couldn't ask for anything better than to have us wasting time hating each other about silly lies. The conservative "Birthers" an their ilk are terrorist tools, trying their best to rip the USA to shreds.
(I know, but I'm testing you.)
The question is, what do we spend the GREATEST amount on? Because it's important to know.
What I see by all this is the matter is not EVER going to be settled unless this Mr transparent O bummer shines allot of light on all his records.. ALL of them.. till then yep ..
He is in my humble opinion ... drumroll the Antichrist .. prove me wrong? He sure fits THAT description to a "T"
Finally do you race baiters even have a black or Hispanic friend or is this the best you can do? act like you give a darn..
And for God's sake, learn how to use some punctuation once in awhile!
Maybe you should ask THEM for proper documentation.
Article II of the United States Constitution says, "No person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty-five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States."
Where in there do you see anything having to do with being a dual citizen?
Wiley, I have read the Constitution, "over and over and over and over." Have you even read it once?
That's what the Major did. When he sued to get out of going, the military quite reasonably read that as an indication that he had changed his mind about his volunteer service and told him not to show up. And then his DoD contractor employer fired his worthless ass.
He only volunteered so that paperwork could be generated telling him to ship out. Once he had those orders, he met the prerequisite for filing suit (unless you are presently under orders to leave, your suit is not yet "ripe" so the orders have to be issued first).
In other words, the whole thing was a political stunt cooked up by his lawyer, who filed similarly frivolous claims about Obama's birth certificate on behalf of other tools like the ex-Major. She will soon be disbarred for violating Federal Rule of Civil Procedure 5, which indicates that every pleading filed by a lawyer must be filed in good faith for a proper purpose. Political stunts clearly do not count.
I wish he HAD gone overseas. I am sure that he would not have come back home except in a box with a flag over it. No one likes cowards. He would have deserved to get fragged for the disrespect he showed to our military, our judicial system, and our President. Piece of shit coward.
I wonder where you learned English, supposedly the "official language of the United States of America. I suppose it could be the same place where you learned "logic", where you learned common decency, where you learned to love thy neighbor as thyself, etc.
I get that you are angry. I get that you hate 24/7. I get that you teach hate to your children and to your family. I get that you have nothing but your skins and that you are sooooo afraid the real world is going to leave you in the dirt where you think you shouldn't be.
So Joe Biden recently said that "We have to spend money to keep from going bankrupt"
LOL oh wait....that isnt a joke? He actually said that? Wow.
Now this is the second guy in command. And in his economic class, he learned to get out of bankruptcy, you need to spend more money...that you dont have. Wow, talk about clueless.
Deficit spending is how you get out of a recession. Economic cycles have been going on since well before Egyptians and Romans fought over who had to keep Mark Antony. When your economy is in recession, people stop buying things. So producers cut down on how much they make. And prices rise. Which is bad. Since people have no money. Since it's a recession.
So the government spends. Whether it has the money or not. And that money that the government spends goes into the economy. Roads get built. Bridges get repaired. School books get printed. People get hired. People get paid. People pay taxes. The government gets paid back. But more importantly, the economy pulls itself out of the ditch.
So STFU since you clearly have not the foggiest idea what you're talking about.
"Wow, talk about clueless."
Keep 'em coming, genius. I have all day.
I mean, this has been debunked so many times... good lord. If you are so obsessed with this issue, wouldn't you at least keep the debunked talking points off the page? It makes you look even dumber. Then again, go right ahead. This is hilarious. Go Birfers, Go!
As for Maya not knowing the name of the hospital her father was born in, I haven't the faintest idea of the name of the hospital my father was born in. I just know that he was born in Kalamazoo, period.
www.peoplespassions.org/peoplesvoice/Birth_Cert...
Either way, I will reiterate -- AGAIN -- that the United States Constitution does NOT specify that the President produce something called a Birth Certificate. Why, Chuck, do you think that your demands are more important than the Constitution's?
http://www.usnews.com/articles/news/campaign-20...
Chuck, you wrote, "You're scary if you wish Biden was President. Please someone take away your voter registration card."
You are un-American as they come, sir. In everything that we have debated on this board so far, I have never once insinuated or said outright that you should be barred from voting for your beliefs.
You, sir, have just gone from legitimate debater to supporter of Stalin-esque tyranny. Congratulations.
I don't ask that you agree with me, and I'm pretty sure I won't agree with you. Frankly, I think it's pretty scary that anyone would want Mike Huckabee to be president when his #1 issue is abortion, and it seriously freaks me out that anybody believes Sarah Palin is even remotely qualified to be dogcatcher (to paraphrase "good ole Biden"). But that's just a political disagreement. We have a different worldview.
I get that you were joking, dude, but seriously... with all the shit that has been thrown at people on the left for the last few, um, decades, all the smears of un-Americanism and whatnot, I just get a very bad taste in my mouth when those kinds of things are said, even as jokes.
If so, then Weigel has misled you. Because, I spoke with Okubo, and she said she's not qualified to say that what's on BHO's site matches what they have on file.
If you dispute anything I'm saying, the burden of proof is on you. Otherwise, you're just trying to throw up dust.
http://hawaii.gov/health/about/pr/2008/08-93.pdf
Dude-I think you could get the vault copy and STILL not believe!!! I hope you have a good therapist, you need it!
If that's your game: I just spoke to the FBI, and they couldn't confirm that 24AheadDotCom isn't a pedophile.
If you dispute anything I'm saying, the burden of proof is on you. Otherwise, you're just trying to throw up dust.
Lines have to be drawn in civilized society. I'm not saying people should take all your guns, or whatever your weapons are, away. But for what could you possibly need, say, a Kalishnikov? If we should be able to get whatever from the local Gun Hut, shouldn't I be able to buy grenades if I want to? And then, if we're going forward with this doing what we want, shouldn't I be able to use them anytime, anywhere I want to?
Cecile, due respect, it's Eric Burdon who was the lead singer of the Animals, not Eric Burton.
(I realize this is OT, but I don't like disinformation of any kind getting out there.)
just watch Rachel Maddows show from last night to see what the truth is
pat b. showed the world what that part of the party is all about/
shame shame shame
Let's have intelligent conversation and not just boil everything down to race.
I googled "john mccain birth certificate" and got 220,000 results.
so I don't think it was "just as fierce."
It is said by Kenyan sources that Barack Obama was born in the coastal resort town of Mobassa, Kenya while his mother and father were on summer holiday from college, his mother went into labor in the hot sun while at the beach, she returns home with her baby and registers him born in HI with no proof needed besides herself as a witness, he is issued a COLB and his grandfather Stanley informs the newspapers of the birth which is then printed.
Obama for his entire life uses this COLB as his only american citizenship proof. Obama uses his Indonesian citizenship granted to him from his adoption by his Indonesian stepfather Lolo Soetoro for college grants and other foreign programs. Obama never registered for selective service as proven his Sel Service paperwork is fraudulent. In early '08 his passports were illegaly accessed along with 2 other candidates and on March 21 2008, Obama calls for the state dept to investigate (pls google: "Obama wants Congress to probe passport breach") Five days later, one of those witnesses of the breach, Lt. Quarles Harris Jr. was found shot dead in his car.
In his first day in office, Jan 21, Obama signs off on Executive Order 13489 sealing all records and leaving Attorney General Eric Holder in command of any document release.
July 14, Stefan Frederick Cook a reservist, who had previously filed a restraining order preventing his deployment to Afghanistan, was fired from his civilian job for questioning the elgibility of the Pres.
Look this stuff up, its all online, dont believe me, do your own research, this is not a conspracy theory, it is indeed a conspiracy.
If somehow proven:
Biden becomes temporary president, a new election will be called for, democratic party fails and ceases to exist, Libertarians and Republicans become the 2 main parties, MSNBC Olberman and Maddow are done, Jackson and Sharpton cry foul, marches in the streets, marches turn to riots. From this point we can only hope for the best.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/23736254/
But more than that, I'm with Stupidity -- what does your article about the passport breaches prove?
When I was a little kid, I saw people playing chess. Until I actually learned the game, I would "play chess" by moving pieces and saying "Check!" (I was four or five years old.)
So I recognize the same process among kooks. They see somebody hold up a sheaf of papers and say, "This proves it!" and they think those are the two elements of proving things, a bunch of documents and a declaration.
They never seem to catch on to the idea that the documents have to actually contain stuff that has relevence to their assertions.
I've seen Obama's birth certificate, it was given many months ago in hopes of shutting up the conspiracy theorists but alas these folks are morons and just can't let this one go.
Everyone who read a word past that, get up and leave the room. Go get some fresh air. Come back when you're thinking straight. No one in their right mind would believe that any Obama-trashing troll on this website has the foggiest idea where Kenya is, let alone what anyone in Kenya said about jack shit.
Next.
ITS A $12 BIRTH CERTIFICATE!!!!!!!!! SHOW IT TO US!
geez, give me a break! just because somebody posts a story on the internet doesn't make it the truth! pull your head out of the sand and join us in the real world. . .
he DID show his birth certificate...but does it really matter to you? He could show each and every citizen the document in person and you crazy conspiracy theorists would just say it was a fake...get a life! He's an American, so start being American and question your government about thing that matter (like health care, the economy, etc) not this frivolous nonsense.
In fact, where is the proof of any of this garbage?
Also, do you know how to use contractions?
And yes, I will attack you for common punctuation errors. If it's common, then that means it's probably pretty easy to avoid, too.
And even if I am, "young and gullible," it's better than being obtuse, and it's a heckuva lot better than being ignorant of the rules of grammar.
But I ask again, since you didn't answer my question: Where are the Kenyan sources? Can you provide them? Because the burden of proof is on you, since you made the assertion. I don't have to provide anything; President Obama has already made my argument for me.
More importantly, do you actually know what it means? And do you know the difference between PRESIDENTIAL records and PERSONAL records?
Yeesh.
"Biden becomes temporary president, a new election will be called for, democratic party fails and ceases to exist, Libertarians and Republicans become the 2 main parties, MSNBC Olberman and Maddow are done, Jackson and Sharpton cry foul, marches in the streets, marches turn to riots. From this point we can only hope for the best."
Thru the back door people now are having a hard time getting amo. Guns you can buy. Amo is harder to find and cost way to much for one bullet. Now 6 months ago I was able to go to the gun store and get what i wanted in the way of amo. Now it not only cost tons to get my amo, but I just cant go to any gun store to buy what I need for my guns.
You said earlier that you just want to be able to provide for your family. So why waste your money on bullets and guns and other weapons? I, personally, would want to ensure that there was a roof over my family's head, plenty of food for them to eat, a car to commute for both them and me, plenty of gifts at Christmas and birthdays, etc. Isn't that more important than hitting up the gun store and spending loads of money there?
Sen Tom Coburn -- of Ricky Ricardo slur fame ---- shouldn't be a citizen. Oklahoma was a territory .
Stefan Cook -- PS was also fired from his job a s a govt defense contractor.
It doesn't -- any more than watching Keith Olbermann helps a gasbag liberal's. Watching one guy on TV (or many guys on TV) is just one thing you're doing. How about listening to the other side?
You know what I do, Wiley? I read. A lot. I mean, a LOT a lot. I read progressive sites. I read conservative sites. I read middle-of-the-road sites. I read magazines. I read journals. I read published accounts from think-tanks. And you know what? It confuses the hell out of me. But at least I keep informed. If you're watching Glenn Beck, and that's what you believe to be your contribution, you're further gone than I'd feared.
And so far as sending mail and making calls... dude, that doesn't prove diddly shit. Anybody with half a brain can send an e-mail (as this board itself proves). If you want something to change, organize it yourself!
You say, "Guess what. I have gotten off my butt and no to the drugs or pills that I dont need to take." We'll set aside your brazen misuse of the rules of grammar there and get to the main point: What the hell does that prove? You say, "I have joined many others and will do my best to VOTE out congress." Well, you can't "vote out congress," though you can vote out your representative and help GOTV efforts in other districts. But what good will that do? Democrats and Republicans in the House and Senate are really not extraordinarily far apart. Oh, sure, you get your wingnuts on either side, and sometimes it seems like they're way far apart. But frankly, most of them are just posturing (hello, Eric Cantor).
So in summation, I ask you again: What are you doing to change this country?
GEEEZZZZZ
I hope I raised good kids and they vote there way to.
Neither are a lot of us. What's your point?
It is true that the U.S. Constitution is the Supreme Law of the U.S. However, WE THE PEOPLE, collectively and in general consensus have the power to over rule the Constitution any time we want. In fact, there are at least five incidences in our history when men were elected to Congress and were sworn into Congress before they reached the legal age set forth in the Constitution, which is 25 for the House, 30 for the Senate, and 35 for the presidency.
How was this possible? As I said before, WE THE PEOPLE, collectively and in general consensus are the supreme sovereignty in the U.S. and therefore have the legal right to elect anyone we want into office, regardless of their age, and in the case of the presidency, regardless of their citizenship.
WE don't need the permission from the White House, Congress or the Supreme Court because we are the boss of them. They are not the boss of us. We can do anything we want, collectively. They have to do everything we say, if only WE THE PEOPLE would stop being wee the sheeple.
Either way, don't get any bright ideas, Ahnold. You'll never be president.
Oh and YOU put Joe Gaffe Biden as second in command. Nice job YOU
Let me repeat myself.
WE THE PEOPLE collectively and in general consensus are the supreme sovereign legal and legislative authority in the U.S.
How in the world can you possibly interpret that as being me singularly (YOU)?
I need popcorn for this one.
You could be arrested for making threats of violence against the president.
Legally, they could drag your ass out of your house and haul you off to jail.
If you want to replace the president, there is a right way and a wrong way of doing it.
You want to do it the wrong way.
There's a difference between a mob of angry people and WE THE PEOPLE collectively throughout the entire country.
If WE did to decide to kick the president out of office before the next election and without Congress doing so through the impeachment process, WE would have to march on Washington, peaceably of course, completely surround the White House, and then just sit down and stay there and wait for however long it would take for Obama to resign and leave on his own accord.
That's what was wrong with the peace marches that happened when Bush was president. On at least three occasions WE had over 100,000 people protest the war. But at the end of the day, everyone went home.
Once again, WE THE PEOPLE turned back into wee the sheeple.
Because if there is, I absolutely, 100% guarantee you that anyone who participates in such a coup will be tried for -- and convicted of -- treason.
I sincerely hope you aren't actively ADVOCATING a coup.
And I will again remind you that the United States Constitution says NOTHING about providing an "original birth certificate," or a birth certificate of any kind. All it says is that one must be a natural-born citizen.
Unintended consequences are a bitch, ain't they?
English as a second language, perhaps?
If you're going to insult somebody's education, please don't show the deficiencies in your own. It sets us all back.
As you can see, typically, they think they are smarter than most people, and anyon who questions the Kenyan Pres is just a total idiot. Make up your own minds, and make sure you have plenty of ammo.
Great. Now you've treated us to the mental image of you two having sex.
The "birther" theory requires the ability to be shown a document, and then to immediately deny the document exists.
That's way too much work!
I'm not being facetious. The Constitution does not require a birth certificate be shown. In fact, it doesn't require "proof" of any kind. To say that it does imbues implied powers into the Constitution. Usually, conservatives are against that, maintaining that one must do a strict reading of the Constitution and not imply any kind of extraordinary power to it.
So which is it?
Or did I misunderstand you?
Jeese. What is WRONG with these folks????
And if it wasn't Hawaii, that still wouldn't necessarily matter. The qualifications are that one parent was a U.S. citizen when he was born; and that the parent lived in the US for at least five years, at least two of which had to be after her fourteenth birthday.
The Dred Scott decision has nothing to do with it. Besides, most of it was annulled by the Fourteenth Amendment anyways.
AlcheMiss is right. The Consitution gives Congress the authority to create a uniform nationality law. They did so via the Immigration and Naturalization Act of 1952. If President Obama was born out of the country (which he was not), the Act provides that a child born abroad between 1952 and1986 to 1 parent posessing US citizenship is a citizen if that parent had been present in the US for at least 10 years, 5 after the age of 14.
If only one parent is a U.S. Citizen at the time of ones birth, that parent must have resided in the United States for minimum ten years, five of which must be after the age of 16
O's mother was only 18 and could NOT pass US citizenship on to him. Thanks for playing.
Something like that, right?
Let's forget for a moment that no such legislation exists (the emails you're getting about it are false), Obama didn't introduce any such legislation, and no such tax exists. Read FactCheck before you believe all these nutjob emails you get. Whew!
And you can believe that, because you just read it on the Internet!
but I can tell you what the Republican talking point is. they're going around saying that "since everyone is so afraid that Obama is gonna take away their guns and rip up the Second Amendment, there's been a run on ammunition in gun stores as gun owners try to buy all that they can while it's still legally available."
It's not true at all. You can, if for some indecipherable reason you feel you need to, legally and rather easily purchase more than enough ammunition to meet any need you have for it.
There is no shortage.
It's just a talking point to get the gun-toting constituency of the right wing (and, to the extent they can, the left wing) scared into voting Republican, and more to the point, to get the political chattering class to say things like "Does the run on ammunition mean Obama is losing touch with working-class white voters, who are clinging to their guns and ammunition?" and other such nonsense.
I am sure kwiley has heard it. I would bet that kwiley has not been affected by it. I doubt kwiley owns any guns. Any gun owner I've ever met knows that "amo" is a meaningless bit of gibberish while "ammo" is what you put in a gun.
I have yet to find one credible statement from kwiley but she is attacking our President in vile ways, while pretending to be seeking what's good for America.
What is good for America is for you to acknowledge the truth when it is publicly-available. What part of "certified as authentic by the State of Hawaii" or "he is a citizen if his mother is a citizen" do you not understand, you know?
The whole birther thing just divides the country and creates needless rancor and hard feelings at a time when large issues need to be worked out and in fact are hanging delicately in the balance. I have a lot of older relatives and a lot of friends. I don't want to see them have inadequate health care for a day longer than they have to, and certainly not because some racist jerks filed bogus lawsuits to challenge the President's citizenship just as a means of trying to throw his Administration off stride so that it cannot achieve anything positive FOR AMERICA.
That is not a concern for truth. That is not patriotism. That is not defensible. That is madness. So every time someone spews that nonsense I will shut it down as best I can by pointing out its inherent absurdity.
American Maritime Officers?
American Motors Owners Association?
Those are its English usages, as acronyms.
Then there's:
Bosnian
Adverb
amo
1. hither, here
2. this way
Synonyms
* amoder
* ovamo
Catalan
Noun
amo m. (plural amos)
1. owner (of a piece of land or real estate, a business, etc.)
2. master
Chickasaw
Verb
amo
1. to mow
Classical Nahuatl
Particle
amo
1. Alternative spelling of ahmo.
Croatian
Adverb
amo
1. hither, here
2. this way
Synonyms
* amoder, ovamo, simo
Esperanto
Noun
amo (plural amoj, accusative singular amon, accusative plural amojn)
1. love
Galician
Verb
amo
1. first-person singular present indicative of amar.
Hawaiian
Verb
amo
1. carry (on the shoulders)
Italian
Etymology 1
Latin hāmus
Noun
amo m. (plural ami)
1. hook
Etymology 2
Latin amō
Verb form
amo
1. first person singular present tense of amare
Latin
Etymology
Probably from a lost nursery-word of the papa-type. Cf. amita (“‘aunt’”), Old High German amme (“‘nurse’”).
Pronunciation
* (Classical) IPA: /ˈa.moː/
Verb
present active amō, present infinitive amāre, perfect active amāvī, supine amātum.
1. I love.
* Plautus
Tu me amas, ego te amo.
You love me and I love you.
2. I am fond of.
3. I am under obligation to; I am obliged to.
4. (with infinitive) To enjoy, be accustomed.
And yet he's allowed to carry a gun.
(I'm making the assumption that he's male.)
(Yeah, yeah, I know she said that, but she sure wasn't talking to me -- self-deprecation five!)
I'll try not to do it again.
(Sorry, I'm an ass, and I've been procrastinating on this site way too long.)
This confuses me. Not sure I understand the rationale behind these repeated requests.
She has confirmed, on Oct 31, 2008, that Barack Obama was born in Honolulu, Hawaii.
In addition, the copy the Obama campaign released as been seen, touch, felt and confirmed to be an official copy of that original birth certificate. Photographs exist. Independent, third party confirmation exists.
What evidence will you believe, what spokesperson will you believe, if not the person directly responsible for managing such records, who has access to such records, who has seen the records?
Like John Kerry never authorized the release of his military records but we do have the results from Bush's dental exam (medical records) in 1972.
When your leader, George W. Bush, releases his National Guard records, then all my issues with his being a drug-addled, draft-dodging coward (just like Rush Limbaugh and Dick Cheney) will "just go away" as well.
Fukino said that no state official, including Gov. Linda Lingle, ever instructed that Obama's certificate be handled differently from any other.
Some Obama critics claim he was not born in the United States
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in...
Meanwhile, I spoke to Weigel's quote source, and if you haven't already read about what she said, click here.
Love is seldom free.
So, what do you think the magazine "Guns & Ammo" is about, anyway?
If you have to buy your own ammo in ANY case, I'd suggest you talk to your employer and see why that is. And besides that, you can still write off the taxes.
They're just free entertainment.
It's a bit much for me to call them traitors, though, until they start advocating for or participating in acts of terror against our country.
The list goes on. So yes, there are PLENTY of legitimate things to gripe about with this administration. Oh, I left out, his Vice President continues to say the dumbest things imaginable. I know, i know. He is a democrat so the media lets him get away with it. But it doesnt change the fact that he says the idiotic things he does say.
My point was that people are raising the birthright issue (which isn't really an issue at all) in lieu of actual issues. I raised this point before.
Amazingly (I know, this is going to blow your mind) I don't agree with everything President Obama has done. But I also feel the need to defend against this claim of otherness, this malarkey about where he was born, because it simply is not an issue, and it angers me that this type of crap is starting to seep into mainstream political discourse. This type of bullshit has NO PLACE in the House of Representatives (neither, by the way, do Biden's verbal gaffes, any more than President Bush's did). But some (though by no means all) of your issues SHOULD be. Those are the debates that SHOULD be taking place. But instead, we get nonsense issues like this, as well as the crap about Judge Sotomayor being a racist. It's sickening, and it's being perpetuated by one ideological viewpoint in an effort to score cheap political points with a bunch of chickenshit white folk who get knobby-kneed when a black guy in a sideways cap walks next to them on the sidewalk but who claim they believe in equality.
I'm no race-baiting Jesse Jackson (I've had to live my entire life with that asshole in my city), but I'm sick to death of the complexes of persecuted-feeling white males. I'm a white male, and I know from personal experience that I've had it a helluva lot easier than most people of color. That doesn't make affirmative action right (as CJ Cregg once said on The West Wing, I'm the wrong liberal to talk to about affirmative action), but neither does it mean that we shouldn't see things the way they really are. And what this crappy-ass manufactured controversy is based in is the worst kind of race-baiting from media moguls too busy lining their pockets to actually give a damn about the average working-class person.
"he has and is pursuing an expansion of government into our personal lives." Yeah, right. You never noticed that Bush and his minions broke all the laws by illegally spying on American citizens. Also, the fact that the Repugs are constantly trying to reverse the right to legal abortion in this country. Also, they continuously deny gays the right to get married. These are all huge expansions into people's personal lives. And there are a lot more. All you have to do is pull your head out of your ass and pay attention.
Currently, Title 8 of the U.S. Code fills in those gaps. Section 1401 defines the following as people who are "citizens of the United States at birth:"
* Anyone born inside the United States *
* Any Indian or Eskimo born in the United States, provided being a citizen of the U.S. does not impair the person's status as a citizen of the tribe
* Any one born outside the United States, both of whose parents are citizens of the U.S., as long as one parent has lived in the U.S.
* Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is a citizen and lived in the U.S. for at least one year and the other parent is a U.S. national
* Any one born in a U.S. possession, if one parent is a citizen and lived in the U.S. for at least one year
* Any one found in the U.S. under the age of five, whose parentage cannot be determined, as long as proof of non-citizenship is not provided by age 21
* Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is an alien and as long as the other parent is a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years (with military and diplomatic service included in this time)
* A final, historical condition: a person born before 5/24/1934 of an alien father and a U.S. citizen mother who has lived in the U.S.
* There is an exception in the law — the person must be "subject to the jurisdiction" of the United States. This would exempt the child of a diplomat, for example, from this provision.
It doesn't matter if he is a U.S. citizen or not, or if he is under 35. The election is final. WE THE PEOPLE have spoken. Congress has confirmed it. The Supreme Court has sworn him in.
U.S. citizen or not, Obama is our legal U.S. President for the next three and a half years, unless impeached, or removed from office, collectively by WE THE PEOPLE.
* Any one born outside the United States, if one parent is an alien and as long as the other parent is a citizen of the U.S. who lived in the U.S. for at least five years (with military and diplomatic service included in this time)
IS a "Natural Born citizen"
You expect us to believe that a "center-right nation" run by a Republican White House in a time of war would have a federal government just totally gloss over any detail, no matter how slight, that might have kept:
a BLACK man;
named Barack HUSSEIN Obama (a few years after Saddam was captured, no less);
whose pastor said God Damn America on endlessly-played loops;
OUT OF THE WHITE HOUSE?
Come on. The FBI spied on MLK for crying out loud. If there was ANY shred of LEGAL basis to keep Barack Obama out of the White House based on the legitimacy of his birth certificate, then the Bush Justice Department would have checked the birth certificate EXTREMELY thoroughly during the FBI background check that all Presidential candidates undergo.
And news about the whole investigation would have leaked to Fox News in perfect time for the Sean Hannity hilarity hour.
If you say otherwise, you know that all you're doing is pretending.
And that is just one of the unfathomable logical leaps we are asked to take if we are to accept the premise of the Birthers' argument.
A bigger, even sillier one is that you have to assume, to take their view, that the State of Hawaii is not only involved in a massive conspiracy, but has been involved in that conspiracy since the day Barack Hussein Obama was born.
And to believe that, you have to believe that when he was born, the white and Pacific Islander staff at the hospital or City Hall had to see a black baby named Barack Hussein Obama being claimed by a white woman named Stanley and thought "let's risk our careers and our freedom from jail by making up a story about this kid's birth. We just know that little baby Barack is gonna be the first black President!" Let's fake a birth certificate for the little change-bringer!
And if you believe that, well, let's be honest, if you believe that then you're so f*cking dumb that I cannot be bothered to spend much time caring what else you believe.
What are people trying to say, that his mother is not really his mother. I don’t think anyone is contending that she is not a US citizen. Therefore, it kind of makes me foolish even participating in a debate like this as there is nothing to debate.
But really, this is all common sense stuff, I think. I still don't understand why any of this has a political implication.
Just produce your real birth certficate .
http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in...
By the way, it is only a "reproduction" of my birth certificate, because, like most states, they keep the original in it's storage facitlities. This prevents "birther" idiots from making changes to the original.
On the night and early morning Obama was supposedly born, Hickam Field airbase early warning technicians reported unidentified flying objects breaking into the atmosphere at over 10,000 mph. heading straight for the oahu. The objects slowed and were lost from radar on the northwest section of the island and were presumed to have hit the ground. Military units were dispatched, but did not arrive untill after the local village had rescued a man and an infant from the inferno which at the time was a sugar cane field. Both the man and the infant were described by the villagers as "Negroes" and were handed over to the military,but not before the man gave his name to the villagers. His name? Hombama.
It's the truth as unbeleivable as it sounds. Our President is a REAL alien.
Once more I ask, what exactly does this issue have to do with politics? Or are you just venting?
Wouldn't it have been persuasive enough to say "I'm a woman?"
Denying it multiple times as you did, you may have given away more than you intended.
The lady doth protest too much, methinks.
But, at least, if you are a woman, you could be more easily forgiven for not having the foggiest idea what the word "ammo" looks like on the printed page. Since, you know, you made the entire nonsensical spiel about running out of "amo" up out of whole cloth that you pulled straight out of your ass.
You don't own a gun any more than you own any of the stupid birther talking points you've regurgitated here today.
So whether you're female, all female, or "no dude here," why not just go do some of that reading you keep telling us you do? Since you "like to see all of it," you might start by looking at Obama's birth certificate. Look at it over and over. Especially at the part where it describes his race. Keep looking. It's not going to change magically before your eyes. And then say to yourself... "President...Barack...HUSSEIN...Obama."
Welcome to the next 7 and a half years of your life, doll.